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Swagger Dagger posted:Someone teach me about Wargames! The WW2 version of Command and Colors is Memoir '44. It's pretty good, designed to be a quick scenario rather than a super detailed simulation.
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Dec 1, 2012 07:07
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As far as Monopoly replacements go, Power Grid has paper money, an emphasis on cutthroat economic competition, etc. It's an auction and building game rather than a roll and move but depending on what it is about monopoly they like it might work.
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Dec 1, 2012 07:13
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Maybe we need a list of better designed games that are analogous to classic games? Mystery of the Abbey > Clue Funny Friends > Life Twilight Struggle > Battleship Imperial > Risk Dominion > Any Card Game Bananagrams > Scrabble
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Dec 1, 2012 07:35
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Cocks Cable posted:Maybe we need a list of better designed games that are analogous to classic games? Wait, I've seen Bananagrams in stores, but haven't actually given it thought. It's good?
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Dec 1, 2012 07:37
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Cocks Cable posted:Maybe we need a list of better designed games that are analogous to classic games? I love me some Dominion, but I don't think it can directly be compared to any card game (unless you specifically mean TCGs, of course).
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Dec 1, 2012 07:40
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^^^ That was just a rough knee jerk draft. Dominion is probably better compared to TCGs.mikeycp posted:Wait, I've seen Bananagrams in stores, but haven't actually given it thought. It's good? It's pretty good for what it is. Very light and fast free form scrabble played in real time. There's a nice sense of  when you get to say "Peel...Peel...Peel..." while everyone else groans in annoyance.
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Dec 1, 2012 07:44
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Cocks Cable posted:Bananagrams > Scrabble Clearly you're not aware there's a Words With Friends board game now.
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Dec 1, 2012 07:46
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Admin Understudy posted:Clearly you're not aware there's a Words With Friends board game now. I am but isn't it the same as Scrabble but with new hip repackaging of a famous iPhone app? Who wants to wait 30 min for someone to come up with a word just to hit some bullshit triple word score tile? Bananagrams is quick and hectic and doesn't require arcane knowledge of obscure words in the dictionary.
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Dec 1, 2012 07:51
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Swagger Dagger posted:Someone teach me about Wargames! I really can't say too much about wargames or ASL, but the ASL Starter Kits are going for totally reasonable prices on the BGG market.
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Dec 1, 2012 08:01
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Finally got to play Space Alert tonight. Unfortunately, 2 guys were no show so we were stuck with 3. It was still a whole helluva lot of fun though! We only ran through the test runs and one simulation. There's no way we'd be able to properly tackle the tougher missions with just 3. I really can't wait to get 1 or 2 more people and really have a go at that drat game.
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Dec 1, 2012 08:08
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Cocks Cable posted:Maybe we need a list of better designed games that are analogous to classic games? I'd submit Small World as a Risk analog as well.
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Dec 1, 2012 08:22
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Swagger Dagger posted:Someone teach me about Wargames! For squad(ish) wargames, I'll only comment on the games I've played, and won't get into a few that I wouldn't recommend. ASL is pretty much the WW2 version of D&D. Lots of charts, books, and stats for everything under the sun. Every situation that could possibly come up is probably covered by the rules somehow. The game often feels more like a simulation than a balanced game, for better or worse. For a more available game, I can't recommend Combat Commander enough. The random scenario generator alone makes this the best system out there, and the game is fast, dynamic and fun. This is my choice of the best available option, but there aren't any vehicles. Also, it's card driven, which you seem to enjoy, but not in the same way as a CDG (neither is C&C, though). The expansions will make the game bigger and add variety, but I feel the game is already complete without them. This is the squad based game that will be remembered twenty years down the road, it's that good. The whole C&C series is good, but abstracted to the point that it feels more like a strategy game than a wargame. That's not necessarily a bad thing, but it will often influence if it's the right game for someone or not. For Memoir 44, the game almost demands a few expansions to add some needed complexity and variety. Conflict of Heroes is also good, especially if you want vehicles in the mix. It's a bit more beer and pretzels than Combat Commander, but a very good game with a well deserved strong following. This is a hex and counter game like ASL. Like Combat Commander, the expansions (or a new stand alone) will add variety but the game is complete without. Finally, there's Panzer, a recent reprint of an older series. It's not just a smart name, this is pretty much a squad based game focused on tanks. The game is pretty fast and quick, but there are tons of options to tune up the complexity and simulation levels to your sweet spot. The game itself is hex and counter with hidden action selection and dice. Be advised that an expansion is almost mandatory for the game to have legs. Fighting Formations is a bit of a slog. A great simulation, a good game, but so drat long for what it is that I rarely recommend it. If you don't mind a 3-6 hour skirmish, it's pretty good.
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Dec 1, 2012 08:49
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Dominion posted:Please no one take the bait in the ambassador thread with the guy saying how great a game Zombies!!! is. djfooboo posted:It's better than Killer Bunnies. I hate that game with the burning of 1000 hotpockets. PikaPuff fucked around with this message at 09:07 on Dec 1, 2012 |
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Dec 1, 2012 09:02
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I think Killer Bunnies is the only game worse than Munchkin.
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Dec 1, 2012 09:25
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I'm going to recommend Karnaxis as an upgrade to Monopoly/Life. The game is basically the old PC game Jones in the Fast Lane as a board game without the humor. You can get a job, or be a small business owner or do both as you try to complete your life's dream for whatever character you drew. The first edition rules made getting a job really bad compared to owning a business, but the newer rules updates balance it out quite a bit. Pretty much this game flew under the radar because it was self published and only available via the guy's website.
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Dec 1, 2012 09:53
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So I'm thinking about finally busting out my copy of Descent 2d Edition tonight. None of us have ever played so is there anything I should know going in? Also we might only 3 people including myself, is the game playable at that amount?
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Dec 1, 2012 10:05
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Evil Vin posted:So I'm thinking about finally busting out my copy of Descent 2d Edition tonight. None of us have ever played so is there anything I should know going in? Also we might only 3 people including myself, is the game playable at that amount? I wouldn't play Descent for the first time with only 3 - it's balanced better with 5 (including Overlord) - if you;re playing with three, each player needs two PCs, and that's quite a lot to manage for a first game. However, if that sounds doable, then go for it.
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Dec 1, 2012 10:23
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thespaceinvader posted:I wouldn't play Descent for the first time with only 3 - it's balanced better with 5 (including Overlord) - if you;re playing with three, each player needs two PCs, and that's quite a lot to manage for a first game.
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Dec 1, 2012 10:34
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I actually deliberately left out a list of beginner games in the ambassador thread since I wanted people to ask questions about them: I can probably edit them in later. As for wargames, check out the second/third post in this very thread: there's a mini effort post about wargames there which can answer a lot of questions. Keep in mind, though, that CDGs are defined as Twilight Struggle-like games, so C&C in effect, even though it uses cards, is not defined as a CDG. I have tried 1989 (I own it) and although I do like it, I don't like it as much as Twilight Struggle. Although it improves a few things (consolidating realignments/coups is a good thing), some people have misgivings about the Hannibal-like card fighting mechanism as well as the fact that a single dice roll after that can have a lot of meaning on how the game turns out. Overall I like it though. If you are looking for games of it or TS, hit us up on the #boardgoons IRC channel on synirc, since there are quite a lot of wargamers hanging around there.
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Dec 1, 2012 10:48
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You know what's a decent gateway game? Alien Frontiers. Incredibly easy to learn, you roll dice which should give people a comfortable familiarity. However, instead of roll and move, it teaches people new to designer board games that you can do something differently with dice (worker placement). Still quite a bit of direct conflict, pretty short game for 3-4 players. The only downside I see is the downtime between player turns.
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Dec 1, 2012 11:02
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Pierzak posted:Don't you mean Descent 1? That was horrible with 2 heroes. I've played D2 with 2-4 heroes and poor scaling is not one of the game's shortcomings. I do mean descent 1, yes. I missed the '2nd edition' flag there. Haven't played 2e, so no ideas there.
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Dec 1, 2012 11:12
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PikaPuff posted:What's wrong with this one [Killer Bunnies]? I played it once and hated it, due to not understanding the rules. To be fair, I've played board games with people who love the poo poo out of that kind of thing if only because it gives them an excuse to dick around with each other while abusing various drugs. (Kinda thankful that I'm no longer living with potheads.) Hell, I've had fun with that sort of game every once in a while when playing Talisman. But at the same time "wacky hijinks occur" is not really a design concept you should be constructing a game around.
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Dec 1, 2012 11:53
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PikaPuff posted:Serious question. What's wrong with it? Both are games with too much luck - any choices that the player takes matter far less than luck. There are a lot of games out there like that (Talisman was just mentioned, and is a good example) and they can be fun every so often, but people often don't like something where the experience can be summed up as "some stuff happened, then someone won". There are games where randomness can take your victory away from you, especially the randomness of the other players (at least it can feel like that) but games where you feel like you had no real part in your result (whether a win or a loss) are unfulfilling. I've heard that the win condition for Killer Bunnies is to basically ignore everything that happened before, and just roll a few dice, and whoever rolls highest wins - though I'm reasonably certain this is hyperbole.
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Dec 1, 2012 12:22
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Swagger Dagger posted:Someone teach me about Wargames! To get a taste of both wargames and CDG, try Paths of Glory and then Pursuit of Glory. They're army and div scale respectively. Ops are used to activate unit stacks. Paths represents the whole of WWI and Pursuit is the Near East subset (Balkans and Egypt to SW Russia and India). If you have a few hours surely someone in #boardgoons will explain them and run you through some.
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Dec 1, 2012 14:57
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I sang the praises of Combat Commander a couple pages ago. The random scenario generator is fun, almost a minigame. Rules-wise it is a lot simpler than most of the other options and the rules are easy to reference. Playing it feels like a great war movie more than a simulation, so if you wanna get groggier on a tactical level ASL is still king.
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Dec 1, 2012 15:24
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PaybackJack posted:I'm going to recommend Karnaxis as an upgrade to Monopoly/Life. The game is basically the old PC game Jones in the Fast Lane as a board game without the humor. You can get a job, or be a small business owner or do both as you try to complete your life's dream for whatever character you drew. The first edition rules made getting a job really bad compared to owning a business, but the newer rules updates balance it out quite a bit. Pretty much this game flew under the radar because it was self published and only available via the guy's website. I wrote a review for it last year: http://meepletown.com/2011/06/review-karnaxis/
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Dec 1, 2012 16:36
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VoodooXT posted:Avoid Mayday. I usually go with Fantasy Flight and Ultrapro. The hologram is a little annoying with Ultrapro, but they're my go-to for standard card size sleeves. The problem with FFG sleeves is that they don't actually fit snug at all and they have a large overhang. We tried sleeving Cosmic Encounter and it just wasn't as good as the tighter fit like Mayday and I suppose some others have. The thickness is nice though although somewhat of a nuisance in terms of storage and stacking.
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Dec 1, 2012 17:34
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There's always the fact that you actually get working sleeves when you get them from FFG though.
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Dec 1, 2012 18:29
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If Arkham Horror only had one reason to exist, it'd be for the artwork produced for it that was then used for the FFG Art Sleeves. A stack of these look so drat cool. http://store.fantasyflightgames.com/productdetails.cfm?sku=FFS21
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Dec 1, 2012 18:41
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PikaPuff posted:Serious question. What's wrong with it [Zombies!!!]? "Oh cool, I drew the marbles item card, which I can only redeem at the toy store, which is on the exact opposite side of town from the helicopter!" Random, to the point of useless cards.
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Dec 1, 2012 18:51
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PikaPuff posted:Serious question. What's wrong with ZOmbies!!!!? First, it's highly random. This isn't automatically a problem, but there's no way to mitigate it, which renders player skill useless. The combat is all D6 based as well. Second, the end game is really crappy. So many of the cards are used to screw other players. So the natural strategy is to hold them to play on somebody who's about to win. So what should be a 10 minute ending becomes a 45 minute ending as the leader is dogpiled again and again and again... which leads to the third point, which is the game takes far too long to play for what should be a 15 minute game tops.
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Dec 1, 2012 19:09
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Not to mention that with all this combined, there is quite literally no game there. I would argue that munchkin has more content than zombies.
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Dec 1, 2012 19:13
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Finally, it's a game about zombies, and no one has ever managed to make a decent zombie game. Nobody knows why.
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Dec 1, 2012 20:08
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Poopy Palpy posted:Finally, it's a game about zombies, and no one has ever managed to make a decent zombie game. Nobody knows why. I would disagree with this (but of corse it's up to personal taste). City of Horror is awesome and if you like diplomacy heavy games you'll have a blast.
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Dec 1, 2012 20:22
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Yeah I've heard good things about City of Horror, but it's also quite new so I can't blame people for not having played it.
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Dec 1, 2012 20:29
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I thought Last Night on Earth was pretty good 
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Dec 1, 2012 20:51
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I know zombies are overplayed as a theme, but has anyone made a mechanically WORSE zombie game than [Zombies!!!]? Can even Zombicide claim that prize? I'd say Zombie Fluxx is better than Zombies!!!, but that's just me.
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Dec 1, 2012 21:35
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Scyther posted:I know zombies are overplayed as a theme, but has anyone made a mechanically WORSE zombie game than [Zombies!!!]? Can even Zombicide claim that prize? I'd say Zombie Fluxx is better than Zombies!!!, but that's just me. Zombicide has its issues but its nowhere near as bad as Zombies!!!
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Dec 1, 2012 21:42
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My main problem with Zombies!! is that it's horribly unthematic. I wouldn't normally dismiss a game wholesale for being unthematic, but theme is the only reason anyone has ever bought Zombies!!, so it must be executed correctly or it's a dealbreaker. Your goal is to beat the other survivors and gently caress them over? Why? The victory condition of killing 25 zombies doesn't make much sense either for that matter. Of course I can guess the answer to the question. Somebody has to make the zombies attack the heroes, but the designers didn't want someone to have to play the zombies (like LNoE) and didn't know how to implement a crude zombie AI (like many modern coop board games: Mice and Mystics, Gears of War, etc.) This was maybe sort of forgivable in 2001, I don't know? But these days we know either of these options is viable. Wazzu posted:I've heard that the win condition for Killer Bunnies is to basically ignore everything that happened before, and just roll a few dice, and whoever rolls highest wins - though I'm reasonably certain this is hyperbole. The way this works is that throughout the game you don't collect VPs, you collect raffle tickets. Put them all in a hat at the end, draw one out, its owner is the winner. To be honest this doesn't really bother me that much, compared to the other problems the game has. For a light game it's a pretty tolerable way to make sure beginners have a chance, and that there's no such thing as runaway winners or kingmaking. For more serious competitive games it would be awful, but whatever. The real problem to me is in the core mechanics of the game. First off, almost anything worthwhile you can do on your turn requires you to have a bunny in play. If you don't have a bunny in play, you effectively lose your turn. Pretty annoying huh? So how do you get a bunny? Luck of the draw. And if that weren't bad enough, for some reason I still don't understand, you play by queueing up actions a turn in advance. (Two turns, even? I forget.) So even when you get that bunny, you're still out a turn while you wait for it to come into play. And what happens if your bunny gets sniped by an opponent and you've queued up an action that required one? I won't spoil it but it rhymes with "Choose your Urn." Which, coincidentally, is a great way to spend all this down time; make sure your funeral preparations are in order so you can kill yourself if they try to start a second game of Killer Bunnies. McNerd fucked around with this message at 22:44 on Dec 1, 2012 |
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Dec 1, 2012 22:12
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Zombicide is definitely better than Zombies!!! which is just a boring shallow slog fest of screw the leader with no redeeming qualities. Here are some thoughts on various zombie games if you must have a zombie theme. Last Night on Earth - Semi-Coop. One versus Many. Still the best thematic narrative creating zombie experience IMHO. City of Horror - Competitive. Negotiation, Voting, Alliances. Has a much more abstract theme. Hated this one because the main mechanic negotiation/voting falls completely flat. Also has balance issues with the roles. Zombicide - Full coop. Zombie spawning mechanic can be broken and worked around in a meta-game sense. Characters are rip offs of nerd culture references which might be annoying and as a whole are not very balanced against each other. Kinda sort fun at times but it's the epitome of Ameritrash. Tolerable because it's full coop. Zombie State - Competitive but mostly solitary play with little interaction between the players. Global scale crisis management with resource collection and a research tree. Tech tree is not very balanced nor broad, so among the limited options there are a few optimal paths. Cheap looking components. Interesting in theory, but ultimately didn't like this one. Zombie Dice - Push your luck. Filler. But awesome silly filler that can play like 20+ if needed. Eaten by Zombies - Competitive. Deckbuilding, Hot Potato. This was an interesting new take on deck building where you can choose to fight the ever growing zombie horde or escape and pass the buck to the next player in line. Might have issues with turn order that can't be avoided. Rule book sucked balls. Zombie Survival: The Board Game - Competitive but mostly solitary play. Last one left standing is the winner. You defend a house from nightly zombie attacks. Cheap looking components. Interesting idea but not well executed. Falls short.
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Dec 1, 2012 22:22
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