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Shimrra Jamaane posted:I literally got into a shouting match with my aunt during Thanksgiving dinner when she said that Hurricane Sandy (and the government's response to it) was just as bad if not worse than Katrina. That's right, she literally used the words 'probably worse.' How the gently caress she rationalizes that I still don't know but apparently those people in New Orleans who stayed behind deserved it. Oh and she has been talking to some friends in New Jersey and according to her crappy anecdotal evidence FEMA and other big name aid relief is useless and hasn't helped anyone at all compared to church group charities. See if you can goad her into agreeing with this: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=prXAsjWVwrA Then claim silent victory for not believing that craziness. Also for not giving Alex Jones any money. (  The only reason why I know this show exists is my father-in-law made me watch three of these in quick succession this Thursday. Followed by "Doomsday Preppers." Followed immediately by knowing glances and prodding to see how much of this stuff I bought whole sale into. What a long fucken Thanksgiving.)
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Nov 25, 2012 00:46
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Do you think Alex Jones is a net positive to anti-corporatism, for actually talking about it to a reasonably large audience on a regular basis, or net negative for associating it with UFO conspiracies and whatnot?
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Nov 25, 2012 02:35
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I purposely buy Eid stamps every year because I think it's wonderful to celebrate diversity and I support the USPS in their efforts to do just that. Also the prospect of loving with people's minds is a bonus.
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Nov 25, 2012 06:41
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VideoTapir posted:Do you think Alex Jones is a net positive to anti-corporatism, for actually talking about it to a reasonably large audience on a regular basis, or net negative for associating it with UFO conspiracies and whatnot? I have no idea of public sentiment of Alex Jones, partially because the people whom I do talk to about Alex Jones think he's a prophet of truth. Anecdotal, I know, but I don't hear too much about him in the public opinion outside of those small circles, so it's hard for me to point one way or another in that regard. Regardless of what cause the man champions that I agree with, his sole purpose in life is to get paid to push horrible theories. Most of which are libertarian in nature and are so far gone it damages any credibility he would have garnered. The amount of horrible propaganda he pushes far outweighs anything remotely close to his more sane and relevant theories. To some extent, the boy who cries wolf starts to get intermingled in there as well. It becomes harder to advocate for anti-corporatism when it's wrapped under lizard-men, time travel, death rays, soy takeovers, and other garbage. Fucitol fucked around with this message at 20:02 on Nov 25, 2012 |
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Nov 25, 2012 19:50
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ZappDash posted:I have no idea of public sentiment of Alex Jones, partially because the people whom I do talk to about Alex Jones think he's a prophet of truth. Anecdotal, I know, but I don't hear too much about him in the public opinion outside of those small circles. Did Alex Jones actually favor a candidate in this election?
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Nov 25, 2012 19:54
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Zwabu posted:Did Alex Jones actually favor a candidate in this election? Lizard-king/Crab-people '16
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Nov 25, 2012 20:06
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ZappDash posted:I have no idea of public sentiment of Alex Jones, partially because the people whom I do talk to about Alex Jones think he's a prophet of truth. Anecdotal, I know, but I don't hear too much about him in the public opinion outside of those small circles, so it's hard for me to point one way or another in that regard. I'm amazed people didn't up and drop Alex Jones back during Y2K. He was hyping it up as the end of the world and how the U.S. government was going to take over the united states in a NWO plot. On the day it was supposed to happen he kept talking about how the government blew up a water plant or something like that, because NWO. Of course, it didn't happen and the next day he went back to talking about whatever bullshit he sells. Of course, he never brought it back up about how the world was supposed to end and NWO didn't take over, yet he's always talking about how it's a threat that never quite materializes. It really should be obvious at this point he's just an actor that like a clock, strikes right twice a day.
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Nov 25, 2012 20:21
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I'm sure he got a huge drop in ratings back then. But I personally never heard his Y2K stuff. I've heard other bullshit from him, obviously, but I think that's the thing: a continuous stream of new listeners. I'm sure he's only got a small core audience of schizophrenics who stick around after the big lies are proven false.
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Nov 25, 2012 20:30
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I forgot about this, but I've only met one person in real life who's ever even heard of Alex Jones. This British guy, probably in his late 40's, was in town meeting a friend of mine. I get to talking to him, and we hit it off. We talked about the Leveson Inquiry and the Murdoch scandal, the Republican primary and all the wackiness and insanity, the evils of the Torries and the Republicans, music, beer, food, culture, science. Absolutely brilliant guy. In the course of the conversation, I'm making an argument, I forget what about, something mundane, and he says "I'm actually a part-time writer for a site, and you know, I made almost that exact same argument in an article once. Have you ever heard of Info Wars?" I guess he saw the look on my face. "Oh, you've heard of it? Are you an Alex Jones fan too?" We were interrupted then or I changed the subject, I forget. I never had the heart to go look up what crazy poo poo this otherwise reasonable dude was saying.
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Nov 25, 2012 20:40
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XyloJW posted:I forgot about this, but I've only met one person in real life who's ever even heard of Alex Jones. Didn't Infowars get linked on Drudge a fair amount during this campaign season? I would imagine that would be mainly due to the fact that Jones trashes Obama so frequently, it's hard for me to imagine a wild eyed conspiracy theorist actively promoting a Mormon megamillionaire for President, so I'm sure it was a strange bedfellows situation. But just through exposure on Drudge I'd think Alex Jones would have a little more notoriety than his usual.
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Nov 25, 2012 20:49
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VideoTapir posted:Do you think Alex Jones is a net positive to anti-corporatism, for actually talking about it to a reasonably large audience on a regular basis, or net negative for associating it with UFO conspiracies and whatnot? While Jones may be anti-corporate in theory, he uses rhetoric very similar to your other right wing blowhards. He's been saying the same "Obama won for promising people free poo poo" talking points (he loves to throw out OBAMAPHONE and play the "You didn't build that clip" even now and of course calls Obama a socialist). He can say that he's against the finance sector and corporate abuse and talk about the false left-right paradigm, but he's ultimately just another right wing extremist with a talk show, except he's more for the Ron Paul Republicans than the evangelicals or big business republicans. Dr. Paul is a frequent guest on his show.
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Nov 25, 2012 23:37
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ZappDash posted:( I loving love Doomsday Preppers. That show is filmed amazingly. I swear the show itself is being sarcastic as hell in its editing and sound design. They want so bad for you to think those people are insane, but they can't come right out and say it. I also like to play a game while watching it. The game is called "try to spot the white supremacist paraphernalia or racist shooting targets they don't want me to notice".
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Nov 26, 2012 01:00
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Anyone else been seeing lots of memes about American foreign aid and how the US is feeding the world of lazy people, or am I just lucky? Got a cute post from a rather old English gent I know, who's a member of my local fish club. I can't find it on my FB page anymore, but the gist of it is a NYC cabbie picks up a clear Muslim (turban and all, that's how you tell, right?), and the Muslim customer sits in the cab and rattles off that there will be no Western music playing as that is an abomination to the Prophet, and the cabbie will not make political commentary as that is an abomination to the Prophet, and there will be no small talk about religion or women as that is an abomination to the Prophet. So the American non-Muslim cabbie throws out the Muslim, and when the Muslim asks why, the cabbie retorts that there were no cabs when the Prophet was around, so they must be an abomination, so ride a loving camel! ....and this is why I am regretting friending so many fish people on FB. The same pleasant old man also posts daily about how great Jesus is and that abortion is not an issue about women or men, but BABIES. Damnit stick to loving fish!
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Nov 26, 2012 01:27
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This is the version I have:quote:A devout Arab Muslim entered a black cab in London , He curtly asked the cabbie to turn off the radio because as decreed by his religious teaching, he must not listen to music because in the time of the prophet there was no music, especially Western music which is the music of the infidel. The cab driver politely switched off the radio, stopped the cab and opened the door. The Arab Muslim asked him, "What are you doing? "The cabbie answered, "In the time of the prophet there were no taxis, so f...k off and wait for a camel!!"
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Nov 26, 2012 01:59
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True proof these people live in a fantasy world. Non muslim cabbies? Preposterous.
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Nov 26, 2012 02:25
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He asked me to turn off my radio? Better put my job at risk and miss out on easy money!
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Nov 26, 2012 02:52
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I'm pretty sure there's a California law that states a cab driver is required to turn off the radio if asked. But that's godless commie California so I'm not sure what my point is here. e: It may not be a law now that I think of it, it might be one of those "passenger bill of rights" things that's typical company policy. Either way though.
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Nov 26, 2012 02:54
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There was non such thing as music in 570 C.E.
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Nov 26, 2012 02:56
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Saw this on twitter, those drat libs expecting me to know 4th grade level math by the end of highschool  
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Nov 26, 2012 03:32
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It's a legitimate criticism in my opinion. So much of the modern world and policy are completely opaque to the average person, and at least in the US that's even with a marginal education in civics. Of course the conclusion shouldn't be to cut 4th grade math, but it's a definite inadequacy in citizens' education.
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Nov 26, 2012 03:37
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I learned all those things in school, what the hell? I guess other than how to vote? I know how to read so that helps.
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Nov 26, 2012 03:37
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MaxxBot posted:Saw this on twitter, those drat libs expecting me to know 4th grade level math by the end of highschool He accidentally makes a good point; our schools do a really awful job of teaching students the basic life skills they need, or the basics of how our government and economy works.
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Nov 26, 2012 03:38
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I know I just posted this same thing pretty much, but you guys didn't have to learn how to write checks in school? I was taught that in both middle school and high school.
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Nov 26, 2012 03:42
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MaxxBot posted:Saw this on twitter, those drat libs expecting me to know 4th grade level math by the end of highschool That said, I imagine I'm coming from a different place from whoever posted this originally.
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Nov 26, 2012 03:45
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I went to high school in three different states in different parts of the country and yeah, none of them really had much in the way of civics, banking, bureaucracy, or emergency stuff. One school had a completely bizarre vocational training class that taught you how a bunch of weird outdated technology worked that was at least career-oriented, I guess? But I'll tell you what they all had and was required at every level--state history. I took Mississippi History, which I was informed did not count for poo poo in Nevada, so they made me take Nevada history, even though I told them I'd be moving to Oklahoma the following year and that it wouldn't be worth poo poo there either. Sorry, required. And yeah, then I took Oklahoma history. I love history, but all of these classes were completely pointless--there's no lesson to be learned that general American history didn't cover in a bigger, better way. I would've much preferred a real-world class of some sort.
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Nov 26, 2012 03:51
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ultimateforce posted:I learned all those things in school, what the hell? I guess other than how to vote? I know how to read so that helps. I went to a rather nice high school (though I was never in any advanced courses), and I didn't learn any of that stuff barring the extremely basic "what taxes are" one. I sure as hell didn't learn anything about loans, practical things like jump-starting a car (I'm loving terrified of getting a flat tire or even getting pulled over since I've never had to deal with those things), how to apply for work, what made good sources beyond "don't use Wikipedia," and tons of other things. Maybe some of those don't have a place in school, or it's expected that your peers or parents are supposed to cover that sort of thing, but mine never did and it made a lot of my young life really difficult. I still have to ask my parents questions about credit and such, and I'm 26! e: some of this might be because I was something of a timid dweeb in high school and never took any classes that would specifically deal with things like writing checks and other more down to earth topics, but it should have been covered in gen ed. We spent 20 minutes in Homeroom every morning, it'd be nice if that time had been used for practical, easy to explain skills. Countblanc fucked around with this message at 03:59 on Nov 26, 2012 |
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Nov 26, 2012 03:56
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MaxxBot posted:Saw this on twitter, those drat libs expecting me to know 4th grade level math by the end of highschool
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Nov 26, 2012 03:57
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Urban Space Cowboy posted:But seriously...nearly every one of these things I did learn in high school. (Off the top of my head I don't remember being specifically taught about checks or banking, but gently caress checks anyway.) And what do you suppose the probability is that this anonymous shitheel, who can't recognize a Greek proper name when he/she/it sees one, has also argued for the importance of classes in physics and engineering, in which the Pythagorean theorem is drat well indispensable? I'm pretty sure most high schools don't teach that stuff, though. I tried digging up information, but that information is not handy. Despite the author's bizarre argument that life-experience classes do more harm than good, there's some information here: http://www.consumerismcommentary.com/should-high-schools-require-money-management-classes/
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Nov 26, 2012 04:13
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Given that the far right is already convinced that public schools are government indoctrination centers, you'd think they'd be a little more wary about calling for citizen's ed classes.
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Nov 26, 2012 04:16
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All of that stuff would've been a lot more useful to me than the majority of time I spent in classes at my school
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Nov 26, 2012 04:18
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High school was a pretty good place to hone my abstract art skills, though.
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Nov 26, 2012 04:23
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Countblanc posted:...practical things like jump-starting a car (I'm loving terrified of getting a flat tire or even getting pulled over since I've never had to deal with those things)...
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Nov 26, 2012 04:23
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MaxxBot posted:Saw this on twitter, those drat libs expecting me to know 4th grade level math by the end of highschool I actually took a class on this called Life Skills and Career Exploration. It was pretty much designed to be a stoner class, where they relegated the losers who were destined for auto repair or welding. I took it because I needed an elective. I was pleasantly surprised to learn how to write a resume, handle a job interview and do taxes. It was one of the first classes to go when they cut funding, and that really made me pissed because it's one of the few courses I actually used the information from on a daily basis.
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Nov 26, 2012 04:45
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So I posted the Berkley Big Box study at http://laborcenter.berkeley.edu/retail/bigbox_livingwage_policies11.pdf on my facebook back when it was posted in the Walmart thread. Today, a good friend who is, honestly, one of the smartest, kindest people I know and, for some reason, a big time Libertarian replied. I need help arguing. I am making the poorly connected arguments in red, he is in the black. This was the original post: So why don't we have a livable minimum wage? IMPACT ON CONSUMERS Even if Walmart were to pass 100 percent of the wage increase on to consumers, the average impact on a Walmart shopper would be quite small: 1.1 percent of prices, well below Walmart's estimated savings to consumers. This works out to $0.46 per shopping trip, or $12.49 per year, for the average consumer who spends approximately $1,187 per year at Walmart. This is the most extreme estimate, as portions of the raise could be absorbed through other mechanisms, including increased productivity or lower profit margins.
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Nov 26, 2012 05:14
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Leaving everything else to posters who are more knowledgeable than myself, your friend is absolutely, categorically wrong in his last post when he states that "most are probably eligible for Medicaid." You need to call him out on the fact that he clearly has no idea how that program actually functions.
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Nov 26, 2012 05:28
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MaxxBot posted:Saw this on twitter, those drat libs expecting me to know 4th grade level math by the end of highschool I went to a "smart kid" high school and the only thing out of that list I learned was how the government actually works in U.S. government class. I also learned how the U.N works in a "current events" class. I always actually wanted a home ec class so I could learn to cook and how to really take care of basic household things. My family and house were not optimal at all.
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Nov 26, 2012 05:36
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XyloJW posted:I went to high school in three different states in different parts of the country and yeah, none of them really had much in the way of civics, banking, bureaucracy, or emergency stuff. One school had a completely bizarre vocational training class that taught you how a bunch of weird outdated technology worked that was at least career-oriented, I guess? I taught Poli Sci 101 for 3 semester. 2 classes a semester. In those 6 classes roughly 10% of students could name the three branches of the government correctly and about 25% got close(President instead of Executive, Congress instead of Legislative, minor poo poo). ~70% could name both major political parties. Somewhere around 50% knew the party of our sitting president. Less than 8% knew the parties of their state senators. Note I said "their", not the location of the school - I actually went online to double check in some cases. 64% of my students, on average, are on academic scholarships. I weep for our civics education in high school. On the upside - I go over that stuff the first week of class in RAPID fashion (because I was also teaching US Government those semesters) and give the same quiz at the end of semester. Numbers went up by about 60-70%. I felt like at least some of the kids learned SOMETHING. I was really shocked when I gave that little "first day easy quiz so I know what you know" and about 65% of the class outright failed. I had to go talk to my mentor and ask him how do I show my face in that class and not either laugh or yell at these poor kids.
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Nov 26, 2012 05:44
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prahanormal posted:High school was a pretty good place to hone my abstract art skills, though. Many generations to come will be able to witness my art left behind on various benches, desks and chairs.
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Nov 26, 2012 05:48
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Soonmot posted:So I posted the Berkley Big Box study at http://laborcenter.berkeley.edu/retail/bigbox_livingwage_policies11.pdf on my facebook back when it was posted in the Walmart thread. The Medicaid thing above is true. Medicaid requirements are straight up hilarious in some states, it's pretty god drat sad. Anyways, why would unemployment increase? First off, Wal-Mart, any every business for that matter already employs as few people as possible. If Wal-Mart was a much smaller company in a position where it'd have to eat into its profits in a significant way to pay employees a decent wage, they may hold back on hiring people and try to squeeze more work out of their current employees. Their profit margins are gigantic though. More importantly though, the study showed what would happen if all the costs were passed onto consumers. It'd be such a negligible rise that consumers would never notice it. They wouldn't lose their market edge and more importantly it wouldn't cost them a dime into their gigantic profits. There is no reason, at least economic, not to pay wal-mart employees $12 an hour beyond the fact they don't want to. At that level on top of it, not only would Wal-Mart's bottom line not be hurt, it'd take millions of people off the dole. Everyone would be happy. Amused to Death fucked around with this message at 06:00 on Nov 26, 2012 |
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Nov 26, 2012 05:49
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Your friend is wrong. The cost passed on to consumers assumes the same level of employment as they have now. He's also making the classic libertarian blunder of assuming "lots of underemployment is better than bearable unemployment", which is false. The vast majority of corporations couldn't afford to lose jobs, even if they cost a little more. They're already trying to do that and a raise hike that could be passed ENTIRELY onto consumers wouldn't spike that drive at all. Firms are already only hiring part-time workers... that's why we need more robust minimum wage and benefits laws. Walmart employees, from what I read, actually receive more in government assistance than Walmart pays in corporate taxes. Think about that. Walmart - largest employer in the world - is a net recipient of federal aid. Boggles the mind. He's set up a strawman and you fell for it. This article, as I said, assumes NO LAYOFFS. Raise minimum wage to $12/hour, pass 100% of that cost on to customers, net cost of $13/year for average Walmart consumer. Imagine the average Walmart consumer is a Walmart employee. They work 1 hour a year to cover that increased cost. Then, for the rest of the year, they made (roughly) $2/hour more. That's $80/week, 320/month, 4160/year. Is it going to move them up the ladder of life? Probably not. Would 4000 a year make them much much more stable in life? Certainly. It might even get a lot of them off government benefits - or receiving significantly less. As it stands RIGHT NOW taxpayers are subsidizing corporate greed. I don't care what your stance is politically, unless you're a completely blindered sociopath you'd rather tax dollars go to needy families than greedy corporations. Every dollar that a Walmart employee gets in government benefits is, basically, a dollar that Walmart, Inc. deposits as profit. And that's gross. Amused to Death posted:There is no reasonm, at least economic, not to pay wal-mart employees $12 an hour beyond the fact they don't want to. At that level on top of it, not only would Wal-Mart's bottom line not be hurt, it'd take millions of people off the dole. Everyone would be happy. I thought about this today and the only thing I could come up with and it's pretty  is tacit collusion to keep wages as low as possible among all large scale employers.Walmart has to have these numbers. They have to know they could easily pay their employees more and be fine. Hell - they argue for $12/hour... imagine if every minimum wage receiving Walmart employee suddenly went to $11/hour. The costs would be negligible and they'd look like saints. The goodwill bought with the public alone would be astounding. Having to rage wages because of a minimum wage hike is one thing - voluntarily saying "We're paying every employee more! (even if it's still basically poverty...shhh)" makes you look like Mother Teresa. sicarius fucked around with this message at 05:57 on Nov 26, 2012 |
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