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redreader
Nov 2, 2009

I am the coolest person ever with my pirate chalice. Seriously.

Dinosaur Gum

kaishek posted:

Then again, redreader, did I read correctly that you keep 200 in your account and that your credit cards aren't all paid off? If that is the case then I did totally misread you and yes you definitely have some re-organizing to do. Credit cards paid off is first thing. Second thing is 200 of any currency is not nearly enough of a buffer in an active use account.

No, that's not right. I have credit cards that I use and then pay off every month, *IN FULL*. I have no debt in my name. I'm just saying that when I get paid, every time I get paid, I pay off the entire balance of every credit card. I am pretty sure I mentioned this before, but people always assume the worst here! ;)

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canyoneer
Sep 13, 2005


I only have canyoneyes for you

redreader posted:

but people always assume the worst here! ;)

Because that's usually the case! You seem to have it together though.

for content:
One thing that helped me when I began budgeting was to make a spreadsheet (woo!) and divide income/expenses to the daily level. It's easier to visualize that way. Example:
$150 per day = monthly gross/31 days
-$35 per day = income/payroll taxes
-$25 per day = rent
-$10 per day = car payment
-$4 per day = car insurance
-$20 per day = savings for trip to Mexico
....etc
=
$35 per day discretionary


That way, as you're going through your day you can think things like:
"I'll spend $20 at the grocery store on the way home to buy stuff to make lunches so I can have $15 extra a day to do whatever with."
"This collectible lightsaber costs a week and a half's worth of discretionary income"
"50 cents a day for Netflix streaming seems fair"
"I just spent my entire salary for today on two tickets to a 3D movie I didn't even like"

Bringing it down to the micro level (at least for a moment) makes it much easier to visualize how you actually spend your money.

redreader
Nov 2, 2009

I am the coolest person ever with my pirate chalice. Seriously.

Dinosaur Gum

YES.

Right now I'm:

-tracking spending.
-looking at monthly spending in various categories on mint to get a general idea.

-before I make a budget: writing down allllll of our expenses (rent, cars, car servicing, dentist, pets) in a spreadsheet and getting my wife to add hers too. Identifying if they're yearly, monthly, quarterly. Deciding which are needed (rent) and which are optional (xbox live) , getting our income, identifying where too much money is spent (restaurants, apparently, for way-too-much this month according to mint) then I can decide where to allocate everything. I should have this done by the end of this weekend. There's a LOT of stuff to add in there, apparently.

Thankfully I did first year accounting in university so I understand how to record a bunch of this stuff, e.g if glasses are a yearly thing and I'm doing the budget by the month, I can divide the yearly cost by 12 and decide to put 1/12th of the cost aside per month.

I suppose when I'm done with this I'll need to know some stuff still, like figure out optimizations:
-should we both get healthcare from my plan, or should we stay on separate plans
-how much do I allocate for an FSA? (figure it out based on what we spent total last year on medical)
-how much (this is personal so I don't want to give details, but I want to find out how to work it out) do I save as a nest egg in cash (I already have a fair amount), how much do I allocate straight towards the student loan repayment, and how much for the 401k/Roth? I don't get matching but she gets 6% matching so she just allocated 6% of her salary to a 401k 'cos that's free money.

My father sent me a long email with some great advice. He said to always pay off debt first. the highest interest rate loan she has is about 8% so we're going to get that one first. I am not sure though, if I should put all excess into that or not. I'm tempted to put maybe 200 into savings per month, 5% of my salary into a 401k (someone said Roth IRA, too), maybe 100 dollars into buying stocks for long term investment, and the rest into her student loans. I have no idea how much 'the rest' will be but I suspect over 1000 per month. If it's less than that I'll definitely lower the savings. I've made a list of goals, ranked:

Long term:

-have a short term nest egg for surviving 6 months with no income. I'm 95% sure I have this amount already but I may not be thinking of some necessary expenses.
-pay off all of her student loans asap, apart from maybe the 3% interest ones.
-start saving for a downpayment on a house.
-not live a miserable 'save everything, no fun' existance.
-budget for vacations


Short term:

-Track all expenses manually, to keep myself mindful
-make an expenses spreadsheet based on past spending, for the first step of planning a budget
-use this spreadsheet plan a budget.
-set aside money for spending on food/drinks. Draw that in advance. Stop buying said stuff when that money runs out.

Large Hardon Collider
Nov 28, 2005


PARADOL EX FAN CLUB
I applied for a credit card and got denied, in part for having too many recent credit checks. This is probably due to moving recently. How long should I wait before reapplying? I also want to increase the limit on my card I've had since before college, but that would require another credit check.

Zeta Taskforce
Jun 27, 2002

kaishek posted:

Heh, I didn't mean to imply effortless or don't bother trying, I was just seeing people saying never and no when the answer is moderation not denial. Perhaps I was misinterpreting! You are absolutely right that he should work to get a plan written down, figure out where the money is going. I just wanted to make sure that the bar and impulse purchase budget wasn't set to $0.

I pick on you because I like you, really! Moderation and denial are relative terms, and the truth is somewhere in between. But for many of us, depending on how big of a mess and what we did to get there, the short term might be closer to denial.


Large Hardon Collider posted:

I applied for a credit card and got denied, in part for having too many recent credit checks. This is probably due to moving recently. How long should I wait before reapplying? I also want to increase the limit on my card I've had since before college, but that would require another credit check.

Without knowing anything else, my best guess would be 6 months.

Large Hardon Collider
Nov 28, 2005


PARADOL EX FAN CLUB

Zeta Taskforce posted:

Without knowing anything else, my best guess would be 6 months.
What information would be helpful?

I signed a lease in December, but the landlord cancelled it and refunded our money in may, at which point I signed another lease. So that's two credit checks, and I actually checked my credit score myself in March. I applied for the card last month, which makes four checks in about seven months.

Zeta Taskforce
Jun 27, 2002

Large Hardon Collider posted:

What information would be helpful?

I signed a lease in December, but the landlord cancelled it and refunded our money in may, at which point I signed another lease. So that's two credit checks, and I actually checked my credit score myself in March. I applied for the card last month, which makes four checks in about seven months.

Too many inquiries isn’t a common reason why things get denied. I was wondering if you had any slow payments at any point, any bad debt that went to collections, if you already have a lot of debt, either other cards, car loans, student loans, high utilization on existing cards, if you just started a new job. If it is only inquiries, the ones within the last 6 months are the ones that are of concern, but if there are other underlying issues, it will be longer and there could be other things you have to do too.

Harry
Jun 13, 2003

I do solemnly swear that in the year 2015 I will theorycraft my wallet as well as my WoW
I don't think the one you do yourself counts, and I think usually landlords do "soft inquiries" which don't really matter. You might want to try calling the reconsideration hotline, you can probably talk your way out of it.

LorneReams
Jun 27, 2003
I'm bizarre

Zeta Taskforce posted:

Too many inquiries isn’t a common reason why things get denied.

Most banks have a hard limit where it will deny based on fraud concerns. It's technically still an adverse action using credit information so they have to send the standard "We denied you based on these criterias blah blah"

Hufflepuff or bust!
Jan 28, 2005

I should have known better.

Large Hardon Collider posted:

What information would be helpful?

I signed a lease in December, but the landlord cancelled it and refunded our money in may, at which point I signed another lease. So that's two credit checks, and I actually checked my credit score myself in March. I applied for the card last month, which makes four checks in about seven months.

I had two questions but you answered the first one, which was how long ago the decision was. Try calling the card company, and mention that you think the recent inquiries were from a recent move, and ask if they will reconsider their decision (or ask to speak to the reconsideration department or credit department) based on some sort of stable income, or if you've had a relationship with that bank in the past (checking/savings account, insurance, anything). Do this first. It won't be another inquiry because they should be able to use the one they've already done, but you do have to do it within 30 or maybe 60/90 days. Basically, you got denied by an automated algorithm, but you can ask for a human to "check its work" and they often err on the side of issuing credit, especially if you have a stable income or are willing to accept a lower limit initially.

2nd question was what your score check in March showed - it should actually tell you how many "hard" inquiries you had. Landlord inquiries should show up as "soft" inquiries (don't count) but they may have done something different that did actually show up as a hard pull. The difference between them is that a hard pull is used in preparation for issuing credit (a loan, credit card, or other account), whereas a soft pull is used to examine previous records of credit granted, but not to issue new credit (for a lease, employment, etc.).

If a company makes an adverse decision (denying you credit) based on your score, they are required to provide you with the information they used to come to this decision. If reconsideration fails, follow the directions (which should be on the letter you receive denying you) to request a report based on adverse action. See how many inquiries it says you have and what else on there may have been a factor. I find it unusual that you'd be denied for what should have been soft inquiries and a personal check of your own score which shouldn't appear at all. Something else may be going on. I get denied occasionally for this reason, but that's because I've gotten something like 12 credit cards in the last two years. Do as I say, not as I do.

Also, Zeta, we cool :)

Eggplant Wizard
Jul 8, 2005


i loev catte

Large Hardon Collider posted:

I applied for a credit card and got denied, in part for having too many recent credit checks. This is probably due to moving recently. How long should I wait before reapplying? I also want to increase the limit on my card I've had since before college, but that would require another credit check.

Why do you need another credit card?

Chumbawumba4ever97
Dec 31, 2000

by Fluffdaddy
Sorry if this is in the wrong thread; set my rear end straight if it is.

I am looking to refinance my mortgage, it's a 30 year fixed and it looks like we will get it at 4%. Around a few grand in closing costs, but it will reduce our monthly payments by a good $600. This is a pretty good friend handling this for us, so we do trust him, but were wondering if 4% really is the best deal. He swears it is, but reading around here I've heard people getting as low as 3% with NO closing fees (granted, it's on a 15 year mortgage) and I'm just trying to make sure we're not getting ripped here. Thanks and sorry if this is in the wrong thread!

baquerd
Jul 2, 2007

by FactsAreUseless

Hamburglar posted:

Sorry if this is in the wrong thread; set my rear end straight if it is.

I am looking to refinance my mortgage, it's a 30 year fixed and it looks like we will get it at 4%. Around a few grand in closing costs, but it will reduce our monthly payments by a good $600. This is a pretty good friend handling this for us, so we do trust him, but were wondering if 4% really is the best deal. He swears it is, but reading around here I've heard people getting as low as 3% with NO closing fees (granted, it's on a 15 year mortgage) and I'm just trying to make sure we're not getting ripped here. Thanks and sorry if this is in the wrong thread!

My parents just got 2.8% out of ING Direct, 15 year though with a ton down.

Zeta Taskforce
Jun 27, 2002

Hamburglar posted:

Sorry if this is in the wrong thread; set my rear end straight if it is.

I am looking to refinance my mortgage, it's a 30 year fixed and it looks like we will get it at 4%. Around a few grand in closing costs, but it will reduce our monthly payments by a good $600. This is a pretty good friend handling this for us, so we do trust him, but were wondering if 4% really is the best deal. He swears it is, but reading around here I've heard people getting as low as 3% with NO closing fees (granted, it's on a 15 year mortgage) and I'm just trying to make sure we're not getting ripped here. Thanks and sorry if this is in the wrong thread!

That rate is competitive for good credit, those fees are reasonable, so I don’t think you are being cheated, but I wouldn’t say that THEY ARE THE ABSOLUTE BEST!!!!! either. I don’t think anyone is offering 30 year mortgages at 3%, but they are doing 15 years at that rate. I am a savings account customer of ING and I am aware they do mortgages, but I don’t think they offer 30 year fixed rate mortgages. The last I checked they offered a 10/1 ARM which is NOT the same thing. Not saying it’s a bad product, but you cannot compare the two based only on rate.

SlightlyMadman
Jan 14, 2005

My credit union is offering 3.38 on a 30-year and 2.62 on a 15. Those are both with points though. If you have perfect credit, I'd think you could do more like 3.5 on a 30. Just shop around and see.

Sylink
Apr 17, 2004

I have a simple question. On CDs, is the interest rate calculated per year at the end of the term or every year?

For example, I see a 5 year CD with an interest rate of 1.8%. Say I put $1000 down. How much do I end up with at the end?

1.85 + the principal after five years or is there yearly compounding in there somewhere?

k3nn
Jan 20, 2007
Compounded annually. So $1000 * 1.018^5 = $1093.29 after 5 years.

snuggleshrub
Jul 2, 2010
A couple questions about things which I am considering doing in the future regarding my finances.

Recently I got a new job making a modest sum(I would prefer not specify exactly how much) but due to still living at home am in the position to do a lot of saving relative to my income. The new job offers a 401k with matching so it seems a no-brainer to take advantage of that. Is starting a Roth IRA as well advisable? For someone with a low income is a Roth IRA the best way to go?

Additionally I have around 35k in student loans. Looking at my payment options I see that I have the option to make payments based on my income. These payments would only be a fraction of my normal payments and any balance remaining after 25 years on this payment plan is forgiven. Is this sort of payment option advisable? It would be possible to pay the normal amount due to my low cost of living. I could foresee this this method of payment becoming less advantageous were I to start making more money in the future and perhaps then I would end up paying more in interest than I would have paying the amount back in ten years, but it also seems hard now to predict exactly what I'd be making 25 years from now.

Eggplant Wizard
Jul 8, 2005


i loev catte

Derenge posted:

A couple questions about things which I am considering doing in the future regarding my finances.

Recently I got a new job making a modest sum(I would prefer not specify exactly how much) but due to still living at home am in the position to do a lot of saving relative to my income. The new job offers a 401k with matching so it seems a no-brainer to take advantage of that. Is starting a Roth IRA as well advisable? For someone with a low income is a Roth IRA the best way to go?

Additionally I have around 35k in student loans. Looking at my payment options I see that I have the option to make payments based on my income. These payments would only be a fraction of my normal payments and any balance remaining after 25 years on this payment plan is forgiven. Is this sort of payment option advisable? It would be possible to pay the normal amount due to my low cost of living. I could foresee this this method of payment becoming less advantageous were I to start making more money in the future and perhaps then I would end up paying more in interest than I would have paying the amount back in ten years, but it also seems hard now to predict exactly what I'd be making 25 years from now.

Contribute to your 401k up to the match and max out a Roth IRA every year, yeah.

I'd probably want to pay off the loans, personally, but get together an emergency fund first. I don't know how those payment plans work... if you could get on the low payment plan and still make higher payments it seems like that'd be a good deal in case you still have a balance in 25 years. There's a student loan thread in BFC someplace that would be a good place to get advice on it.

Effexxor
May 26, 2008

Okay, so this is lovely, and I know that. But how does one deal with the fact that they're contributing about 75% to a household and stay... not bitter? My husband works really hard at a job that he hates as he tries to go to school and search for a better one, and I really appreciate it, but it still sucks to see my paycheck just get sucked away, and to know that you are paying the insurance, the rent, the utilities, the food and to know that if something goes down, you're the one to shoulder the burden financially. We're going to just start to make a budget, I know, but god help me, when I get the 'money to blow' section, I want more. I feel like I deserve more. And it makes me feel utterly terrible and guilty. I'm hoping that this will calm down once I get used to a budget, but for right now it's a bitter feeling that I really hate.

10-8
Oct 2, 2003

Level 14 Bureaucrat

Effexxor posted:

Okay, so this is lovely, and I know that. But how does one deal with the fact that they're contributing about 75% to a household and stay... not bitter? My husband works really hard at a job that he hates as he tries to go to school and search for a better one, and I really appreciate it, but it still sucks to see my paycheck just get sucked away, and to know that you are paying the insurance, the rent, the utilities, the food and to know that if something goes down, you're the one to shoulder the burden financially. We're going to just start to make a budget, I know, but god help me, when I get the 'money to blow' section, I want more. I feel like I deserve more. And it makes me feel utterly terrible and guilty. I'm hoping that this will calm down once I get used to a budget, but for right now it's a bitter feeling that I really hate.
He's your husband. He's working hard and he's also in school. It sounds like he's more than trying to pull his weight. The problem is with you, not him.

I make three times what my live-in girlfriend does. But she works her rear end off at a job she hates and she never complains. Then she comes home and helps around the house. It would never even occur to me to be bitter at her simply because she isn't bringing in more money so I could buy more swag for my McMansion. Jesus.

Effexxor
May 26, 2008

10-8 posted:

He's your husband. He's working hard and he's also in school. It sounds like he's more than trying to pull his weight. The problem is with you, not him.

I make three times what my live-in girlfriend does. But she works her rear end off at a job she hates and she never complains. Then she comes home and helps around the house. It would never even occur to me to be bitter at her simply because she isn't bringing in more money so I could buy more swag for my McMansion. Jesus.

It's completely a problem with me, as I said. And we're not exactly in McMansion mode, more of 'What the gently caress are we doing, paycheck to paycheck sucks.'

Chumbawumba4ever97
Dec 31, 2000

by Fluffdaddy

baquerd posted:

My parents just got 2.8% out of ING Direct, 15 year though with a ton down.

Zeta Taskforce posted:

That rate is competitive for good credit, those fees are reasonable, so I don’t think you are being cheated, but I wouldn’t say that THEY ARE THE ABSOLUTE BEST!!!!! either. I don’t think anyone is offering 30 year mortgages at 3%, but they are doing 15 years at that rate. I am a savings account customer of ING and I am aware they do mortgages, but I don’t think they offer 30 year fixed rate mortgages. The last I checked they offered a 10/1 ARM which is NOT the same thing. Not saying it’s a bad product, but you cannot compare the two based only on rate.

Thank you kindly. The point of us refinancing would be to lower our monthly payments so we have more money now. I think if we really want to get rid of the mortgage quickly (like a 15 year mortgage would) we can always just pay more towards our mortgage every month. Seems like a decent plan, I think.

Nocheez
Sep 5, 2000

Can you spare a little cheddar?
Nap Ghost

Effexxor posted:

It's completely a problem with me, as I said. And we're not exactly in McMansion mode, more of 'What the gently caress are we doing, paycheck to paycheck sucks.'

You are married, so it's not 'your money' and 'his money'. It is 'your money' and you need to work together on how you spend it.

My wife made less than me for the first 3 years we were together, but just recently got a promotion and will most likely be making more than me going forward. I can't imagine feeling anything but happiness for her success.

It sounds to me that neither of you are on the same page financially. Sit down and figure out what your combined net income is, then look at your necessary bills. Then look at your discretionary spending. Figure out where you are bleeding money and correct it. Set aside a fair amount for each of you for personal spending (that you both agree on) and stick to your budget.

MrKatharsis
Nov 29, 2003

feel the bern

Nocheez posted:

You are married, so it's not 'your money' and 'his money'. It is 'y'alls money' and you need to work together on how you spend it.
That's the truth. It's uncomfortable for both parties at first. Nobody wants to just give it away, and nobody wants to receive it like charity. This feeling starts to go away the more you act as one unit.

Effexxor posted:

when I get the 'money to blow' section, I want more. I feel like I deserve more. And it makes me feel utterly terrible and guilty.
Hooray! You're breaking the bonds of our collective consumerist psychosis!

Effexxor posted:

I'm hoping that this will calm down once I get used to a budget, but for right now it's a bitter feeling that I really hate.
It will definitely calm down once you're on a written budget. I found that rewriting my budget over and over in different ways(week/month/year/in/out) until I understood every aspect definitely eased a lot of anxiety. When I ran out of different ways to group expenses, I would write down a "better days" wish list. I'll never throw out that pad of graph paper. It's a dog-eared reminder of how horrible being in debt was.

GoGoGadgetChris
Mar 18, 2010

i powder a
granite monument
in a soundless flash

showering the grass
with molten drops of
its gold inlay

sending smoking
chips of stone
skipping into the fog

Effexxor posted:

Okay, so this is lovely, and I know that. But how does one deal with the fact that they're contributing about 75% to a household and stay... not bitter? My husband works really hard at a job that he hates as he tries to go to school and search for a better one, and I really appreciate it, but it still sucks to see my paycheck just get sucked away, and to know that you are paying the insurance, the rent, the utilities, the food and to know that if something goes down, you're the one to shoulder the burden financially. We're going to just start to make a budget, I know, but god help me, when I get the 'money to blow' section, I want more. I feel like I deserve more. And it makes me feel utterly terrible and guilty. I'm hoping that this will calm down once I get used to a budget, but for right now it's a bitter feeling that I really hate.

A budgeting book like the Total Money Makeover or All Your Worth could be very helpful. You don't feel as much anxiety parting with, say, $141 for an electricity bill when you know for a fact you've got $150 budgeted for it and still have $250 that you get to "blow" each month. Figure out where your money is coming and going!

And forgive my nosiness, but is there an issue here beyond money? Look at your word choices... "Contributing about 75% to a household", "bitter", "paycheck just get sucked away", "I deserve more". It sounds like you're feeling an imbalance and I hope it isn't just that you make more than him. Get your E/N on if you're feeling unjustly yoked.

10-8
Oct 2, 2003

Level 14 Bureaucrat

GoGoGadgetChris posted:

And forgive my nosiness, but is there an issue here beyond money? Look at your word choices... "Contributing about 75% to a household", "bitter", "paycheck just get sucked away", "I deserve more". It sounds like you're feeling an imbalance and I hope it isn't just that you make more than him. Get your E/N on if you're feeling unjustly yoked.
That's what I'm surmising. I don't think this is a problem with household budgeting, e.g., making sure income exceeds expenses. It seems to be more a problem of deciding who gets to spend how much of the total household pie. I think when she says "budgeting" she means "My discretionary budget should be larger than my husband's because it's my money!" And that's not a budgeting problem, that's a relationship problem that only she can deal with.

Sophia
Apr 16, 2003

The heart wants what the heart wants.
This is like an object lesson for my advice that no one get married while either person is still in school, and especially when only one person is in school. Date, yes. Engaged, sure. Married? No. It creates an underlying financial imbalance that is really hard for anyone to deal with.

jerman999
Apr 26, 2006

This is a lex imperfecta
I'm a 22 year old federal employee maxing out my TSP and a Roth IRA. My agency just rolled out the Roth TSP option - preferable to the traditional TSP? Only problem I see is that the matching contributions have to go into the traditional rather than the Roth side, but seems like I'd still make out well in the end.

Fancy_Lad
May 15, 2003
Would you like to buy a monkey?

Nocheez posted:

You are married, so it's not 'your money' and 'his money'. It is 'your money' and you need to work together on how you spend it.

My wife (of ~8 years plus ~7 of dating before that) and I don't work completely on this mentality. The important thing is that you both need to come to a mutual understanding on how money will work in your relationship.

We came to our current arrangement because, quite frankly, our spending and savings mentalities are vastly different and would be a major issue in our relationship if we had 100% joint "our money".

Here is how we break things down:

We have combined household expenses like the mortgage, insurance, utilities, groceries, repairs, taxes, tools. We also include anything else that we agree is a common expense - for instance she likes to garden as a hobby. We include the expenses incurred with this as a household expense as it reduces the food budget, same for canning and other related activities. We determined how much these requirements average out to cost monthly, and make that + 20% (we are always tweaking the percentage but this is where we are right now) our goal for a joint account that we pay these expenses out of. The surplus acts as a buffer to even out irregular spending (like the twice a year insurance) as well as a household emergency savings. It can also act as a savings account for larger joint purchases (it was used to fund the down payment for our home, for example). We fund this on a percentage based on our incomes. For example, if I make $25k/year and she made 75k/year, for every dollar I contribute she would contribute three.

We have a combined vacation fund. We have an agreed upon amount come out of each of our personal accounts and everything we do on vacation has to come out of this account. Right now we are on a 1 to 1 ratio for contributions, but this has moved around over the years based on each of our priorities.

Pretty much everything else is "my money" and "her money". We do a fairly good job of alternating who pays when we eat out - at least to the point where it hasn't ever been an issue. Her car loan comes out of her money, if I had one it would come out of mine. If she wants to buy a $300 purse, she budgets for it on her own and does (although we agreed to talk about purchases over $100 before hand). If I want to buy some stupid gadget, I do.

That said, we do talk about our personal finances and do reviews of them a few times a year. This is to make sure we are both doing things like contributing to retirement and making progress on our goals. It also acts as an opportunity to tweak things around.

This system clearly wouldn't work for everyone, especially if you have children or just a single income, but it works really well for us and using the percentages for household expenses (and making sure both of us agree to what is considered a household expense) helps a lot to handle feelings of one or the other of us feeling like we deserve more.

Now for this particular case, him being in school complicates things. The basic message says the same though: The bottom line is that you need to have an open conversation about money and figure out what works for you as a couple (just like in other areas of your relationship) or you are in trouble...

Remy Marathe
Mar 15, 2007

_________===D ~ ~ _\____/

Sophia posted:

This is like an object lesson for my advice that no one get married while either person is still in school, and especially when only one person is in school. Date, yes. Engaged, sure. Married? No. It creates an underlying financial imbalance that is really hard for anyone to deal with.

This sounds weird to me- it has never been the norm or even particularly common for both members of a married couple to make the same amount of money. Traditionally this is handled via division of labor; ideally you match each others' effort. School is effort. Work is effort. Home maintenance is effort. Childcare is effort. Expecting to balance all the things that go into a home economy via standard income dollars seems overly reductionistic and unrealistic.

Not saying school wouldn't complicate the balancing act, but unless there's something else unhealthy going on (one spouse pursuing their dreams while the other's working a poo poo job to make it happen and resentful that the roles aren't reversed), if it's really an investment in what will become communal money later, it shouldn't be an imbalance. In fact I'd think it less advisable for people prior to marriage or full commitment to try and carry a school imbalance, because what the student is investing will be tied to them 100%, the supporting partner getting zero compensation if things don't work out.

Dragyn
Jan 23, 2007

Please Sam, don't use the word 'acumen' again.

Sophia posted:

This is like an object lesson for my advice that no one get married while either person is still in school, and especially when only one person is in school. Date, yes. Engaged, sure. Married? No. It creates an underlying financial imbalance that is really hard for anyone to deal with.

Similarly, if one has a good deal of school debt, while the other is debt free.

My better half jokingly (I think) says that she won't agree to marry me until I pay off my loans.

Sophia
Apr 16, 2003

The heart wants what the heart wants.
^^Debt is a little different when both parties are working because even though their outflow is higher, it's still easier to mentally quantify their financial contribution to the team. It's a stressor, but not nearly as big of one in my opinion.

Of course school is effort, but unlike housecleaning and childcare it is effort that is very difficult to quantify in dollars and is also not addressing a monetary outflow, simply increasing future inflow, which makes it much easier to resent. Taking care of a house has a current market value (cleaning services). Taking care of kids has a huge market value (daycare). It's easy for anyone to see where "value" is being added at a glance.

Conversely, schooling is meant to increase earnings over a lifetime, beginning at an uncertain future date and for an uncertain future amount. This is hard even for people who think about investments to internalize as a net positive, much less someone who doesn't have the time or inclination to do so. It's much easier to quantify the current income they are giving up by not working as much. Since schooling lasts so long, it's even worse. Add in the fact that marriage generally makes it feel even more difficult to walk away from the perceived imbalance, the trapped resentment only magnifies.

This is obviously a cold, calculated way of thinking about it but it does mirror the unconscious feelings that arise in the situation.

Sophia fucked around with this message at 19:10 on Jun 29, 2012

PRADA SLUT
Mar 14, 2006

Inexperienced,
heartless,
but even so
As a rough estimate, about how much money should be put away in long-term savings monthly? This includes cash savings, investments, etc. 20% net?

This is presuming it wouldn't better used to pay off debts/mortgage/etc.

GoGoGadgetChris
Mar 18, 2010

i powder a
granite monument
in a soundless flash

showering the grass
with molten drops of
its gold inlay

sending smoking
chips of stone
skipping into the fog
I would say between 10% and 20%. Closer to 10% if you're paying down debt (other than mortgage/student loans) and closer to 20% if you're less indebted.

redreader
Nov 2, 2009

I am the coolest person ever with my pirate chalice. Seriously.

Dinosaur Gum

GoGoGadgetChris posted:

I would say between 10% and 20%. Closer to 10% if you're paying down debt (other than mortgage/student loans) and closer to 20% if you're less indebted.

And if you're paying off student loans, as little as possible and as much as possible into the loans?

Guinness
Sep 15, 2004

It all depends on your situation, your income, your expenses, your future plans, etc.

If your student loans have a ridiculous rate like mine did (6.6%), then it's a pretty good idea to focus on paying those down rather than just paying the minimum for years and years. You still want to be saving some money rather than just plowing it all into debt, but getting rid of those loans will save you a lot of money over time.

I just paid off my 23k (principal) in student loans a week ago, and feels good man. I self-imposed a 2-year payment plan on myself once my grace period expired, and it sucked plowing $1000+/mo into loans on top of maxing my RIRA, building a 10k emergency savings, and investing an additional ~15k on the side, but man was it so worth it to get that poo poo off the books. I didn't have a 401k match at the time so I just skipped the 401k entirely to pay down my debt faster. Do it while you're young and can live cheaply.

The only debt I have left now is ~9k on my car (at 3.5%) and my revolving monthly credit card bill that gets paid in full every month, so I am now able to sock away a shitload of money since I'm still young (24) and single.

Guinness fucked around with this message at 22:36 on Jun 29, 2012

SlightlyMadman
Jan 14, 2005

If you have outstanding debt where the interest rate is greater than a reasonable long-term return on investment, it's generally a good idea to pay that down instead of saving. Mortgages are a bit more complicated, but for anything else like student loans, car loans, or credit cards, pay that poo poo off. The only real exception to this is if you don't have an emergency fund set up yet, in which case that should be your priority, since it will help you prevent racking up additional debt in the future.

disaster pastor
May 1, 2007


Last August, I applied for the AmEx Blue Cash Everyday and was denied, but applied for the Chase Freedom and was approved. My FICO according to the Chase approval was 632, which was a bit of a surprise, but made sense: no credit cards, and a credit report empty except for student loans. It also explained why I was rejected by AmEx.

Fast forward ten months. The student loans continue to be paid on time, I pay off the Chase in full every month. I reapply for the AmEx, expecting a denial and prepared to call them and ask for reconsideration, and I'm approved immediately. Just got the approval letter, and my FICO as of Monday is 739.

I am not complaining at all, but is it normal for one's score to move that quickly up (I can think of ways it could move that quickly down...), or should I suspect one of the two scores didn't properly account for something?

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Eggplant Wizard
Jul 8, 2005


i loev catte
That is pretty weird but I guess 0 available credit, small credit history = meh, but once you got a credit line and some kind of history, WITHOUT any black marks = welp must be better.

Credit scores are sorcery anyway.

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