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The rule for Righteous Fury against vehicles is different to regular RF. Instead of adding an extra d10, you roll 1d5 on the critical damage chart and apply the result. This means you'll probably disable the vehicle in some way, possibly even reducing its armour value. I agree that it seems overly hard to outright destroy an enemy vehicle but I like the idea that you're more likely to incapacitate a vehicle than destroy it. Also, combat wouldn't be much fun if you could 1-hit-KO an enemy tank. Or be 1-hit-KO'd.
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Jun 28, 2012 06:37
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Hull Crit table: 1. Anyone not strapped down might be stunned for 1 round 2. -20 penalty to all actions until someone takes a round to stop a opaque gas leak 3. Anyone not strapped down might be stunned for 1d5 rounds 4. random crewmember takes 1d10+6 damage and a level of fatigue 5. Hit facing loses 1d10 Armor Turret Crit table: 1. Turret crew stunned for 1 round 2. Weapon is jammed, must be cleared 3. -10 accuracy penalty to all turret weapons for 1d5 rounds 4. turret seizes up 5. turret loses electrical power Motive System Crit table: 1. Driver must roll to avoid the vehicle changing direction randomly, gains fatigue level 2. may only move tactical speed next turn 3. motive system impared damage 4. vehicle may now stall out if it tries to go faster than tactical speed 5. vehicle temporarily goes out of control Weapon System Crit Table: 1. Weapon's gunner stunned for 1 round 2. Weapon Jams and must be cleared 3. Weapon suffers -10 BS for 1d5 rounds 4. weapon seizes up and cannot be moved 5. weapon is disabled (but not destroyed) A few of these might result in mobility or armament kills, but I don't like the idea of relying on them to take out an enemy vehicle. Maybe I'll do a test tank battle to see how things go. That said, one of the best tank killers in the game is the humble Molotov Cocktail. The rules for vehicles being on fire are quite nasty. On a 10+ on a 1d10 something in the vehicle explodes and the vehicle takes 8 crit damage ignoring armor. You also add +1 to the roll each round, so after three rounds of being on fire you've got a 30% chance of something exploding. The crew takes -20 to all actions while the vehicle is on fire and its a Agility-20 test to put the fire out. Galaga Galaxian fucked around with this message at 06:59 on Jun 28, 2012 |
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Jun 28, 2012 06:52
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I'm pretty sure infantry fighting tanks in real life don't shoot them in the front, for exactly that reason. Front of tanks are really well armored.
Zereth fucked around with this message at 07:02 on Jun 28, 2012 |
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Jun 28, 2012 06:59
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I'm not talking about infantry fighting tanks, I'm talking about tanks fighting tanks. Yes even then it should be hard to damage another tank shooting at it's front armor, but a max damage roll for a dedicated high-power Tank-killer cannon should do more than scratch a tank on front-armor hit.
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Jun 28, 2012 07:10
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The Vanquisher Cannon is Accurate, does it still get a significant damage bonus based on degrees of success on the shot?
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Jun 28, 2012 07:12
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The rules for Accurate specify only Basic type weapons get that bonus damage for extra DoS.
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Jun 28, 2012 07:21
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Galaga Galaxian posted:The rules for Accurate specify only Basic type weapons get that bonus damage for extra DoS. Well that's a shame. It seems appropriately flavorful for what is the tank-cannon equivalent of a sniper rifle.
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Jun 28, 2012 08:14
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Well, I don't really want to bust out the tabletop comparisons, but basically, Leman Russes are supposed to have armor up front basically equivalent to a land raider. The battle cannon is strength 8, so you need to roll a 6 on a d6 to even glance the front armour with it. Armoured combat will probably involve a lot of maneuvering for position to get ina shot at the sides or rear based on the current rules. If you wanted to run your game with a lot of tank combat, you might even just want to use mook rules for enemy vehicles, any sort of structural integrity damage counts as critical, or a straight up kill to help the combat feel more rewarding. The Vanquisher does feel a little off, in that it could probably be at least 3d10+10 like the battle cannon is. Failing that, bumping up the damage on either by 1d10 would be an easy way to increase lethality. I could see myself doing this because the battle cannon damage feels a little too insignificant compared to the autocannon, which is nearly the same despite being much smaller ammunition. Speaking of the land raider too, in Deathwatch and other sources, they top out with 50 armor points on all sides, meaning that the Leman Russ definitely has some of the toughest armor in production.
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Jun 28, 2012 08:20
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Signal posted:Well that's a shame. It seems appropriately flavorful for what is the tank-cannon equivalent of a sniper rifle. I feel the same way- heck, it'd be a neat way to tie in the Vanq's +2d6 armour penetration with the RPG's mechanics. If it were up to me, I'd houserule it that way. As an aside, anyone have any ideas on how to make an Executioner's Plasma Cannon? I'm thinking of using the normal Plasma Cannon statblock, but with the RoF changed to -/3/- , and maybe expand the Blast rating to 3. Look good?
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Jun 28, 2012 09:41
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CommissarMega posted:I feel the same way- heck, it'd be a neat way to tie in the Vanq's +2d6 armour penetration with the RPG's mechanics. If it were up to me, I'd houserule it that way. Are you talking about the Leman Russ Executioner's Plasma Destroyer? Or something else? If thats what your talking about bump it up to 3d10+12 -/-/3 (makes no sense to have a gun that can semi-auto and not single shot) Blast (5), Overheats, Maximal. Special Rule of overheat is tech-use test to flush the coolant into the plasma or detonate. Maybe bump the range up I dont know. kingcom fucked around with this message at 11:52 on Jun 28, 2012 |
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Jun 28, 2012 11:41
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kingcom posted:Are you talking about the Leman Russ Executioner's Plasma Destroyer? Or something else? Yeah, the main gun. Still gonna rule that vehicle weapons don't overheat though 
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Jun 28, 2012 12:20
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CommissarMega posted:Yeah, the main gun. Still gonna rule that vehicle weapons don't overheat though Normally yes but the whole description of the Plasma Destroyer is that everyone who pilots a Russ with one mounted is considered insane because its so unstable. These guns have a reputation for overheating and vapourising the vehicle its mounted to.
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Jun 28, 2012 15:15
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kingcom posted:Normally yes but the whole description of the Plasma Destroyer is that everyone who pilots a Russ with one mounted is considered insane because its so unstable. These guns have a reputation for overheating and vapourising the vehicle its mounted to. Man, why you gotta squash my hash, dude? Is this about that Sororitas thing? I take it back, man. I take it back 
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Jun 28, 2012 17:41
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Welllllll.. I mean, the tank used as a model has no chance of exploding, but yeah, maybe add critical hit effects when the main cannon is damaged, you get a nice plasma tank rupture? Easy enough to do, without having a chance of blowing up with every pull of the trigger.
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Jun 28, 2012 19:04
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How about if the Plasma Destroyer overheats the weapon gains the Weapon Disabled damage effect. Also if ]the Plasma Destroyer is ever disabled or destroyed the tank catches on fire as the plasma loses containment. That way the gun is knocked out and the tank has an increasing (but not quite instant) chance of exploding. Also give it the Extremely Volatile trait, to make it even more likely to explode.  That should encourage the crew to bail at the first sign of trouble. If you want to be real mean, apply a penalty to put out the fire above the normal -20 Agility test.
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Jun 28, 2012 22:44
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Grant the rule that on burning a fate point in death, a player may choose to forgo survival to have the damage to the tank to cause a cataclysmic plasma rupture, with suitably messy results.
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Jun 29, 2012 01:26
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Normally tanks plasmas don't overheat because they have ample cooling, from what I remember. I think the idea with the Plasma Destroyer is it's so far beyond its cooling system it's insane. So yeah, have it be the only tank with Overheat as a rule.
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Jun 29, 2012 02:41
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KSAF Staff Report posted:Normally tanks plasmas don't overheat because they have ample cooling, from what I remember. I think the idea with the Plasma Destroyer is it's so far beyond its cooling system it's insane. Was that noted down all 'official'-like in the IA rules? I can't find my IA books (my monies  ), so I can't comment. If it's not in the official rules though- woohoo! Loophole!
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Jun 29, 2012 07:30
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In Imperial Armor, and I'm pretty sure in the current 5th edition IG codex, the plasma destroyer on an Executioner does not suffer from 'Gets hot!' rules, so it shouldn't be temperamental enough to explode on an itchy trigger finger.
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Jun 29, 2012 07:39
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Awww c'mon, you know you want a tank that has the potential to become a fiery deathtrap. It'll be fun! I think the variant should still at least get the Extremely Volatile trait, even if the Plasma Destroyer can't "overheat". It is still carrying around one or more very large plasma flasks. Galaga Galaxian fucked around with this message at 07:42 on Jun 29, 2012 |
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Jun 29, 2012 07:40
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CommissarMega posted:Man, why you gotta squash my hash, dude? Is this about that Sororitas thing? I take it back, man. I take it back What did I do  What Sororita thing?
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Jun 29, 2012 10:10
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kingcom posted:What did I do The Sororitas Only War homebrew I posted  I was making the joke, yes?
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Jun 29, 2012 10:20
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CommissarMega posted:The Sororitas Only War homebrew I posted Oh! Ok, my brain...its not working so good.
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Jun 29, 2012 10:38
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Galaga Galaxian posted:Awww c'mon, you know you want a tank that has the potential to become a fiery deathtrap. It'll be fun! I thought Hellhounds filled in that role.
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Jun 29, 2012 11:23
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Hellhounds don't "have the potential to become" a firetrap, pretty sure the entire thing is designed to explode into flames as you turn the ignition and you're only supposed to live long enough to scream "FOR THE EMPEROR" as you steer it into enemy lines.
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Jun 29, 2012 15:25
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KSAF Staff Report posted:Normally tanks plasmas don't overheat because they have ample cooling, from what I remember. I think the idea with the Plasma Destroyer is it's so far beyond its cooling system it's insane. Actually, the problem was IIRC that they didn't find enough space for two of the main coolant lines. So they just bolted them to the top of the turret, where they're liable to get ruptured if the tank comes under any kind of fire. That's when things become... interesting.
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Jun 29, 2012 17:23
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Only War Beta has been updated. Vanquisher cannons are no longer pointless, as are Favoured Weapons.
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Jul 4, 2012 00:50
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MaliciousOnion posted:Vanquisher cannons are no longer pointless YESSS Seriously, there's not really much point in playing an Armoured Regiment squad unless you can pilot a Vanquisher, especially since you don't have to worry about points costs (Pask-Vanquishers  ).
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Jul 4, 2012 03:07
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Vanquisher fix is decent, but there are still other anti-tank weapons that are thoroughly mediocre. Also they took away meltaguns from weapon specialists, this amuses me.
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Jul 4, 2012 03:12
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Galaga Galaxian posted:Also they took away meltaguns from weapon specialists, this amuses me. Well, they still can, assuming that meltaguns are their regiment's Favoured Weapon.
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Jul 4, 2012 03:19
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CommissarMega posted:Well, they still can, assuming that meltaguns are their regiment's Favoured Weapon. Well, meltas are powerful enough to deserve making them rare. Basically, if you're rocking meltas, it's because your regiment is known for that poo poo. or you guys managed to grab one somehow, hut that's different.
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Jul 4, 2012 04:20
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Baneblade co-axial autocannons are Ogryn-proof? Do they expect enough players to rip them off Baneblades for it to need the tag? Well, yes I guess.
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Jul 4, 2012 19:50
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What does the Ogryn Proof rule do? Also, after reading Dead Men Walking, is the Death Korps's ability to gently caress up everything by being needlessly antagonistic towards their allies and dumb as bricks towards their enemies represented in Only War, other then the WP tests to not run into the wrong direction when a grenade lands nearby?
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Jul 4, 2012 22:21
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Ogryn-Proof simply means the weapon can be used by an Ogryn. Ogryn's can't use most weapons because they are complicated and fragile (from an Ogryn's PoV) and they'd break them. Currently there are 3 Ogryn-Proof ranged weapons. Ripper gun, Heavy Stubber, M36 Autocannon
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Jul 4, 2012 23:14
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Might be on the groggy side, but, does anyone think the autocannon is statted a little more powerful than it should be? It's practically a battle cannon with rapid fire. That, and Ogryn's feel a little less powerful than they should be, while the increase for wound points is nice, shouldn't they have higher unnatural strength/toughness bonuses than space marines?
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Jul 5, 2012 00:26
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Well, the Battle Cannon has the benefit of exploding everything in a 21m diameter.
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Jul 5, 2012 00:33
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Miruvor posted:Might be on the groggy side, but, does anyone think the autocannon is statted a little more powerful than it should be? It's practically a battle cannon with rapid fire. The extra two damage on the battle cannon might not look like much but it also has a vastly superior range and is Blast (10), Concussive (3). Not to mention the battle cannon is mounted on a tank. Space Marines are genetically modified to be superior to regular humans, whereas Ogryns are just bigger because they come from high gravity worlds.
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Jul 5, 2012 00:45
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MaliciousOnion posted:The extra two damage on the battle cannon might not look like much but it also has a vastly superior range and is Blast (10), Concussive (3). Not to mention the battle cannon is mounted on a tank. Yeah, but with a quick-lick of house ruling, you can have a Leman Russ Exterminator, twin-linked autocannon tank! 
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Jul 5, 2012 00:56
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Well, if we're going to compare vehicles that aren't in the book edit: \/ Macharius Vanquisher. Super-heavy with twin-linked vanquisher cannon. MaliciousOnion fucked around with this message at 03:32 on Jul 5, 2012 |
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Jul 5, 2012 03:00
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The hell is that? Someone's custom Leman Russ? I don't recognize it, but I'm not super familiar with Forge World vehicles.
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Jul 5, 2012 03:23
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