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wattershed posted:Apropos of nothing, they're apparently putting a Stone retail store in Oceanside, much more convenient for a lot of the coastal Orange County goons. Holy poo poo, that would put it right in the territory for me to hit them up when I'm visiting my mom. Details?
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Apr 22, 2012 04:10
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Opened my 3 year old Westy 12 tonight with the wife, so good.
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Apr 22, 2012 04:31
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Podima posted:Holy poo poo, that would put it right in the territory for me to hit them up when I'm visiting my mom. Details? They applied for a license of the same type of business as the one they have for the South Park retail store, nothing really known beyond that yet.
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Apr 22, 2012 04:58
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Oh man, Saison du Buff is up for our next Tap Nite. Weren't there some favorable posts about that recently? Looks like that may be my #200. Also quick notes after the Southern Tier Tap Nite the other night: Mokah- Very sweet, almost syrupy. Didn't taste much coffee flavor at all, if the tap handles were switched out and they said it was Choklat, I would have believed them. Wasn't too bad though. Jahva- The mellowest of the three (they couldn't get Pumking in time). Mouthfeel was more porter-like than stout. Okay but not knock-me-off-my-seat amazing. Creme Brulee- Two of my friends ordered it before I did. One couldn't finish their glass and the other took 3 hours to get through it. I had a few sips and it was like drinking a Yankee Candle, about 100 times sweeter than the bottle I had a few months ago. Ended up not ordering my own glass because I knew I couldn't finish a whole one either. So yeah, I guess I shouldn't be too surprised or anything  I finished the night with a Sam Adams Summer Ale as I needed to do a 180 from the super-sweet stouts. Was an okay wheat, not particularly memorable but I wouldn't turn it down if someone offered me one.
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Apr 22, 2012 05:47
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Valencia posted:it was like drinking a Yankee Candle That's probably the best description I've seen of ST Creme Brulee Stout. Remember how we were just talking about Stone having cheap bombers? My local Binny's just had Sublimely Self-Righteous on sale for $5.99 a bottle, and Arrogant Bastard for $3.99. But Lagunitas had them beat with Hop Stoopid for $3.49.  Needless to say, I'm having a pleasant night in for cheap tonight.
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Apr 22, 2012 06:03
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air- posted:Recently tried Left Hand Ambidextrous and it was outstanding. Every aspect of it (Milk Stout, Oak Aged Widdershins, Wake Up Dead Coffee Stout) came through and I'm surprised it was still balanced without being super boozy. I'm so excited to try Ambidextrous this new bar I discovered is going to have it on tap soon. They also had Goose Island Pere Jacques, Left Hand Milk Stout, Port Brewing Midnight Expression, and Avery Maharaja. They had more but that's what I ordered anyway. I had to get the Pere Jacques because the only way you can get Goose Island in New Jersey is to get it on tap, for now. I was impressed with it, one of the few Dubbels I really enjoyed.
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Apr 22, 2012 06:17
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wattershed posted:Sorry, can't let this slide by here, aside from Rogue's tiny bottles, how are either of them overpriced? Well to start I almost never get bombers because the $/oz usually sucks compared with 12oz bottles even for the same beer, so I'm not a good authority on bomber pricing. $6.50/bomber (22oz) = $19.50 six-pack (6*12oz). That's a poo poo price for beer, even really good beer. To be equal in price per ounce to a $10 six-pack (my personal upper limit for normal purchases), the bomber would have to be about $3. Growlers (64 oz) are also only sometimes a good deal. Using a $10 six-pack as a standard, the growler refill needs to be less than $8.90 to be equal $/oz. I've mostly seen them in the $10+ range for refills, even without buying the growler bottle, and they come with the extra time constraint of having to finish it before it goes flat once it's opened. By this same math, a 5-gallon Corny keg only needs to stay under $89/refill to be an equal deal, which is usually way more than they cost, so that's where you start really getting savings on bulk buying of beer. A $50 corny keg is equal to a $5.62 six-pack. For a 15.5 gallon keg to equal a $10 six-pack, it would have to cost $275. At a more 'normal price' (widely varying obviously) of $90 for a decent beer, that's equal to a $3.26 six-pack. berzerker fucked around with this message at 11:00 on Apr 22, 2012 |
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Apr 22, 2012 09:46
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berzerker posted:Well to start I almost never get bombers because the $/oz usually sucks compared with 12oz bottles even for the same beer, so I'm not a good authority on bomber pricing. $6.50/bomber (22oz) = $19.50 six-pack (6*12oz). That's a poo poo price for beer, even really good beer. To be equal in price per ounce to a $10 six-pack (my personal upper limit for normal purchases), the bomber would have to be about $3. Not to slap on my beer snob hat here, but I'm hard-pressed to think of a really good six pack for $10. Even a decent one, for that matter. The reality of the situation is most of the time, better beers aren't in six packs because random buyers will see the price and balk at it. Knowledgeable buyers know what they're getting with singles, though, and that negates the need to sell in bulk. You can't compare what shows up in a sixer to what's sold in bombers because what usually makes it into a bomber is made with a more expensive ingredient list than your run of the mill APA. Is a bomber of St. Bernardus 12 too expensive? Despite the ingredient bill and quality? You say a bomber would have to be $3 to fit into your price range, yet there are no bombers at that price, so either the whole industry is out of sorts, or maybe your standards are askew?
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Apr 22, 2012 16:52
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Weebay posted:I'll confirm that for you, if you don't have a ticket, they won't let you in; the event was getting too crowded so they capped it. Weebay, I have been trying to find that business card and I can't to save my life. Seeing that you don't have PMs, I hope you continue to read this thread. Email me at jmurra7 at gmail so we can set something up.
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Apr 22, 2012 16:55
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wattershed posted:Not to slap on my beer snob hat here, but I'm hard-pressed to think of a really good six pack for $10. Even a decent one, for that matter. Left Hand Milk Stout is $10 for a six. So are the vast majority of beers from Troegs and Victory. Sierra Nevada Pale is like $16 for a dozen, I think Torpedo and Celebration are about $10 a six too.
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Apr 22, 2012 16:58
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wattershed posted:Not to slap on my beer snob hat here, but I'm hard-pressed to think of a really good six pack for $10. Even a decent one, for that matter. Nugget Nectar, Cigar City Tocobaga/Jai Alai/Maduro, Bell's Two-Hearted, 3F Zombie Dust/Alpha King, Lagunitas Little Sumpin' Sumpin, Weihenstephaner's likeup, none of those do it for you?
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Apr 22, 2012 17:03
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Arnold of Soissons posted:Left Hand Milk Stout is $10 for a six. So are the vast majority of beers from Troegs and Victory. Sierra Nevada Pale is like $16 for a dozen, I think Torpedo and Celebration are about $10 a six too. Came here to say this. There are many great beers for $10 for a 6 pack. It seems many people are getting money and quality confused, which seems to be the biggest problem of any hobby, just look at Audiophiles.
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Apr 22, 2012 17:04
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Arnold of Soissons posted:Left Hand Milk Stout is $10 for a six. So are the vast majority of beers from Troegs and Victory. Sierra Nevada Pale is like $16 for a dozen, I think Torpedo and Celebration are about $10 a six too. please let's not rehash the $10 sixer conversation from a few weeks back... as for bombers, the price point is higher because they're usually higher-end beers. it's not a fair comparison.
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Apr 22, 2012 17:07
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danbanana posted:please let's not rehash the $10 sixer conversation from a few weeks back... Agreed.. Troegs and Victory are 11.99 where I'm at. Prices differ from region to region. danbanana posted:as for bombers, the price point is higher because they're usually higher-end beers. it's not a fair comparison. I'm am not sure that makes sense though, why would I get a Unibroue bomber for example @8.99 when I could get ~48oz. (almost double) for $12. The only bombers I buy are usually ones that aren't offered in 12oz. packs, and local brews that are good and cheap ($3-4 / 22oz.) TenaciousTomato fucked around with this message at 17:42 on Apr 22, 2012 |
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Apr 22, 2012 17:34
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wattershed posted:Not to slap on my beer snob hat here, but I'm hard-pressed to think of a really good six pack for $10. Even a decent one, for that matter. The reality of the situation is most of the time, better beers aren't in six packs because random buyers will see the price and balk at it. Knowledgeable buyers know what they're getting with singles, though, and that negates the need to sell in bulk. You can't compare what shows up in a sixer to what's sold in bombers because what usually makes it into a bomber is made with a more expensive ingredient list than your run of the mill APA. danbanana posted:please let's not rehash the $10 sixer conversation from a few weeks back... Of course they're (nominally) high end beers, but that's still not really an excuse because 1) there's LOTS of great beers for under $10 for a six-pack, and I've almost never seen a six-pack as expensive as the $20/six-pack to match a ($6.50, relatively cheap) bomber's $/oz, 2) lots of places let you mix-and-match a six-pack so you can still get experimentation and variety, and 3) there are a lot of beers sold in both six-pack and bomber format and the bomber is unreasonably more expensive. Yes, the market is messed up there, or rather able to achieve much greater efficiency at 12oz bottles than rarer shapes. If you HAVE to have Arrogant Bastard then by all means go ahead, maybe your taste buds really are more sophisticated than mine, but I have no lack of choices in six-pack (or individual 12-oz bottle) format. Granted, I hate sweet/fruity beers so most belgians are right out the window, and thus a lot of the expensive craft beer market, so my tastes - as always - aren't everyone's. I absolutely don't buy the premise that bombers are incomparable to 12oz bottles because you can't get as good of beer in 12oz as you can in bombers - there's just lots of lovely beer in 12oz as well as beer as good as anything you can get anywhere. Bombers are definitely marketed to beer 'connoisseurs' which means an inelastic market and willingness to buy at much higher prices, which some people are obviously willing to pay. Good for you if you're among them. Still, I don't buy that that really means better quality in any meaningfully general sense (i.e. taste and personal preference, the only ones that really matter).
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Apr 22, 2012 17:40
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TenaciousTomato posted:I'm am not sure that makes sense though, why would I get a Unibroue bomber for example @8.99 when I could get ~48oz. (almost double) for $12. The only bombers I buy are usually ones that aren't offered in 12oz. packs, and local brews that are good and cheap ($3-4 / 22oz.) I justify purchasing over bombers is that it's cheaper on a per trial basis usually. If I can't get a single of a Unibroue beer, but can get a bomber and want to try it out, I'll buy the bomber as it's cheaper than a pack of it. I think it's also the format as well, it's just cool to pour beer from a bomber, don't ask me why.
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Apr 22, 2012 17:45
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berzerker posted:Bombers are definitely marketed to beer 'connoisseurs' which means an inelastic market and willingness to buy at much higher prices, which some people are obviously willing to pay. Good for you if you're among them. Still, I don't buy that that really means better quality in any meaningfully general sense (i.e. taste and personal preference, the only ones that really matter). if taste and personal preference are your arguments, then what does cost matter? i'm going to drink the stuff i like and i'm going to spend the money i'm willing to spend to try new things. that i'm paying more per ounce than you doesn't mean i'm getting ripped off. pricier beer is usually that way for a reason: smaller batches, limited release, more costly production methods. that makes them incomparable because, y'know, they're different.
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Apr 22, 2012 18:19
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danbanana posted:pricier beer is usually that way for a reason: smaller batches, limited release, more costly production methods. that makes them incomparable because, y'know, they're different. If we're all honest, this only accounts for the beer being more expensive some of the time. The rest of the time it's just because they know you'll pay more.
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Apr 22, 2012 18:35
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danbanana posted:if taste and personal preference are your arguments, then what does cost matter? i'm going to drink the stuff i like and i'm going to spend the money i'm willing to spend to try new things. that i'm paying more per ounce than you doesn't mean i'm getting ripped off. Taste and personal preference are the only things that make beer good or bad. The value (quality/$) of beer is an important consideration as a beer consumer. If I was Mitt Romney, maybe I'd only care about the absolute quality of beer, but until then I avoid paying twice as much for the same beer, which I don't think is so wild of a position. I totally accept that there are people who really experience a better beer (even if I might not, for personal preference reasons) from particular fancy organic hop, small batch, etc. etc. beers exclusively available in a bomber, but even if I thought it was a 50% better beer, I'm not going to be happy paying 200% more for it. That much is just me personally - I don't expect others to adopt my level of thriftiness and it's not worth discussing too deeply. What I do object to as a broader argument is the idea that bombers are generally the only place to find the best beers. My absolute favorite beers are either exclusively tap or available in 12oz bottles. That means that the substantial additional cost of buying in bombers is unjustified for any reason but pure curiosity in trying new beers (which I agree is sometimes worth the cost, just not often, since there are always more to try in cheaper formats too). Sure, price correlates to quality to some extent, sometimes for good reason, but you can't possibly be arguing it's anywhere near to a perfect correlation. Higher quality usually means higher price, but higher price is not a reliable indicator of higher quality. berzerker fucked around with this message at 18:53 on Apr 22, 2012 |
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Apr 22, 2012 18:50
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Like I said before: I like Arrogant Bastard. I didn't say before: I hardly ever buy it. The reason is because it only comes in 22oz bottles, not in six packs. Now, my wife is every as nerdy about beer as I am, so for us a six pack is basically three servings, a 750 or 22oz is one serving each. For huge beers, or special beers, splitting a big bottle is fine and sometimes even preferable to drinking it alone. But for something like Arrogant Bastard, we wind up paying $6 to each get a little less than one normal bottle of good-but-basically-normal beer. That's just a flat out lovely deal compared to $9-10 for three beers each.
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Apr 22, 2012 19:18
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Hoppin Frog stuff is only available in bombers. I don't think some of them are worth the price they charge, but I think all of their beers are good for the most part. I've tried every single beer they've produced, and there are few which I would never think about buying again. Other breweries which I don't think produce any 6 pack stuff (although I can't say for sure cause I don't live close to them like I do HF, and don't know as much about them): Alpine, Anchorage Brewing, Jester King, Jolly Pumpkin. JP produces stuff in smaller bottles, but it's still sold by the bottle. There's a ton of stuff from certain breweries/certain styles you basically wouldn't get to drink if you only bought 6 packs. I think this debate is really stupid to have. Sure, enjoy your $10/6 pack, and I still will, too, but I'll also buy bombers, and not complain when I have to spend $10/22 oz for some phenomenal rear end beer which I wouldn't get to try unless I spent extra money. Breweries can do what they will with pricing, if people don't think it's good, they won't keep buying it.
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Apr 22, 2012 20:55
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Wrapped up a pint of Bison Honey Basil. Comes in hot on the heels of the DFH Saison du Buff, but lacks the complexity. The basil is pronounced, strong, and well-balanced. It's bitterness is offset by the honey and the malt profile. This, like the DFH brew, should be paired with food. By itself, it is merely a curiosity. Not bad, but certainly not a casual drinker.
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Apr 22, 2012 21:14
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What do you guys think about drinking a Drie Fonteinen Oude Geuze the same night as drinking some Belgian Tripels/Quads? Should I start out with the Geuze, or the Belgians? I know that the Geuze will have a really strong/complex flavor, and I know the Quad will too. I just don't want the Geuze to throw off the flavor of any of the other beers, cause I know sometimes I feel like if I drink a strong IPA, any beers after that seem to not be quite the same.
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Apr 22, 2012 21:21
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Go with the geuze first, as it is sweeter of the two, imo. Then, after that sets in you can sip on some quads and trips and get krunk. I would eat an appropriate meal with either style as well.
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Apr 22, 2012 21:43
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I'm drinking a Southampton Biere de Garde, my first experience with the style. Is this a pretty good representation of the style? I like it, but its not at all what I expected - something about the name made me think it would be much more similar to a saison.
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Apr 22, 2012 21:50
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Arnold of Soissons posted:If we're all honest, this only accounts for the beer being more expensive some of the time. The rest of the time it's just because they know you'll pay more. i completely disagree. smaller batch runs means more production cost per ounce. then add non-standard ingredients, non-standard brewing techniques, and secondary processes. this is why some beers are more expensive. it's simple manufacturing economics. while i admit that profit gouging certainly occurs, it's not the sole reason why everything a brewery makes isn't $10 a sixer. the same logic that says it's silly to pay for a $15 bomber of something when there's a $10 sixer available can be applied to natty light: why pay $10 for something when you can get "the same thing" for $3? it's absurd, of course, because they're NOT the same thing.
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Apr 22, 2012 22:02
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RiggenBlaque posted:I'm drinking a Southampton Biere de Garde, my first experience with the style. Is this a pretty good representation of the style? I like it, but its not at all what I expected - something about the name made me think it would be much more similar to a saison. As compared to a saison, it should be a bit darker, sweeter, stronger and less hoppy, though not very dark or very sweet or very strong. Copper-ish color, up to maybe 7%ish, sweet more like a marzen than a Vienna.
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Apr 22, 2012 22:03
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danbanana posted:i completely disagree. smaller batch runs means more production cost per ounce. then add non-standard ingredients, non-standard brewing techniques, and secondary processes. this is why some beers are more expensive. it's simple manufacturing economics. while i admit that profit gouging certainly occurs, it's not the sole reason why everything a brewery makes isn't $10 a sixer. When a brewery makes a "special" version of a beer, the price difference is completely unrelated to the expense increase in producing it. What the market will bear is by far the determining factor in the price you pay for beer made in the USA. There are a few exceptions, but not many. Chocolate Yeti doesn't cost 30% more to make, for example, and you're an idiot if you think it does. Belgian Yeti is literally the exact same everything, but they pitch a different yeast into the fermenting tank. The difference in cost to them is negligible, and any difference in the price you pay is profit for the brewery. It's Ok that the brewery charges more money and makes a profit or extra profit. They need to eat too and obviously people are willing to pay the prices, myself included. But barley, yeast and water are dirt cheap, and hops and any other normal additives aren't really expensive either. Beer is just plain a cheap thing to make, unless you start storing whole production runs of it for a while.
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Apr 22, 2012 22:12
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Yeast is not cheap, at least when you're using specific yeast. There is a cost to culture and sustain yeast strains. There's a lot of lab QA/QC that goes on. Beer gets expensive, fast. Look at the grain and hops bills for something like DFH 120, for instance. And that doesn't even begin to cover the time it takes, on the brewery's system, to handle the boil, the fermentation, etc. Time literally is money. Are there beers that are overpriced? Sure. But is every expensive beer overpriced? Certainly not.
FreelanceSocialist fucked around with this message at 22:29 on Apr 22, 2012 |
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Apr 22, 2012 22:24
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Arnold of Soissons posted:When a brewery makes a "special" version of a beer, the price difference is completely unrelated to the expense increase in producing it. What the market will bear is by far the determining factor in the price you pay for beer made in the USA. There are a few exceptions, but not many. Chocolate Yeti doesn't cost 30% more to make, for example, and you're an idiot if you think it does. Belgian Yeti is literally the exact same everything, but they pitch a different yeast into the fermenting tank. The difference in cost to them is negligible, and any difference in the price you pay is profit for the brewery. smaller batches = higher production cost. this is a really, really simple economic concept in manufacturing because the overhead for a small batch is much higher than a large one (production changeover time, more labor per output, more QC steps, added cost of separate storage, separate packaging requirements, etc.) does chocolate yeti cost 30% more in ingredients? probably not, but it doesn't result in a full 30 extra points profit either. to quote someone here, "you're an idiot if you think it does." (thanks, by the way, for the nice little dig. it's wonderful to engage in conversation that results in personal insults!) and since a lot of "specials" require "special" processes, that adds more cost. barrel aging, as an example, is hugely expensive. not just because of extra equipment needed (initial investment costs that need to be covered later in pricing), but because it requires additional warehousing (hello, overhead), possibly additional climate conditions (oh, mr. overhead! nice to see you again!), and generally delays release time. it sure as hell isn't just-in-time manufacturing. conversely, beers in which freshness is a critical component require additional forethought in shipping schedules and inventory processing, which, y'know, adds cost. so on top of the extra ingredients and processing that goes into, say, a DIPA compared to it's IPA sibling, there's other considerations needed. and each one of those costs money. if breweries wanted to really gouge, they could. i'm sure some do. but FFF knows drat well that selling bottles of dark lord at $15 per is below true market value. that they don't sell it for $75 is a testament to the industry and the way it treats it's customers. (USER WAS PUT ON PROBATION FOR THIS POST)
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Apr 22, 2012 22:33
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FreelanceSocialist posted:Yeast is not cheap, at least when you're using specific yeast. There is a cost to culture and sustain yeast strains. There's a lot of lab QA/QC that goes on. Beer gets expensive, fast. Look at the grain and hops bills for something like DFH 120, for instance. And that doesn't even begin to cover the time it takes, on the brewery's system, to handle the boil, the fermentation, etc. Time literally is money. Are there beers that are overpriced? Sure. But is every expensive beer overpriced? Certainly not. and this.
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Apr 22, 2012 22:33
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I tried three philosophers and chimay grand ale and I am hooked. Where do I go from here?
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Apr 22, 2012 23:03
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danbanana posted:i completely disagree. smaller batch runs means more production cost per ounce. then add non-standard ingredients, non-standard brewing techniques, and secondary processes. this is why some beers are more expensive. it's simple manufacturing economics. while i admit that profit gouging certainly occurs, it's not the sole reason why everything a brewery makes isn't $10 a sixer. No, I mean often there is literally the same beer available in six-pack and bomber form on the shelf in a well-stocked beer store (Total Wine, BevMo, etc.), and the bomber is usually $/oz twice the price. Obviously plenty of beers come only in one or the other, but the basic point I was making in comparing the pricing on those that do both is that it's just a costlier container by and large. Here's my favorite brewery just for one simple example: http://barrelhouse.drinkdrakes.com/?page_id=32 $7.99 six-pack, $6.50 bomber, for an excellent (and identical) microbrew. Or, look at bevmo or Total Wine's websites, that's easy to compare because they list alphabetically so the same beer gets listed in a row in different packaging. Bombers come with a significant surcharge for, I guess, the convenience of it being only one bottle or something. http://www.bevmo.com/Shop/ProductList.aspx?N=41+4294956807&area=Beer&No=40&Ns=Name|0 Anyway, the original argument went something like 'I don't like Stone and Rogue, they're always way overpriced' (largely since they're mostly sold in bombers) -> rejection of that because they're among the cheapest bombers -> 'okay but bombers are way overpriced in general.' If you really want that beer that's only in that bomber, I have absolutely no problem with that, and likely there's plenty of times I'd do the same depending on my mood and what else is being sold nearby. I just don't think Rogue or Stone are very competitive because they're way overpriced for the quality (completely subjective) of what they offer, whatever the reason for that. There's tons of six-packs of $10 and under beer that are actually HIGHER quality (completely subjective). berzerker fucked around with this message at 23:17 on Apr 22, 2012 |
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Apr 22, 2012 23:03
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Bioshuffle posted:I tried three philosophers and chimay grand ale and I am hooked. Where do I go from here? If you've never had it, St. Bernardus Abt 12
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Apr 22, 2012 23:06
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Bioshuffle posted:I tried three philosophers and chimay grand ale and I am hooked. Where do I go from here? Rochefort 10, The Sixth Glass by Boulevard, and V12 by Victory.
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Apr 22, 2012 23:36
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Allagash Tripel, Brasserie des Rocs Brun, Unibroue Trois Pistoles... Any decent Belgian is great if you enjoyed 3 Philosophers and Chimay Blue.
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Apr 23, 2012 00:28
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Welp, I'm officially a volunteer at the American Craft Beer Fest in Boston this June. Still not sure when and where I'll be, but I'm already kinda sad because it sounds like they give away beer after closing up shop for the night, and I won't be able to stay that late or I'd miss the train home. Spent the weekend on Cape Cod and visited the, you guessed it, Cape Cod Beer company. It's not much of a tour since it's really only one room, but they pour samples of pretty much everything. I'd never had anything from them before, but I liked everything enough to buy a bottle of porter and a pint glass.
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Apr 23, 2012 01:39
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CalvinDooglas posted:Brasserie des Rocs Brun This beer doesn't get talked about enough. Such an underrated beer, it's got a unique profile but definitely fits in the group of reasonable suggestions. It's the zig to the zag that is Rochefort, St. Bernardus, Victory V-12, Malheur 12, etc. Oh and it also comes in four packs and singles so we can all agree on how to best purchase and enjoy it!
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Apr 23, 2012 03:00
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Back in Houston now, and wow, how much has changed. My local walking-distance watering hole's selection would have been considered an IPA hop nerd heaven a coupla years ago, but now it's pretty normal apparently for bars to have at least the IPAs from all kinds of Houston and Austin breweries on tap. It certainly goes with the stagnant night air pretty well. It seems like there're two breweries that are trying to go all Belgian-style in Austin now. One is Jester King, which has BA street cred out the rear end and has been going all Brett in the past half year-ish. The other is Adelbert's Brewery, which has a homepage right out of 1998 (and labels from about 1978) but do some seriously awesome poo poo -- I had the Naked Nun witbier of theirs and it was among the best American versions I've had. Also a new beer bar opened up just a few blocks from me that has this frequent-drinker program in action; IMO the best version of this sorta thing I've seen so far. Educate while filling your gut. SUPER HASSLER fucked around with this message at 03:55 on Apr 23, 2012 |
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Apr 23, 2012 03:00
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HaandBryggeit's Dark Force is pretty decent, but gently caress this is worse than bourbon going down. I feel like I have heartburn as a strong alcohol and spice finish goes down my throat. I don't know how old this is, since the sticker was peeled off, but this is batch 342 and it's definitely way too hot on the finish.
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Apr 23, 2012 03:24
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