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For practical and financial reasons I'm interested in neander working, as I'm going to be moving at an unknown time in the near future and don't want to have to move a jig as well and I can't afford to drop more than probably $200 on tools right now. I'd like to get into small woodworking, carving, and eventually luthiery. My immediate project that I want to work on is building several instruments from ancient Rome and Greece for a musical project I'd like to try to launch. First up is a lyre. What would be the best way to go about this? The only tools I have at my disposal presently are some chisels and knives, and a dremel. How would a neander worker go about planing? Routing? If I bought wood from a Lowe's or something, and wanted to cut it into shape, how would I go about doing that without using a jig or table saw? I've never seen any significant wood working done without power tools, so I don't know to cut a board into a shape with handtools, is it just using a regular saw and sawing off what I don't need until I'm roughly where I want to be, then whittling/carving from there?
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May 31, 2012 21:37
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I'm looking for a good beginner lathe and I was wondering if anyone had any suggestions. Since it's my first one I imagine I should just get something cheap, but the price ranges are just so crazy out there. What should I be looking for if I just want to turn some bowls and maybe try my hand at some custom chess pieces? Appreciate the help!
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May 31, 2012 21:51
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Paramemetic posted:is it just using a regular saw and sawing off what I don't need until I'm roughly where I want to be, then whittling/carving from there? Check out coping saws. And the 10,000 other specialty saws in Lee Valley or Woodcraft. That's a good place to start. edit: Didn't mean to sound like a dick. Welcome aboard to the best hobby around! Please ask any questions you have. iwannabebobdylan fucked around with this message at 22:02 on May 31, 2012 |
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May 31, 2012 21:58
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Paramemetic posted:For practical and financial reasons I'm interested in neander working, as I'm going to be moving at an unknown time in the near future and don't want to have to move a jig as well and I can't afford to drop more than probably $200 on tools right now. Working with hand tools isn't necessarily going to be cheaper. You can go with used stuff and restore it but collectors have driven prices up on a lot of stuff. Some of the less common tools like a router plane are very hard to find used. New quality hand tools from places like Lee Valley are going to be expensive but they are typically worth it for something that works well and lasts. Take a look at the Logan Cabinet Shoppe videos for some examples of working entirely with hand tools.
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May 31, 2012 22:18
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Thanks for your replies. Even as I was sending that I felt like it was a lovely question. I've looked for hand tools before and never even found them, so it makes sense they'd be more expensive. I didn't mean to come across as a no-research Google please post, I just honestly had no idea how those things would even be accomplished. Also while I read those lists of places to buy tools in the OP, I honestly hadn't looked because I'd always been taught to handle tools before purchasing and never figured to look online for them. Hopefully when I next post in this thread it'll be better. Thanks again for the replies. Paramemetic fucked around with this message at 22:35 on May 31, 2012 |
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May 31, 2012 22:31
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Start by watching Roy Underhill (The Woodwright's Shop). He does everything with hand tools. Woodworking and luthiery in particular has been around long before power, water driven or otherwise. I wouldn't go down the neander route based on cost as quality hand tools are in some cases, much more expensive than their powered equivalents. But as mentioned above, there is a saw for every purpose; coping, ripping, crosscutting, dovetailing, fretting, flush cutting, veneer, miter, and the list goes on. Then you get into planes, which include routers, rabbets, chisel, jacks, smoothing, etc. Various drills: egg beaters and braces. In neander working, you'll need a lot of different saws to take the place of one or two powertools. Not trying to talk you out of it, just giving you a realistic perspective.
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May 31, 2012 23:00
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I watch a lot of Roy, and the more I do the more I try to incorporate hand tools into my work. And the more I use hand tools the more I enjoy it. For me its just a hobby so I have no problems just taking my time.
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May 31, 2012 23:17
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Paramemetic posted:For practical and financial reasons I'm interested in neander working The height of woodworking artisanry was well before we had electrically powered equipment, most lathes and such were handmade so calling it "neander working," which is kind of a dumb name anyway, misses the point entirely. Neandertal man was capable of developing their own tools by themselves to boot- various tool cultures emerged including flint chiselwork for wood or bone carving. The point is, powered or expensive tools do not make the woodworker. You can make your own tools from the ground up with steel stock. Definitely check out Roy Underhill's tv show and if you're really into it, check out his handtool books and history of woodworking books.
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Jun 1, 2012 00:52
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Not an Anthem posted:The height of woodworking artisanry was well before we had electrically powered equipment, most lathes and such were handmade so calling it "neander working," which is kind of a dumb name anyway, misses the point entirely. Neandertal man was capable of developing their own tools by themselves to boot- various tool cultures emerged including flint chiselwork for wood or bone carving. Underhill's Master's thesis was, in fact, titled "How to Start With a Tree and an Axe and Build Your Home and Everything in It". You really can (and humans have for millennia) start from scratch if you're willing to take the time and learn the skills.
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Jun 1, 2012 01:37
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Magnus Praeda posted:Underhill's Master's thesis was, in fact, titled "How to Start With a Tree and an Axe and Build Your Home and Everything in It". You really can (and humans have for millennia) start from scratch if you're willing to take the time and learn the skills. If anyone is interested in that idea, watch this documentary: Alone in the Wilderness. Dude starts with an axe + saw and ends up building an entire cottage and everything in it... even the hinges on the loving doors! That link is only a short part, the full thing is about an hour but I couldn't find a link for it
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Jun 1, 2012 02:00
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Hopefully I'm in the right thread. I'm in the market for a jig saw for some woodwork I'll be doing, but I'm not sure what I should be looking for in one. What features are must-haves? Any specific brand recommendations?
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Jun 1, 2012 02:19
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Guitarchitect posted:If anyone is interested in that idea, watch this documentary: Alone in the Wilderness. Dude starts with an axe + saw and ends up building an entire cottage and everything in it... even the hinges on the loving doors! That man is more dexterous with an axe than I am with a pen. "Impressive" doesn't even begin to cover it.
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Jun 1, 2012 03:02
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Not an Anthem posted:Neandertal man was capable of developing their own tools by themselves to boot- various tool cultures emerged including flint chiselwork for wood or bone carving. I think you're taking the neander thing a little too seriously. That moniker has been around a longtime and has always been intended as a tongue in cheek jibe; (neander = caveman), not as a commentary on Homo neanderthalensis. mds2 posted:I watch a lot of Roy, and the more I do the more I try to incorporate hand tools into my work. And the more I use hand tools the more I enjoy it. For me its just a hobby so I have no problems just taking my time. I am always envious of how quickly and effortlessly he performs woodworking with handtools. melon cat posted:Hopefully I'm in the right thread. I'm in the market for a jig saw for some woodwork I'll be doing, but I'm not sure what I should be looking for in one. What features are must-haves? Any specific brand recommendations? Bosch. They pretty much revitalized the jig saw and almost everything else is based on them. Barrel grip, variable speed, orbital blade, & tool-less blade changes. There are other good ones out there, very similar, maybe some better.
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Jun 1, 2012 07:28
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BUGS OF SPRING posted:I'm looking for a good beginner lathe and I was wondering if anyone had any suggestions. I don't know what your price range is but I have been extremely happy with my Jet 12x20. As a first lathe, it really fit the bill, at least for me. While at times it would be nice to have a great big $6000 Powermatic (ahem), something light like the Jet in question does just fine and will last you for as long as you need it. This is the lathe in question, and I got the stand that goes with it for a total of about $700, I think. Like I said, I don't know if that's in your price range but if it is, I suspect you would be very happy with that one.
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Jun 1, 2012 14:48
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wormil posted:Bosch. They pretty much revitalized the jig saw and almost everything else is based on them. Consensus around here is that the Bosch GST 135 CE is the best jigsaw ever made. That is until Bosch upgraded it to the GST 140. No idea what Bosch USA call the models over there. Festool and Mafell have released new jigsaws that probably compete with the title but for a much heftier price tag. Get a torpedo model, not the old-lady-handbag version. The torpedo version allows you to use it upside-down among other things.
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Jun 1, 2012 15:12
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wormil posted:Bosch. They pretty much revitalized the jig saw and almost everything else is based on them. Iskariot posted:+1
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Jun 1, 2012 19:06
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That looks like the GST 150. It's very good but the 135 and 140 are slightly better. They have better precision control. The 150 is slightly stronger IIRC.
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Jun 1, 2012 23:08
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Bad Munki posted:I don't know what your price range is but I have been extremely happy with my Jet 12x20. As a first lathe, it really fit the bill, at least for me. While at times it would be nice to have a great big $6000 Powermatic (ahem), something light like the Jet in question does just fine and will last you for as long as you need it. This is the lathe in question, and I got the stand that goes with it for a total of about $700, I think. Like I said, I don't know if that's in your price range but if it is, I suspect you would be very happy with that one. $3400, won't be $6000 for another few years. Paid off about half of it so far with bowl sales this month now that my rough outs from January are mostly ready to finish turn. I suggest the Delta 46-460 VS. There isn't a better lathe in it's class that I'm aware of. I think Nova was coming out with something that might have topped it but there were QC issues or something and it was delayed. Might be out now. Although, Delta was sold and they are having difficulty supplying warrantied parts at the moment. Might want to wait a bit to see if that gets sorted. Haven't had anything break on mine and I've used it quite a lot. Another piece of elm. 8.5”x3.25”   
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Jun 2, 2012 20:16
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Never stop posting bowl pictures. I am so loving jealous of your lathing.
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Jun 2, 2012 22:22
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I'm almost done building my wife a cedar lined chest, and getting to the point of applying the coloring I want to the exterior (birch plywood, maple for the borders).  I bought 1 oz. of this TransFast powdered wood dye in Turquoise blue, and mixed up a quart in distilled water this afternoon to do some testing on scraps - does anyone have experience with wood dye and the process I should use? My goal was a finish like this:    I'm thinking of a water based wood conditioner/sealer to help apply an even coat, and then using an oil based lacquer or polyurethane as my topcoat - I'd love any suggestions or advice you guys have, I've never used dye before.
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Jun 2, 2012 23:10
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DJJustice posted:I've never used dye before. I haven't used powdered dye but I have used the TransTint liquid dye and it is very easy. I mixed with alcohol and spritzed it on with a small hand sprayer. My understanding is that alcohol is not as colorfast as water mixing but it doesn't raise the grain any appreciable amount and I had no issues with blotching on poplar or pine. With finishes, my preference is lacquer over varnish/poly for anything except maybe regular use tabletops. Lacquer dries faster, melts into itself and is easier to repair if necessary. I'm curious how that oil based brushing lacquer works out, I've thought of trying it.
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Jun 3, 2012 01:56
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Got some beading tools. Like them. Spalted Elm 8.125"x3.125"   
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Jun 3, 2012 22:05
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I'm really wishing my (dad's) lathe could do bowls. All I can do with it is make cylindrical objects as it's not "chuck compatible". Spindles, rolling pins, etc. Nothing that people are really going to pay much for. Hmmm... Think there might be a market for hardwood dildos?
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Jun 4, 2012 01:56
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Blistex posted:I'm really wishing my (dad's) lathe could do bowls. All I can do with it is make cylindrical objects as it's not "chuck compatible". Spindles, rolling pins, etc. Nothing that people are really going to pay much for. sure - but they're referred to as "fish whackers" as they are used to whack fish on the head to kill them. True story!
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Jun 4, 2012 02:49
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Perfect cover story if discovered under a bed.
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Jun 4, 2012 04:16
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ChaoticSeven posted:Perfect cover story if discovered under a bed. "It's not what you think... I use it on fish" won't help.
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Jun 4, 2012 04:28
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Stultus Maximus posted:"It's not what you think... I use it on fish" won't help. Or does it make it even more air tight? Mulberry 11"x3.5" 
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Jun 4, 2012 15:52
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Have you made any bowls of different wood glued together in a checkerboard or other pattern that shows off the different colours and types of wood?
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Jun 4, 2012 17:18
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That technique is called segmented turning and I haven't really attempted it beyond a few bottle stoppers. I've seen some pretty staggering work in that style, but it just doesn't draw me to want to produce it. Might change later. Actually, I couldn't do it if I wanted right now, since my jointer,tablesaw,planer etc are 350 miles from where I am.
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Jun 4, 2012 17:32
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This is probably a stupid question, but I'm going to be building a couple raised beds out of pressure treated 2x6x8 and 4x4x8 (8' long, 4' wide, with 2' 4x4 posts on the inside of each corner). I'll be securing the 4x4 posts to the 2x6 walls using lag bolts and have two questions. 1. Given that the lag bolt will have to travel the 1.5" and 3.5" of the two pieces of wood, what would be the appropriate length of bolt? Between 4-5" I'm guessing. Also best type for outdoors fastening? Hot dipped galvenized steel or stainless steel? Finally, is just a steel washer fine? Finally would you use one or two lag bolts per 2x6 end? I was planning on using two about 1" from the top and bottom. 2. I don't have much of a workshop but have enjoyed trying to secure two pieces of wood for pilot hole drilling before. Before that was with small pieces of lumber but now I'll be dealing with larger pieces. What is the best way to secure a 4x4 to a 2x6 for pilot hole drilling? Just some standard clamps? I'm thinking my best bet would be two saw horses over which I could lay the 2x6. I could then clamp the 4x4 on to the end with two clamps. Does this sound practical? Basically I want this to be a fairly painless process. cowofwar fucked around with this message at 18:09 on Jun 4, 2012 |
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Jun 4, 2012 18:07
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cowofwar posted:Basically I want this to be a fairly painless process. You could tack it together with nails then secure it with lag screws.
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Jun 5, 2012 09:45
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cowofwar posted:This is probably a stupid question, but I'm going to be building a couple raised beds out of pressure treated 2x6x8 and 4x4x8 (8' long, 4' wide, with 2' 4x4 posts on the inside of each corner). I'll be securing the 4x4 posts to the 2x6 walls using lag bolts and have two questions. 1. 3.5 or 4" lags would be fine. I think that stainless fasteners look nicer, but hot dipped galvanized were a lot cheaper when i built my deck. Don't use any plain steel parts that wil be in contact with the pressure treated wood as they'll corrode, so use hot dipped or stainless washers as well. The fasteners at big box stores are pretty pricey, i got all my deck fasteners from wholesalebolts.com for like 1/3 the price. 2. Id probably have a helper hold the piece in place and temporarily fix the pieces together with a deck screw or two.
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Jun 5, 2012 14:22
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wormil posted:You could tack it together with nails then secure it with lag screws. dyne posted:1. 3.5 or 4" lags would be fine. I think that stainless fasteners look nicer, but hot dipped galvanized were a lot cheaper when i built my deck. Don't use any plain steel parts that wil be in contact with the pressure treated wood as they'll corrode, so use hot dipped or stainless washers as well. The fasteners at big box stores are pretty pricey, i got all my deck fasteners from wholesalebolts.com for like 1/3 the price.
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Jun 5, 2012 21:52
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Don't use pressure treated wood if you're planning on eating anything you grow in those beds. The plants will leech the chemicals and if you eat them, you get the chemicals in you. Not healthy. Use cedar. It's long-lasting outdoors and won't poison you.
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Jun 6, 2012 08:49
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Magnus Praeda posted:Don't use pressure treated wood if you're planning on eating anything you grow in those beds. The plants will leech the chemicals and if you eat them, you get the chemicals in you. Not healthy. Specifically, chromium, copper, and arsenic. Not good things to build a garden out of.
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Jun 6, 2012 11:10
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Stultus Maximus posted:Specifically, chromium, copper, and arsenic. Not good things to build a garden out of. Treated wood that non-contractors have access to is no longer CCA (chromated copper arsenate) but rather ACQ (alkaline copper quartenary) which doesn't have the chromium or arsenic, so it isn't nearly as bad. This was mandated as of 2004 in the US. I have heard from a master gardener friend that WSU did a study and found that the only risk of leaching was planting root vegetables with 1-2" of the wood. I can't find anything online to back this up though, so I'll have to ask him for a source.
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Jun 6, 2012 16:03
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The Eames Chair thread made me wonder why I haven't seen a boatload of wood-workers replicating the Eames House Bird. It was a c1910 piece of Appalachian Folk Art after all, and I've seen guys on woodworking shows make all kinds of birds with sticks for legs... http://www.stardust.com/HOUSEBIRD.html
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Jun 6, 2012 18:41
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Haven't even been at my new house a week and I'm already picking up free wood. One of my immediate neighbors was trying to trim the branches off a downed tree using a sawsall and a set of clippers. It was going to take him a couple days the way he was going, and I had a chain saw, so I took a half hour and got the job done. It went so well that we decided to drop the tree that one was hanging off of (it was kind of a mess, the way one tree fell through another). The second tree still had some living trunk, and so in the end, we had a nice 12" diameter, 6' long log that ended up behind my shed, waiting for me to process. I'm not 100% sure, but I'm calling it red maple.  
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Jun 8, 2012 23:56
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Man, there are a lot of great logs around here. I'm genuinely considering getting one of these Granberg small log saw mills. Anyone used these, or any of their products? $130 on Amazon, doesn't seem too bad to me if it works as advertised...
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Jun 9, 2012 23:50
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Bad Munki posted:Man, there are a lot of great logs around here. I'm genuinely considering getting one of these Granberg small log saw mills. Anyone used these, or any of their products? $130 on Amazon, doesn't seem too bad to me if it works as advertised... NO! These things are a waste of time, gas, wood, and money. They do not work as advertised and I've yet to meet one person who has had a good experience with these hunks of junk. The best thing to do is to find someone with a sawmill and give him the hangdog-look or some money so he'll cut the wood for you.
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Jun 10, 2012 03:20
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