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Daedalus Esquire posted:I think just about every warder is described as having those dead passionless eyes, every dark friend, and some of the children of light. The specific description is whenever someone grins/laughs and Jordan says something like "but his grin never reached his dangerous eyes" or whatever. I'm not really sure if we're talking about the same thing. There's a difference between dead eyes and "deadly" eyes--a lot of characters, Aes Sedai, Warders, generals, etc., have sharp eyes. Dead eyes is something only a few people have. AFAIK. My memory could be faulty here.
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Jun 12, 2012 21:48
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Daedalus Esquire posted:I think just about every warder is described as having those dead passionless eyes, every dark friend, and some of the children of light. The specific description is whenever someone grins/laughs and Jordan says something like "but his grin never reached his dangerous eyes" or whatever. You've now made me imagine everyone in the series giving the stink eye to people and I can't stop laughing. Thank you so much for this image.
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Jun 12, 2012 21:55
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Daedalus Esquire posted:I think just about every warder is described as having those dead passionless eyes, every dark friend, and some of the children of light. The specific description is whenever someone grins/laughs and Jordan says something like "but his grin never reached his dangerous eyes" or whatever. I always kinda liked that little piece of description. It does a lot depending on the character. It could be a thousand yard stare, or an indicator of utter insincerity but it's really not hard to imagine. Its easy to see as a haunted or really intense look on a soldier or whatever, but really study Hillary Clinton or Mitt Romney smiling in a picture.   It doesn't mean they're giving the stinkeye, it means that they're putting on a front for whatever reason. Maybe they're lying, maybe they just don't give a gently caress in the context of the scene. I dig it.
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Jun 12, 2012 22:22
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Ok, I guess that makes sense. I might have misspoke when I said dead eyes, but I guess with those examples I can see the sort of thing Jordan was going for. I just really got the impression that there was a large population of people in Randland that just didn't have feelings other then a desire to kill.
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Jun 13, 2012 05:31
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arioch posted:There's less than a handful of people I can remember with that kind of description and from what I remember all of them but 1.5 are bad guys. I'd go so far as to say that half the time characters have expressionless/dead faces, the other times you could practically read their entire minds with one glance at their face. I've always felt that was a literary flaw with Jordan. He takes too many exposition short cuts by just letting the POV character tell you what the other person is thinking by reading their face for you. It gets very confusing when the other person isn't thinking that at all, and your supposed to figure out when the main character is right and when they are wrong.
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Jun 13, 2012 06:27
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Book 7, ch. 20 talk: Are we supposed to know who Cadsuane is? I feel like her names been mentioned in passing before, but it could just be that there are 100 minor characters with names 1 vowel off from main characters' names.
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Jun 19, 2012 01:09
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She might have been mentioned in passing by a character, but as you'll soon realize, shes a pretty hard character to forget.
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Jun 19, 2012 01:36
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Daedalus Esquire posted:She might have been mentioned in passing by a character, but as you'll soon realize, shes a pretty hard character to forget. And boy have I tried.
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Jun 19, 2012 02:15
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Cadsuane is the best. 
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Jun 19, 2012 03:16
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Nynaeve is INFURIATING me, btw. She gets better, right?
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Jun 19, 2012 03:45
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Quad posted:Nynaeve is INFURIATING me, btw. She gets better, right? I sense some fun times ahead for you, She does in fact not get better with age.
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Jun 19, 2012 04:03
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Cerepol posted:I sense some fun times ahead for you, She does in fact not get better with age. See, I completely disagree.
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Jun 19, 2012 04:17
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RembrandtQEinstein posted:See, I completely disagree. She gets better with some solid deep dickin.
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Jun 19, 2012 04:22
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wellwhoopdedooo posted:She gets better with some solid deep dickin. Also on the part of the reader. Quite a few of us find her more understandable(if not necessarily more likable) from an older perspective than when we first read of her. Pretty much every character is a broken record on some level, but I attribute that mainly to the sheer length of the series. Personality quirks simply appear so often and are most remembered that across the books all you recall tends to be their more 'unique' traits.
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Jun 19, 2012 04:29
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Paracelsus posted:Cadsuane is the best. I agree. Based on things I'd heard, I was prepared to hate her, but I actually dig her.
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Jun 19, 2012 05:06
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werdnam posted:I agree. Based on things I'd heard, I was prepared to hate her, but I actually dig her. Hell's Grannies all rock. I don't understand why they get so much dissing.
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Jun 19, 2012 08:18
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Jedit posted:Hell's Grannies all rock. I don't understand why they get so much dissing. But she was meeeeaan to Randykins! 
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Jun 19, 2012 08:43
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Cadsuane: I didn't like her on my first read, but like Nynaeve, I have a lot more sympathy for her now. She is really actually pretty level headed when it comes to Rand and refuses to fall in line just because he's a scary sorcerer who is going insane. honestly, I see her as a counterpoint to Lews Therin ranting in his head on this read through. :edit: \/ hmmm, probably best to spoiler any plot points or roles she plays, but if she's introduced to the story, no reason we can't talk about her or her apparent personality. Daedalus Esquire fucked around with this message at 14:34 on Jun 19, 2012 |
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Jun 19, 2012 14:09
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Based on where we are in the book, isn't the other thread probably a better place to discuss this character?
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Jun 19, 2012 14:15
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Just finished CoS, pretty light spoilers I guess: the whole book was 9 days?! The gently caress. After a change of guard in the Children in Book 6, it was awesome to completely ignore them here. Also completely ignoring Perrin, other than "we had a fight, so now we're off to Ghealdan for some reason." 800 pages of looking for a bowl, Nynaeve crying because she had to apologize to a man who has saved her life and never really done anything negative to her other than I guess putting flour on some dogs 6000 pages ago. It's like he deliberately stuck in tiny snippets of possibly interesting plotlines totry and make up for a whole book of sniffing and braid tugging. AARGH. why do I still want to read the rest, what has happened to me. drat you RJ.
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Jun 21, 2012 15:30
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Keep the faith, Quad! I'm in CoT now, and you can look forward to exciting chapters such as a lesson from Faile on how to properly launder silk so that you don't have to iron it and a chapter whose focus is Elayne and Aviendha taking a relaxing bath. There's some other cool stuff, too, I guess.
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Jun 21, 2012 18:04
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I thought Nynaeve was the one formerly omni-annoying character that actually DID grow up and mellow out in the later books and become awesome. Elayne, on the other hand, is the same relentlessly arrogant moron in ToM that she's been since day one.
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Jun 23, 2012 19:20
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Eric the Mauve posted:I thought Nynaeve was the one formerly omni-annoying character that actually DID grow up and mellow out in the later books and become awesome. Elayne, on the other hand, is the same relentlessly arrogant moron in ToM that she's been since day one. You just don't understand women. Now if Mat or Perrin were here, they could tell you what to do with Elayne 
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Jun 23, 2012 22:23
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Minarch posted:You just don't understand women. Now if Mat or Perrin were here, they could tell you what to do with Elayne Its a lack of spanking. Elayne is one of the few female characters who missed out on getting spanked.
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Jun 24, 2012 20:50
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veekie posted:Its a lack of spanking. Elayne is one of the few female characters who missed out on getting spanked. Seriously, people can complain about the weird sex stuff in GRRM's books, at least he's overt about it. The way Jordan subtly wrote sex and  spanking is way creepier. It's just so drat consistent across all of the characters that spanking is the natural way to assert yourself. It's a wonder Rand doesn't run around with a heron-marked hairbrush...
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Jun 24, 2012 22:44
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I've heard his Conan books feature similar amounts of spanking to put both women and men in their place.
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Jun 25, 2012 01:21
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I can't recall but I'm sure somebody here will know: is spanking consistent across all WoT cultures as well? Maybe its just acceptable in the cultures that we the readers get POVs of most of the time in the series. I can't recall any examples of Aiel or Seanchan spanking. And yeah, I recognize that this is a reach and even if it were true it would be giving Jordan too much credit because seriously, spanking. 
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Jun 25, 2012 01:22
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Egwene gets quite the strapping from the wise ones...
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Jun 25, 2012 02:28
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Ah yeah you're right. Well gently caress that theory then 
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Jun 25, 2012 02:42
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Well I still dunno about the seanchan
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Jun 25, 2012 03:34
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Daedalus Esquire posted:Well I still dunno about the seanchan Yeah, the Seanchan are cool as far as I know. Sure there's the whole humanity violating slavery thing, but at least they don't condone spanking. I can respect that about them. Seriously though, I don't think it's a well kept secret that Jordan had, um, idiosyncrasies about gender relations in general and spanking/probably BDSM in particular. It's just part of the package.
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Jun 25, 2012 03:37
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Eric the Mauve posted:Yeah, the Seanchan are cool as far as I know. Sure there's the whole humanity violating slavery thing, but at least they don't condone spanking. I can respect that about them. Don't forget the seanchan also introduced coffee to randland. A few slaves here and there is worth being able to have your morning brew. Also corporal punishment has been the major form of punishment for most of history. Its not that weird.
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Jun 25, 2012 04:23
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Eric the Mauve posted:Yeah, the Seanchan are cool as far as I know. Sure there's the whole humanity violating slavery thing, but at least they don't condone spanking. I can respect that about them.
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Jun 25, 2012 09:53
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The Lord Bude posted:Also corporal punishment has been the major form of punishment for most of history. Its not that weird. Robert Jordan posting from beyond the grave. While corporal punishment is no doubt a thing, I don't recall it being so fixated on slapping that rear end with the palm of your hand.
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Jun 25, 2012 14:32
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veekie posted:Seanchan do use spanking. The Adam allows spanking without using your hands. I thought that was a Cadsuane/Egwene thing and the Seanchan are more about inflicting pain directly to the brain, Semirhage style.
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Jun 25, 2012 14:42
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Minarch posted:Seriously, people can complain about the weird sex stuff in GRRM's books, at least he's overt about it. The way Jordan subtly wrote sex and Yes, references to spanking are much more disturbing than a play by play of deflowering an unwilling 13 year old girl.
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Jun 25, 2012 16:40
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teddust posted:Yes, references to spanking are much more disturbing than a play by play of deflowering an unwilling 13 year old girl. I really don't see how you can say Jordan is way creepier. GRRM wrote about people being hosed to death and all kinds of other really creepy and hosed up poo poo. I just honestly didn't feel the need to read those books after the giant gap between 3 and 4. At least the Wheel of Time has some kind of coherent story really. edit: wrong quote but its to the guy above mes quoted post
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Jun 25, 2012 21:24
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Ramadu posted:I really don't see how you can say Jordan is way creepier. GRRM wrote about people being hosed to death and all kinds of other really creepy and hosed up poo poo. I just honestly didn't feel the need to read those books after the giant gap between 3 and 4. At least the Wheel of Time has some kind of coherent story really. Well there's always this Terry Goodkind fellow... Suddenly, neither Jordan nor GRRM seem all that creepy!
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Jun 26, 2012 01:05
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Kilson posted:Well there's always this Terry Goodkind fellow... Point taken.
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Jun 26, 2012 01:56
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Minarch posted:Robert Jordan posting from beyond the grave. Most if not all legitimate corporal punishment (done as punishment by someone lawfully empowered to carry out punishment) in the series is not spanking however. The white tower employs switching for novices/accepted and birching for criminals, the aiel use switches or straps, the sea folk hang you from the ankles and flog you. This is consistent with the way corporal punishment in a school or judicial setting had been carried out throughout human history, and continues to this day in the countries that still permit it. There is quite simply nothing kinky about it. The only time someone gets/ is threatened with an actual spanking is when it is done without legitimacy - cadsuane trying to bully people, perrin with faile. In this situation the hand spanking is used specifically because it is humiliating, and strongly implies that the recipient is just a small child. It is entirely unrelated to legitimate discipline.
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Jun 26, 2012 03:49
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