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Decades posted:Fantasy sparring chat is still fun though. That's all it is. If you don't spar, your style is essentially useless. No amount of theory will change that fact.
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Apr 11, 2012 15:10
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Polyrhythmic Panda posted:That's all it is. If you don't spar, your style is essentially useless. No amount of theory will change that fact. If you even skimmed my admittedly long-rear end post then by sparring you must mean full-contact striking. So who's going to break it to jiu-jitsu and wrestling that their styles are useless? I don't have the heart.
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Apr 11, 2012 15:24
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quote:You seem like a reasonable guy but I'm going to have to make this point: when boxers spar, it looks like boxing, when wrestlers spar it looks like wrestling, it's that way for every martial art we recommend. On a similar note, Decades, this is the question that immediately struck me when you addressed the range issue. If I'm understanding correctly that "trapping range" is more of a transient position than a place you hang out, why do you do most of your drilling from there? As a BJJ student I do train transient and intermediate positions (he's driving his knee over my leg to pass guard, holy poo poo shove that back and do something) but the majority of techniques are based around the stable positions where the most time is spent. Boxing techniques, at least from an outsider's perspective, seem to begin and end in a normal stance and range or I guess in the clinch. Wrestlers probably have more "book smarts" regarding scrambles than I ever will but I'm still informed that the main way of learning them is just to experience a thousand of them; I don't think they spend a ton of time drilling them though I could be wrong. Do you think it's accurate to say WC is different in this respect? If so, what for?
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Apr 11, 2012 16:02
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Decades posted:Thank you for not taking that Judo bit the wrong way. Judo rules and I have the biggest crush on Rhonda Rousey. Haven't tried it, just a little bit of bjj, but I'd definitely be interested. If I had to pick another art that was closest to the core of what we do it'd probably be Judo. We've got strikes and lack the gi, but I imagine if I were to jump ship, Judo's where my skills would be most applicable. The early UFCs pretty much settled this. Grapplers generally just protected their heads and shot in for a takedown. The time it took them to shoot exposed them to one or maybe two effective strikes and then a bunch of generally ineffective body shots in the clinch if they didnt get a clean takedown. All of Royce's early UFC fights against strikers were just him chasing them around the octagon, protecting his head, and jumping on them when they came in or got pushed against the cage. The quest to prove which style is "the best" ended up proving that you need a well rounded skill set to win organized fights without rules which disqualify certain techniques. The whole "well if they shoot in I can do X striking technique" theory lasted about 20 seconds in the real world. People who wanted to win those fights but not grapple started calling up wrestling coaches and learning to stuff takedowns and muay thai coaches to learn how to deal good damage in a clinch, i.e they added another style's skills to their toolbox. Smegmatron fucked around with this message at 16:47 on Apr 11, 2012 |
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Apr 11, 2012 16:39
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You know a martial art based around clinching up and beating/submitting someone actually seems fairly practical and cool. Dirty boxing plus greco and that wc trap hands stuff. Randy did that a lot and it seemed to work pretty well: even on stronger younger guys. We'll call it "western wing chun" and award colored singlets for ranks.
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Apr 11, 2012 16:43
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Xguard86 posted:Dirty boxing plus greco and that wc trap hands stuff. Probably Muay Thai rather than dirty boxing (I'm a boxer but I admire Muay Thai's "hit with anything" style)
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Apr 11, 2012 16:48
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I always associate clinch striking that's not from the plumb with dirty boxing. I guess MT would be good to work in as well. Plus whatever standing submissions you could work enough to be useful.
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Apr 11, 2012 18:02
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Decades posted:For the record this stuff should be taken with a grain of salt since we're talking hypotheticals. I don't like this attitude (not that I'm accusing you of standing for it). Let's leave jabs to the eyes off the table. Once you take that out, WC striking is fully compatible rules-wise with Muay Thai. Sure you might not want to spar with unpadded elbows and knees to the head all the time, but it's possible. And if it's possible, WC tactical development shouldn't have to be hypothetical. You can just go and do it. Maybe other WC don't agree with it (although you do) -- tossing out the extreme stuff still leaves you with enough technique to spar with a version of the art. And from there you can evolve things to what really work. I strongly want that to happen with WC and other CMA, but it's just not out there, imo. Xguard86 posted:You know a martial art based around clinching up and beating/submitting someone actually seems fairly practical and cool. Dirty boxing plus greco and that wc trap hands stuff. Randy did that a lot and it seemed to work pretty well: even on stronger younger guys. Shootboxing is the ruleset that encourages these outcomes, and even that is fairly kickboxing looking. Though it's cool that there's a sport that lets Andy Souwer throw up a standing neck crank.
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Apr 11, 2012 18:22
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Don't worry, we have a rule: You get five outside punches per round. "Ain't so pretty no moh'r"
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Apr 11, 2012 18:39
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Decades posted:If you even skimmed my admittedly long-rear end post then by sparring you must mean full-contact striking. So who's going to break it to jiu-jitsu and wrestling that their styles are useless? I don't have the heart. Wrestling and BJJ has sparring, it's called wrestling/rolling. It's where you try to apply the techniques of your style against a resisting opponent in a live, continuous setting. The closest thing you do to sparring is drilling, which is not sparring. Sparring in a striking context means trying to hit someone who is trying not to get hit and is also trying to hit you. And yeah, it should be full contact at least some of the time. If you think I'm exaggerating the importance of sparring, go to a boxing or kickboxing gym and ask if you can spar with someone to test the validity of your Wing Chun training.
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Apr 11, 2012 18:56
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McNerd posted:If I'm understanding correctly that "trapping range" is more of a transient position than a place you hang out, why do you do most of your drilling from there? Good points. I oversimplified when I said that a WC guy wouldn’t want to hang out in that range – the point is more not to linger in that range while your opponent is rooted. Started from outside range, the ideal for the WC guy is to enter and make contact of some sort or another, use that contact to break the opponent’s balance (uproot), and only linger insofar as you can maintain that state of balanced WC guy and unbalanced opponent. The easiest way to picture it is the opponent being rocked straight back on their heels with an initial punch, push, or even just the penetrating step leading the way itself, making contact around the crotch or hips. The WC guy would try to follow the opponent as he moves to continue striking or pushing and maintain that unbalanced state until the opponent is stuck in a corner or on the ground. This is sort of where the whole “chain punching” thing comes in. This is usually approached one of two ways that I’d argue are no good. The first and most frequently ridiculed approach to chain punching is standing in place and landing loose rapid fire punches without power like a kung fu movie – the opponent held in place by… something. The second problematic approach is charging forward like a freight train. Here the punches may or may not have power, but there are a lot of other problems with all out rushing an opponent head-on that I don’t think I need to get into here. To do it right you’ve got to remain present and sensitive to the opponent’s movements, following closely, but not chasing, and prepared to stop on a dime and readjust your angles if the opponent starts to recover – which they pretty surely will if they’re used to martial arts or fighting of any kind. They also probably wont stagger straight back flailing like a spaz, as the charging type of chainpuncher probably pictures. Real life fighting happens at constantly changing angles. I’d say this is more of a challenge than a problem for the WC guy, who should really be trying to shift to a side and take angles anyway, as you’ll more likely be able to wreck the opponent’s balance and get him tripped up that way, not to mention better striking opportunities presenting themselves. The kind of control I’m talking about is hard to describe and hard to picture and might even sound farfetched until you’ve felt it. It requires a kind of sensitivity that requires years to develop. In more modern/western terms I guess you could roughly swap in “timing” for sensitivity, but not exactly. A skilled WC guy can make an unskilled one dance using the wrist-to-wrist contact alone as the latter tries to stay on his feet, but is pushed and pulled continuously in the direction he least expects and is never able to get his hips under him. This is when you can safely linger in that very close range, along with any time that your opponents hands are both controlled (which I guess is pretty limited to a WC trying mutually to do the same thing to you). Hope that somewhat answers the question. Smegmatron posted:The early UFCs pretty much settled this. Grapplers generally just protected their heads and shot in for a takedown. The time it took them to shoot exposed them to one or maybe two effective strikes and then a bunch of generally ineffective body shots in the clinch if they didnt get a clean takedown. We’re very much on the same page here. I didn’t mean to suggest defending takedowns with strikes in my response. It’s the dropped hips that are the important element of the actual takedown defence. The strikes are there because if the opening presents itself, why wouldn’t they be? As I understand it the main reason we’d try to drop our hips while keeping both feet on the ground rather than sprawl is to permit us to keep hitting. Also keep in mind that I was talking about sparring a Judoka, who I’d expect to clinch high, rather than a wrestler who’d shoot low. Low shots are tougher to deal with for WC guys, but also probably for just about anyone. Well-rounded skillsets are best, and nothing is wrestling but wrestling. WC can’t beat wrestling at its own game, but I do think that the stuff I’ve been talking about beats any pure striking art in the takedown defense department. kimbo305 posted:I don't like this attitude (not that I'm accusing you of standing for it). Let's leave jabs to the eyes off the table. Once you take that out, WC striking is fully compatible rules-wise with Muay Thai. Sure you might not want to spar with unpadded elbows and knees to the head all the time, but it's possible. And if it's possible, WC tactical development shouldn't have to be hypothetical. You can just go and do it. Sounds good to me, though two things I’d like to pick at as far as compatibility with Muay Thai. One is throws/trips, as in actually tossing your opponent to the ground. I’m ignorant as to how that would be scored in Muay Thai, but I think it would make sense to award points for it if that’s not already the case. The second more important thing is gloves, and this is a problem for pretty much any real or hypothetical attempt at sport WC. It works a lot better bare-handed, even though it doesn’t generally make sense to fight people that way. Open-handed mma gloves could be a reasonable compromise, but closed gloves, even smaller Muay Thai ones, would be significantly restrictive. Personally I’m still challenged enough within my class (and pressed enough for time) that I don’t feel too compelled to seek out boxers and grapplers to test myself against, at least for now. I’m arguably still learning the basics of WC, even though I’m a couple of years in. But yeah, no reason it couldn’t happen. Am I the chosen white dragon who will in time rise up to evolve CMA into the ultimate modern hybrid fighting style? Probably not, no. But I think it kind of sort of could be done. Polyrhythmic Panda I can really only tell you to read my first post again. If wrestling and rolling count as sparring then the final section of my class outline does too. If I were to test my training in a boxing gym tomorrow I’d get punched a lot and would have some terrible habits that are only stripped away from a person after lots of full contact striking-based sparring – no delusions there.
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Apr 11, 2012 20:00
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Decades posted:Sounds good to me, though two things I’d like to pick at as far as compatibility with Muay Thai. One is throws/trips, as in actually tossing your opponent to the ground. I’m ignorant as to how that would be scored in Muay Thai, but I think it would make sense to award points for it if that’s not already the case. The second more important thing is gloves, and this is a problem for pretty much any real or hypothetical attempt at sport WC. It works a lot better bare-handed, even though it doesn’t generally make sense to fight people that way. Open-handed mma gloves could be a reasonable compromise, but closed gloves, even smaller Muay Thai ones, would be significantly restrictive. Throws are not point-scored in MT, but they can count toward control of a fight. There's some kinds of throws that aren't allowed, but it'd take a very pro MT match before you'd be fouling for them. I get that having a glove on adds bulk, making it hard to work in tight gaps. And obviously harder to grip. Though I'd argue those things don't take away from letting you do the art safely with more realistic resistance (like actually punching someone in the face if there's an opening instead of showing or trying to pull the punch).
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Apr 11, 2012 21:40
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Decades posted:We’re very much on the same page here. I didn’t mean to suggest defending takedowns with strikes in my response. It’s the dropped hips that are the important element of the actual takedown defence. The strikes are there because if the opening presents itself, why wouldn’t they be? As I understand it the main reason we’d try to drop our hips while keeping both feet on the ground rather than sprawl is to permit us to keep hitting. Also keep in mind that I was talking about sparring a Judoka, who I’d expect to clinch high, rather than a wrestler who’d shoot low. Low shots are tougher to deal with for WC guys, but also probably for just about anyone. Well-rounded skillsets are best, and nothing is wrestling but wrestling. WC can’t beat wrestling at its own game, but I do think that the stuff I’ve been talking about beats any pure striking art in the takedown defense department. A judoka won't just clinch high, especially if it's nogi. Single and double leg takedowns are part of the judo curriculum and have only been recently banned from official competitions. They are also only banned when done straight up but are fine in combos so people still drill them.
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Apr 11, 2012 23:18
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kimbo305 posted:Throws are not point-scored in MT, but they can count toward control of a fight. Throws are big points in trad muay thai fights. If you mean you don't actually get a point for them, I guess you're right. But that doesn't make sense either because you can only lose a round 10-7 at the worst. But if a guy lands a bunch of punches but gets thrown once or twice a round cleanly, he's going to lose. Partially because punches are the least scoring points in trad Muay Thai (knees, then elbows, then kicks, then punches)
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Apr 11, 2012 23:20
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Guilty posted:Throws are big points in trad muay thai fights. If you mean you don't actually get a point for them, I guess you're right. But that doesn't make sense either because you can only lose a round 10-7 at the worst. But if a guy lands a bunch of punches but gets thrown once or twice a round cleanly, he's going to lose. Partially because punches are the least scoring points in trad Muay Thai (knees, then elbows, then kicks, then punches) Yeah, I just meant that MT doesn't assign point values to techniques, but instead whole rounds are assessed for who's winning and effective. While we're here, which throws are not allowed in MT? When our sanshou fighters are prepping for MT matches, the coach has to remind them what kinds of throws don't count or are illegal. Something to do with where your hands are and the hips or something...
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Apr 11, 2012 23:25
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Decades posted:Polyrhythmic Panda I can really only tell you to read my first post again. If wrestling and rolling count as sparring then the final section of my class outline does too. If I were to test my training in a boxing gym tomorrow I’d get punched a lot and would have some terrible habits that are only stripped away from a person after lots of full contact striking-based sparring – no delusions there. It actually has more in common with point sparring, since it isn't continuous. Point sparring is terrible. Also, the techniques used in wrestling and rolling are the same techniques people use in actual fights. Have you ever seen Chi Sao applied in a fight? Every time I see WC students sparring hard, they just look like really bad kickboxers. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Krg4k8uB4E8 Polyrhythmic Panda fucked around with this message at 00:28 on Apr 12, 2012 |
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Apr 12, 2012 00:10
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Decades posted:If you even skimmed my admittedly long-rear end post then by sparring you must mean full-contact striking. So who's going to break it to jiu-jitsu and wrestling that their styles are useless? I don't have the heart. Wrestling, in most of its forms, isn't a form of combat. The goal is a pin fall, not to injure or submit your opponent. BJJ is a combat art but it isn't a complete art and it doesn't have a whole lot of useful stuff on striking. These aren't problems because nobody expects a single art to be perfect at everything. Most arts are useful for focusing on specific skills, wrestling has good takedowns and scrambles, BJJ has good submissions and guard, Judo has some cool throws from the clinch, Boxing has excellent striking and movement and MT has good striking from the clinch and kicking. The rules for these sports limit sparring and competition to these actions, but they generally try to put as few restrictions on the area of focus as possible. WC has a general focus of striking, clinchwork and throwing from the clinch IIRC, but it tends to have rules that restrict your ability to practice these realistically. That's a serious problem.
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Apr 12, 2012 01:06
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Decades posted:We’re very much on the same page here. I didn’t mean to suggest defending takedowns with strikes in my response. It’s the dropped hips that are the important element of the actual takedown defence. The strikes are there because if the opening presents itself, why wouldn’t they be? As I understand it the main reason we’d try to drop our hips while keeping both feet on the ground rather than sprawl is to permit us to keep hitting. Also keep in mind that I was talking about sparring a Judoka, who I’d expect to clinch high, rather than a wrestler who’d shoot low. Low shots are tougher to deal with for WC guys, but also probably for just about anyone. Well-rounded skillsets are best, and nothing is wrestling but wrestling. WC can’t beat wrestling at its own game, but I do think that the stuff I’ve been talking about beats any pure striking art in the takedown defense department. No we aren't. I'm on the page entitled "Wing Chun is totally impractical." Go and watch the early UFCs, the ones before MMA was a thing and people were still rigidly adhering to the doctrine of their style. There's actually a fight or two with wing chun or kung fu practitioners. They were universally dominated by grapplers of all disciplines because none of their training gave them any tools to create or maintain good spacing and most of the grapplers had at least a rudimentary idea of how to get close to people. Saying a given style can't stand up to another given style at their own game is one thing, but you need to realize that if you want to maintain the spacing that suits something like WC, you're going to need some wrestling or jujitsu or whatever up your sleeve. Just lowering your hips won't stop a judoka from reaping a leg (if anything it'll help them) and it won't stop even a mediocre grappler from giving you a gravity assisted bear hug. You need to take elements of their arts to defend against them and once you're doing that in conjunction with your wing chun, you've ceased to practice wing chun and started to develop your unique version of MMA. If you enjoy your wing chun then that's awesome and you should keep it up, but it's important to appreciate it for what it is in practice and not what it could theoretically do. Also I just found out that the guy who's taught about 90% of all of the BJJ classes I've taken is moving back to Brazil to open his own gym and I'm kind of sad about it. It's not like there's a lack of awesome instructors at the gym, but still 
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Apr 12, 2012 01:13
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Decades posted:Thank you for not taking that Judo bit the wrong way. Judo rules and I have the biggest crush on Rhonda Rousey. Haven't tried it, just a little bit of bjj, but I'd definitely be interested. If I had to pick another art that was closest to the core of what we do it'd probably be Judo. We've got strikes and lack the gi, but I imagine if I were to jump ship, Judo's where my skills would be most applicable. I'm not experienced enough to have learnt the double legs properly, but we've dabbled a bit from some wrestlers and BJJ guys who have shown us after class but like thoguh said, grabbing below the belt used to be legal in competition and still exists in combos so most Judoka would have something. I'm envisioning that even if I can't get underhooks, I can just bear hug and take WC guy backwards with a leg trip (probably something like tani otoshi, staying a bit more square than that pic though so I land right on top instead of going for the IPPON!). You're right about us moving in will put in the WC range, but from what I've seen of WC I don't think you guys really have much of a knockout punch correct me if I'm wrong, I'm going off articles and shawn obasi vids so I wouldn't mind taking a few hits on the way in and then seek out an arm bar of strangle as they flail around underneath me. Thats my novice opinion though. Experienced grapplers would have a proper game plan but thats how I've always envisioned it going. And there's always the grab around the neck too and I can do something like koshi guruma or even osoto makikomi. And if they resist and pull back too much just take em backwards and watch them hit the back of their head on the ground. You should do Judo by the way. You seem more reasonable than most WC guys. My fiance dropped 40kg (88lbs for you americans) and did her first judo lesson last night and she loved the poo poo out of it and she's got no martial arts base at all. Her back is only mildly broken but thats semantics really because I've got someone to practice grip fighting with on weekends now! Smegmatron posted:Just lowering your hips won't stop a judoka from reaping a leg (if anything it'll help them)
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Apr 12, 2012 01:18
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I still think the the main disagreement I've got with anyone on this page boils down to "All Wing Chun is ineffective" vs "Almost all Wing Chun is ineffective." I have no interest in attempting a sweeping defense of all people and things identifying themselves as kung fu or WC - and in fact criticized other WC variations in pretty decent detail, so when people use the early UFCs (that I've watched repeatedly) and random sparring videos as reference points, I don't have much to say but "yup". Discussing specific elements of technique that I've actually brought up is a different story, and I'd be genuinely enthused to learn more about reaping the leg, etc. I'm a guy who stumbled into a particular class that I think is unique and cool and distinctly different from most and felt like sharing a bit of my personal thoughts and experiences. I feel like we're getting to the part of the discussion where y'all say "show me" (not unreasonable) and I have nothing to show (just the way it is). Some of the best things in life are not viewable on Youtube. Decades fucked around with this message at 01:49 on Apr 12, 2012 |
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Apr 12, 2012 01:33
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Decades posted:I still think the the main disagreement I've got with anyone on this page boils down to "All Wing Chun is ineffective" vs "Almost all Wing Chun is ineffective." Why would you think that your particular WC class is different when you don't even spar? How would you even know that what you're learning is effective? Decades posted:Some of the best things in life are not viewable on Youtube. Do you think you are a more effective fighter than those WC students on Youtube? Despite not being able to handle yourself in a boxing ring or on a wrestling mat, do you think you can handle yourself in a self defense situation? I'm just having a hard time imagining why someone would train WC knowing that it isn't very effective in terms of combat sports or self defense. Balance, fitness, and coordination are all things you can develop while learning something that is actually applicable in real situations. Polyrhythmic Panda fucked around with this message at 02:35 on Apr 12, 2012 |
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Apr 12, 2012 02:32
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I think it's reasonable to say you enjoy wc and don't care if you couldn't fight your way out of some thunder dome style situation. Put your dicks away boys and let's talk about what a wreck my hands and elbows are after starting to box. This gets better right? I think I'm still hyper extending my elbows, and prob need to wrap my hands tighter.
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Apr 12, 2012 02:41
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Gentlemen, we can't fight in here, this is the fighting thread!
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Apr 12, 2012 02:54
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You might just have to wrap your hands smarter, not tighter. In one class I was hitting the heavy bag and complained to my coach that my wrist was sore, he re-did my wrap for me and the pain basically disappeared for the rest of the night. It wasn't anything special but he did my hand a different way than I'd been doing, and then a lot of turns on the wrist to lock it down.
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Apr 12, 2012 02:58
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I wouldn't have a problem with it if he didn't say things like "it's potentially extremely effective" and just admit that he's doing it because of Hollywood, Bruce Lee, and sexy uniforms. If you want to do Tae Bo because it's fun that's fine, but don't go around theorizing and fantasizing about potential combat applications. Anyway, my guess with your hands is that they just need time to toughen up. Try not to bruise your knuckles though, it takes forever to heal. I have had problems in the past with my elbow though, specifically from throwing lead hooks. I think the problem was that my elbow wasn't high enough (forearm should be parallel to the ground), which is a pretty common thing with a lot of people, so that's something to look out for.
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Apr 12, 2012 03:00
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The opinion of every Wing Chun fighter that I've met is usually something like "You think Wing Chun is worthless? Well, the Wing Chun you see in OTHER places might be worthless, but the Wing Chun that I'VE learned is different." Yet nobody can prove it. It can't be shown on camera, it can't be shown in person. I'm sure you can understand my skepticism. I will continue to believe that 100% of it is worthless as a fighting method until somebody demonstrates its worth to me. At that point, I will be happy to eat my words, I just want to see it. If you do it for reasons other than self defence then good luck to you, but my biggest problem with it is that it's constantly marketed as some kind of ultimate self defense system.
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Apr 12, 2012 05:23
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NovemberMike posted:Wrestling, in most of its forms, isn't a form of combat. The goal is a pin fall, not to injure or submit your opponent. Meh. I'm not a wrestler but it seems quite close enough. A competent wrestler, against a comparatively untrained opponent, has pretty much won the fight if he's pinned you, hasn't he? He can either hold you for all eternity or, surely, find some way to work punches in without completely losing position (after all, he has forever to think that problem through while his opponent is helplessly pinned, losing stamina from desperate escape attempts, and probably having a hard time breathing). And that's assuming that a hard takedown on a non-mat surface hasn't already won the fight. (I guess you can turn that around and talk about how many wrestling techniques are too hard on the knees for concrete, but I don't think that problem is insurmountable and of course it applies to BJJ too.) McNerd fucked around with this message at 06:36 on Apr 12, 2012 |
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Apr 12, 2012 06:31
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In a no-gi streetfight a judoka isn't going to try to clinch with you or shoot on you if they have any sense, they're going to circle you and stay outside, maybe throw some kicks at your knees as you step to mess with your balance, and look for a russian 2 on 1 grip to ude-hishigi-waki-gatame (armpit armlock) so they can plant your face into the ground. Also, if you squat you're vulnerable to being off-balanced backwards, so I have no doubt that a judoka would have a field day with you if you sunk your hips without sprawling to keep punching as he came in- forearm deflect the punch and ko/o uchi makikomi as you drop your hips with an elbow between the eyes as your head hits the ground. CivilDisobedience fucked around with this message at 07:56 on Apr 12, 2012 |
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Apr 12, 2012 07:48
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CivilDisobedience posted:In a no-gi streetfight a judoka... I'm an idiot here, but how different would a shirt be from a gi in terms of a street fight? I understand there's no collar, but I'm fairly certain you could grab a handful of something. (Yes my understanding of gi-based Judo is that you get a collar to play with as well.)
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Apr 12, 2012 11:38
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BirdOfPlay posted:I'm an idiot here, but how different would a shirt be from a gi in terms of a street fight? I understand there's no collar, but I'm fairly certain you could grab a handful of something. (Yes my understanding of gi-based Judo is that you get a collar to play with as well.) I don't do judo, but my guess is that normal clothes are much flimsier than a GI and can be expected to rip if you grab them and try and do some throw.
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Apr 12, 2012 11:56
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Jackets are more akin to a gi than shirts. Which is good in cold cold Canada where people are wearing jackets for the majority of the year. As such I limit my street fighting judo to only beating the poo poo out of Hell's Angels plebs and keeping my nose clean for the months of June, July, and August.  speaking of shirts, have any of you been so exhausted after training that you accidentally grabbed and put on a training partner's shirt instead of your own? (Mine was yellow, his was dark brown...  )
Bangkero fucked around with this message at 13:46 on Apr 12, 2012 |
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Apr 12, 2012 13:43
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mewse posted:You might just have to wrap your hands smarter, not tighter. In one class I was hitting the heavy bag and complained to my coach that my wrist was sore, he re-did my wrap for me and the pain basically disappeared for the rest of the night. Makes sense, when my trainer did the wrapping I had zero pain. It started when I did my own. Guess I need more practice.
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Apr 12, 2012 14:22
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Speaking of martial arts vs other martial arts, a Norwegian television channel is running a show/competition called "Norges beste fighter", or Norway's best fighter, and it's like a mix of the ultimate fighter (with less drama) and the earlier UFCs (with more rules). They're basically following normal MMA rules, with the exception of not allowing any elbows. So far BJJ, muay thai, kickboxing and wrestling seems to be the order of the day, having knocked out taekwondo, TJJ, boxing and karate. You can check out the results so far yourself: http://translate.google.com/transla...fighter&act=url
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Apr 12, 2012 14:55
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Polyrhythmic Panda posted:If you want to do Tae Bo because it's fun that's fine, but don't go around theorizing and fantasizing about potential combat applications.
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Apr 12, 2012 15:15
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DekeThornton posted:I don't do judo, but my guess is that normal clothes are much flimsier than a GI and can be expected to rip if you grab them and try and do some throw. Yeah, you could maybe use a t-shirt for a choke, but certainly not for a throw. I can't think of many throws that can't be done off a wrestling grip or an underhook though.
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Apr 12, 2012 15:23
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Nierbo posted:Why not? Its fun. Isn't that how MMA was born? No. It was started because people who actually fight wanted to fight people from different backgrounds. Theory is great, but only if you have experience with what you're theorizing about and plan to actually test your theory.
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Apr 12, 2012 16:15
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02-6611-0142-1 posted:The opinion of every Wing Chun fighter that I've met is usually something like "You think Wing Chun is worthless? Well, the Wing Chun you see in OTHER places might be worthless, but the Wing Chun that I'VE learned is different." Yet nobody can prove it. It can't be shown on camera, it can't be shown in person. I'm sure you can understand my skepticism. I will continue to believe that 100% of it is worthless as a fighting method until somebody demonstrates its worth to me. At that point, I will be happy to eat my words, I just want to see it. If you do it for reasons other than self defence then good luck to you, but my biggest problem with it is that it's constantly marketed as some kind of ultimate self defense system. This is exactly the way I feel about crossfit. Everyone who does crossfit always says, "some gyms have bad technique, but MY GYM emphasizes good technique" but it is never, ever true.
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Apr 12, 2012 16:51
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I lurk in here and occasionally post HEMA stuff, so here you go: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IqA4_Mk897U This is from a tournament in Houston a month ago. I start on the left. We end up doubling out, meaning we hit each each other at the same time 3 times over the course of the match and both had a loss recorded.
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Apr 12, 2012 17:22
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Thoguh posted:Yeah, you could maybe use a t-shirt for a choke, but certainly not for a throw. I can't think of many throws that can't be done off a wrestling grip or an underhook though. I agree with most of this, but while it's true for flimsy t-shirts, pretty much anything tougher than that (button-down shirts, vests, knits, etc.) will work fine for a throw or two from my experience fighting with drunk friends. Anyway, I'd probably go for an underhook if I had to fight in "street clothes". That's what I do in no-gi BJJ and there's little to no difference for me between that and grabbing a gi. KingColliwog fucked around with this message at 19:09 on Apr 12, 2012 |
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Apr 12, 2012 17:28
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A flying piece of posted:We end up doubling out, meaning we hit each each other at the same time 3 times over the course of the match and both had a loss recorded. That seems frustrating.
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Apr 12, 2012 17:28
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