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IncendiaC posted:Definitely finish Toll the Hounds before reading it. TtH has quite a bit of Tiste Andii lore that you don't want to miss. And considering Forge of Darkness is all about the Tiste Andii... For the record, I'm more stating that he could read the first two chapters that are online if he absolutely had to. They are prequels so don't reference anything that happens during or after Toll the Hounds. The book as a whole? Definitely finish the series first.
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Aug 2, 2012 23:26
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Erikson says that reading Forge of Darkness without having read Malazan (or having finished) should be fine. he actually hints that this may become the standard for new readers (start with the trilogy and then move to the main series).
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Aug 3, 2012 02:20
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Really want to read those free chapters, but I feel like I should finish TCG first. Despite what a lot of people have said I'm actually enjoying the Shake sections.
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Aug 3, 2012 02:32
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The shake become a lot better as their story gets fleshed out. I felt like they were one of the more poorly explained aspects for a great deal of their story.
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Aug 3, 2012 02:39
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The Shake also gave us Yedan loving Derryg, so I'm cool with them. Though I enjoyed their plotline anyway and viewed it as a good continuation of the events from TtH.
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Aug 3, 2012 03:05
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Oh Snapple! posted:The Shake also gave us Yedan loving Derryg, so I'm cool with them. I think I just really hated the two witches. Twilight and Yedan Derryg were cool.
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Aug 3, 2012 09:25
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Yedan's story was so great, it was like a classic Greek epic sidestory, I loved every moment of it. When dat loving dragon's head comes flying back through the breach, I can just imagine the faces of the tiste liosan
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Aug 3, 2012 12:42
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Abalieno posted:Erikson says that reading Forge of Darkness without having read Malazan (or having finished) should be fine. he actually hints that this may become the standard for new readers (start with the trilogy and then move to the main series). Not having read Forge of Darkness, I can't say for sure. However, my sense is that there's a lot in RG -> TCG that deals with Tiste Andii The Shake, all that happens in Black Coral and certainly, BIG SPOILER Anonmander's fate that I feel folks might do themselves a disservice reading Forge of Darkness before Book of the Fallen. It's really only after reading the RG->TCG that I was at all interested in the Forge series.
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Aug 3, 2012 17:50
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I'm a bit confused. I just about 20% into the second Malazan book. Are the first three considered a trilogy and the rest more stand alone reads?
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Aug 3, 2012 17:59
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No, it's a complete, almost perfectly linear series that builds itself up through each book. The thing with Deadhouse Gates and Memories of Ice is that they take place at the same time but in different places, and you can conceivably read those two in any order and not really suffer for it. The only other exception is Midnight Tides, and that's because it introduces completely new characters in a completely different area of the world and focuses on them as to build them up as the main story transitions to that continent.
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Aug 3, 2012 18:18
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Robot Danger posted:I'm a bit confused. I just about 20% into the second Malazan book. Are the first three considered a trilogy and the rest more stand alone reads? 
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Aug 3, 2012 20:33
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Robot Danger posted:I'm a bit confused. I just about 20% into the second Malazan book. Are the first three considered a trilogy and the rest more stand alone reads? The chart just posted is a pretty good reference. For the most part there are three settings that get explored throughout the books, such that 1, 3, and 8 are on Genabackis, 2, 4, and 6 take place in Seven Cities, and 5, 7, 9 and 10 take place somewhere you haven't heard about yet.
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Aug 3, 2012 22:03
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Thanks! Erikson's quote posted above kind of threw me off.
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Aug 3, 2012 23:10
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Oh he's talking about the prequel trilogy he's writing. The Malazan Book of the Fallen is its own 10-book series, but Erikson will be releasing the first book in a prequel trilogy about a younger Anomander Rake and the Tiste Andii. It'll be fairly unrelated to the Malazan series storyline, so I guess it'll be up to you whether you want to read Forge of Darkness or just go through the series. I can't imagine it would spoil much, and it might make some of the divisions between the races present in the Malazan series more understandable.
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Aug 3, 2012 23:29
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It will also be over a year before the trilogy is finished and you wouldn't want to wait that long before diving in to the main series. We should update that image with the newest books. I'm getting the necromancer novella number 5 next week!
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Aug 3, 2012 23:43
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Fuzzy Mammal posted:It will also be over a year before the trilogy is finished and you wouldn't want to wait that long before diving in to the main series. It'll be at least two years won't it? I'd imagine best case scenario is Book 2 in summer 2013 and book 3 in summer 2014. Worst (Erikson) case is probably Book 2 in winter 2013 and book 3 in summer 2015. He's pretty likely to finish this trilogy before Martin's done too.
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Aug 4, 2012 02:24
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Masonity posted:It'll be at least two years won't it? George RR Martin? Erikson's more likely to finish his trilogy before Martin even puts out the next book.
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Aug 4, 2012 02:33
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Yeah I read books. posted:George RR Martin? Erikson's more likely to finish his trilogy before Martin even puts out the next book. I assumed that's what he meant...
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Aug 4, 2012 02:43
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Could someone redo this an add an arrow that goes back from book 4 to book 2? It's extremely important. And I'd even add an arrow in parallel between book 2 and 3 since some essential things cross over. Masonity posted:Worst (Erikson) case is probably Book 2 in winter 2013 and book 3 in summer 2015. He's pretty likely to finish this trilogy before Martin's done too. That's best case. He said he would aim for a book every 2 years. Or every 1,5. I think he has other projects as well now. About Forge of Darkness: someone would be pleased to know there's no poetry at all introducing each chapter. And there's "The Shake" in the character list...
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Aug 4, 2012 04:03
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Nah you should leave that for the reader to discover, it's a pretty fun reveal.
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Aug 4, 2012 05:13
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So Orb, Scepter, Throne had, in the last third of the book, Bauchelain and Korbal Broach out of f'n nowhere. Does anyone know where this fits in the timeline of their novellas? I've read the first three and have Crack'd Pot Trail sitting unread on my desk - does that lead in to OST, or are they just on the Spawns for the hell of it? To be honest it seemed weird having them show up again. Their series always felt like it existed in a different world to the Malazan stories, and Memories of Ice was just them passing through on the way to some other world.
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Aug 4, 2012 11:16
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So Forge of Darkness preview and The Crippled God spoilers Anomander was described as having golden skin, it seems that all the Tiste were Liosan first? We also learn that Anomander and his brothers are not blood-children to Mother Dark but rather being a Son of Darkness is a title. The leader of the Legions was Ossercs father and "transparant" so we are going to see a civil war between the Tiste with the army being led by someone which will call himself Father Light. This makes some sense with what happens in TCG, the Liosan are not invading but rather returning home. I wonder what makes Anomanders faction dark, and why Silchas Ruin stays pale... It seems to me that Mother Dark is at first a title and later she ascends to godhood, and in the first two chapters it's unclear if anyone knows who Draconus really is... I'm so loving excited for that book!
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Aug 4, 2012 11:49
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zokie posted:So Forge of Darkness preview and The Crippled God spoilers Anomander was described as having golden skin, it seems that all the Tiste were Liosan first? We also learn that Anomander and his brothers are not blood-children to Mother Dark but rather being a Son of Darkness is a title. Half way through the book and without spoiling much you don't already know, forget liosan or andii. They are simply tiste. The tiste are a people the same way the jaghut or imass are. Andii, Liosan and Edur come later, and seem to be more magical changes imposed on them, Just as imass became t'lan imass. Well, not the same or even similar really but the same principal of taking people and changing them. As for your guesses on father light, mother dark and draconus you are pretty close.
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Aug 4, 2012 12:07
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Is anyone else reading the book at the moment, or just me? I'll be upset if I can't talk to anyone about it for months because of US release dates. That said, (60% or so through)Gripp is being set up as a Whiskeyjack prototype right? What with that dodgy leg he won't let the healer look at?
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Aug 4, 2012 17:09
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^^^^ This is the point where I won't look at this thread for months until the book is out here in the US; it's the best way to stop my wandering mouse going over those black boxes 
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Aug 5, 2012 03:37
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I broke down and ordered from amazon UK. Hardcover though. I couldn't figure out how to get the kindle edition with a US credit card. This poo poo is so stupid.
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Aug 5, 2012 06:39
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I'm reading it, but it will be a very slow affair. I'm like that, I can write a lot on just two pages: http://loopingworld.com/2012/08/05/the-forge-of-darkness-attempt-at-analysis/ 
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Aug 5, 2012 07:52
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I did the Kindle UK workaround and started reading last night. One thing struck me (speculation, fine to read if you've read the first preview chapter). Arathan, the bastard son of Draconus and half-sister to Spite, Envy, and Malice, off-handedly mentions being the downfall of Draconus. There's a mysterious character in BotF who is referred to as 'Elder' by T'lan Imass and harbors a particular hatred for Draconus. Does Arathan become Ruthan Gudd, Captain of the Bonehunters? HeroOfTheRevolution fucked around with this message at 07:58 on Aug 5, 2012 |
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Aug 5, 2012 07:54
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HeroOfTheRevolution posted:I did the Kindle UK workaround and started reading last night. It's possible I guess. He'll be someone. That much I'm sure of. Personally I was expecting him to be part of Quick Ben due to the fact that he's son of Draconus and QB talks to "mother" dark mentioning "father" who seems to be Draconus. I also wouldn't be surprised if we find out MD pre godhood was his mother. Book one really sets things in motion though. Now I'm done I can't wait for book 2. No one actually believes his wanting to slow down somewhat claims do they? :-(
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Aug 5, 2012 11:38
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Masonity posted:It's possible I guess. He'll be someone. That much I'm sure of. Personally I was expecting him to be part of Quick Ben due to the fact that he's son of Draconus and QB talks to "mother" dark mentioning "father" who seems to be Draconus. I also wouldn't be surprised if we find out MD pre godhood was his mother. Continuing with FoD preview Well QB does have long fingers, if it's him at least he kicked the nailbiting habit after a few thousand years 
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Aug 5, 2012 13:05
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Masonity posted:It's possible I guess. He'll be someone. That much I'm sure of. Personally I was expecting him to be part of Quick Ben due to the fact that he's son of Draconus and QB talks to "mother" dark mentioning "father" who seems to be Draconus. I also wouldn't be surprised if we find out MD pre godhood was his mother. Oh, that's a good thought too and might make a bit more sense. Turns out Arathan gets a mention in Memories of Ice as well while she talks with Lanas Tog about who rescued Baljaag (the ay holding Fanderay's spirit), though it's a throwaway line so I'd be surprised if anyone picked up on it (emphasis mine) quote:Lady Envy shrugged, smiling with delight at the oppurtunity to return such a gesture. "A misguided sibling who thought he was being kind. All right, perhaps that was too simplistic an answer. My sibling had found the goddess terribly damaged by the Fall, and needed a warm-blooded place to lay her spirit, so that it could heal. Serendipity. The ay's pack was dead, Whilst she herself was to young to survive in normal circumstances. Worse yet, she was the last left on the entire continent." Later, the ay recalls this through Toc quote:Then, standing before her, a figure. Cowled, swathed in roughly woven black wool, a hand - wrapped in leather straps, down to the very fingers - reaching out. [...] The touch, Toc realised, of an Elder God. And a voice: You are the last, now. The very last, and there will be need for you. In time... Looking back on the parts where Ruthan Gudd's mentions of Draconus aren't necessarily the type a son would be, though it's possible he'll show up in the Kharkanas trilogy just based off this whole monologue: (quote from Dust of Dreams) quote:
He also says 'Quick Ben, how much longer can you hide?' later on, implying he knows who QB is. HeroOfTheRevolution fucked around with this message at 15:06 on Aug 5, 2012 |
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Aug 5, 2012 14:20
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HeroOfTheRevolution posted:He also says 'Quick Ben, how much longer can you hide?' later on, implying he knows who QB is. Or it could mean that he sees a hint in there, and knows an azathanai is lurking inside, but can't quite grasp who.
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Aug 6, 2012 02:47
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Just got to the point in Forge of Darkness (about 1/3 through) where Draconus and party meet Grizzin Farl and my new Ruthan Gudd theory is that he is Grizzin Farl. Definitely not Arathan, since in the meeting with Draconus that Ruthan Gudd recalls Draconus refers to him as 'friend.' Arathan is almost certainly the 'Elder' soul in Quick Ben, especially since Draconus wants to talk with Quick Ben pretty much as soon as he gets out of Dragnipur. My evidence: 1) Grizzin Farl calls Draconus 'friend.' When Arathan asks about that, Draconus tells him that Grizzin Farl calls everyone his friend. Ruthan Gudd recalls meeting Draconus at the edge of Kallor's empire and Draconus calls him 'friend' then. I was more convinced until just now when I read that it was Draconus and not past Ruthan Gudd that said 'friend' but it could still work. 2) Grizzin Farl is half Azathanai (which we know eventually become, or become known as, Elder Gods) and half Thel Akai. Ruthan Gudd insists he's not an Elder God, though the Unbound call him Elder. The Thel Akai homeland is Jacuruku. When Ruthan Gudd escapes from the Azath, his first thought is 'Jacuruku, you've changed.' It's pretty circumstantial, but it's fun to try to speculate.
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Aug 7, 2012 21:10
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HeroOfTheRevolution posted:Just got to the point in Forge of Darkness (about 1/3 through) where Draconus and party meet Grizzin Farl and my new Ruthan Gudd theory is that he is Grizzin Farl.
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Aug 7, 2012 22:33
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Crimson Dragoon posted:Pretty much the same way I felt when reading that for the first time. And man, you're in for a total treat when you reach near the end. Karsa hands out one of the most fitting punishments ever to one of the characters there. Just finished HoC. Can't be sure whether it's more awesome that Karsa totally hosed Bidithal up, or that he slaughtered two Hounds of Darkness. Either way,  . I also get all  at Onrack and Trull's relationship. It makes me think of Mappo and Icarium and that alone gives me lots of warm feelings.I do have some general questions at this point, regarding the T'lan Imass. The Ritual of Tellann is what makes them all immortal right? If so, what the hell is the Vow? Is this something that is gone into more detail later? Is it just a sort of oath they take to live a certain way and by breaking it you're exiled (similar to Trull's shorning)? And finally, in regards to that chart and the suggestion that an arrow be drawn from book 4 to book 2, what does it refer to exactly? Is it something that I'll discover later, or is it just the first part being Karsa's upbringing only to discover he's that badass Toblakai you met in book 2?
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Aug 8, 2012 02:47
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Yarrbossa posted:
T'lan Imass (MoI and HoC):If I remember correctly, the Ritual of Tellann was done because of the Vow. The Vow was basically "gently caress the Jaghut, we won't stop until they're all dead". The Ritual allowed them to continue their war after natural life spans. Chart: Yep. The arrow refers to the prologue of House of Chains.
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Aug 8, 2012 02:59
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I know this might not be the best place to ask, but does anyone know of any sort of book reading software for the PC that WONT destroy my eyes after a while? The way text is set up in books ruins my eyes on my laptop screen for some reason, and I haven't had an opportunity to get Toll the Hounds yet and after finishing Reaper's Gale a couple of weeks ago, really need to get my Malazan fix. Any suggestions are welcome!
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Aug 8, 2012 07:45
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Illuyankas posted:
Can you link me to that quote? I'm backtracking a bit on this having found out that Grizzin Farl is the father of Errastas and Sechul Lath, and has a wife (my guess is Kilamandaros). The Jacuruku quote does make me think he has something to do with the Thel Akai, though. Could Ruthan Gudd be the child of Feren and Grizzin Farl (Erikson went out of his way to casually slip in that they slept together), who hates Draconus because of what he did to his mother?
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Aug 8, 2012 13:52
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Yeah I read books. posted:I know this might not be the best place to ask, but does anyone know of any sort of book reading software for the PC that WONT destroy my eyes after a while? The way text is set up in books ruins my eyes on my laptop screen for some reason, and I haven't had an opportunity to get Toll the Hounds yet and after finishing Reaper's Gale a couple of weeks ago, really need to get my Malazan fix. Any suggestions are welcome! When I do read a book on the PC I use the Mobipocket Reader. I don't know if it will help with your eyes but it does have a ton of different options for changing up the font, text size and background color that might be beneficial for you and it's free. Anyway, I just got Forge of Darkness today. I've only been able to read a couple of chapters so far, but I do like what I have read.
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Aug 9, 2012 00:27
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I just picked up Deadhouse Gates from where I left it about a month ago. I've forgotten a few plot details and was hoping someone could remind me about a few things. 1. Where are Fiddler, Crokus and Aspalar headed? They're currently disguised as a married couple and their protector, making their way through a recently captured town. 2. What was the thing Kalam stole from the assassins and what is he planning to do with it? Thanks.
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Aug 10, 2012 05:58
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