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Do you mean the resume itself is two pages long or that it's a cover letter plus resume? Because you may want to consider getting that down to a single page, especially with only undergrad experience. The way I've heard it from a few people who do that kind of hiring is that the majority of recent graduates are going to have nearly identical lab experience, most of which won't even apply to what they'll be doing in an entry-level job. They're getting buried in resumes, so adding another page onto that isn't going to help much. I would only go into detail about things you did that were really unique or exactly related to the job you're applying to. But that kind of thing might be better suited for a cover letter. My understanding is that the main things they're looking at are: whether you've held a real job down for more than a few months (always a plus), what sort of program you graduated from (and where, if it's a big-dick school), how interesting you look on paper (they get tired of seeing the same poo poo over and over), and how much of a hassle the resume is to deal with (they do not like having to look at lots of words or deal with multiple sheets). Take all of this with a grain of salt, though. It's just what I've heard and read.
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May 9, 2012 14:53
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Hey, thanks. It's actually a two-page resume and a full-page cover letter for this application (plus a crazy 5-pages Selection Criteria response because it's for Australia and I had to address 15 criteria). Is the 1-page limit also true for academics? Only one project is from my undergrad though, the others I did for my master's and 2 of them lead to publications (JBC, PLoS One). I'm also referring to them in my Selectrion Criteria responses so I'd want to keep them in the resume. Since my BSc was just at a mediocre school nobody's heard of, and my MSc will be from a Dutch university (they're all respectable, but none is awe-inducing), I think my appeal will have to come from the projects. I think they're interesting, but I'm also afraid the topics are too over the place to make an impact (biochemistry/photocrosslinking, bioinformatics/epigenomics, fungal genetics/organelle biology, cell biology/signaling). ...I forgot what I was trying to say. plasmoduck fucked around with this message at 23:23 on May 9, 2012 |
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May 9, 2012 16:53
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More text on the resume does not mean it will be better received. Resumes need to be concise so that the person looking at it can get a feel for you as quickly as possible. Many people will not even bother looking at a second page, or immediately dismiss it. After reviewing resumes for the last 6 years, I can say I've yet to see a BS or MS resume that couldn't be done in 1 page.
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May 9, 2012 22:59
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I'm with GNinjaGnome on that one. Get your resume down to one page, and get it to the point ASAP. (At least for USA applications; I can't vouch for elsewhere.) In the states, you have about six seconds to get your point across in your resume. My last manager at PFE literally gave applicants one sentence. If he couldn't immediately tell you were qualified, your resume was in the bin.
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May 10, 2012 00:13
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plasmoduck posted:Hey, thanks. It's actually a two-page resume and a full-page cover letter for this application (plus a crazy 5-pages Selection Criteria response because it's for Australia and I had to address 15 criteria). Is the 1-page limit also true for academics? Only one project is from my undergrad though, the others I did for my master's and 2 of them lead to publications (JBC, PLoS One). I'm also referring to them in my Selectrion Criteria responses so I'd want to keep them in the resume. First off, are you a citizen of the US or located in the US right now? If not, you're not going to get anywhere. Second, 5 different labs is a warning flag. Why didn't you stick with 1 or 2? I'd drop the two 2-month projects and just put the other 3 on your resume. It's also considered gauche to name-drop the professors on your resume. If they know the professor for whose lab you're applying, then you should make the connection in your cover letter, with your professor's permission. By far and away your best chance of getting a job is to ask your professors that you did research for (especially the 2 you published with) if they have any connections or suggestions for finding a job. If they have US collaborators, which is a great chance, they'd love the chance to place someone they know in those labs. As I mentioned before, you should lead with the fact that you got independent funding from a competitive merit-based scholarship for your research. This is a big loving deal in academia, even if it's only a couple grand. Also, drop the summary, and move your publications to a more prominent place on your resume. Those are good journals and you should be proud of those publications. Finally, drop the skills section. If you have relevant skills to the jobs you're applying, address them in the cover letter. Don't just say you're proficient at protein expression, for example. Say you expressed and purified over a dozen proteins, including human Bcl in E. coli to a yield of 3 mg/L culture at a purity of 95%. That'd be an impressive achievement that both demonstrates your ability, and shows that you know what's important. I hope that scattershot of advice is helpful.
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May 10, 2012 00:55
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I'm about to graduate with a MS in Biotechnology from a UC, I'm looking for a job and freaking the gently caress out. The school I'm at is in an area that supposedly has a lot of biotech companies but I still can't shake the feeling that I might not be able to find anything. I was looking at Research Associate positions but I don't know if I'm over or under-qualified for them. I see a lot of listings for managerial positions too. It looks like a lot of report writing and paperwork, but they all require extensive science backgrounds. Even though I have a MS I don't know if it's worth applying for those when my experience is almost all in basic science. I actually have an interview with a startup company on Friday, but it comes off as kind of shady. Is it normal to end up at a job like this right out of graduation? edit: Also, CV or resume? Which one is better?
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May 10, 2012 03:17
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porkypocky posted:I'm about to graduate with a MS in Biotechnology from a UC, I'm looking for a job and freaking the gently caress out. The school I'm at is in an area that supposedly has a lot of biotech companies but I still can't shake the feeling that I might not be able to find anything. I was looking at Research Associate positions but I don't know if I'm over or under-qualified for them. I see a lot of listings for managerial positions too. It looks like a lot of report writing and paperwork, but they all require extensive science backgrounds. Even though I have a MS I don't know if it's worth applying for those when my experience is almost all in basic science. Resume is more appropriate until you get more experience.
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May 10, 2012 03:37
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Dik Hz posted:You aren't qualified for managerial positions until you have more experience. Research Associate is a bit on the low end, but if you get hired and demonstrate value, you'll move up quickly. In industry, Scientist I would be appropriate if you have done research before. Yeah, I have some work experience in an academic lab before my MS program and the project that makes up my thesis. How much experience do I need to use a CV then? I have a bunch of papers and posters from my first job so the PI from that job sat down with me and helped me write a CV. Is all that stuff irrelevant now?
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May 10, 2012 03:55
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porkypocky posted:Yeah, I have some work experience in an academic lab before my MS program and the project that makes up my thesis. How much experience do I need to use a CV then? I have a bunch of papers and posters from my first job so the PI from that job sat down with me and helped me write a CV. Is all that stuff irrelevant now? Edit: One more: if you have a PhD, use a CV if you're applying for a large company, academic position, or government position. Otherwise use a resume. Dik Hz fucked around with this message at 04:23 on May 10, 2012 |
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May 10, 2012 04:07
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Dik Hz posted:If you're applying for an academic job based on a referral from the prof that helped you write the CV, use the CV. If have some other good introduction for an academic or government institute job, use the CV. If you're applying to a job posting, use a resume. Okay, got it. Thanks for the clarification 
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May 10, 2012 04:20
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porkypocky posted:I'm about to graduate with a MS in Biotechnology from a UC, I'm looking for a job and freaking the gently caress out. The school I'm at is in an area that supposedly has a lot of biotech companies but I still can't shake the feeling that I might not be able to find anything. Which area? If it's San Diego, welcome to hell, because the market is really freaking tough right now.
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May 10, 2012 08:35
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Thanks a lot Dik Hz, that helped a bunch.Dik Hz posted:First off, are you a citizen of the US or located in the US right now? If not, you're not going to get anywhere. quote:Second, 5 different labs is a warning flag. Why didn't you stick with 1 or 2? I'd drop the two 2-month projects and just put the other 3 on your resume. It's also considered gauche to name-drop the professors on your resume. If they know the professor for whose lab you're applying, then you should make the connection in your cover letter, with your professor's permission. - #1 was for my bachelor thesis abroad. Research was great (ubiquitin stuff) and I was asked to return for a PhD, but my boyfriend didn't want to move to Sweden (and winter darkness got to me). - #2 was just a summer job in my hometown, I'll remove this - #3 was the first of 2 obligatory projects in my MSc program and had to be done at my Department (Netherlands, topic no connection to #1 sadly). I did well and was asked to stay for a PhD, but again, my boyfriend didn't want to move here and I'd rather work with mammalian cells. - #4 was a bioinformatics project that I did in place of 2 courses that clashed with #5 timing. I wanted to leave this one here because I learned R from scratch and managed to produce enough results within 2 months to get another co-authorship (paper in submission), which I'm kinda proud of and says something about my learning pace and computer literacy. I'm also referring to this on in my Selection Criteria response. - #5 was my second MSc research project. I've always wanted to go to Japan for an internship and was accepted by a good lab in line with my interests (some connection to #1), in a place where my boyfriend also wouldn't mind living (he's half Japanese). I also got a decent scholarship so all seemed gravy - but after tons of problems (bad communication, terrible lab safety, regular 60-70 hr weeks) even if the outcome was o.k. I'd prefer western-style labs for the future (or the RIKEN labs, but they only employ PhD/postdoc level). I'm aware and I agree that the resulting lab salad is too scattered to leave a good/clear impression, but I'm having a bit of trouble to compress this without leaving out important things (e.g. projects leading to papers). Also I don't know if I can refer to not listed projects list in Selectrion Criteria (this is an AUS issue). quote:As I mentioned before, you should lead with the fact that you got independent funding from a competitive merit-based scholarship for your research. This is a big loving deal in academia, even if it's only a couple grand. quote:Finally, drop the skills section. If you have relevant skills to the jobs you're applying, address them in the cover letter. Don't just say you're proficient at protein expression, for example. Say you expressed and purified over a dozen proteins, including human Bcl in E. coli to a yield of 3 mg/L culture at a purity of 95%. That'd be an impressive achievement that both demonstrates your ability, and shows that you know what's important. Again thanks a lot for all that advice, seems like I have a whole lot to think about/work on still. plasmoduck fucked around with this message at 16:59 on May 10, 2012 |
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May 10, 2012 11:34
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plasmoduck posted:Ah, I didn't know that about name-dropping and will remove them next time. The "5 labs" thing has more to do with logistics and my boyfriend being stubborn than anything One more thing about the name-dropping... "science" is a big field, but any given field within it is a very small world. Go into any interview with the assumption that not only does your interviewer know who your name-dropped reference is, but that he's got the guy on loving speed-dial. I learned that lesson about six years ago through experience when I hyped up my neuro research under a guy out at Cold Spring Harbor Laboratory while interviewing at a position at Harvard. Ends up the guy had worked with my reference for a good five years, and he literally pulled out his cellphone, put it on speakerphone, and dialed my reference on the spot. When my name-drop had no recollection of me or my (in reality very minimal and pointless) research with him, the interview was as good as toast. Just don't do it. The potential pain and humiliation isn't worth it. 
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May 10, 2012 18:08
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Ouch. Although in my case it probably wouldn't be a big problem. Save for one person (from the summer job), all three group leaders know I've been applying, think favourable of me and already agreed to be my referees... I probably should approach them again and be more adamant about referring me to someone they know. Too often my pride gets in the way of asking for help, it's pretty stupid.
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May 10, 2012 19:27
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plasmoduck posted:Ouch. Although in my case it probably wouldn't be a big problem. Save for one person (from the summer job), all three group leaders know I've been applying, think favourable of me and already agreed to be my referees... I probably should approach them again and be more adamant about referring me to someone they know. Too often my pride gets in the way of asking for help, it's pretty stupid.
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May 10, 2012 22:49
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Sundae posted:When my name-drop had no recollection of me or my (in reality very minimal and pointless) research with him, the interview was as good as toast. I think the moral of this story is to only name drop people that actually know you and your work.
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May 11, 2012 07:50
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Appachai posted:I think the moral of this story is to only name drop people that actually know you and your work. Well yes, that would indeed be the moral of the story.
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May 11, 2012 16:29
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Arcaeris posted:Which area? I'm in Irvine but looking either in Orange County or LA. I had an interview for a small start-up today(like, half the lab is in the shipping dock small) that I think went pretty well. I have a bunch of positions left to apply to and a month left to graduate though so hopefully I'll have more than just that option.
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May 12, 2012 09:20
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This is a slightly related topic, but loving christ it's getting on my nerves. I'm at that age where everyone is getting married and having kids. And suddenly everyone is a fan of that loving quack Dr. Sears and his "unbiased" alternative schedule for vaccinations. Why is it that so many new moms are going for this stupid naturalistic bullshit regarding vaccines!? And any time you give them good information they just scream at you that you think they're bad parents and they know their kids better than some know-it-all doctor or scientist. Sorry for the rant, my area now has a whooping cough epidemic.
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May 16, 2012 23:15
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Solkanar512 posted:This is a slightly related topic, but loving christ it's getting on my nerves. I think being a parent makes you scared and that fear makes you irrational. You're now responsible for everything for a helpless life form--their financial, emotional, physical, social, whatever well being. I once read a very good quote about this and it went something like: "If the way you make money has something to do with the anxiety and fear of parents, you never have to worry about being poor."
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May 17, 2012 02:21
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The only two big biotech companies i know of in LA/OC are Teva and Amgen, you've applied to them i imagine. I know a small startup in inglewood is hiring but only for lab assistant position and PhD position. If you just wanted a job then i would say go try UCLA for an SRAII/III position or Cedars?
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May 23, 2012 02:43
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Eugenics posted:The only two big biotech companies i know of in LA/OC are Teva and Amgen, you've applied to them i imagine. I know a small startup in inglewood is hiring but only for lab assistant position and PhD position. Yeah, I've applied for all of those places including USC. I was thinking that I could apply for lab manager positions too. The last lab I was in I ended up doing all the manager responsibilities anyway because it was so small.
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May 23, 2012 03:48
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Actually a lot of outfits at least in the Bay Area don't hire new masters grads as scientists. The economy has really given us a lot of highly qualified candidates to pick from. I'd say expect to come in at the mid research associate range, maybe senior research associate if you have considerable experience.
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May 25, 2012 06:06
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Hey guys. I've been lurking this thread on and off for a while now, but finally decided to get caught up. I graduated 3 years ago with research experience in organic syn. Since graduating I've been working at as an analytical chemist at a consumer products testing lab (heavy metals, phthalates, and other restricted/toxic substances). Generally, the job is okay except at times it can be so routine. I actually look forward to troubleshooting issues that come up or method development. I consider myself proficient on ICP-OES and HPLC, but have dabbled lightly into ICP-MS and GCMS as well. So if anyone is interested in this field ask away. I also came across this article (http://hackerjobs.co.uk/blog/2012/5/16/assessing-a-company-questions-you-need-to-ask-in-an-interview) a while back and thought it'd be a good read for the goons out there looking for a job. It'll definitely help avoid problems down the road.
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May 30, 2012 05:26
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So my company wants me to move to Boston from Seattle. They are proposing a 10% salary increase and relocation. It looks to me that apartments are around 40% more expensive than they are here in Seattle. They also want me to sign a 2 year contract though. I'm thinking that I should ask for 30% and 1 year and then compromise at 20-25% and the 2 year contract. What do you guys think?
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May 31, 2012 02:03
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john ashpool fucked around with this message at 15:00 on Mar 13, 2016 |
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May 31, 2012 13:11
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Appachai posted:So my company wants me to move to Boston from Seattle. They are proposing a 10% salary increase and relocation. It looks to me that apartments are around 40% more expensive than they are here in Seattle. They also want me to sign a 2 year contract though. I'm thinking that I should ask for 30% and 1 year and then compromise at 20-25% and the 2 year contract. What do you guys think? Edit: I can't loving read, I thought you were coming to Seattle. Ugh, that sucks 
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May 31, 2012 15:03
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john ashpool posted:Boston is stupid expensive, in part because there is a housing shortage. I think only San Fran and NY are more expensive. How big of a company are we talking about? The company is around 70 people total. They just opened a second location in Boston (Bedford). Right now they are buying some fancy equipment(that we already should have had) and they are thinking about putting it in Boston in the new lab so that they can bring people on tours of the facility. Most cost of living calculators seem to say Boston is around 20% more expensive than Seattle.
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May 31, 2012 15:59
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Welp, guess I'm rejoining the masses of the funemployed after 6 months. Not going to lie, I kind of really disliked process synthetic chem, especially done at a ghetto meth lab garage-stage startup. Setting up, hauling around, and working up 22L reactions got old real fast.
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May 31, 2012 23:24
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zilong posted:Welp, guess I'm rejoining the masses of the funemployed after 6 months. Not going to lie, I kind of really disliked process synthetic chem, especially done at a ghetto meth lab garage-stage startup. Setting up, hauling around, and working up 22L reactions got old real fast. drat, that sounds even worse than the lab I used to work in.
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Jun 1, 2012 01:28
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Solkanar512 posted:drat, that sounds even worse than the lab I used to work in. And this is with the company being in a fairly late stage as a startup. Back when the founder began the company maybe 10 years ago, it was just one roll up garage (the company's taken over 4 adjacent units now), a table, a rotovap, and a big fan. That being said, the big walk-in hoods and ventilation and such were actually pretty good... just not the hauling heavy things all day part.
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Jun 1, 2012 01:43
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Dik Hz fucked around with this message at 03:09 on Jun 25, 2012 |
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Jun 6, 2012 23:14
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Okay - I have a story, finally. Not really a lab story, but if it goes like the December shutdown went for my department, I'll 100% be gone after a year, off to greener pastures even if it involves reducing my pay. We're going into our summer shutdown next week. For us, this is hell-month, because it's one of two times per year that the engineers can get into the manufacturing block to fix things short of catastrophic equipment failures. Not that the hours look that different, at least judging by my co-workers and their 14-20 hour workdays. Everything we've been piling up for the last six months, and everything that we anticipate that we might need to have happen before December, has to be done in this one month. Once the equipment goes live again, our window is shut and we can't touch a thing until December. Yesterday we had a presentation about some new changes in the shutdown procedures. For one, because of safety concerns from last year, we'll now have a cap of 14 hours per day of expected worktime, and we're capped at 6 days per week during shutdown. ... unless our managers apply for a waiver. Which every single manager has, as per the next slide. So, we've instituted a 14 hour rule that has been waived for each and every one of you. Your safety is important to us! It is the foremost thing on our minds! Oh by the way, reminder that this summer we're replacing the air handler units, so you guys are going to be working 14+ hour shifts, seven days a week, in attics and mechanical rooms in the middle of July without ventilation. Make sure you drink plenty of water! [You can't bring water into any of the areas we're going to be working in.] Have a great shutdown, everyone, and remember: safety first! [Except for the safety concerns we created purely by not timing our HVAC upgrades for the december shutdown and by expecting you to work 14+ hours a day.] Last slide: A reminder that as of April, the comp-time policy no longer applies during shutdowns. Sundae fucked around with this message at 15:02 on Jun 23, 2012 |
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Jun 23, 2012 14:59
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Sundae posted:Okay - I have a story, finally. Not really a lab story, but if it goes like the December shutdown went for my department, I'll 100% be gone after a year, off to greener pastures even if it involves reducing my pay. When that slide showing that every manager applied for a waiver was shown, how was there not a riot?
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Jun 23, 2012 17:06
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My guess is a combination of "the midwest," "engineers and their general masochism," and that the job pays a good 2-3X what most jobs in Indiana pay. Even if they understand that the boat could really use a good rocking, they probably can't afford to be the one rocking it. Cynical side of me coming out here, but never underestimate an engineer's ability to keep a straight face while stating that he, himself, is not deserving of anything other than what he explicitly signed a contract for. I'm going to deal with it this time (well, and in December too  ) since I can't leave until a year is up anyway. (Well, I can - I just owe back all the relocation money if I do.)Three cheers for a really, really lovely month coming up. Hopefully it isn't as bad as the one I wasn't here for back in December; according to my coworkers, some people literally brought in sleeping bags and caught a few hours here and there between projects, because there wasn't enough time for them to go home and sleep before they'd have to be back again. Sundae fucked around with this message at 17:30 on Jun 23, 2012 |
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Jun 23, 2012 17:27
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Sundae posted:My guess is a combination of "the midwest," "engineers and their general masochism," and that the job pays a good 2-3X what most jobs in Indiana pay. Even if they understand that the boat could really use a good rocking, they probably can't afford to be the one rocking it. Cynical side of me coming out here, but never underestimate an engineer's ability to keep a straight face while stating that he, himself, is not deserving of anything other than what he explicitly signed a contract for.
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Jun 23, 2012 17:46
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seacat posted:I was under the impression you were much happier there than at PFE? Guess not Apparently I'm not. Though I am admittedly compensated much better. I don't think it's going to be worth it, even for the extra $20K.I started out much happier, right up until training ended and they decided that I didn't need to ever go home again. Don't get me wrong: the company is way, WAY better than PFE is, and my PFE buddies out here agree with that. It's my particular department / position that sucks so much. The R&D roles here are fine, but I'm in manufacturing engineering now. Apparently we're not supposed to care about anything but work. Now that I'm "qualified" internally for my role - training completed and what not - I get calls in the middle of the night pretty much every day during the week, and several per day on weekends. (I actually just finished taking one. ) If a company requires that you make sure you're always available on a moment's notice to do work, you're never really having a weekend or any off-time. Sleep doesn't work when your 8 hours is really 3 / 2 / 3, where the 2 is time spent on the phone diagnosing a part failure in the middle of the night.I also have one thing looming in the distance that I know will eventually become a problem. (It isn't yet, but it will be.) The company shutdown in the winter runs mid-December to roughly mid-to-late January. You get Christmas off, but the rest of the time around it is the same hellish crazy-schedule that we're going to be doing in July. The engineers are expected to not take any vacation days during that time period, meaning I will never be able to go visit my family back in the northeast for Christmas. No problem for one year, but by the time year 2-3 rolls around, that's going to be a big issue for me. I kinda like them.
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Jun 23, 2012 17:59
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Sundae posted:Cynical side of me coming out here, but never underestimate an engineer's ability to keep a straight face while stating that he, himself, is not deserving of anything other than what he explicitly signed a contract for. "Yeah, I guess it's ok that my boss get to sleep with my wife first on my wedding night, it's in the contract." I know what you're talking about, but the fact that they can't understand that they have no power to alter the contract in any way should be clear to them. I mean poo poo, I had to run our electronic work order outage last Memorial Day Weekend (HAVE YOU EVER BUILT A PLANE WITH PAPER FORMS OH HOLKY poo poo) but it worked out at the end, I had plenty of overtime pay and a modest bonus with thanks and handshakes from upper management. I'm really sorry to hear about your work, and please, please make sure you and your employees are familiar with the signs of heat stroke and exhaustion. http://www.cdc.gov/niosh/topics/heatstress/ I'm sure I'm preaching to the choir with you, but for the rest reading this heat exhaustion is really serious poo poo that is easily preventable if you know what you're looking for.
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Jun 23, 2012 18:09
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Sundae posted:Now that I'm "qualified" internally for my role - training completed and what not - I get calls in the middle of the night pretty much every day during the week, and several per day on weekends. (I actually just finished taking one. Wait, you aren't paid to be on call? Isn't that a direct violation of the Fair Labor Standards Act?
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Jun 23, 2012 18:14
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Solkanar512 posted:Wait, you aren't paid to be on call? Isn't that a direct violation of the Fair Labor Standards Act? They're lumping it under salaried-exempt, just like IT companies (try to) do.
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Jun 23, 2012 19:10
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