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Demiurge4 posted:I was a bit confused about the scene when Magnus busts into the Emperor's Throneroom and their minds meet, wouldn't the Emperor see the truth of it? Was the message not relayed properly or did the Emperor interpret it as a lie? It doesnt matter what the message was when Magnus uses psychic power to break through the incredibly warded room that the Emperor was doing, destroying the wards in the process and causing the Emperor's painstaking webway work to be completely ruined.
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Apr 30, 2013 23:41
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Demiurge4 posted:I was a bit confused about the scene when Magnus busts into the Emperor's Throneroom and their minds meet, wouldn't the Emperor see the truth of it? Was the message not relayed properly or did the Emperor interpret it as a lie? I think the Emperor simply didn't want to know or believe what Magnus told him but then you have stuff like the Outcast Dead where Cream_Filling posted:My memory of the fluff is a little confused now, but wasn't it also that the Emperor sends Russ and his wolves to arrest Magnus and bring him back to Terra, but instead Horus or some other person messes with the message to make it "arrest with extreme prejudice"? I think it depends on what you're reading? In the latest version of the fluff I think it's the Emperor sending Russ to bring Magnus in but Russ, with Horus' urging, deciding to end the problem once and for all.
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Apr 30, 2013 23:50
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Cream_Filling posted:My memory of the fluff is a little confused now, but wasn't it also that the Emperor sends Russ and his wolves to arrest Magnus and bring him back to Terra, but instead Horus or some other person messes with the message to make it "arrest with extreme prejudice"? You are right. Horus played on the fact that the Space Wolves hate magic, and aren't the Thousand Sons full of that. I forget which book it is, but Horus delights in telling someone that. Forget who. And as to the whole Magnus breaking into the Emperor's throne room area... Thing... I thought the message itself was ruined by the Emperor losing his life's work, and by Magnus realizing what he has done. And correct me if I am wrong, but I took it that now the Emperor is stuck on the Golden throne, with the barriers gone, in order to stop the warp from bleeding into Terra. So, I guess I can see why Magnus never tried to apologize or anything. I'd be pissed too if I was God-Emperor of man.
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May 1, 2013 00:04
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Impaired Casing posted:You are right. Horus played on the fact that the Space Wolves hate magic, and aren't the Thousand Sons full of that. I forget which book it is, but Horus delights in telling someone that. Forget who. Not entirely true, I think. According to the Sigilite, the big E is fighting back the warp, but he's not doing it on the golden throne. He's doing it in the warp, because that's how the emperor rolls: fist to fist with Khorne, mind to mind with Tzeentch, dick to dick with Slaneesh, and weird oozing pus to weird oozing pus with Nurgle. He could hold back the web way breach with a bunch of Geller fields, anyway, I think.
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May 1, 2013 00:12
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Impaired Casing posted:You are right. Horus played on the fact that the Space Wolves hate magic, and aren't the Thousand Sons full of that. I forget which book it is, but Horus delights in telling someone that. Forget who. That and also because the amount of power it took for Magnus to kool-aid man the webway project is enormous, possibly more than Magnus could have done himself without "outside" help. So now the Emperor's not sure whether Magnus is right and is telling the truth, whether he's telling the truth but has been tricked by the warp gods, or whether he's lying and is utterly corrupted.
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May 1, 2013 00:29
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VanSandman posted:'When Magnus tried to warn the Big E' is one of those continuity snarls that the authors never seemed to get quite right.... It's obnoxious, sure, but try not to worry too much about it. What are the audiobooks like? Is it just someone reading the story normally, or are there like a ton of sound effects and weird voices for all the characters?
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May 1, 2013 10:35
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Elrond Hubbard posted:What are the audiobooks like? Is it just someone reading the story normally, or are there like a ton of sound effects and weird voices for all the characters? The audiobooks are just some guy narrating the story. They do voices, to an extent, but I find they rarely sound like Space Marines should sound (at least in my head.) "Oh, he's a Veteran? OK, let's make him sound like a 93 year old English butler!" I don't know if they've improved on this, since I haven't listened to an audiobook since the originals were released. The audiodramas have the music, background sounds, etc. If you've ever heard an old radio drama, this is what the audiodramas are like. Again, some weird decisions on voices.
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May 1, 2013 15:51
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I never got the 93 year old English butler, honestly. I like them but they aren't for everyone.
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May 1, 2013 15:55
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Elrond Hubbard posted:What are the audiobooks like? Is it just someone reading the story normally, or are there like a ton of sound effects and weird voices for all the characters? Dreadful ham acting without the good grace to be entertaining, and stupid pew pew noises.
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May 1, 2013 15:57
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Man, why couldn't they get the voice actors from the Dawn of War series to do the audiodramas? I'd throw down the extra  for that.
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May 1, 2013 19:13
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joneswt posted:Man, why couldn't they get the voice actors from the Dawn of War series to do the audiodramas? I'd throw down the extra https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WeCfod1XT7E
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May 1, 2013 19:46
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I want to see that guy's version of a wet leopard growl.
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May 1, 2013 21:12
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Elrond Hubbard posted:What are the audiobooks like? Is it just someone reading the story normally, or are there like a ton of sound effects and weird voices for all the characters? It depends. The short stories usually have a ton of sound effects. The Butcher's Nails is really bad in that regard, especially with the space-combat parts. It has so much sci-fi pew-pew and whooshing it's almost like a 1950s B-movie. On the other hand, the Betrayer audiobook has none of that junk and is really good, especially since it has a single narrator who still nails very unique tones and styles for all the characters. His impressions of Lorgar, Lotara and Horus are all great, and the voices of the Mechanicus guys make me smile in the good way.
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May 3, 2013 15:44
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As an aside, I heard that the latest audio dramas sound more professional - I don't know what this means, but maybe the sound effects are scaled back.
berzerkmonkey fucked around with this message at 15:58 on May 3, 2013 |
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May 3, 2013 15:56
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I know it's something that varies between authors, but I don't like it when games or other media give lasguns pew-pew noises. I prefer the Abnett style where they make crack noises, more a normal gun. Save the pew-pew for the Eldar or something.
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May 3, 2013 15:59
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I just finished Betrayer, and it was really good, wow. There's something to be said for ADB's storytelling but I wish it had gone more into the Emperor's reasons, I'm going to assume that the Emperor didn't attempt to remove Angron's implant because his sense of justice would prevent him from serving the Empire, which he views as unjust.
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May 4, 2013 21:32
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How come nobody ever writes about the White Scars? I don't think the Khan has even appeared in the Horus Heresy series.
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May 4, 2013 21:54
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VanSandman posted:How come nobody ever writes about the White Scars? I don't think the Khan has even appeared in the Horus Heresy series. I wish they did! As well as Dark Angels stuff that doesn't suck. They did come out with one of those limited prints about the Scars but I never threw down the money for it.
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May 4, 2013 22:06
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Polpoto posted:I wish they did! As well as Dark Angels stuff that doesn't suck. They did come out with one of those limited prints about the Scars but I never threw down the money for it. I liked the first Dark Angels book. It was cool to have a bit of fantasy/knights and poo poo in the middle of my sci-fi madness. The second one was pretty weak, though.
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May 4, 2013 22:15
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VanSandman posted:I liked the first Dark Angels book. It was cool to have a bit of fantasy/knights and poo poo in the middle of my sci-fi madness. The second one was pretty weak, though. I thought ends of the book was really weak. You follow a boy who becomes a knight and then a space marine. You learn very little about the Primarch and even less about the supposed plot against the Emperor. The book was entirely pointless in the context of the Horus Heresy, if it had been a standalone I probably would have liked it more.
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May 4, 2013 22:20
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Demiurge4 posted:I thought ends of the book was really weak. You follow a boy who becomes a knight and then a space marine. You learn very little about the Primarch and even less about the supposed plot against the Emperor. The book was entirely pointless in the context of the Horus Heresy, if it had been a standalone I probably would have liked it more. Hey, at least one of them gets beheaded by the Lion throwing a tantrum in some later short story, if I remember right. It's actually kind of funny how casually and anticlimactically they off this character that's a major character from multiple books. He gets like 3 sentences total in the whole thing. Though I might just be confusing this because I never got a sense for a single character in those books and all the generic biblical names just sort of blend together.
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May 4, 2013 22:28
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Demiurge4 posted:I thought ends of the book was really weak. You follow a boy who becomes a knight and then a space marine. You learn very little about the Primarch and even less about the supposed plot against the Emperor. The book was entirely pointless in the context of the Horus Heresy, if it had been a standalone I probably would have liked it more. The end was my favourite bit from a lore angle, you get to experience the way the Imperium crushes the native culture of planets from the native viewpoint and it sets up the 'traitor' Dark Angels as being more interesting than just chaos worshippers and more seperatists.
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May 4, 2013 23:52
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Demiurge4 posted:I thought ends of the book was really weak. You follow a boy who becomes a knight and then a space marine. You learn very little about the Primarch and even less about the supposed plot against the Emperor. The book was entirely pointless in the context of the Horus Heresy, if it had been a standalone I probably would have liked it more. Honestly it's standalone quality was one of those things I liked about it. I wish we'd got a book, novella, whatever, that gave us a look at what each chapter looked like pre-Heresy, especially Primarch stuff before the big E found them.
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May 5, 2013 02:17
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Demiurge4 posted:I just finished Betrayer, and it was really good, wow. There's something to be said for ADB's storytelling but I wish it had gone more into the Emperor's reasons, I'm going to assume that the Emperor didn't attempt to remove Angron's implant because his sense of justice would prevent him from serving the Empire, which he views as unjust. ADB's next Horus Heresy book (which he will be starting soon, he is in the last stages of the Talon of Horus) is The Master of Mankind, and he has confirmed that the title is not tricky or misleading, it is a book focused on the Emperor, his character, and his motivations. Given that ADB has set up a lot of "the Emperor is a lot more complicated than you think" storylines in his novels and short stories, I think it is a very safe bet that he knows what he is going to do with the book along those lines.
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May 5, 2013 16:32
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VanSandman posted:How come nobody ever writes about the White Scars? I don't think the Khan has even appeared in the Horus Heresy series. From what's been said on Warseer and a couple of other places, Chris Wraight is doing a HH novel about the Scars and the Wolves and their fight in space against the Alpha Legion. I think he's mentioned it on his blog as well.
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May 5, 2013 16:32
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Fried Chicken posted:ADB's next Horus Heresy book (which he will be starting soon, he is in the last stages of the Talon of Horus) is The Master of Mankind, and he has confirmed that the title is not tricky or misleading, it is a book focused on the Emperor, his character, and his motivations. It's going to be interesting to see if he plays off of The Outcast Dead where it's heavily implied that the Emperor knows what's going to happen during the Heresy, including his death. It might really provide a new angle on the development of the Imperium since the Heresy, if all is going as the Emperor set it up to go.
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May 5, 2013 18:18
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Based on his various blog posts, I trust ADB to not ruin things by actually giving out any real, unambiguous answers. Also, The Outcast Dead is a bad book and I hope nothing from it survives.
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May 5, 2013 18:29
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Pyrolocutus posted:It might really provide a new angle on the development of the Imperium since the Heresy, if all is going as the Emperor set it up to go. This would be awesome because it's either one more nail in the coffin of the Emperor being someone who should have been trusted with humanity's destiny, at all, ever OR The Emperor is literally Hari Seldon. The first one makes the setting incrementally "better," the second one makes the setting much more awesome, especially if ADB has the trollish self-awareness about the setting that he sometimes seems to.
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May 5, 2013 18:30
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It's already been said that the Emperor has a pretty strong degree of prescience, but that around the time of the Heresy, his foresight has become inexplicably clouded. This may also be one of the reasons he goes back to Earth - to either hunker down or else try and figure things out.
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May 5, 2013 18:55
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Pyrolocutus posted:It's going to be interesting to see if he plays off of The Outcast Dead where it's heavily implied that the Emperor knows what's going to happen during the Heresy, including his death. It might really provide a new angle on the development of the Imperium since the Heresy, if all is going as the Emperor set it up to go. My personal guess is that he won't. ADB is big on the "individual sandbox" take on 40K lore quote:Part of 40K’s appeal is the inconsistency. The IP folks have explained to me oh-so many times that 40K writing is about every author having their own sandbox, their own sectioned-off corner of the setting, to do with as they please and show their perceptions. It’s not Star Wars, with that same aggressive continuity shrinking the galaxy word by word, annihilating all mystery. Which is why when there’s something like Kharn getting the same voice actor in an HH audio drama and a 40K audio drama, I just don’t really care. My Lorgar isn’t Anthony Reynolds’s Lorgar. My Fabius Bile won’t be Jim Swallow’s Fabius Bile. My Logan Grimnar isn’t Bill King’s Logan Grimnar. And so on. I’m not bound by what they’ve done before, and they’re not bound by what I’ve done. He mentions in there that continuity is a lot more stringent in HH, but there is a big gulf between everyone having the same events and everyone having the same take on the characters. And frankly, I think that has worked out pretty well so far. It means I can ignore things like Battle for the Abyss and the idea that 500,000 soldiers are a threat to a galaxy wide empire, and instead get down with the character driven arcs of Abnett and ADB's stuff and the civil war involving billions of troops from single worlds where individuals don't matter and die often and such. And people who want event driven arcslike Wrath of Iron and have a core group of a few hundred named people drive every event in the galaxy because they are so exceptional, they can enjoy that. And we can all be happy. Incidentally, if you don't follow ADB on twitter and read his blog, you are missing out. He is really good about fan interaction, but is a complete professional (unlike some other authors I could name). He's also upfront about the business side of things, which is refreshingly direct. http://aarondembskibowden.wordpress.com/2012/12/05/hydras-and-wolves/ <- good article about his general take on writing sides and balancing events and action. I'm still trying to guess which is his least favorite chapter. I'm guessing Dark Angels. http://aarondembskibowden.wordpress.com/2012/05/08/my-dream-40k-series/ <- what it says on the tin. He's joking about a bunch of that, but the chunk up until the "antagonist" line could be a single (very thick) novel and I'd read the hell out of it.
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May 5, 2013 19:31
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Fried Chicken posted:http://aarondembskibowden.wordpress.com/2012/12/05/hydras-and-wolves/ <- good article about his general take on writing sides and balancing events and action. I'm still trying to guess which is his least favorite chapter. I'm guessing Dark Angels. The way Lorgar calls out Magnus makes me think it's Thousand Sons, but I'm biased. Could just as easily be the completely ignored White Scars.
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May 5, 2013 21:58
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Everyone ignores the White Scars because they're not European enough and there isn't the same kind of general pop cultural awareness for space-Mongols as there is space-Arthur, space-Rome, or space-vikings (and even the artists often say gently caress it and just draw them as white guys anyway). For example, I remember reading some short story where the guy just gives up and gives the White Scars all fake japanese names, which annoyed me.
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May 5, 2013 22:06
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Cream_Filling posted:Everyone ignores the White Scars because they're not European enough and there isn't the same kind of general pop cultural awareness for space-Mongols as there is space-Arthur, space-Rome, or space-vikings (and even the artists often say gently caress it and just draw them as white guys anyway). For example, I remember reading some short story where the guy just gives up and gives the White Scars all fake japanese names, which annoyed me. There's plenty of love for the Salamanders, who are basically charcoal skinned dudes with red eyes.
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May 5, 2013 22:43
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Arbite posted:The way Lorgar calls out Magnus makes me think it's Thousand Sons, but I'm biased. Could just as easily be the completely ignored White Scars. It can't be the White Scars precisely because they're ignored. Similar situation for the Salamanders and Raven Guard. I'd say Thousand Sons aren't it either because of how much Magnus is brought up in his stories. Though I want to say Emperor's Children.
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May 5, 2013 22:45
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People ignore the White Scars because they are a second rate Space Wolf mimic and their signature unit style is stolen from the Dark Angels. They have a good colour scheme, but it's really hard to paint well and lacks some of the more interesting unit marking details. Those things explain perfectly why they are unpopular. Also, they are perfectly fine being 'white' as they are space marines and canonically do not have a fixed skin tone.
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May 5, 2013 22:45
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Rapey Joe Stalin posted:People ignore the White Scars because they are a second rate Space Wolf mimic and their signature unit style is stolen from the Dark Angels. They have a good colour scheme, but it's really hard to paint well and lacks some of the more interesting unit marking details. Those things explain perfectly why they are unpopular. People thought Ultramarines were the most boring marines until Abnett did them a turn and made them interesting. And even before, most people, especially wargamers, are at least peripherally aware of ancient Rome so they had a general handle for their theme. There is a ton of cool history nerd stuff you could do with a space-version of the historical Mongol Empire or similar groups, but it just hasn't been done yet, and the general pop-cultural awareness of the Mongols (horses, arrows, killed a lot of people, fur hats, and that's about it) is far smaller compared to ancient greece, rome, etc., especially when you take into account the fantasy genre as a whole. When you say "space-vikings," there just a lot more existing knowledge base for the average American / British person to latch onto, given both their historical connections and also because the fantasy genre was heavily, heavily influenced by Norse mythology and epics, etc. Also, skin-tone is distinct from physiognomy. Demiurge4 posted:There's plenty of love for the Salamanders, who are basically charcoal skinned dudes with red eyes. People like them because, values-wise, they're the closest to modern western sensibilities by actually caring about individual and valuing self-reliance and individuality. And also because twin-linked meltaguns. The salamander novels are all pretty bad, of course, but culturally speaking they usually vaguely reference indo-european paganism (fire cults) more than they do other cultural influences beyond a few Africanish names. OXBALLS DOT COM fucked around with this message at 23:19 on May 5, 2013 |
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May 5, 2013 23:10
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Demiurge4 posted:There's plenty of love for the Salamanders, who are basically charcoal skinned dudes with red eyes. I think it's more because the Salamanders are one of the least dickish armies. Which gives them some character unlike the White Scars.
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May 5, 2013 23:11
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JerryLee posted:especially if ADB has the trollish self-awareness about the setting that he sometimes seems to. Cream_Filling posted:People like them because, values-wise, they're the closest to modern western sensibilities by actually caring about individual and valuing self-reliance and individuality. And also because twin-linked meltaguns. The salamander novels are all pretty bad, of course, but culturally speaking they usually vaguely reference indo-european paganism (fire cults) more than they do other cultural influences beyond a few Africanish names.
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May 6, 2013 03:45
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Cream_Filling posted:People thought Ultramarines were the most boring marines until Abnett did them a turn and made them interesting. Unique and beautiful snowflakes thought they were boring. They have been consistently the most popular chapter since at least late second edition. Also, marines are described as having their own weird physiognomy from the enlarged bone structures. Lovely Joe Stalin fucked around with this message at 04:15 on May 6, 2013 |
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May 6, 2013 04:09
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"Equine" features, wasn't it? Thankfully not to the extent of Heldane: 
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May 6, 2013 04:17
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