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neongrey
Feb 28, 2007

Plaguing your posts with incidental music.
Man the last time I took two weeks to read a book I was seven years old. It wasn't her chapters that kept me going.

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whowhatwhere
Mar 15, 2010

SHINee's back
When reading late-period GRRM, you take your enjoyment where you can.

Thulsa Doom
Jun 20, 2011

Ezekiel 23:20
Joffrey's wedding is near enough that they could do them at the same time, just move his up a bit. Call the episode "The Red Wedding" and let people assume the red refers to the Lannister colors. I'd structure the episode so we see Joff first and the non-readers think it's some kind of contrast or reversal and then start the slaughter at the Twins.

mind the walrus
Sep 22, 2006

While that's the better way to do it, no question, they could also do it if Walder Frey or someone creepy is given a line about deflowering a girl and calling it a "red wedding", feinting the audience by making them think it's just a memetic reference to the awful way women are treated in the GRRM-verse.

Blade_of_tyshalle
Jul 12, 2009

If you think that, along the way, you're not going to fail... you're blind.

There's no one I've ever met, no matter how successful they are, who hasn't said they had their failures along the way.

Get Billy Idol in there as a minstrel. He knows a pretty good wedding song.

whowhatwhere
Mar 15, 2010

SHINee's back

Joda posted:

Also, while on the topic of CGI budget, I hope the show gets a significantly bigger budget next year. I'm worried they'll have to default to characters talking about the vast majority of events involving White Walkers and dragons.

:allears:

Sophia
Apr 16, 2003

The heart wants what the heart wants.
Related:

From here

quote:

2. Are the White Walkers back for good?
We haven't seen them since that glimpse in the series premiere, but that was enough to clue us in that they play a large role in the overall story "Game of Thrones" is telling. Now that their epic re-reveal has served as the season two cliffhanger it's only fair to expect a lot more of them to come, right?

1. Now that she has her dragons back, is there any stopping Dany?
It's the same question we had at the end of season one, only amplified by the fact that the young dragons are breathing fire. Dany was at the center of the finale's strongest sequence as she stepped inside the House of the Undying, found herself in a wintry version of the Iron Throne room and shared a tender moment with her late beloved Khal Drogo. But instead of getting distracted by hallucinations, Dany kept her eye on the prize. She's coming for that throne, and more than anyone else, she seems worthy of it.

It's like watching characters in a horror movie going down into the basement. Don't go down there, girl.

Blade_of_tyshalle
Jul 12, 2009

If you think that, along the way, you're not going to fail... you're blind.

There's no one I've ever met, no matter how successful they are, who hasn't said they had their failures along the way.

quote:

10. Will Brienne get Jamie Lannister to his destination in one piece?

So I'm assuming he hasn't lost his hand yet. That is the best question.

bigmcgaffney
Apr 19, 2009
We all shall have balls a legendary shade of blue, like a pair of white walker eyeballs nestled deep in their rotting sockets to keep out the winter's chill in a cold, dying world

whowhatwhere
Mar 15, 2010

SHINee's back

RizieN posted:

Can someone settle a dispute?

Was the guy Jon Snow killed his uncle Benjen or not?

To be fair, it was the guy's friend, not that poster, but :ughh:

hand of luke
Oct 17, 2005

Mmmhmm, yes. I suppose I will attend your ball. Someone must class up the affair, musn't he?
So Daenerys believes she's the last Targ and that she's infertile -- has she spared a moment to think about this or is she content to let Westeros devolve into the inevitable war of succession after her death?

Urdnot Fire
Feb 13, 2012

Just watched the last episode. "They'll be waiting a long time" sums up Dany's storyline pretty well.

hand of luke posted:

So Daenerys believes she's the last Targ and that she's infertile -- has she spared a moment to think about this or is she content to let Westeros devolve into the inevitable war of succession after her death?
She'll just have Belwas sort it out. Speaking of whom, I was really hoping he'd just be chilling in Xaro's vault.

Urdnot Fire fucked around with this message at 20:40 on Jun 5, 2012

Blade_of_tyshalle
Jul 12, 2009

If you think that, along the way, you're not going to fail... you're blind.

There's no one I've ever met, no matter how successful they are, who hasn't said they had their failures along the way.

Well, now. HBO truly has no shame at all when it comes to merchandising.

I look forward to the high-quality replica of Sean Bean's noggin and a realistic wolf mask you can don beneath your nine-spiked crown of bronze.

IRQ
Sep 9, 2001

SUCK A DICK, DUMBSHITS!

$30 grand for a big lovely metal chair? You could learn how to weld, by the materials, make the loving thing, pay yourself $100/hr for all that AND buy a car to haul the poo poo home from Hope Depot and still have money left over.

Urdnot Fire
Feb 13, 2012

HBO can do as they like.

whowhatwhere
Mar 15, 2010

SHINee's back
What, now Loosechanj changes the tag to "unfunny"?

IRQ
Sep 9, 2001

SUCK A DICK, DUMBSHITS!

whowhatwhere posted:

What, now Loosechanj changes the tag to "unfunny"?

What was it before? poo poo? It probably should be poo poo.

Mnemosyne
Jun 11, 2002

There's no safe way to put a cat in a paper bag!!

IRQ posted:

What was it before? poo poo? It probably should be poo poo.

Gross would work.

whowhatwhere
Mar 15, 2010

SHINee's back
It was still Event. Because ADWD had come out around a year ago. Oh well, get thread title, get labelled unfunny. GRRM is a fickle mistress.

lobotomy molo
May 7, 2007

by Jeffrey of YOSPOS
Or sex.

whowhatwhere
Mar 15, 2010

SHINee's back
Goddamn, watch this viewer capture everything about Dany based entirely on the show:

Axeface posted:

Given the contrast with the experiences of Sansa, Cersei, Catelyn, Brienne, and Margaery, I'd say Dany's arc is very consciously written as a rebuttal of standard fantasy cliches...it's just that I think it still has to exist in tension with the rest of work, and, within that context, with the values of its own fairly self-contained narrative. I'm as down with righteous warrior princesses as the next guy, but Dany's not written quite that simply. She starts out as the same kind of passive, domesticated princess that Sansa does, and her whole arc (and Sansa's, and implicitly Cersei's, etc.) is growing out of that through hard experience. But where Sansa et al. found their ambitions run headlong into GRRM's disdain for fantasy tropes, Dany has instead been fairly successful overcoming obstacles on her own terms. She’s the Mother of Dragons, right? But that doesn’t make her just a fragile princess: That makes her the Chosen One. And I think the main thrust of Dany’s arc is deconstructing that trope.

The idea that Dany’s character is supposed to march this triumphal path of hardship to claim what’s rightfully hers is not only in pretty distinct contradiction to everything the series has thus far said on the way life works, it’s buying into her own hype even as you’re seeing every reason that it’s dangerous and misguided. The other female characters in the show have by and large been failed by the world in their expectations, and these failures have been the cause of their growth; Cersei’s development into bitterness is the most obvious example, and given the contrast with her sister (and her refusal to accompany the Hound) I think that Sansa’s arc is ultimately going to be about moving past that princess-in-distress archetype in a healthy way. Dany, though, has found a string of admittedly bitter successes, moving first past her brother, then Drogo, and now Qarth and to a certain extent Jorah. The tension I see there—the tension that I think we as viewers are supposed to see and Dany isn’t—is that Dany always walks away from these encounters with the wrong lesson. She stops being a pawn for her brother, and instead falls in love with her rapist; she gets her own khalasar, and sets out on the same path of conquest that killed Drogo; she triumphs against Ducksauce’s machinations towards royalty, and promptly starts on the next phase of her own. The fact that she’s The Girl Who Would Be King lets her power her way through and grow as a character, but it’s always in a direction laden with irony or foreboding. She spent like half of this season talking about her dragons and her rightful claim, and this is a season that prominently featured Harrenhall and Stannis Baratheon’s men burning in Blackwater Bay. We're invited to look at her as a heroic figure, sure, but we're also invited to look at what that means, and at the actual make-up of the person underneath that.

To speak more specifically to the absurdity of her character, I really don’t see a reason to qualify that with “supposed” or “sort of”; maybe GRRM has some radically different vision in the books, but the series, through deliberate parallels with Jon, Theon, Sansa and Viserys, not to mention the performance of Emilia Clarke, is making it abundantly clear that Dany, despite her ambitions, still hasn’t really grown up. That’s not to undercut the character but to acknowledge her narrative role. Her lack of maturity and moral responsibility is exactly what put her on her Hero’s Journey to begin with; putting aside that I think it’s utterly queasy and classless as a plot device, Drogo’s rape of Dany and the eventual development of her relationship with him mirror her shift from victim to would-be aggressor in the political sense…but despite her experience with Mirri Maz Durr, she seems totally unconscious of this, and just keeps rattling on about how she’s going to take back what’s hers and how the people of Westeros will be delighted to have their proper ruler back. The character at one point actually acknowledges that she is basically quoting Viserys and being unrealistic and selfish, and that’s her best moment on the show: That’s the closest Dany comes to having an adult epiphany that the thing she’s dreamed of being, the thing she wants to be, the thing that she’s becoming is, fundamentally, monstrous. Which collides violently both with her ambitions and with the rainbows Jorah is popping in her rear end on a daily basis.

Everything about this character save her capacity for murder undermines her stated goals. And on the most surface level, which is to say on a very important level, she is constantly rebuked for acting, well, all FIYUH AND BLUD: The Spice King dismisses her goal and her rage as absurd at the city gates and then again in his palace, Ducksauce nakedly condescends to her and treats her like the fool she basically is, and Jorah, his infatuation and apparent religious awe notwithstanding, sees her clearly as a child, to the point where she openly rebukes him for it. Is that an interesting arc and a good character? Yeah. Is it absurd? Of course. That's why it works. It's mocking a trope.

So, I mean, that’s a lot of :words: from me again, but I’m sticking by my point: Dany is absurd, and this absurdity is the driving force behind all the narrative tension that she generates.

Sometimes it really is the smart thread.

Contra Calculus
Nov 6, 2009

Gravy Boat 2k
Okay, so I haven't been keeping up with this thread because I'm busy with unimportant poo poo like school and work and it's taking a severe toll on my GRRM-bitching time.

So the season finished last Sunday I guess and I never got beyond Ghost of Harrenhal because I'm a lazy rear end in a top hat.

How much did the season finale suck on a scale of Theon's bare rear end to Hodor's dick and how frequent were lesbian orgies per episode on a scale of 10-50?

Contra Calculus fucked around with this message at 01:30 on Jun 6, 2012

Urdnot Fire
Feb 13, 2012

No nudity outside of the requisite Ros tits, and there was some good poo poo: Alfie Allen and Peter Dinklage still were shining beacons and the Fist was pretty nice (though the quality of the White Walker's face varies depending who you ask). Robb is really dumb and married Jeyne for no real reason, and Qhorin and his duel with Jon was super underwhelming.

All in all, it was a disappointment after Blackwater.

my cat is norris
Mar 11, 2010

#onecallcat

The finale was pretty dumb though the scene with the Walkers was okay.

Carly Gay Dead Son
Aug 27, 2007

Bonus.
Tyrion's scar was total pussy rear end crap. And Shae just gets worse and worse.

whowhatwhere
Mar 15, 2010

SHINee's back
By which you mean more and more people think she's actually pretty cool instead of yelling at Tyrion for being an idiot?

Urdnot Fire
Feb 13, 2012

Seriously, this Shae is much better than the one from the start of the season or the books.

Carly Gay Dead Son
Aug 27, 2007

Bonus.
It's specifically the actress I don't like, and by worse and worse I actually mean consistently bad.

empty sea
Jul 17, 2011

gonna saddle my seahorse and float out to the sunset
Most of Shae's scenes make me uncomfortable because they just serve to underline what a complete sad sack of a man Tyrion is. I mean, gently caress. He loves this whore he basically just met because she's kind to him. That is tragic as hell. Especially because Tyrion is so drat smart and cunning and yet he can't help but fall under at the slightest kindness. Even when rationally he knows that he's paying for it. It's loving sad. Tywin broke the hell out of him.

However, I don't mind Shae schoolin' Sansa on how not to be murder bait. That's the only time I enjoy her character. Well, that and "I'll cut their faces off!" That was pretty cool. But flouncing around telling me how she loves the smell of cum? Bitch can get strangled annny old time.

Even Ros is classier than that, HBO. :colbert:

whowhatwhere
Mar 15, 2010

SHINee's back
GRRM insisted on one (1) mention of sexual fluids per season as one of the nonnegotiable elements of the contract. Preferably mentioned by beautiful women. He's going to insist on the licking the sticky princes line being in an ep.

Urdnot Fire
Feb 13, 2012

Only one episode?

Stay Safe
Sep 1, 2008

by FactsAreUseless
As much as no one wants to hear it, I don't think they'll show his wolf's head sewn to his body in the HBO series.

Just throwing that out there.

lobotomy molo
May 7, 2007

by Jeffrey of YOSPOS

Dead Man Posting posted:

As much as no one wants to hear it, I don't think they'll show his wolf's head sewn to his body in the HBO series.

Just throwing that out there.

As long as we still get to hear the wailing and gnashing of teeth of newbie fans, it's all good. GRRM can rape his way into their hearts, just as he did ours.

Trico
Nov 5, 2009

still you are nowhere
I was pretty amped to see "Weasel Soup" play out this season, but that sort of not happened.

Rurik
Mar 5, 2010

Thief
Warrior
Gladiator
Grand Prince

Martin Van Buren posted:

It's specifically the actress I don't like, and by worse and worse I actually mean consistently bad.
I've seen the actress in porn before GoT, so I like her.

That long post about Dany reminded me about some feminist blogs that complain that Gurm is throwing poo poo at all his female characters. It's true, the fate of Sansa, Cat and even Cersei is certainly not enviable. But not only strong and weak women suffer, strong and weak men do as well: Ned, Tywin, Tyrion and especially that womanizer Theon. Latter's case is pretty strong argument against misogyny.

I just hope Gurm really isn't in love with Dany. Princess Perfect is tiresome.

Rape Jake.
Feb 23, 2012

by T. Mascis

Dead Man Posting posted:

As much as no one wants to hear it, I don't think they'll show his wolf's head sewn to his body in the HBO series.

Just throwing that out there.

You don't even "see" it in the books.

bigmcgaffney
Apr 19, 2009
Why talk about ASOIAF when we can talk about James Harden's beard, thats what up

Urdnot Fire
Feb 13, 2012

Rurik posted:

I just hope Gurm really isn't in love with Dany. Princess Perfect is tiresome.
You can blame Emilia Clarke for that.

Rape Jake.
Feb 23, 2012

by T. Mascis
Stupid sexy Emilia Clark.

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Rurik
Mar 5, 2010

Thief
Warrior
Gladiator
Grand Prince
Stupid sexy Ned Flanders Stark.

Actually more like stupid Ned Stark.

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