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Oxxidation posted:Yes, I and everyone else with an existing forebrain figured that out 2500 neon-tinted words ago. I only can't figure out if the usual tedium is deliberate this time because of the contrast. Up above, we have lots of interesting Big Twist stuff happening. Below, we've got Dawson's Creek. Andrew Hussie: Good at characterization and world-building, not great at pacing. Stop the loving presses.
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Feb 3, 2013 02:03
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Regy Rusty posted:I think you've got a few too many assumptions in there. I already covered what I think about Jack being analagous to Doc Scratch, but I'm also not sold on this interpretation of Lil Cal's timeline, since I think there are still too many blank spots. It's a leap, I agree. But everything we've seen about jujus seems to indicate that there should never be more than one of them. So that means that the two Lil' Cals need to somehow be the same one, through some trick of Time Travel. And since we're seeing Caliborn influencing the B2 one such that the B1 is affected, that implies the B2 one comes "first". Unless it's a voodoo doll thing and order doesn't matter.
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Feb 3, 2013 02:04
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Is no one going to mention the Crowbar with the power negating abilities?
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Feb 3, 2013 02:04
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Kinda hoping Hussie posts a full picture of the last page, because it's really drat great. Tried to merge the pictures, but they need the spacing: they don't line up.
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Feb 3, 2013 02:04
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Oxxidation posted:Yes, I and everyone else with an existing forebrain figured that out 2500 neon-tinted words ago. I only can't figure out if the usual tedium is deliberate this time because of the contrast. Up above, we have lots of interesting Big Twist stuff happening. Below, we've got Dawson's Creek. I don't agree that it's tedious, but I'd certainly say that the contrast is deliberate. They're missing the plot because they're so busy with Teen Problems.
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Feb 3, 2013 02:05
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Bobulus posted:Doc Scratch was created from the same Lil' Cal that is now influencing Jack. What I'm seeing it as is two different methods of accomplishing the same goal: Bringing Caliborn's influence into a distant world. I guess I can see where you're coming from. It would be interesting if Doc Scratch ends up being the refined version of this technique, perfected by the adult Caliborn, while this is his younger version's first attempt. And it would also be appropriate that the refined version occurs earlier in this Cal's personal timeline because Lord English is all about confusing timelines. I want to see how Jack and Caliborn act as this plays out though, since at least so far it seems more like a direct control sort of situation.
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Feb 3, 2013 02:05
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Oxxidation posted:Yes, I and everyone else with an existing forebrain figured that out 2500 neon-tinted words ago. I only can't figure out if the usual tedium is deliberate this time because of the contrast. Up above, we have lots of interesting Big Twist stuff happening. Below, we've got Dawson's Creek. That would be what's known as dramatic irony. It's pretty effective.
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Feb 3, 2013 02:06
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Kit Walker posted:That would be what's known as dramatic irony. It's pretty effective. Unrelated, but is Kit Walker your original username or did you change it?
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Feb 3, 2013 02:08
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Doug Rattman posted:Unrelated, but is Kit Walker your original username or did you change it? My original.
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Feb 3, 2013 02:08
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Kit Walker posted:My original. http://americanhorrorstory.wikia.com/wiki/Kit_Walker This character first appeared in 2012.
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Feb 3, 2013 02:09
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Oxxidation posted:Yes, I and everyone else with an existing forebrain figured that out 2500 neon-tinted words ago. I only can't figure out if the usual tedium is deliberate this time because of the contrast. Up above, we have lots of interesting Big Twist stuff happening. Below, we've got Dawson's Creek. I'm supposed it's a form of tragic irony; we the audience know stuff (Jack turning into a Caliborn avatar complete w/ seizure superlasers) that the cast does not. So while LEJack (le jack? roxy get out) is getting ready to destroy half of prospit, the B2 kids, off their sugary high are simply absorbed into dealing with their own issues. I don't see anything wrong with this characterisation, it's the same flavour of fault that the A1 trolls had and it parallels rather nicely. You'll also probably find yourself lonely in thinking that it's utterly boring poo poo, this isn't the Mingfang journals, not by a long shot.
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Feb 3, 2013 02:09
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Aside from everything else, my favorite thing about this update is that it has brought us back to unironically discussing something we haven't seen since late 2010: "Jack is Lord English!!!"
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Feb 3, 2013 02:09
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Plom Bar posted:Andrew Hussie: Good at characterization and world-building, not great at pacing. But you don't understand. His pacing is intentionally bad, like, ironic and stuff. Pretty clever, really. Pure genius in fact. Brilliant.
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Feb 3, 2013 02:12
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YF-23 posted:I'm supposed it's a form of tragic irony; we the audience know stuff (Jack turning into a Caliborn avatar complete w/ seizure superlasers) that the cast does not. So while LEJack (le jack? roxy get out) is getting ready to destroy half of prospit, the B2 kids, off their sugary high are simply absorbed into dealing with their own issues. I don't see anything wrong with this characterisation, it's the same flavour of fault that the A1 trolls had and it parallels rather nicely. I'm far from alone in finding the Alpha Kids to be the worst characters in Homestuck. They never fail in finding new ways to disappoint. So as usual, everything about the current crop of updates is pretty great, except for them!
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Feb 3, 2013 02:12
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Oxxidation posted:I'm far from alone in finding the Alpha Kids to be the worst characters in Homestuck. They never fail in finding new ways to disappoint. Do you seriously think they are worse than Kankri Man you've got issues
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Feb 3, 2013 02:13
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Doug Rattman posted:http://americanhorrorstory.wikia.com/wiki/Kit_Walker The original Kit Walker: http://i.imgur.com/M5aHutP.jpg
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Feb 3, 2013 02:13
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So... what is Jack going to smash with that crowbar? We've seen it break jujus (Felt equipment), the website, etc. It seems like it break just about anything. So what will break?
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Feb 3, 2013 02:15
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Kit Walker posted:The original Kit Walker: huh I wonder if the writers of AHS knew about The Phantom
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Feb 3, 2013 02:15
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Bobulus posted:So... what is Jack going to smash with that crowbar? We've seen it break jujus (Felt equipment), the website, etc. It seems like it break just about anything. So what will break? A set of snooker balls.
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Feb 3, 2013 02:16
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Bobulus posted:So... what is Jack going to smash with that crowbar? We've seen it break jujus (Felt equipment), the website, etc. It seems like it break just about anything. So what will break? I want him to reach back and whack the loving screen, breaking the fourth wall and bringing the kids to the session.
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Feb 3, 2013 02:19
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He will break quest beds  Jack in himself doesn't really scare anymore, but English Mode Jack with plot device crowbar is concerning.
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Feb 3, 2013 02:20
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I don't think the logs this time around were intentionally dull to contrast with the exciting revelations above. I mean, all this dialogue is still important stuff for the characters to help grind out their arcs, but grind is the relevant term here. They need some time to hash out their issues with honest and forthright dialogue which they're finally getting around to doing, and Hussie simply had the foresight to pair this up with an exciting visual series of events that smooths over the pacing of the dialogue. Sometimes resolving character development issues can't be graceful and snappy. Wanting them to just be over it is basically the same tone of complaint Caliborn had. On a personal note I'm really enjoying the thoroughness of their discussions, since if there was one thing that seemed to be missing from the adventures of the first four kids it was some honest group introspection. We're going to go through this again with John and Co. for some even bigger narrative payoffs near the end, hopefully that'll keep more readers' attention.
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Feb 3, 2013 02:21
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Kit Walker posted:I won't be convinced that Jack is LE until I see him hulk out into a green monstrosity. The similarities are uncanny but it might just be that Caliborn is using Lil Cal's juju powers to transform other people into a sort of proxy for his wrath. Perhaps it's something similar to what happened to the Handmaid? It does sort of look like what happened to her, at least.
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Feb 3, 2013 02:23
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Bobulus posted:So... what is Jack going to smash with that crowbar? We've seen it break jujus (Felt equipment), the website, etc. It seems like it break just about anything. So what will break? Isn't it obvious? He's going to BREAK. HEADS.
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Feb 3, 2013 02:28
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Oxxidation posted:Someone should probably pick up that phone because I loving CALLED IT. I am also on the phone for the same reason. This puts a spin on Bec Noir mentioning that Lil Cal was his only friend a billion panels ago. Also, this explains why everyone who actively deals with Cal seems to wear shades, I guess. Saradiart fucked around with this message at 02:43 on Feb 3, 2013 |
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Feb 3, 2013 02:30
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Surprised no one else has brought this up - Caliborn still has his double black hole sprite, right? Maybe he's planning to fuse himself with Jack and go God Tier in the bargain, similar to how Jade did it? I loved the pacing on this sequence. The dialogue forces you to slow down, building tension, instead of just burning through Jack's transformation. That's pretty straightforward stuff, right? EDIT: Also, not enough love for Gamzee's YOU'RE MOTHERFUCKIN WELCOME stamp. Indie Rocktopus fucked around with this message at 02:33 on Feb 3, 2013 |
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Feb 3, 2013 02:30
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LET'S PLAY A GAME. Oxxidation Or Caliborn??? A posted:YES. I. AND EVERYONE ELSE WITH AN EXISTING FOREBRAIN. FIGuRED THAT OuT 2500 NEON-TINTED WORDS AGO. I ONLY CAN'T FIGuRE OuT. IF THE uSuAL TEDIuM IS DELIBERATE THIS TIME. BECAuSE OF THE CONTRAST. uP ABOVE WE HAVE LOTS OF INTERESTING BIG TWIST STuFF HAPPENING. BELOW WE'VE GOT DAWSON'S CREEK. B posted:JuST WALLS AND WALLS. OF CANDY ASSED TOOTY FRuITY loving poo poo. LOADS. OF. TEXT. OF PEOPLE BABBLING MOSTLY. WE ARE TALKING ABOuT MIGRAINE INDuCING DIARRHETIC VERTICAL SuICIDE DROPS OF uGLY loving WORDS. IMPENETRABLY ASININE RAINBOW FREEFALLS OF FRIVOLOuS BANTER. GOT IT? C posted:I AM ON MY KNEES. IN A FIELD. uNDER HEAVY RAIN. FISTS HANGING LIMP AT MY SIDES. SCREAMING INTO THE ABYSSAL HEAVENS. D posted:THIS ATROCIOuS GARBAGE YOu'RE MAKING ME WATCH. IS NEVERENDING ENOuGH! WITHOuT MAKING ME GO BACKWARD THROuGH ACTS! E posted:THEY WERE GOING NOWHERE. AND BEING STuPID. AND DOING LITERALLY NOTHING WHATSOEVER. EXCEPT FOR WALLOWING IN GROTESQuE EMOTIONS. F posted:AT LEAST THINGS ARE ACTuALLY HAPPENING. BEYOND TEENS BEING SAD AND/OR STuPID. G posted:I'M NOT SuRE IF THE ALPHA KIDS' BLATHER. BEING HORRIBLE, LONG-WINDED, AND COMPLETELY uNENGAGING. WAS DELIBERATE OR NOT. BuT IT WAS ONCE AGAIN THE WORST PART OF THESE uPDATES. HOLY loving poo poo LET THE GOOD CHARACTERS COME IN AND MAKE THESE FOuR SHuT THE gently caress uP AT LAST ABOuT WHO LIKES OR DISLIKES WHO. H posted:I DON'T WANT TO DEAL WITH THE ALPHA SESSION ANYMORE. THIS TRICKSTER MODE CRAP IS JuST GOING TO DRAG IT OuT EVEN FuRTHER. AND TAKE EVEN MORE TIME FROM THE CHARACTERS I (AND BASICALLY EVERYONE ELSE) ACTuALLY CARES ABOuT. DID YOU WIN?? CHECK THE ANSWERS: We all lose!! HOORAY!!!
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Feb 3, 2013 02:33
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Caliborn loved the Trickster updates so I can see through those ones.  It makes it stand out how much of a broken record you've become. VVVVVV JamJars fucked around with this message at 02:48 on Feb 3, 2013 |
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Feb 3, 2013 02:45
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If your only counter-argument to the glut of negative reactions to teen feelings-talk is "a villain Hussie wrote says the same things, sort of!" then you're in dire straits.
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Feb 3, 2013 02:46
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Oxxidation posted:If your only counter-argument to the glut of negative reactions to teen feelings-talk is "a villain Hussie wrote says the same things, sort of!" then you're in dire straits. A glut of negative reactions is fine, if it's a genuine glut. But it's you. You're the glut.
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Feb 3, 2013 02:51
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Freudian posted:A glut of negative reactions is fine, if it's a genuine glut. But it's you. You're the glut. There have been plenty of other people, right in this thread, who are sick of the Alpha Kids. You notice how in this update everyone was freaking out exclusively about what happened up above? That's because what was going on below was the exact same song that's been playing for the last year and a half. But that record just keeps on a-skippin' all the same. It's perfectly okay if this thread contains things other than praise and Dolash's borderline pathological need to post blocks of impenetrable speculation every time somebody blinks. And Koos. Actually I wouldn't mind more Koos. Come back Koos
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Feb 3, 2013 02:53
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Akett posted:Hey wait a sec, the huge explosion is on the far side of Prospit from the moon chain, yet on the next page Jack looks like he's at the base of the chain. Option A: He's still on the other side of Prospit from the chain, he was just blown far enough away from it that the rest of Prospit isn't in the shot. Option B: Artistic license. Hatbox Ghost posted:Oxxidation put it best when he said it's "horrible, long-winded, and completely unengaging". Besides those three things homestuck is indistinguishable from shonen manga, right down to the insufferable fanbase, although something tells me that if it actually were manga most of you would be turning your noses up at it. Doesn't this count as 'careposting'? Are you allowed to do that? I think you might be breaking the FYAD Code, dude. Dolash posted:I don't think the logs this time around were intentionally dull to contrast with the exciting revelations above. I mean, all this dialogue is still important stuff for the characters to help grind out their arcs, but grind is the relevant term here. They need some time to hash out their issues with honest and forthright dialogue which they're finally getting around to doing, and Hussie simply had the foresight to pair this up with an exciting visual series of events that smooths over the pacing of the dialogue. One of the really interesting thing about Hussie's writing is the way he just skips over stuff that's narratively inevitable to skip to interesting decision points. Look at Act 5-2 for the best examples of this: there's a lot of timeskipping going on there! This is something that a lot of my favorite authors do - Glen Cook, for example, uses a similar technique to great effect. The argument is, then, "It's not actually necessary to show the alpha kids reconciling, if it's easily inferred from events before and after; it should only be shown if the mechanism by which they reconcile is interesting." Personally, I felt that these conversations were interesting (in a cringingly-painful kind of way, in Jake's case), but Oxxidation disagrees. And it's quite fair for him to do so! There is no such thing as a 'required' boring bit in a well-written work of fiction. Oxxidation posted:If your only counter-argument to the glut of negative reactions to teen feelings-talk is "a villain Hussie wrote says the same things, sort of!" then you're in dire straits. The 'glut of negative feelings' is comprised of: - posts from you - posts from a Real Cool Fyad Dood - Caliborn I'm not trying to delegitimize your complaints - it's totally OK to not like a character or set of characters in a work of fiction! - but you don't really get to claim Weight of Numbers behind you, dude.
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Feb 3, 2013 02:56
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Oxxidation posted:There have been plenty of other people, right in this thread, who are sick of the Alpha Kids. And half a dozen nations collaborated in the invasion of Russia in the Second World War! Italy, Hungary, Romania, Finland, Slovakia... why do we single out Germany in particular? It's really unfair to Hitler. Yes, I am being facetious. Facetiousness was never a thing that wasn't happening. This started with me compiling a quiz comparing you to a homocidal alien with learning difficulties and a Napoleon complex. I don't actually mind/care if you're here posting wrong opinions about Homestuck!
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Feb 3, 2013 03:02
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The core of Homestuck, and really any story for me is the characters and their relationships with one another. As fun as all the weird time poo poo and trickster shenanigans are, stuff like these updates are what I stay for.
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Feb 3, 2013 03:04
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Oxxidation posted:There have been plenty of other people, right in this thread, who are sick of the Alpha Kids. You notice how in this update everyone was freaking out exclusively about what happened up above? That's because what was going on below was the exact same song that's been playing for the last year and a half. But that record just keeps on a-skippin' all the same. Actually, if you look back to people posting about the past couple days' updates, you'll generally find people reacting positively precisely because they were a change. The alpha kids were actually making some real loving progress. People are just reacting to Jack right now because what he's doing is just that serious. EDIT: Worth mentioning I don't have any problem with your posts. I actually think they're pretty funny.
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Feb 3, 2013 03:08
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For the record I think it's fine if Oxxidation is tired of the Alpha Kids. I find I prefer the original set as well, and am anxious to return to them. I just think these particular dialogues are good for the Alpha kids' arcs and are developing them well, and that Caliborn's interference with the trickster mode stuff shows why wanting them to just blow through them wouldn't work. The only other way he could really "resolve" the alpha kids is killing them in a tragic manner that underlines how they failed to develop, sort of like how half the trolls died, but it seems that the dead trolls only died so that they could develop in some other way through the afterlife so it doesn't look like Hussie's big on failed character arcs. That means this is all necessary development.
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Feb 3, 2013 03:08
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PleasingFungus posted:. He isn't the only person, I'm sick of the alpha kids too. It's just that I don't bother posting about it anymore because some people are very vocal about how they think the alpha kids are great and anyone who doesn't like them is blowing things out of proportion or whatever. I posted before about the "oh no teenagers are acting like teenagers" argument and got basically the same response.
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Feb 3, 2013 03:11
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Rhinoceraptor posted:The core of Homestuck, and really any story for me is the characters and their relationships with one another. As fun as all the weird time poo poo and trickster shenanigans are, stuff like these updates are what I stay for. I'm right there with you with that. Hussie writes interpersonal dynamics really, really well.
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Feb 3, 2013 03:14
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I am quite confused.
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Feb 3, 2013 03:17
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Can't we all just stop fighting and have an earnest talk about our favorite ships or something. Why must we fight. whyyyyy
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Feb 3, 2013 03:19
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