Paradox Grand Strategy: From the Carnival of Lust to the Enlightened Times

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Fintilgin: Sep 29, 2004; Fintilgin sweeps!

Graham Gremlin posted:

I agree with the people who've said this period would be very difficult to model in a Paradox game though and as much as I'd like to be able to run a game from the Roman Republic through to the end of the Cold War in the Clausewitz engine, I don't see it happening.

I've always been tempted to do 'Gibbon's Fantasy' and just hand wave it and say ooohhh, Christianity never arises, the classical world never 'falls', start with Wiz's mod for Rome and transfer it directly into CKII. So you've got Carthaginians and Celtic Gaul etc. Probably easier after the Old Gods comes out and you have some pagan mechanics.

# ? Feb 4, 2013 21:49

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# ? May 29, 2024 23:04

GEORGE W BUSHI: Jul 1, 2012

telcontar posted:

I don't see why, or at least I don't see what makes it more difficult than any of the other time periods Paradox games cover.

I just can't think of a way to model a bunch of Germanic tribes wandering around the map in a way that's easily presented to the player and actually enjoyable to play.

# ? Feb 4, 2013 21:54

binge crotching: Apr 2, 2010

Graham Gremlin posted:

I just can't think of a way to model a bunch of Germanic tribes wandering around the map in a way that's easily presented to the player and actually enjoyable to play.

Play EU3, and use the Always War mod. I think it had 1 month cores, and occupied land transferred in a month as well. Countries would slowly migrate around as they gained/lost land, and it was hilarious.

It's not quite what you want, but it is similar.

# ? Feb 4, 2013 21:58

Emmideer: Oct 20, 2011; Lovely night, no?; Grimey Drawer

So what I'm getting from this is don't install any mods until I've played vanilla a lot?

# ? Feb 4, 2013 22:17

Rudi Starnberg: Jul 8, 2012

It's probably best to get some sort of clue what you are doing in vanilla, yes.

# ? Feb 4, 2013 22:32

telcontar: Dec 8, 2006

Graham Gremlin posted:

I just can't think of a way to model a bunch of Germanic tribes wandering around the map in a way that's easily presented to the player and actually enjoyable to play.

It's not as if they galloped around Europe in random chaos. They occupied large contiguous territories for decades or even generations at a stretch, and they migrated in large groups. I mean it took the Vandals, what, 30 years just to go from Gaul to North Africa? And it took them literally hundreds of years before that to migrate from the Vistula to the Roman border.

# ? Feb 4, 2013 22:38

Fintilgin: Sep 29, 2004; Fintilgin sweeps!

Graham Gremlin posted:

I just can't think of a way to model a bunch of Germanic tribes wandering around the map in a way that's easily presented to the player and actually enjoyable to play.

I was thinking they spawn like the Mongols, as provinceless armies, and then they march around the map raiding provinces for something like Glory and Gold. They could have a different icon from just a soldier, like a little horde or people. They'd basically be migratory pop units. Once they get a certain amount of Gold and Glory they could seize adjacent provinces and become a 'settled' people. Maybe each migratory army unit/horde could seize one province, so the more of them that were killed off while migrating the less land they'd ultimately seize, whereas the more successful they were the more land.

Settled people could still get uprooted and become migrant again, but if you were settled long enough, you'd become 'civilized' like the Byzantines and stuck in place for good.

# ? Feb 4, 2013 22:41

Antinumeric: Nov 27, 2010; BoxGiraffe

Graham Gremlin posted:

I just can't think of a way to model a bunch of Germanic tribes wandering around the map in a way that's easily presented to the player and actually enjoyable to play.

Have tribes have heavily limited populations, that grow veeery slowly. Have the amount of land you can control tied to your population. As you get harassed from one direction it makes sense to move away from it, abandoning old territory and settling new.

edit: losing battles lowers you population.

# ? Feb 4, 2013 22:59

YF-23: Feb 17, 2011; My god, it's full of cat!

NihilCredo posted:

I also heard good things about Terra Nova, and it's updated for 5.2 beta (though that will be the last version apparently) but I haven't tried it myself. I'd suggest you check that out.

Oh my, Terra Nova. I can never unbound that name from this gem of a thread on the paradox forums.

Basically the guy who made that mod actually believes that dragons were literally true existing beings and that dinosaurs survived to recent times (think Nessie). He thought it best, of course, to add these in the mod. His justification to sceptics? Even if the creatures did not exist, people thought they did, so they might as well have! Now that is a logic I could maybe get behind to a degree, but then you have things like going on a dragon hunt which gives army tradition, and stuff like that:

quote:

basicly, right now in 12.98, there is a very rare chance of sea monster encounter events for sea going nations.

behemoth events are still rare but are much more common for nations that had historical sightings, encounters or myths of dinosaurs or dragons.

once a nation gets a behemoth encounter/myth event, then they will eventualy get the dragon quest event where they get to decide how the nation will proceed with this information. Natins can try to hunt dinosaurs/dragons, ignore them, worship them, or try to tame them. the 3 choices other than ignore all give permanent bonuses.

regardless of if you feel that living dragons/dnosaurs were true in the time period or just myth, it still plausibly aplies to the game and I will tell you why.

hunting dragons, even if they are not found, will still increase military training, tactics and exercises, thus, military tradition gain is plausible.

worshiping dragons, regardless of if they are real of myth, will still cause the nations religion to adopt them as a icon and perhaps make elaborate costumes and thus the religious culture would be more united.

taming dragons, even if its a myth, could stil raise the nations prestige if they are able to convince other nations that they have captivated dragons.
code:
dragon_tame = {
	prestige = 0.01
	icon = 3
}

dragon_hunt = {
	army_tradition = 0.01
	icon = 7
}

dragon_worship = {
	tolerance_heathen = -1 
	tolerance_heretic = -1
	tolerance_own = 1
	icon = 9
}

He also later thought for some reason that it would be best to split the dragon_worship modifier for christians and non christians giving the latter a halved effect, producing gems like dragon_worshipchristian. :psyboom:

# ? Feb 4, 2013 23:55

Cowcatcher: Dec 23, 2005; OUR PEOPLE WERE BORN OF THE SKY

telcontar posted:

It's not as if they galloped around Europe in random chaos. They occupied large contiguous territories for decades or even generations at a stretch, and they migrated in large groups. I mean it took the Vandals, what, 30 years just to go from Gaul to North Africa? And it took them literally hundreds of years before that to migrate from the Vistula to the Roman border.

How would you handle breaking up of tribes? Some of the Slavs move south, a bunch of Magyars gets in between them and the rest of the family up north, and a century later they're a separate culture.

E: Bonus points if you rename ones White/Red/Black/etc

Cowcatcher fucked around with this message at 23:59 on Feb 4, 2013

# ? Feb 4, 2013 23:55

A Buttery Pastry: Sep 4, 2011; Delicious and Informative!

YF-23 posted:

Dragons and seamonsters!

Yeah, his thought process is all kinds of special. I can follow the logic of including stuff that people believed in, as beliefs, but then translating them into being real is just. :psyduck:

That said, a DLC that allowed dynamic sea level height and changing provinces to simulate The Biblical Flood part 2: Revenge of God would be a great idea!

# ? Feb 5, 2013 00:14

burnishedfume: Mar 8, 2011; You really are a louse...

A Buttery Pastry posted:

Yeah, his thought process is all kinds of special. I can follow the logic of including stuff that people believed in, as beliefs, but then translating them into being real is just. That said, a DLC that allowed dynamic sea level height and changing provinces to simulate The Biblical Flood part 2: Revenge of God would be a great idea!

To be fair, CK2: God is Pissed would be a hilarious DLC and having biblical floods, 10 plagues of Egypt, people killing thousands of soldiers with a donkey's jawbone, etc. would be loving :black101:

as hell. I mean, granted this guy seems to have some issues but I'll be damned if I see someone say a biblical events DLC wouldn't be a cool idea :colbert:

.

E:

Wait you are also saying it's cool. My bad, disregard :downs:

# ? Feb 5, 2013 00:27

Punished Chuck: Dec 27, 2010

DrProsek posted:

To be fair, CK2: God is Pissed would be a hilarious DLC and having biblical floods, 10 plagues of Egypt, people killing thousands of soldiers with a donkey's jawbone, etc. would be loving as hell. I mean, granted this guy seems to have some issues but I'll be damned if I see someone say a biblical events DLC wouldn't be a cool idea .

E: Wait you are also saying it's cool. My bad, disregard

Yeah, but it would really suck to have your capital occupied in a week because the enemy army marched around its walls seven times on the seventh day.

# ? Feb 5, 2013 00:35

Patter Song: Mar 26, 2010; Hereby it is manifest that during the time men live without a common power to keep them all in awe, they are in that condition which is called war; and such a war as is of every man against every man.; Fun Shoe

Graham Gremlin posted:

If we're making barbarian migration book recommendations, I'd feel remiss if I didn't give a shout out to my old professor Guy Halsall's Barbarian Migrations. He challenges a lot of Heather's ideas and has a more engaging writing style than Heather so it's worth a read if you've read Heather. A little on the pricey side but he is the (self-professed) most significant historian of early medieval Europe under the age of 60 anywhere in the world.

Paradox threads are at their best when they serve as a book club.

# ? Feb 5, 2013 01:00

A Buttery Pastry: Sep 4, 2011; Delicious and Informative!

WeaponGradeSadness posted:

Yeah, but it would really suck to have your capital occupied in a week because the enemy army marched around its walls seven times on the seventh day.

Look, if you don't bother the Ethiopians, the Ethiopians won't bother you. :colbert:

# ? Feb 5, 2013 01:06

Samog: Dec 13, 2006; At least I'm not an 07.

gradenko_2000 posted:

Is there a Paradox chatroom/IRC where I can ask a million small questions about CK2 without spamming this thread?

irc.synirc.net #paradox

# ? Feb 5, 2013 01:30

Hot Dog Day #82: Jul 5, 2003; Soiled Meat

Woops! I am a terrible poster and my phone thought this was the ck2 thread.

To add content, though: thanks for all of the book ideas! I have been looking for more things to read regarding the dark ages, and this thread has been an amazing resource this far

# ? Feb 5, 2013 03:18

NextSundayA.D.: May 13, 2009

~~PM me if you want a EU3 Chronicles code.~~

Taken

NextSundayA.D. fucked around with this message at 08:47 on Feb 5, 2013

# ? Feb 5, 2013 04:54

Jazerus: May 24, 2011

Jon Joe posted:

So what I'm getting from this is don't install any mods until I've played vanilla a lot?

Not really. Miscmods is vanilla but better, though Miscmods Extended is somewhat different. EU3+ is different from EU3 like CK2+ is from CK2 in a lot of ways, as you might expect from Wiz mods, but the changes are pretty extensive and I would not recommend it until you have a thorough understanding of vanilla/Miscmods.

# ? Feb 5, 2013 04:59

Top Hats Monthly: Jun 22, 2011; People are people so why should it be, that you and I should get along so awfully blink blink recall STOP IT YOU POSH LITTLE SHIT

How come the EvW forums are more "ALT. HISTORY TEE HEE" then actual cold war?

# ? Feb 5, 2013 05:46

Bold Robot: Jan 6, 2009; Be brave.

NextSundayA.D. posted:

PM me if you want a EU3 Chronicles code.

~~Same here, I already own it and I've got a code I can give away.~~

A dude got it.

Bold Robot fucked around with this message at 07:58 on Feb 5, 2013

# ? Feb 5, 2013 05:53

Rixaxun: Jan 29, 2009

Bold Robot posted:

Same here, I already own it and I've got a code I can give away.

If you still have this, I'd like it, but don't have PMs. My email is rixaxun AT gmail.com.

# ? Feb 5, 2013 07:10

Bold Robot: Jan 6, 2009; Be brave.

Rixaxun posted:

If you still have this, I'd like it, but don't have PMs. My email is xxg0ku@angelfire.com.

Already gave it away, sorry, should have edited my post more quickly.

Anyone else have one they could give this dude?

# ? Feb 5, 2013 07:59

Kavak: Aug 23, 2009

Rixaxun posted:

If you still have this, I'd like it, but don't have PMs. My email is rixaxun AT gmail.com.

I just sent you mine. Have fun!

# ? Feb 5, 2013 08:39

YF-23: Feb 17, 2011; My god, it's full of cat!

I love how sometimes the pdox forums just screw up. :allears:

# ? Feb 5, 2013 10:38

Serpentis: May 31, 2011; Well, if I really HAVE to shoot you in the bollocks to shut you up, then I guess I'll need to, post-haste, for everyone else's sake.

^^^ I'm getting library wallpaper flashbacks, this time, with all the books' spines being covered in Pdox logos.

# ? Feb 5, 2013 10:43

A Buttery Pastry: Sep 4, 2011; Delicious and Informative!

YF-23 posted:

I love how sometimes the pdox forums just screw up.

Maybe this is just Universo Virtual taking over the Paradox forums? Paradox did after all hand over their rights to them.

# ? Feb 5, 2013 12:02

Rudi Starnberg: Jul 8, 2012

Cowcatcher posted:

How would you handle breaking up of tribes? Some of the Slavs move south, a bunch of Magyars gets in between them and the rest of the family up north, and a century later they're a separate culture.

E: Bonus points if you rename ones White/Red/Black/etc

You could make it so you need directly continous territory to maintain your vassals. If someone splits your land in half then one chuck will be broken off and form its own new nation/culture.

# ? Feb 5, 2013 13:11

Stravinsky: May 31, 2011

Rudi Starnberg posted:

You could make it so you need directly continous territory to maintain your vassals. If someone splits your land in half then one chuck will be broken off and form its own new nation/culture.

That makes zero sense at all and would not represent how migrating people split and formed together.

# ? Feb 5, 2013 16:59

Star: Jul 15, 2005; Guerilla war struggle is a new entertainment.; Fallen Rib

Recently finished my first playthrough of Vic 2:AHD and it's a lot better than what I remembered. Played as Austria and got some real good Great Wars going, especially the last one when me and France, along with my puppets, took on Spain and Russia. The highlight was the everlasting battle between 1.1k russian brigades versus 800 austrians. It kept on going for years until I finally brokered a peace deal with Spain, forcing them to disarm and destroy half of their fleet worth 4000 military points. I can' wait for Heart of Darkness so I can try to be a colonial empire this time around.

# ? Feb 5, 2013 17:20

Nine of Eight: Apr 28, 2011; LICK IT OFF, AND PUT IT BACK IN; Dinosaur Gum

Kavak posted:

Define "ALT. HISTORY TEE HEE". Are we talking Byzantium fetishism and Tito apologists or just people eager to try and fight the Cold War in a different way?

Well, I know for a fact that an acquaintance of mine is helping to write an overly detailed "Nazis won WWII" scenario...

# ? Feb 5, 2013 17:22

Pingui: Jun 4, 2006; WTF?

Any codes left? - I used to play EU2 quite a bit, and would love to try out EU3.

Edit: That was fast, thanks Star!

Pingui fucked around with this message at 17:30 on Feb 5, 2013

# ? Feb 5, 2013 17:25

Star: Jul 15, 2005; Guerilla war struggle is a new entertainment.; Fallen Rib

Pingui posted:

Any codes left? - I used to play EU2 quite a bit, and would love to try out EU3.

Check your PMs

# ? Feb 5, 2013 17:29

mrpwase: Apr 21, 2010; I HAVE GREAT AVATAR IDEAS
For the Many, Not the Few

Bought CKII and Vicky II from the Amazon link someone posted earlier, does anyone have a spare EU3 code? I need to be able to complete my Catalunyan megacampaign :byodood:

# ? Feb 5, 2013 18:38

Raenir Salazar: Nov 5, 2010; College Slice

Kavak posted:

Define "ALT. HISTORY TEE HEE". Are we talking Byzantium fetishism and Tito apologists or just people eager to try and fight the Cold War in a different way?

Yeah I would rather have the alt-hist "If Sino-Soviet split never happened..." discussions than the sort of wet eyed nostalgic navel gazing I've seen racist embittered old cold war warriors engage in like...

"Aw man, did you see all the ways using these slide rules and protractors I've calculating how many Chinese would die if we went nuclear on them? *sniffles*" :qq:

Choose your poison wisely; our cold war history thread in TFR seems pretty cool though, none of the same vibes.

# ? Feb 5, 2013 19:14

Cowcatcher: Dec 23, 2005; OUR PEOPLE WERE BORN OF THE SKY

Raenir Salazar posted:

our cold war history thread in TFR seems pretty cool though

How's the zombie apocalypse thread?

# ? Feb 5, 2013 19:25

Rixaxun: Jan 29, 2009

Golden_Zucchini posted:

I just sent you mine. Have fun!

This doesn't seem to have shown up, could you try resending it please?

edit: Got it this time, thanks a lot.

Rixaxun fucked around with this message at 22:01 on Feb 5, 2013

# ? Feb 5, 2013 21:27

Kavak: Aug 23, 2009

Nine of Eight posted:

Well, I know for a fact that an acquaintance of mine is helping to write an overly detailed "Nazis won WWII" scenario...

Sounds bog standard for alt history stuff. What kind of details are we talking about, though?

# ? Feb 5, 2013 21:33

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# ? May 29, 2024 23:04

Riso: Oct 11, 2008; by merry exmarx

The Fatherland one by chance?

# ? Feb 5, 2013 22:01

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