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Another thing that might be worth looking into down the line is a double or triple strung harp. One in particular that I'm interested in for jazz is a double strung where one side is tuned naturally and the other set is chromatic. One I have heard and heard good things about is about $880 ( Stoney End Specialty Harps), though not a zillion octaves. Those are a little harder to source just because you usually end up needing to find a specific harp maker and or special order them. So chromatic stuff isn't impossible, but if you definitely want lever you'll probably find it easier to go with double strung over having to constantly flip levers. Triple is the same, only the two outside sets are naturals with the center chromatic--you place a little farther in. Edit: The other things is consider renting for a month or two if you want to test out the waters. A lot of harp makers will allow for renting or trying out if you are in the area. felgs fucked around with this message at 23:26 on May 2, 2012 |
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May 2, 2012 23:23
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But... but... you are getting in the way of my instant gratification! More seriously, there's always a problem with buying a major musical instrument, in that you have to balance "what will I need three years from now" with "will I still care enough to be playing three years from now" with "will this instrument be so awful it will make me loathe playing and quit". I don't want either to get something that is way overpowered for what I want to do now or is so limiting that I won't get to enjoy the instrument. In my case, I want to be able to play O'Carolan and bits of Medieval/Renaissance music and modern Anglo/Irish/Scots/... folk of various sorts. Most of the stuff I want to play won't require complex keys, or shifting keys significantly in mid-piece. A triple harp would be complete overkill for me, just as a pedal harp would be. I am a very shy person, so I'm not going to be doing much ensemble work; that means that volume isn't significant. I live in a very music-friendly area (SF Bay) and I'm quietly looking at local stores and makers to see where I can go for a test drive. If anybody knows builders or stores they recommend, that would be ideal. Edit: I'm judging instruments partly by the sheet-music repertoire. Given that these exist: http://www.folkharp.com/product/ballads-and-court-dances-of-the-16th-and-17th-centuries http://www.folkharp.com/product/early-music-for-the-harp http://www.folkharp.com/product/40-o-carolan-tunes-for-all-harps http://www.folkharp.com/product/baroque-music-for-the-harp http://www.folkharp.com/product/pieces-classiques-vol-1 I'm pretty sure I can have a good time with a lever harp. Arsenic Lupin fucked around with this message at 01:23 on May 3, 2012 |
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May 3, 2012 01:14
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Oh definitely, I have a blast with mine.  Thus the 'worth looking into way down the line.' I certainly didn't mean now, just that if you keep with it and it interests you it could be way cool.Also I just love finding reasons to look at harps I'm sorry 
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May 3, 2012 03:26
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There's no reason to be sorry; I'm enjoying this conversation, but we're probably boring everybody else. New question: I have located somebody local who teaches lap harp and occasionally gives classes at a music store I trust. (Basically, if Gryphon Strings in Palo Alto trusts somebody to give a class, I'm willing to give it a go.) She also does harp rental for new students. Apart from basic personality compatibility, what do you look for in a music teacher?
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May 3, 2012 19:03
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I like to know what sorts of things they enjoy playing, since that will likely help. If they know nothing about what you are interested in, that might make it a little trickier. The biggest thing for me, though, has to be whether I understand them. If I can't understand their teaching style it's frustrating and a waste of both our times (and my money). I don't mean I instantly get everything, but if I'm struggling with grasping a concept, they know either multiple ways to explain it or are willing to work with me to make sure I grasp it. I know that sounds pretty 'duh' but I've had not just music teachers who I liked as people and simply could not stand learning from because we were coming from two ways of understanding/thinking so different I never learned anything.
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May 4, 2012 05:26
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I know it isn't a "weird" instrument but I figure this is the best place to ask: Is it possible to teach yourself how to play the piano / keyboard? Actually, what are the differences between the two? Are they even interchangeable skills? I'm not entirely opposed to getting lessons, but it would be awesome if there was some great self-teaching resource out there. I don't even know how to read music, which I'm sure is an important place to start, and I'm just not sure how much of a colossal undertaking all of this would be on my own. I've got some old Casio keyboard collecting dust in my attic and I'd love to be able to figure out how to play the drat thing.
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May 4, 2012 06:17
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I'm teaching myself keyboard right now. If you're doing classical, you probably should just get lessons first to avoid learning all the bad habits that will hold you back. If you want to do pop piano or accompany yourself or others, it's super easy. Probably the easiest instrument I've ever learned, you can't really squeak/overblow/club a note on piano. I don't know where you're starting off from, I learned the basics (like which key is what note, simple triad chords, etc) years ago while learning other instruments and theory so I've been focusing on stuff like rhythmic patterns between the right and left hand, and simple voice leading that's appropriate for pop. Check out billhiltonbiz's channel on YouTube, he has a ton of really useful, practical lessons on piano that are nicely broken up into exercises you can play and apply to any music you're working on.
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May 4, 2012 07:10
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Mradyfist posted:I'm teaching myself keyboard right now. If you're doing classical, you probably should just get lessons first to avoid learning all the bad habits that will hold you back. If you want to do pop piano or accompany yourself or others, it's super easy. Probably the easiest instrument I've ever learned, you can't really squeak/overblow/club a note on piano. Cool, thanks. I like classical piano arrangements, but I'm more interested in random blues / jazz pieces and stuff. I plan to learn as much as I can on my own, and if it seems like something I will stick with, moving on to actual instruction. Money's a bit tight now so I am hesitant to start with actual lessons in case it just isn't for me, but learning a few bad habits is just a risk I'll have to take right now.
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May 4, 2012 07:17
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Stoca Zola posted:If you're not a mellow meditational NA flute kind of person or not interested in traditional Irish music either then this could be the right instrument for you. Oh, you son of a bitch. If I hadn't been drinking tequila and showing a friend this thread I'd let this slide. Harmonica now ordered! I'm also going to learn to NAF this roll line for retribution: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EXj4V_lgvdE :edit: Wow, that came out a lot more aggressive than it sounded in my mind, sorry about that. Anyways, NAF is indeed great for the slow meditational type of style that Stoca references, but don't discount the ability to get bright notes out of it! It may not be the sharpest sounding instrument, but not everything you do has to be a solemn sounding hymn. I'd liken it to a church organ. You have to believe every once in a while after vespers a bored monk would get funky with that thing. TurdBurgles fucked around with this message at 02:59 on May 5, 2012 |
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May 5, 2012 02:47
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Arsenic Lupin posted:@Tap: Meaning the Sharpsicle or possibly the Flatsicle, both of which can be expanded to a full set of sharping levers should I get seriously into chromatic stuff. To begin with, I'd be very happy if I could play "La Follia" and "Monsieur's Almain" and such like, as well as a dollop of O'Carolan. (I admire viols, but am never ever going to put myself in a situation where I have to worry about bowed tone again.) One consideration: if accompanying others isn't a major concern, nor instant key changes, and you're okay transposing, the money spent levering-up a Sharpsicle might be better set aside for your future upgrade harp. I still have no qualms recommending the Harpsicle, but I have read the argument that the bang-for-the-buck decreases as you gussy it up, so it's best used as a simple affordable no-frills leverless folk harp. For example, the Dusty Strings Ravenna model (which I understand to be a go-to deluxe starter) in its 26-string form runs $700 plain vs. the $400 for a Harpsicle 26. So a pretty big difference there. However, at the other end a full-levered Ravenna 26 is $1100 vice $800 for a fully-levered "Fullsicle". I'd reckon $800 to $1100 isn't a huge jump to get a much nicer harp, whereas $400 is pretty competitive to the $700 basic model. Not to belabour it, but my point is the max economy of the Harpsicle is at the basic versions. Felicity: did you find the levers on your generic to be really key in the initial learning stages, or just a nice option you lucked into for your starter harp? quote:Cool, thanks. I like classical piano arrangements, but I'm more interested in random blues / jazz pieces and stuff. ... Certainly feel free to post here with any instrument questions in general, but I do believe there's a piano beginner (or piano mega-) thread in NMD:Musicians' Lounge sub-forum that might have more specialised folks. So worth pinging that thread as well. Tomorrow's goal is to go to the Sunday market in Zagreb and see if I can find any cool Croatian instruments that are small enough to carry with me for a bit, or mail home. I'll be up in the Istria region next, and if the opportunity arises I wouldn't mind picking up a decent Istrian double-chantered bagpipe: 
TapTheForwardAssist fucked around with this message at 15:55 on May 5, 2012 |
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May 5, 2012 15:45
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TapTheForwardAssist posted:Felicity: did you find the levers on your generic to be really key in the initial learning stages, or just a nice option you lucked into for your starter harp? It was a nice thing I happened to luck into. A lot of the beginner music out there has no key changes, and certainly no random accidentals mid song. Plus, since most songs are written for one key, you can retune to that key. Levers are a nice little feature, and neat for loving around with, but I don't actually use them for any songs. Also, that bagpipe was once a cow. I mean, I know that makes sense, but I'm finding it really amusing.
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May 5, 2012 15:57
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I'm kind of imagining the cow bagpipe as producing differently pitched moos, I hope it does.
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May 5, 2012 18:26
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TapTheForwardAssist posted:Okay, a few ways to go here. At the price you're looking at your options are: Whoo, just bought a pretty neat looking synthetic didj thanks to your awesome post. It was actually really hard to get any information on it (they didn't list the key or anything), but it's 56", which was the longest one I could find and it was only $32, so what the hell. It should be here by next week. Thanks so much for all the advice
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May 7, 2012 00:07
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TapTheForwardAssist, your advice is incredibly useful; thank you. The harpist I'm meeting for lessons (today, yippeee!) has a wide range of rentals to try, including a Dusty String. I may wind up Ravenna-addicted, even though they don't come in blue.
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May 7, 2012 16:58
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Wampa Stompa posted:Whoo, just bought a pretty neat looking synthetic didj thanks to your awesome post. It was actually really hard to get any information on it (they didn't list the key or anything), but it's 56", which was the longest one I could find and it was only $32, so what the hell. It should be here by next week. Thanks so much for all the advice Good deal, link? So you have some time to read up online about technique, and then start applying it. There are a whole lot of interesting ways to work didj into various musical styles, solo and ensemble, so some reading up online, watching other players, etc. should help expand your horizons. There are also several didj forums, though I'm not sure what the best one is. I've added your name to the list of new weird instrument goons on pg 14 or so, but I might end up moving the list up to Page 1 to chronicle the unfolding events. Arsenic Lupin posted:TapTheForwardAssist, your advice is incredibly useful; thank you. The harpist I'm meeting for lessons (today, yippeee!) has a wide range of rentals to try, including a Dusty String. I may wind up Ravenna-addicted, even though they don't come in blue. No worries, and really glad Felicity is here for all the technical info. Also glad to see you're giving lessons and rental a shot; one of those good "adult" decisions that'll likely pay off for you going forward. Just check in with us once you get a bit into it to the point where we can fairly add you to the list of goons who've taken up a new instrument. For Croatia, finding traditional musical instruments has been far tougher than I thought. In, say, Turkey or Ecuador any music store you go into will have some local instruments. I've tried asking around in a couple cities, and it mainly appears that trad instruments here just aren't sold on the retail market. If you want to play them, you ask around with other trad musicians, get the name of some old dude living 30 miles out into the woods, and drive out to his house to negotiate a custom order to pick up in a month. Too bad, if Croatian bagpipes were cheap and could be found by asking the right shop (which I managed to do poking around the central souq in Bahrain) I'd have grabbed a couple. As it is all I've seen are one large tamburica and one big baglama-like instrument but with metal frets at Zagreb's weekly antique market (both old and in rough shape), and at their enormous weekly swap meet I saw one piano accordion, one button accordion, and one single guy with a small tamburica. But it had some soundboard cracking, bridge was set in the wrong place and then glued down, so I would've had to jimmy away glue to even set the action right. I'm not even terribly fond of tamburica, since it's kind of like a whiny mandolin, but presented with a good deal I would've bought one to bring home and Craigslist just on the general principle of spreading cool instruments around. I just was hoping to find a diple or two for $20 each. I've noticed too that a lot of diples have a notch cut around the mouthpiece, leading me to believe many of them are actually dual-use for mouthblown or bagpipe. A notch being the common way to prep the wood so the strings can knot around the bag to secure it to the stock of the wooden pipe. I would almost look for a Croatian gusle, but I already used to own one I bought at a swap meet in Seattle. It's basically a one-string lyre for accompanying ballads, so it's a little monotonous but with a certain minimalist hypnotic quality: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=b0c8sj4mPus  FAKE EDIT: I'm still convinced that the boha of Gascony, France is influenced by Balkan bagpipes. It doesn't resemble any pipe remotely near it, even not so much the Italian multi-chantered bagpipes. But it's almost a dead-ringer for the Istrian bagpipe of Croatia, sometimes right down to the metal/carving ornaments. It's not as far-fetched as it sounds, Croatian mercenaries introduced the necktie to France (thus the term "cravat" from "Croat"), so a few of them introducing this type of bagpipe isn't impossible.  It does sound less weird than the Balkan pipe though, or at least most Western. Pro-tip, most of the YouTube videos for these are only tagged in French, so "boha cornemuse" or even just "boha" seems the most effective search: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JFIdXxq0_Bg&feature=related
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May 7, 2012 19:56
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quote:I'm not even terribly fond of tamburica, since it's kind of like a whiny mandolin, Heee. And a zither is a mandolin having a nervous breakdown. Can I ask, is some form of music your day job? You have a really wide-spanning experience.
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May 7, 2012 22:12
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Arsenic Lupin posted:Heee. And a zither is a mandolin having a nervous breakdown. Can I ask, is some form of music your day job? You have a really wide-spanning experience. Not in the slightest; if anything, my dayjobs have gotten in the way of music more than anything else. Over five years in the Marines I didn't play a lot of music, and during three war tours I only played a minimal amount of tinwhistle and of ukulele (a Risa uke-stick practice uke, which recently came up in the uke thread). I got more back into music once I left the military and moved to Austin in 2005, and got deeply back in in 2007 when I was unemployed and moved to the island of Newfoundland. I've been getting more back into music since I last got back from Afghanistan in late-2010 and moved to Quebec, and not long after that I started this thread. This thread has actually gotten me more seriously back into a few instruments I hadn't used in a while. In the last few weeks, I've played more Anglo-Saxon lyre than I have in the three years I've owned one, and having a ton of fun with it. quote:(Stoca Zola's amazing harmonica refurbishment thread) Sorry I didn't give this more love when you first posted it, but been traveling about. Buying random lots of cheap wind instruments gets fun (which is how I acquired a Basque txistu, a one-handed tabor pipe, in Seattle in about '97 at an auction), and your bringing an old harmonica back from the dead has been a fun read. Are the reeds working out fine despite the fire damage and general age? Have they kept the same specs over the years, so if worst comes to worst you can drop in new reedplates but conserve the burned comb and tarnished coverplates? Did you find any good technique to stabilise the burned bits of the wooden comb so they don't crumble over time? In whatever case good on you, and it's good to have an advocate for harmonica here in the thread. I never hit the "epiphany" you mention for blues scales, so I just play a little bit of straight-harp. We do also have one goon who got into chromatic harmonica from this thread, so I need to go and shake him down for some posts too. Harmonica has, I agree, been really overlooked in this thread. Less deliberately, I think mainly due to a lack of serious players among those who drop in here. I've moved the running list of goons who've taken up new instruments during this thread up to the OP, so if you've taken up a new instrument due to this thread and aren't on the list, post and let me know what you have. For me, in Ljubljana, Slovenia, at the moment, and still no luck finding traditional instruments. Easy in Turkey, easy in many parts of Latin America (especially Andean countries), but apparently not so much in the Balkans. As a reminder to myself and a general heads-up, upcoming instruments include: Euro-relatives of the Appalachian dulcimer, a few experimental instruments like the daxophone, and since I mentioned it in this thread I'll probably cover tabor-pipe, and with it the various string-drums. dammit, the computer at the hostel has been blocked from using Tinypic for violating its ToU. What the hell, Euro-backpackers... It's at this address if someone can post it here for me: http://dspace.dial.pipex.com/phil.day/images/pt86.jpg
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May 8, 2012 19:34
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Are you a traveling ethnomusicologist or something? Or just a traveler? Are you traveling in search of the One Great Instrument? Is the world really sound? You're fascinating, TTFA 
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May 8, 2012 20:50
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I don't know what this is, but this is the picture he wanted to post:
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May 9, 2012 01:47
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I've been wanting to play an instrument again for a while. I wouldn't mind needing some effort to sound good, and I'd like something with more depth than just dicking around. I don't sing, so being limited to chords for a long time would be a negative. Price wise I'm pretty flexible. Any advice on where to start, if I wasn't way too vague?
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May 9, 2012 05:49
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James Garfield posted:I've been wanting to play an instrument again for a while. I wouldn't mind needing some effort to sound good, and I'd like something with more depth than just dicking around. I don't sing, so being limited to chords for a long time would be a negative. That gives us a bit of something to start with, sure. So something primarily melodic; do you have a strong preference between winds and strings? Do you have a particular style of music in mind, and/or a particular role for the music? If your goal is to jam along with folks at folk festivals, that may be slightly different from the goal of an instrument to have a smoke and kick back on the couch to play with. And it'd definitely be useful to know if you have, say, a strong love of Bulgarian traditional music, or of 1920s jazz, Bach solos, or any particular genre that you'd imagine you'd like playing. Lastly, seen any things in this thread that jump out at you as "man, I could learn that"? Any YouTube clips where you say, "it'd be cool to be that guy"? With the assembled folks here no doubt we can help you find something, but a few specifics would help. EDIT: been puzzling on it a bit, and having no other data had a few ideas to toss out at you: - If you want something unusual, and not necessarily hard to learn the basics for but with the capacity for a wide variety of styles, complex chromatic arrangements, etc. I'd vote for English concertina. A cool instrument played solo, and also very easy to jump in to any folk/Celtic session, blues jam, play along with buddies in the park, etc. Quite affordable to start with ($380 from Concertina Connection for either baritone or treble), and a good number of new and used larger/finer ones later. I'm still a big fan of the Hayden Duet, and think it makes an ideal singer-songwriter instrument, but the English is melodically more versatile and agile, and has a lot more options on the market. - If you like traditional American music (with possibilities to branch to related styles throughout Western Europe), don't need such total versatility, want a bit of an initial challenge and overall fulfillment, I'd take a look at banjo. I'll go even a bit further (showing my personal biases) and put out an argument for the clawhammer style, and particularly fretless and nylon-strung. Really distinctive sound, lots of nuance, and even more special-snowflake (also way more mellow and less jangly than usual banjo). Banjo is one of the most fulfilling instruments I've played solo: it's somehow tricky yet intuitive, and honestly I just feel really clever whenever I play it, working all the angles and finesseing it. - EDIT: similar in nuance and complexity to fretless banjo, but more for the blues and country set: steel guitar, acoustic or electric. Takes a lot of skill in the hands and ears to nail just the right pitch, with an infinity of possible tones. Really an instrument where you have a ton of micro-control. Also really easy to get a cheap starter, and vintage and custom axes are surprisingly affordable due to the simplicity of the instrument. - If you're okay with pure melodic music, but want something harder than tinwhistle, the Irish flute is like tinwhistle but an octave lower and a bit more artistry. Learning embrochure adds some initial challenge, but plays off in the long wrong in nuance. We cover some of the good sellers earlier in the thread (and have a few players here), so $250-350 gets you a nice make. Don't let the word "Irish" throw you, these keyless flutes were/are used in all kinds of music prior to the emergence of the modern silver Boehm keyed flute, so they can cover quite a few styles. - Want to get outside of Western music, and have the challenge of learning new music theory and scales? Start in on the oud, though you'll maybe want some lessons or at the very least some strong instructional materials (plus online advice from Mike's Oud Forum). Very nuanced instrument, distinctive sound, and open to all kinds of Near Eastern traditions, as well as great for some artsy jazz/microtonal/experimental stylings. Let me know if any of those grab you, and in general toss out some ideas and folks can weigh in. EDIT: if you notice I focus a lot on "finesse" and "nuance" in the above, it's that if you're not afraid of a little learning curve, some of these instruments are tricky to nail just right in the beginning, but pay off in a great flexibility of expression (and personal satisfaction for grasping the skill) down the road. TapTheForwardAssist fucked around with this message at 18:48 on May 9, 2012 |
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May 9, 2012 09:24
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Accordions. Ever since I started reading this thread I can't stop thinking about picking up an accordion, dammit! I've played piano, violin, a bit of flute and harmonica before and I never really enjoyed them much. Piano isn't something you can pick up and play on the go, the violin really bothered me having the strings right by my ear and I hate playing wind instruments. I kept re-reading the post about accordions on the first page and now I can't stop thinking about how absolutely amazing it'd be to learn how to play one. I'm not really interested in getting the kid's one to begin with though. As cheap as it is, I want to pick it up "for reals" and I don't mind dropping $500 on a beginner's, single row of button diatonic one (I guess german style? or is it cajun?) What sort of brands and choices are there for that price range? There's an accordion store a little ways off and an instructor I'm emailing to see if I can pay for an hour of lessons on one of his to see how it goes, but despite that I'm still a bit in the dark. Any help would be appreciated.
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May 9, 2012 14:38
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@James Garfield, I expanded my post above with some ideas.Horrible Smutbeast posted:Accordions. Ever since I started reading this thread I can't stop thinking about picking up an accordion, dammit! I've played piano, violin, a bit of flute and harmonica before and I never really enjoyed them much. Piano isn't something you can pick up and play on the go, the violin really bothered me having the strings right by my ear and I hate playing wind instruments. I kept re-reading the post about accordions on the first page and now I can't stop thinking about how absolutely amazing it'd be to learn how to play one. The real big issue here: what kind of music do you want to play? A lot of squeezebox traditions are very specific to certain kinds of 'boxes; not that it's impossible to play Quebecois on piano accordion or anything, but the styles themselves develop around the technical features of specific boxes.  If, for whatever variety of reasons, you want a decent 1-row 10-button diatonic, Hohner is about the only sub-$800 brand you should look at (above that Weltmeister and a few others emerge). Hohner currently makes the Ariette for $350ish, but that's very specifically a Cajun accordion, so I'd get that only if you want to play Cajun or have a very specific vision that involves applying Cajun accordion to other styles. The Ariette is China-made, and not at all bad but not necessarily amazing. On the used market (mainly eBay) you can however find the Hohner HA-112, -113, and -114 (the last digit meaning how many "stops" it has up-top), and those often go for $200-400. I know pros who say they're middling, but as an amateur I've loved them, and they've nice and light. They come in C, G, or D (the last of which the Celtic boys snap up). On eBay, most sellers can't find the model number, so search "Hohner -piano" in the Accordion section and scan through to see them. Don't confuse them with the Hohner Vienna, which has the same buttons but no knobs up top, and are generally older and in poorer shape; the HAs have a very specific and uniform look, so don't buy something thinking it looks HAish unless it looks precisely like an HA. If you want a Hohner HA-11X, note many sellers are incapable of judging condition, so don't be shy about messaging them to arrange a phone call to hear the reeds sound over the phone (post here if you need details on how to talk them through that) to make sure it's not a wreck. Again, I'm not at all saying that's the exact box you want, just rolling with your stated example. For 2-rows look for the Hohner Erica, and for 3-rows the Hohner Panther (Chinese import but pretty decent); the former goes used for $200-500 depending on key, the latter $350ish new. Again note, the key/format you want is heavily tradition-dependent, so definitely let us know what style of music you want to play. If you know for sure you want 1-row melodeon, we can totally work that for you, just wanted to make sure it's an informed decision. Have you taken a squint at the other styles (CBA, piano, Chemnitzer, concertinas, etc) yet to form a solid idea as to what genre/'box jumps out at you? You're familiar how a diatonic instrument changes its note with changes in bellows direction, etc? Nothing at all wrong with that, and in many ways they're easier to play, just that it's a very specific technique. TapTheForwardAssist fucked around with this message at 18:28 on May 9, 2012 |
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May 9, 2012 17:45
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Hey, Felicity, how the devil did you make a decision among the Blevin harps? There are so freaking many models.
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May 9, 2012 18:34
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Arsenic Lupin posted:Hey, Felicity, how the devil did you make a decision among the Blevin harps? There are so freaking many models. I got a chance to visit and listen. I listened till I heard two that I fell in love with and enjoyed the look of.  I actually had a bit of an idea of how many strings I want in my eventual upgrade(36-40), and I'm very picky about what I think a harp should sound like. I generally dislike high pitched instruments unless they are wind, but for the most part I've always loved the tone of lower instruments (played bass clarinet for years). So with all those sorts of things in mind, it made it really really important that I just listen to the different models till I found one that sounded 'right'. String spacing and stuff is important too, but that's usually fairly standard from what I've seen. The sound is the biggest factor to me, so that's what I did. A lot of listening. The materials affect the sound some, but that's why it's nice to be able to talk to the harp makers themselves.
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May 9, 2012 23:07
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I was thinking of string instruments, not for any particular reason. I can't say I'm looking for any particular style. The oud videos earlier in the thread interested me, but getting lessons would be almost out of the question where I live and learning non-Western scales when I don't have experience with string instruments might be too much. How does playing fretless clawhammer banjo translate to other instruments/styles?
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May 10, 2012 00:25
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quote:I can't say I'm looking for any particular style. Well, that's awfully open-ended. I'd suggest tossing out some kinds of music you enjoy listening to and could see yourself playing, or some examples of stuff in the thread that really appealed to you. James Garfield posted:How does playing fretless clawhammer banjo translate to other instruments/styles? It's hard to compare; banjo is heavily arpeggio-based, which again makes it pretty intuitive because within whatever "chord" formation you're making you'll have most of the notes to play the melody where you're at. That's part of where I was getting at with the "cleverness" comment; banjo really give you a feel for how the melody progresses through the harmony, since mainly in clawhammer you're playing the melody and harmony at the same time, and it flows surprisingly easy together. I'd say banjo is unique enough, not really confusing but just peculiar in style, that it's generally easier to move from banjo to X string instrument than vice versa. That is, a decent banjo player is more able to pick up a guitar or mandolin and sound decent on it that vice versa. It's not really hard, it just has a certain "ah-hah!" point where it really clicks. Despite solid musical background, I dicked around aimlessly with banjo a handful of times over the course of years, and maybe seven years after I bought the drat thing. One slow summer I sat down with a book, and after a week of dicking with it 30m a day I suddenly said "oh, I'm reading the book wrong, you do X, and then Y, and then Z!" And all of a sudden I could play half the soundtrack for "O Brother Where Art Though" on the spot. The closest parallel that occurs to me is dobro/Hawaiian/lap-steel/slide-guitar, or for that matter most open-tuned string instruments. Same kind of concept where you have a basic chord and you're weaving your melody in and out while using chunks of the chord as your own accompaniment. The fretless part has the downside of a slightly sharper learning curve since you have to develop some instinct for where to place your fingers, while frets are more visible and fool-proof. That said, fretless is surprisingly easy once you get the basic knack, and has the upside of allowing really sinuous slides between notes, and if you want to get real high-speed (or real old-school) you can do nuances like playing an "F and three-quarters" instead of F# to get a different feel. Using nylon vs. steel strings makes no real technical difference, but it's easier on the fingers, and also has a much mellower, almost liquid sound. Going from fretted to fretless takes some minor effort, going from fretless to fretted is like switching from stick-shift to manual: crazy easy and lazy. But both styles are totally valid, and fretted is far more common, partially because there are many banjo styles but of them all only clawhammer really ever uses fretless (and even that only 5-10% of players). If banjo is of some interest to you, I'd suggest you dig around YouTube for various styles. Suggested keywords "clawhammer bajo", "appalachian banjo", "dwight diller", "tim eriksen", "fretless banjo", "frailing banjo", "Irish clawhammer" (for a change of genre), "breton clawhammer", etc. Don't feel obliged to love clawhammer on my account: there's also tenor banjo (mainly Dixieland jazz and Irish), plectrum banjo, bluegrass banjo, etc. I just submit that clawhammer is one of the more rewarding styles to play solo, and is both something earthy enough you can just dive in and dig it, but also enough of a rich history that you can spend months listening to various recording and learning new tricks.
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May 10, 2012 00:53
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My husband torturing device arrived today, a Clarke tin whistle. I'm so terrible and my version of London Bridge sounds like it fell onto a bag of shrieking cats. I've never played a wind instrument except for the recorder in elementary school and I'm not used to my fingers being useless lumps at simple tasks. I also got a little kalimba, which sounds much nicer right out of the box.
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May 10, 2012 01:41
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TapTheForwardAssist posted:super awesome advice Well, I was looking more for waltzy/jig type music and I'm not very picky - basically if you can play it at a decent speed and it sounds good I'll learn it. I'm not the kind who only wants to play say, gaelic music or polkas. The only issue I'd have with an accordion is the size of the buttons since I have somewhat messed up hands and would prefer one with bigger buttons (so probably just a one or two row of buttons kind). I wouldn't really trust myself buying a used one either unless I was in a store so I might just go for the Ariette - Still, I'm going to try to find a way to handle one for at least a few minutes in a store before purchasing anything. Yeah, I think what gets me really interested in the diatonic is how the notes change depending on the direction of the bellow. I like a bit of a challenge like that (blame the adhd), plus it'll keep my full attention trying to balance all the different parts and movements. When I played instruments like the piano it didn't seem challenging enough, so I never really got too into it. Thanks for all the advice, I'll have to look into the different types a bit more when I get a chance after work.
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May 10, 2012 02:17
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Horrible Smutbeast posted:Well, I was looking more for waltzy/jig type music and I'm not very picky - basically if you can play it at a decent speed and it sounds good I'll learn it. I'm not the kind who only wants to play say, gaelic music or polkas. Ah, given the criteria you mention (ergonomic limitations, general Western European dance music, into diatonic) then a 1-row seems a pretty solid choice. Cajun music tends to be on C one-rows, Irish on D, and the other Euro traditions it's pretty helter-skelter, so C or D would be as good a bet as any. Plus if you're playing solo, or with rhythm instruments, key is a moot point. If you can find an Ariette to try, getting a feel for it would help. If you want something extra-light, you might see if you can find an HA from a reputable seller, maybe asking around some other forums. EDIT: I recall Ariettes feeling decent for a basic 'box, and the resale hit on decent instruments is reasonably low. I think a $350 new Ariette would re-sell for barely below $300, so you're not risking a ton. It's rather primitive, but there's a Cajun Accordion Discussion Group worth checking into as well. Kind of like how we advise newbie tinwhistle folks start on Irish just to the easily available info and advice, there's nobody so into the 1-row as the Cajuns, so as long as you generally like Cajun music, I would seriously start out there since you'll have no problem finding an instrument, books, DVDs, etc for home learning. And then once you have the basics down you'll be able to branch out to whatever other styles, and the one-row box was certainly used in a large number of styles worldwide before being eclipsed by more complex boxes. TapTheForwardAssist fucked around with this message at 19:05 on May 10, 2012 |
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May 10, 2012 07:24
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I'm still playing my recorder regularly (much to my wife's dismay), but I'd like to find some music that is not just me playing a melody by ear. I've been imitating guitar solos and piano fills in the tunes I'm playing, but it's just... too easy. A couple of tunes have really helped my flats/sharps, but they're still too simple. The Beatles' Blue Jay Way is an absolute bitch on recorder, but it's good for practicing tricky transitions. In The Year 2525 is great because you can just keep going up a step and hitting different sharps/flats. Where can I find music that would incorporate trills? I've been trying to parrot Jethro Tull flute / pipe pieces, but the recorder just doesn't have the range to do it.
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May 10, 2012 16:47
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Followed your ad here. I've yet to learn how to play ocarina, despite having bought two of them. They didn't come with instructions, ended up losing my wood ocarina and the clay one sounds too shrill. I suppose because of how tiny it is? I don't have any experience with music. Might as well pick up a decent one now and learn for real. Jackard fucked around with this message at 17:33 on May 10, 2012 |
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May 10, 2012 17:26
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I think that a lot of instruments which are kind of considered as toys are like that. When I got a toy accordion, it didn't have any instructions either. Luckily people put up tutorials on youtube and stuff.
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May 10, 2012 17:38
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I hope you don't mind if I post a short tune I just recorded on my mobile. It's a polska from a little place called Hälleforsnäs. Played on my nyckelharpa. Wish I had better recording equipment, recording yourself and listen critically is so essential if you want to improve. I don't do it nearly enough .
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May 10, 2012 18:18
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Anyone play the duduk? I've been in love with its sound for years, but I've been scared to get one because everything I've read makes it sound like a difficult instrument, especially for someone whose only musical experience is playing the euphonium in high school. I don't think it's been mentioned yet, so here's a picture and some examples:  Clips: A Cool Wind is Blowing by Djivan Gasparyan Some guy playing playing the Narnian Lullaby in his bedroom The Feeling Begins from The Last Temptation of Christ soundtrack ThirdReichNRoll fucked around with this message at 20:57 on May 10, 2012 |
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May 10, 2012 20:40
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What (stringed, percussion) instrument would you recommend for someone with three working fingers on their left hand , plus a thumb. My Ring finger was broken at the last joint and never healed 100% so It's difficult, if not impossible, to use for making chords on a guitar (which is why I stopped playing in the first place). I've since picked up the tin whistle and the ocarina on my own, but am looking for something relatively inexpensive I can do a bit more with than those two.
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May 10, 2012 21:14
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quote:Followed your ad here. I've yet to learn how to play ocarina, despite having bought two of them. They didn't come with instructions, ended up losing my wood ocarina and the clay one sounds too shrill. I suppose because of how tiny it is? I don't have any experience with music. As noted a few pages back, a lot of the small clay ocarinas are more toys/souvenirs than players. Also ocarinas aren't totally standardised, so if you don't have a fingering chart for your clay one it'd take some experimentation to find the right notes and map them out. And that's assuming it is actually a player, and the holes aren't just arbitrary. Considering that new, quality ocarinas can be had for $20ish, you'll save yourself a lot of hassle to get a good quality ocarina (of moderate size, not a micro one) with a clear fingering chart and maybe an instruction book from the manufacturer. We discuss a couple good manufacturers earlier in this thread. Might as well get the fundamentals down on an easy, quality axe. quote:My husband torturing device arrived today, a Clarke tin whistle. I'm so terrible and my version of London Bridge sounds like it fell onto a bag of shrieking cats. I've never played a wind instrument except for the recorder in elementary school and I'm not used to my fingers being useless lumps at simple tasks. Kalimbas are awfully mellow; I'm surprised we got so far into the thread without covering the thumb-piano. For tinwhistle: don't worry about fingering until you have blowing down, and you're husband will probably appreciate it. Cut out the distraction of fingering and melody, and just spend a few 5-10 minute sessions scattered in the day for a few days. Just finger a basic D, E, or F# and just blow literally as softly as you can. Note how it's whispery and not even a note. Now increase pressure and hear it get clearer, keep increasing, note when it starts to go wonky and back it down to the clear pressure. Just work on that until you have no problem just picking it up and blowing a clear, clean note. Once you have that down, do some basic D to E, or F# down to D, again noting the micro-changes in pressure to get a clean note at each pitch. I mean, you certainly can just dive in and strangle cats for a week or two until you bludgeon the skills in, but if peace at home is a priority do the mellow drills to build breathing first, and then slowly move into melody. LordAdakos posted:What (stringed, percussion) instrument would you recommend for someone with three working fingers on their left hand , plus a thumb. My Ring finger was broken at the last joint and never healed 100% so It's difficult, if not impossible, to use for making chords on a guitar (which is why I stopped playing in the first place). The classic example for this is uber-famous jazz guitarist Djano Reinhardt, though not exactly the same thing since his last two fingers of his left hand were fused in a fire. Jerry Garcia was also missing his middle finger due to a wood-chopping accident as a kid. Long story short, there are many workarounds. If you still want to learn guitar, look into "two finger chords", and there are also some popular open tunings (which I'll eventually cover in this thread) that are easier than standard if you have limited fingers. So adapting the guitar is certainly an option. For strings, the very first thing that jumps to mind is lap-steel guitar (covered with a megapost maybe four or so pages back). The left hand holds a steel bar to the strings, so individual finger dexterity (barring a few niche techniques) is not at all key. My only question would be whether your injury prevents you raising and lowering the bottom half of your hand onto the stings, as the back end of your hand is used to muffle strings behind the bar. Would only be an issue if you have major pain/mobility issues, though if those fingers are just unsmooth that's fine, since they're basically just ballast. As noted earlier in this page about banjo, steel guitar is an arpeggio-based instrument, so you're forming a chord (by the slant of your bar) and using your right hand to pluck both melody and harmony notes. So a full-sounding instrument to play solo, and goes great with any bluesy, country, rockabilly type traditions. They're very easy instruments to build, so quite inexpensive. My vague impression is that folks say you should skip the absolute cheapest $90 eBay instruments since they have a very short string length, and spend a few extra bucks (like $130ish) for the Rogue, which also comes with screw-on legs, case, and other nice gear. There are a few other minor expenses, like basically any kind of guitar amp (often found dirt cheap all over Craigslist, I've bought several decent 2'cubed 50w's for $20 each), a $5 cord, $5 worth of fingerpicks for your right, and maybe $20 on a good steel bar. Alternately, if you want to go acoustic, you can get literally any acoustic steel-string guitar, add a $5-10 nut-riser and retune slightly to DGDGBD and play acoustic (so saving about $25 on amp and $50+ on the guitar). Steel Guitar Forum is a great place to read the FAQs, search up their "what steel guitar for a beginner?" threads to avoid asking common questions, and also maybe post a thread explaining your finger issue and how they feel about steel in that case. If blues/rock/country/rockabilly isn't your scene (and also not Hawaiian, the other big steel genre), and you're thinking more Celtic, French, medieval, etc. then the hammered dulcimer has little need for anything past the first fingers (again barring some fringe techniques). Ditto for bowed psaltery, which has bows in both hands. The Appalachian dulcimer was traditionally often played with a "noter", a wooden sliding stick, in the left hand instead of fingering the frets. If you like the older drone style of dulcimer (vice the modern complex chording, which I don't care for) you can take up the dulcimer old-school and either use a bit of dowel, buy a $20 handmade hardwood noter off eBay, or improvise your own. How do any of these ring for you?
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May 10, 2012 23:06
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Just wanted to chime in, I know there was some discussion on the last page, but Mountain Ocarinas make really good ocarinas at very affordable prices and with excellent warrantees. I have a pair of them in C and G polycarbonate, and they sound great, play great, and I have no problem taking them with me when I travel because if anything happens, they replace it, period. They also make stone and wood and ceramic ocarinas but I have no experience with those personally, however, I can only imagine they are good quality. Edit: Apparently you can grab both C and G for ~$5 off totalling ~$45 before shipping right now, as I just went back to check their prices. They come with fingering charts, plus you can get the fingering charts in PDF on their site. Paramemetic fucked around with this message at 23:29 on May 10, 2012 |
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May 10, 2012 23:27
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I've not played an instrument since Jr. High Band (marimba, 22 years ago), but you got me to try something new. Just ordered a Clarke Tin Whistle, and am going to pull the trigger on a five-string kantele if the order time isn't too long. Have a family reunion with a medieval theme in July, so I'm hoping the wife and I can perform some folk tunes. [Actually I do have a PaIa Theremax theremin which I was given by a physics department, but I suspect it has some blown circuitry, and is hard a balls to do anything with even if it was fully working.]
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May 11, 2012 01:09
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I Greyhound posted:[Actually I do have a PaIa Theremax theremin which I was given by a physics department, but I suspect it has some blown circuitry, and is hard a balls to do anything with even if it was fully working.] Many years ago, Electronic Musician published a schematic and article for a DIY theremin similar to Moog's Etherwave (if I remember correctly). I built one, but did not really get it working properly. I have learned a few things about troubleshooting electronics since then and recently dug it out of storage. I will have to see if I can maybe get it going this summer. There shouldn't be anything too delicate in a transistor based theremin. If its not working chances are its a bad connection/cold solder joint, or something like that, rather than a blown component. You may need to retune the oscillators (adjusting the transformer cores). PAiA is still around and has technical information and tuning procedures online. http://www.paia.com/index.asp The PAiA looks a bit more complex than the one I built, which uses a single oscillator for volume and doesn't have CV/gate outputs.
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May 11, 2012 01:44
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