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DeathByDoubleDip posted:After finding this thread and quickly backtracking, I was starting to wonder if I was the only person who wanted all of the Gundam Meisters in 00 to die. At least in S1 you had the vague impression that that was sort of supposed to be the point. Then S2 came along.
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Oct 14, 2012 22:17
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ImpAtom posted:What are you talking about, there are no identical twins for... oh. Wait. poo poo. Setsuna can't have a twin. He's just too cool and alien, and there can be only one guy as cool and alien as him.  Anyway, I'm enjoying Unicorn so much. 
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Oct 14, 2012 22:19
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Azran posted:Setsuna can't have a twin. He's just too cool and alien, and there can be only one guy as cool and alien as him. Just get a cardboard cutout. It certainly couldn't be any worse at piloting than Setsuna is.
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Oct 14, 2012 22:34
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DeathByDoubleDip posted:After finding this thread and quickly backtracking, I was starting to wonder if I was the only person who wanted all of the Gundam Meisters in 00 to die. What's wrong with Granny Sweater? I liked Granny Sweater. edit: Granny Sweater would be an amazing Gundam character name.
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Oct 14, 2012 22:47
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Azran posted:Setsuna can't have a twin. He's just too cool and alien, and there can be only one guy as cool and alien as him. Sounds like a job for Heero Yuy!
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Oct 14, 2012 22:47
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Serious Frolicking posted:Any of them were still better than that 00 side story guy. If you mean Fon Spaak then yes, he was literally the worst. I think that manga also had that catgirl Haro too if I remember right. Pretty terrible stuff all around.
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Oct 14, 2012 22:52
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Azran posted:Setsuna can't have a twin. He's just too cool and alien, and there can be only one guy as cool and alien as him. unicorn has been good, but I'm sort of surprised that episode 4 isn't disliked more, it's a pretty drat bad episode. Also still in the crowd that liked all of 00, screw the haters.
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Oct 14, 2012 22:56
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I really enjoyed the first season!  Can't recall what exactly happened on Episode 4, but I can't hide the fact that I got considerably confused in regards to who was on each side.
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Oct 14, 2012 23:19
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In Gundam 00, I liked how much we actually saw how devastating mobile suit combat (and terrorism) is for innocent people. It actually felt more like a solid anime story first, Gundam series second. The big WTF moment came for me when (season 1 spoilers): The evil bitch Gundam pilot randomly decided to blow up a wedding party which had all of that girl side-character's family members in attendance. In addition she lost her hand, which was just brutal.
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Oct 14, 2012 23:28
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Monaghan posted:unicorn has been good, but I'm sort of surprised that episode 4 isn't disliked more, it's a pretty drat bad episode. It had Banagher beating the poo poo out of Zinnerman whilst his crew pretended not to notice, and a Juaggu kicking rear end and taking names. I really can't hate it too much.
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Oct 14, 2012 23:45
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Monaghan posted:unicorn has been good, but I'm sort of surprised that episode 4 isn't disliked more, it's a pretty drat bad episode. Episode 4 is easily the weakest, if just for some of the stupid poo poo. (Banagher comparing equipping different weapons on a mobile suits to understanding is the stupidest line in a Gundam in recent memory and that is an impressive award considering what a dire year it has been for Gundam.) It at least had some pretty animation tho'.
ImpAtom fucked around with this message at 23:53 on Oct 14, 2012 |
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Oct 14, 2012 23:50
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JazzFlight posted:In Gundam 00, I liked how much we actually saw how devastating mobile suit combat (and terrorism) is for innocent people. It actually felt more like a solid anime story first, Gundam series second. Its great because the show up until that point idolizes the poo poo out of the whole 'let's end peace through war' thing. Then it shows you what would actually happen if you gave a bunch of loose cannons invincible superweapons.
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Oct 15, 2012 00:13
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ImpAtom posted:Episode 4 is easily the weakest, if just for some of the stupid poo poo. (Banagher comparing equipping different weapons on a mobile suits to understanding is the stupidest line in a Gundam in recent memory and that is an impressive award considering what a dire year it has been for Gundam.) that was dumb but the kicker for me was Him being so obsessed with talking and saving loni, who he met for all of 10 seconds. The same person who had no problems blasting and killing hundreds of civilians . Even when she goes crazy again, he still can't shoot her. This is the exact same poo poo that kio pulled in age. Also there's sort of the issue with the fights themselves, it really made the feddies look like a bunch of incompetent idiots where the show, up to that point, was pretty good about the grunt fights.
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Oct 15, 2012 00:18
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boom boom boom fucked around with this message at 18:49 on Oct 5, 2014 |
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Oct 15, 2012 00:26
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Monaghan posted:it really made the feddies look like a bunch of incompetent idiots ahem 
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Oct 15, 2012 00:32
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ImpAtom posted:That was partially due to budgeting issues and partially due to the fact that it apparently was getting new viewers regularly. The end result is a whole loving lot of recycling. If you're watching the HD version, you're also missing out on a lot of recap episodes that existed in the original. Huh, that explains something I guess. I've been watching the HD remaster weekly as it comes up on their YouTube channel having never watched any SEED before and... well, I didn't absolutely hate it. It's not like the story was great, in fact it was aggravatingly stupid as hell in a few places (like say, Kira's space-magically-teleporting from the cockpit of an exploding mech  ) Otherwise it felt like a fairly normal if bland color-by-numbers modern Gundam show rather then the aggressively terrible affair I had come to expect from reading the thread. I was really beginning to think there was something wrong with me. 
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Oct 15, 2012 00:44
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0x0hShit posted:Huh, that explains something I guess. I've been watching the HD remaster weekly as it comes up on their YouTube channel having never watched any SEED before and... well, I didn't absolutely hate it. It's not like the story was great, in fact it was aggravatingly stupid as hell in a few places (like say, Kira's space-magically-teleporting from the cockpit of an exploding mech "By the numbers Gundam show" sort of describes a big chunk of SEED. The point where the Freedom shows up is a good indicator of a downtown in the show from mediocre to inexplicable superhero fanfiction bullshit. It's exactly the point every remotely sympathetic character joins one side and every villain becomes basically Dr. Doom. However, a lot of the stuff people really hate about the show actually comes to a head in Destiny. Pretty much every worse attribute in SEED gets magnified by Destiny, and so a lot of the things which seem merely dumb become far moreso once you've seen Destiny's take on them, because Destiny serves to highlight exactly how stupid that poo poo is by taking it to a wild extreme. SEED was also the first Gundam show which really seriously got fansubbed widely as it was released, and so it was a lot of people's first experience with being disappointed on a weekly basis, something we're all far more used to by this point. 
ImpAtom fucked around with this message at 01:02 on Oct 15, 2012 |
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Oct 15, 2012 00:54
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0x0hShit posted:in fact it was aggravatingly stupid as hell in a few places (like say, Kira's space-magically-teleporting from the cockpit of an exploding mech He got rescued in a sidestory manga by Lowe Gear, one of the handful of good SEED characters.
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Oct 15, 2012 00:57
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boom boom boom posted:Newtypes, man. Amuro and Char were newtypes, same deal with Scirocco, Haman and a ton of other assholes and/or crazy people were as well. Didn't stop gundam pilots from realizing that they had to go so that more people wouldn't die. Most of them also met for more then 10 seconds and Banagher never had those trippy newtype moments with her. I mean poo poo, no one in the age thread justified Kio's nonsense with "X-rounders, man" 3 posted:ahem While cool it just showed how erratic the entire fight was. The zeon are kicking rear end, some random pilot comes out of nowhere and starts destroying them by himself. Why couldn't there have been a good back and forth?
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Oct 15, 2012 00:58
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ImpAtom posted:"By the numbers Gundam show" sort of describes a big chunk of SEED. The point where the Freedom shows up is a good indicator of a downtown in the show from mediocre to inexplicable superhero fanfiction bullshit. It's exactly the point every remotely sympathetic character joins one side and every villain becomes basically Dr. Doom.
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Oct 15, 2012 00:58
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JazzFlight posted:The funny thing is, these descriptions of Destiny are just making me want to see it more. I would prefer a series that's horrible to one that's boring. I've already watched enough boring Gundam series, I want something that makes me feel something one way or another. Destiny's problem is that a lot of it is bad in a boring way. It is perfect god-protagonists suffering no serious problems at all while they sanctimoniously whine at people while suffering no serious threats or danger. The most interesting aspect of it is how the theoretical protagonist is increasingly marginalized and shunted to the side by the returning characters and even that's only interesting for how much one series can poo poo on the dude who is supposed to be the main pilot.
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Oct 15, 2012 01:04
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Whizbang posted:He got rescued in a sidestory manga by Lowe Gear, one of the handful of good SEED characters. He was at the bottom of a small confined pit with a massive explosion going off not a metre above the opening, the sheer concussive force he would have experienced would have been immense, not to mention the fire. Lowe may have rescued him after the event but given where he was when the Aegis blew up he should have been reduced to little more than a stain on that melted chair we saw. There isn't any possible way he could have been blown clear for Lowe to find. ActionZero fucked around with this message at 01:10 on Oct 15, 2012 |
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Oct 15, 2012 01:07
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Monaghan posted:Amuro and Char were newtypes, same deal with Scirocco, Haman and a ton of other assholes and/or crazy people were as well. Didn't stop gundam pilots from realizing that they had to go so that more people wouldn't die. Most of them also met for more then 10 seconds and Banagher never had those trippy newtype moments with her. You do realize that Banagher actually managed to STOP her rampage by reaching out to her, right? And that her Psycommu System combined with some REALLY bad memories was what was making her go out of control, not because she was a bad person, right? Amuro and Char had a long antagonistic relationship before they "awakened," exacerbated by the fact that Amuro eventually killed their mutual girlfriend. Haman and Scirocco and the like were just straight up messed up people who couldn't be stopped any other way. Those were completely different situations. Mecha Gojira fucked around with this message at 01:11 on Oct 15, 2012 |
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Oct 15, 2012 01:09
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ActionZero posted:He was at the bottom of a small confined pit with a massive explosion going off not a metre above the opening, the sheer concussive force he would have experienced would have been immense, not to mention the fire. Lowe may have rescued him after the event but given where he was when the Aegis blew up he should have been reduced to little more than a stain on that melted chair we saw. There isn't any possible way he could have been blown clear for Lowe to find. He wasn't, from what I recall. Lowe Gear finds the Strike and a reinforced blast hatch had come down to protect Kira. Which is still a stupid explanation but they had some kind of handwave in there. Just a stupid one. Edit: Yeah, looking it up, there was apparently an "emergency hatch" that was also phase shifted or something. Lowe pulls Kira out, the Strike's power goes down right afterwards and Lowe goes "Good boy, you saved your pilot's life." The scene where all the kids find Kira passed out afterwards is directly proceeded by Lowe stumbling into the cabin and going "Hey, FYI, found this dude out there." I really hate the loving "hey, important plot info kept only in the manga" poo poo Gundam is doing now. They use it to explain where they pulled an extra GN Drive from in 00 and what the hell happened to Asemu in AGE and it's really loving stupid. ImpAtom fucked around with this message at 01:18 on Oct 15, 2012 |
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Oct 15, 2012 01:12
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Mecha Gojira posted:You do realize that Banagher actually managed to STOP her rampage by reaching out to her, right? And that her Psycommu System combined with some REALLY bad memories was what was making her go out of control, not because she was a bad person, right? Okay fine, but when he couldn't shoot her even after she started going again and was about to kill a ton more people is when I really rolled me eyes and was glad that Riddhe shot her. Also, if she's a "good person" the show should have demonstrated this. All we got was her being a bloodthirsty soldier, who wanted to go and kill everyone in the federation for revenge for her family, when the people she's killing didn't do anything. She was a horribly written character and as much more sympathetic in the novel, because she was a completely different character!
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Oct 15, 2012 01:17
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Monaghan posted:Okay fine, but when he couldn't shoot her even after she started going again and was about to kill a ton more people is when I really rolled me eyes and was glad that Riddhe shot her. Also, if she's a "good person" the show should have demonstrated this. All we got was her being a bloodthirsty soldier, who wanted to go and kill everyone in the federation for revenge for her family, when the people she's killing didn't do anything. She was a horribly written character and as much more sympathetic in the novel, because she was a completely different characte. That's fair, though remember when that final blast DID go off, she used her little shield bits to dissipate the blast and protect Banagher and Riddhe. Riddhe then killed her AFTER she just made sure he wouldn't be killed.
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Oct 15, 2012 01:19
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ImpAtom posted:He wasn't, from what I recall. Lowe Gear finds the Strike and a reinforced blast hatch had come down to protect Kira. Which is still a stupid explanation but they had some kind of handwave in there. Just a stupid one. But... the chair was melted. He was in the chair. If whatever caused the chair to be melted was stopped by the blast shield then it must have still been going on when Lowe got in to pull him out and it must have been hot enough to melt metal. There is no possible sequence of events short of magic that could lead to Kira surviving that explosion given what we see in the show. Truly he must be Jesus and he came back from the dead. That's my story and I'm sticking to it. 
ActionZero fucked around with this message at 01:25 on Oct 15, 2012 |
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Oct 15, 2012 01:20
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Explosions dont work the same way in gundam SEED as they do in real life, they are more like portals that teleport you exactly where you need to be. That or they kill you, depending on how important to the plot you are.
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Oct 15, 2012 01:22
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IIRC Strike was still on fire and stuff when Lowe pulled him out, so that melted the chair after he pried open the blast doors. The blast doors on the cockpit are also what allowed the Lohengrin to kill Mwu, since they made Strike's cockpit a fortress.
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Oct 15, 2012 01:21
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ImpAtom posted:I really hate the loving "hey, important plot info kept only in the manga" poo poo Gundam is doing now. They use it to explain where they pulled an extra GN Drive from in 00 and what the hell happened to Asemu in AGE and it's really loving stupid. That poo poo is bad enough on its own even if the material is good, but my only experience with non-UC manga stuff are the 00 spinoffs and yikes they were not good at all.
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Oct 15, 2012 01:35
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Hey is worked(?) for American comic books, obviously it'll work for Japanese media too!
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Oct 15, 2012 01:37
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I kind of expect silly moments in Gundam series nowadays. VV For example, I remember there was a dumb stretch in Gundam Wing where the Gundam pilots were really obsessed with suicide. "Oh no, I'm surrounded by the same kind of mook I've been destroying the last few episodes - better do some unnecesary self-destruction!"
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Oct 15, 2012 03:45
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If i were a protagonist in Gundam Wing that isn't Duo I'd wanna kill myself at any possible chance too so that's just relatively good characterization. Really fleshes those fuckers out
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Oct 15, 2012 04:16
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To be fair, the self destruct was half Sandrock's idea.
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Oct 15, 2012 04:35
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So I've been watching the SEED HD remaster just to have some background noise, and I think I've figured out the worst thing about the art style. It's not just that all the main characters have the same face, it's the way their eyes are drawn. For some reason they look completely dead and emotionless, like doll's eyes... I just noticed on a close-up on Kira's face that he was showing absolutely no emotion whatsoever. A lot of anime probably has this problem but I don't think I've ever felt this way about the way eyes were drawn in any other Gundam series. All the eye shines and details are there but they feel flat, like none of the characters actually have eyeballs and just painted eyes on their faces instead. A weird thing to get hung up on, I know, but it just struck me. Also, on the subject of Gundam SEED, compared to the likes of Star Trek Voyager, it's almost tolerable. It would do well to have a character like the EMH to liven things up, though.
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Oct 15, 2012 04:40
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If you think he looks like a dead, lifeless realdoll now, just you wait until SEED factor becomes A Thing
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Oct 15, 2012 04:43
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Well Manicured Man posted:It would do well to have a character like the EMH to liven things up, though. Ive never seen star trek but the show later gets a tiny ball robot that floats around and sceams things like "I'M FINE AND SO ARE YOU!" during The Dramatic Scenes.
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Oct 15, 2012 04:54
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Hirai's art style is loving awful. Just completely awful. SEED would probably be twice as good a series with any other loving art style because at least character would be able to emote slightly.
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Oct 15, 2012 04:59
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ImpAtom posted:Hirai's art style is loving awful. Just completely awful. SEED would probably be twice as good a series with any other loving art style because at least character would be able to emote slightly. Nah, nobody involved would allow that. Rie Tanaka specifically complained about how ridiculous Lacus is because she wasn't able to show emotions at any point, and as a voice actor she was pretty well separated from the visual choices.
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Oct 15, 2012 05:43
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Monaghan posted:Okay fine, but when he couldn't shoot her even after she started going again and was about to kill a ton more people is when I really rolled me eyes and was glad that Riddhe shot her. Also, if she's a "good person" the show should have demonstrated this. All we got was her being a bloodthirsty soldier, who wanted to go and kill everyone in the federation for revenge for her family, when the people she's killing didn't do anything. She was a horribly written character and as much more sympathetic in the novel, because she was a completely different character! Personally I think she works in the OVA better than what I'm told she's like in the novels because in the OVA she just inherits her father's hate and has no real basis of her own for why the Feds are bad or what she's doing is good - she's just doing it because she was raised to. It helps reinforce how pointless the whole thing is and is connected to Unicorn's story about the Zeon remnants by that since they're fighting for a war that ended years ago and that they can't really win too. In the novel she's certainly more of a sympathetic character and I can dig the whole muslim thing it's trying to get across, but it doesn't feel as connected to the rest of the story. I still think Riddhe was in the right to do what he did because he wasn't connected to her like Banagher was and had no idea of the newtype conversation they were having, all he saw was Banagher hesitating to kill someone who was offing civilians indiscriminately for no discernable reason. Again though, it just highlights the tragedy of the circumstances that it went down like that so I've no beef with it. I said this on /m/ and get endless waves of hate for being Zeekscum and other such retarded poo poo though, so maybe I'm just delusional.
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