|
Are you getting the Wii U? This poll is closed. |
|||
|---|---|---|---|
| Yes |
|
9031 | 65.25% |
| No |
|
1191 | 8.60% |
| Maybe |
|
808 | 5.84% |
| I'm an idiot |
|
460 | 3.32% |
| Waluigi |
|
1603 | 11.58% |
| Waa |
|
748 | 5.40% |
| Total: | 13841 votes | ||
|
Quest For Glory II posted:You know in most industries, promoting someone's product is a paid service. I mean I'm just saying. In no other circumstance can someone say "you can promote our product on your (X), but ONLY if we get all the money" and not get laughed out of the building. In most industries, using footage of somebody's product can also be bad if you have no permission/sponsorship, which is why you get fake off-brand props that look vaguely similar to Coke unless Coke has paid you; and if Coke pays you, you hold the can of Coke with the label facing the camera for the length of a shot. It's also why you sometimes see white/silver laptop computers in various media with different fruit on them instead of an actual apple.
|
#
?
May 16, 2013 02:38
|
|
|
|
| # ? May 31, 2024 01:16 |
|
|
Chronojam posted:In most industries, using footage of somebody's product can also be bad if you have no permission/sponsorship, which is why you get fake off-brand props that look vaguely similar to Coke unless Coke has paid you; and if Coke pays you, you hold the can of Coke with the label facing the camera for the length of a shot. It's also why you sometimes see white/silver laptop computers in various media with different fruit on them instead of an actual apple. It doesn't really matter to me if someone thinks LPers are sad nerds in basements, there is a legit correlation between the promotion that those channels provide and actual games sold, Steam Greenlight stats have shown it, and that service has a value. Nintendo or any copyright holder in general shouldn't get to have their cake and eat it too. They won't, either, because those channels will stop covering Nintendo products, which results in less awareness for a company that right now is extremely lacking in awareness and visibility right now.
|
|
#
?
May 16, 2013 02:43
|
|
|
Whether Nintendo is justified in their actions or not, I can't see how it's prudent to risk pissing off and alienating some of your most hardcore fans. I don't know how much influence these bigwig LPers actually wield, but word of mouth can be a pretty powerful force in this industry.
|
|
#
?
May 16, 2013 02:44
|
|
|
Almost Smart posted:Whether Nintendo is justified in their actions or not, I can't see how it's prudent to risk pissing off and alienating some of your most hardcore fans. I don't know how much influence these bigwig LPers actually wield, but word of mouth can be a pretty powerful force in this industry. I really can't think of a good reason other than "Oh poo poo Wii-U isn't selling like hot cakes better nickel and dime everything" or they're making some exclusive new channel for the Wii-U where people will record their LPs of Nintendo games just for other Nintendo owners. I mean they have the Youtube channel up there on the Wii Menu why would they take the LPs off Youtube.
|
|
#
?
May 16, 2013 02:54
|
|
|
Maybe they're preparing for a miiverse update with the ability to record gameplay/commentary. Probably not.
|
|
#
?
May 16, 2013 03:01
|
|
|
One thing I'll say this is hurting is that right now the content-ID system can't differentiate between videos extending beyond a certain length and press related content so some channels like GameXplain and The Bit Block have certain large scale videos affected at this moment. Those are the kind of examples I hope get straightened out. Even then, the videos affected are ones for games that have both come out recently and are the mainstream Mario titles like Luigi's Mansion and NSMBU. The kind of games that a lot of LPers rush home from the Gamestop the day it comes out and slam jams the disk into the system so they're the FIRST ONES to get footage of the game on YouTube.
|
|
#
?
May 16, 2013 04:31
|
|
|
Viewtiful Jew posted:The kind of games that a lot of LPers rush home from the Gamestop the day it comes out and slam jams the disk into the system so they're the FIRST ONES to get footage of the game on YouTube. What ever happened to just ya know, playing a game?
|
|
#
?
May 16, 2013 04:35
|
|
|
Gutcruncher posted:What ever happened to just ya know, playing a game? Egos.
|
|
#
?
May 16, 2013 04:42
|
|
|
Gutcruncher posted:What ever happened to just ya know, playing a game? It's all Slowbeef's fault clearly.  Kidding aside, Internet superstardom is a very attractive thing for people without a job or life, so if you can play videogames AND have thousands of people kissing your rear end at the same time, you're set for life.
|
|
#
?
May 16, 2013 04:50
|
|
|
TaurusOxford posted:It's all Slowbeef's fault clearly. Slowbeef's actually been spending the better part of the night trying to tell people who use the most amazing analogies how he feels: Slowbeef posted:But it is their cake! Why is no one understanding this! You're talking over CAKE THEY MADE AND BAKED!!!!
|
|
#
?
May 16, 2013 04:54
|
|
|
Kilometers Davis posted:Egos. I can't wait until someone decides to nominate one of them for a Grammy or something. Then you'll have arguments like WHO IS THE MOST GAME?! to determine which person gives the better LP's and is the hardest of hardcore gamers which will probably lead to bloodshed. Eventually future generations will still light a candle every night and think that Billy Tupac-man Shakura Taisen didn't die in that shootout, he just went into hiding. He's would still be out there giving stealth LP's under new alias and they'll point to references saying he couldn't be dead if he's holding the new limited edition flavor of Mt.Dew in one of his supposed pre-death videos.
|
|
#
?
May 16, 2013 04:57
|
|
|
Quest For Glory II posted:You know in most industries, promoting someone's product is a paid service. I mean I'm just saying. In no other circumstance can someone say "you can promote our product on your (X), but ONLY if we get all the money" and not get laughed out of the building. At Nintendo HQ, a promoter starts his presentation. "Now, I know this new Super Mario game is going to be great, but your audience needs the full experience. As part of this ad campaign, we're going to record one of our interns playing the game start to finish. People will get to see all of the content without ever touching the game, it's a new wave of advertising!" The promoter is quickly escorted out of the building. Jeff the intern is sitting in a running car in the parking lot. Jeff: "How'd the presentation go?" Promoter: "gently caress those entitled assholes. We're taking our show to YouTube."
|
|
#
?
May 16, 2013 05:17
|
|
|
I could see it argued than an LP can promote a niche title that few people are familiar with. There is no way that LPs do a drat thing to promote a game like, say, NSMBU; on the contrary, pre-existing interest in these titles is what drives traffic to these videos. With heavy hitter new releases or super popular classics, LPers are riding the games' hype to promote themselves.
|
|
#
?
May 16, 2013 05:34
|
|
|
I've reached 100% on Lego City Undercover for some reason. I think I got more value out of that game in terms of hours of game play than any game I've bought since GTA IV. Loz Doyle from TT Fusion did say they built in support for DLC quote:Are there any plans for expansions, such as DLC packs?
|
|
#
?
May 16, 2013 05:37
|
|
|
Supercar Gautier posted:I could see it argued than an LP can promote a niche title that few people are familiar with.
|
|
#
?
May 16, 2013 05:39
|
|
|
Console slump or not, I think if you're LP'ing a game whose sales are approaching 2 million, the game is drawing people to you and not the other way around. You can swap out other examples, including non-Nintendo titles, and the point doesn't change.
|
|
#
?
May 16, 2013 05:44
|
|
|
Gendo posted:I've reached 100% on Lego City Undercover for some reason. I think I got more value out of that game in terms of hours of game play than any game I've bought since GTA IV. How close were you to that 60 hour estimate? I just got done with finals so I have a bunch of free time for the next few weeks and I need a game I can just kick back have some mindless fun with, and Lego City sounds like it fits the bill. I always end up getting 100% in Lego games though, and 60 hours is just about double what each of the other ones took me.
|
|
#
?
May 16, 2013 05:56
|
|
|
Supercar Gautier posted:Console slump or not, I think if you're LP'ing a game whose sales are approaching 2 million, the game is drawing people to you and not the other way around. All I know is, as a Youtube Partner (who doesn't do anything game-related), I'm really grossed out at the flagrant misuse and abuse of the Content ID system and this is no exception. Youtube's policy already is against use of game footage without commentary at a baseline level, so all gameplay footage that passes Youtube TOS qualifies as fair use and the videos that don't have commentary are not supposed to be on Youtube in the first place and should be reported. Content ID is all too often used to blanket-strike the entire network and ends up impacting people who didn't in any way infringe copyright or damage a company financially, or may even have had permission in the first place and have now just had their permission basically stomped on. There's no benefit to Nintendo doing this because it results in fewer videos posted which means less visibility which means less awareness; that's at minimum, excluding the conversation rate that channels like TotalBiscuit have at turning viewers into buyers. You don't even have to agree with me on my points above to agree with me on this. Wii U right now might as well be INVISIBLE, based on how things are right now. I don't see how any strategy that involves chasing promotion away helps them.
|
|
#
?
May 16, 2013 06:01
|
|
|
Quest For Glory II posted:Content ID is all too often used to blanket-strike the entire network and ends up impacting people who didn't in any way infringe copyright or damage a company financially Please tell us more about how companies should allow all of their game content to be displayed (without permission) without them seeing a single cent.  Also: quote:...excluding the conversation rate that channels like TotalBiscuit have at turning viewers into buyers. You got a source on that?
|
|
#
?
May 16, 2013 06:48
|
|
|
I don't know how you'd begin to quantify that, but it seems like forward thinking companies like having their stuff out there. It reminds me of the sports leagues and their attitudes towards content. The MLB and their stodgy, incestuous leadership have a directive in place to issue DCMA take down requests for the smallest clip (and even debated taking action on animated gifs). The NBA, who get new media, don't care if you post complete games on Youtube.
|
|
#
?
May 16, 2013 06:56
|
|
|
What I think sucks is there's apparently no "let's split it 50/50" option. Sure, LPers who get income from it are nerds, but an LP is a decent amount of work, often costly equipment-wise, and adds value to game footage. On the other hand, they're showing footage of a copyrighted game. It's sad then that it seems Content ID is just a big sledgehammer, and there's no differentiation between uploading game soundtracks (which should 100% go to the copyright owner) and let's plays/speedruns (which should be split).
|
|
#
?
May 16, 2013 07:01
|
|
|
Dieting Hippo posted:Please tell us more about how companies should allow all of their game content to be displayed (without permission) without them seeing a single cent. Now, you would say, "But these LPers play games to their entirety", and it does happen, and that goes against what fair use is about, which is why the top LP guys get hit up by aggregators like Machinima and TGS who have the proper permissions so they can do longplays legally where they can play the entire game. But again, my contention is with the Content ID system that usually ends up flagging EVERYONE including people who do not longplay entire games and are within their rights to monetize their content. If Nintendo wants to go after people that play their entire game without any commentary without permission, whatever; I disagree with doing it, but it's their call. But flagging everyone with Content ID is just terrible. And Content ID.. it's a poo poo scraper. There are people whose home videos of birds chirping have been flagged as Content ID violations and had their audio muted or the video taken down. Bystanders get sideswiped. It's been used to claim material that companies don't even own. And violating Partners can lose their Partner features, like channel-wide monetization, videos longer than 15 minutes, certain channel customization, and other essentials. quote:You got a source on that? I wouldn't even know where to get analytical breakdowns of game sales by demographic, region, and referrals. The 7th Guest fucked around with this message at 07:15 on May 16, 2013 |
|
#
?
May 16, 2013 07:05
|
|
|
Quest For Glory II posted:I don't know if there's any concentrated articles on it. There is some definite hard data but not with console games (because how would anyone get analytics from the sales of those?) but in the PC world, TotalBiscuit's generated a lot of business for developers. There are Kickstarters that literally went from nothing to funded because of a WTF Is video, and Steam Greenlight projects that got the votes they needed. There's definitely analytical data there and some of it's been shared in the Greenlight thread and you can also look at Kicktraq on those Kickstarters that TotalBiscuit has helped and see the huge spike. I can understand why you're upset then, Nintendo is a pretty indie company. They should be happy that people are spreading the word about niche titles they never would have even heard of like New Super Mario Bros U. How do they expect to meet funding for their next Kickstarter now.
|
|
#
?
May 16, 2013 07:17
|
|
|
On the January 23rd Nintendo Direct, Iwata said they're expecting a playable demo of the new 3D Mario game at E3. Is there any possibility that the demo would show up on the eShop?
|
|
#
?
May 16, 2013 07:22
|
|
|
TechnoSyndrome posted:I can understand why you're upset then, Nintendo is a pretty indie company. They should be happy that people are spreading the word about niche titles they never would have even heard of like New Super Mario Bros U. How do they expect to meet funding for their next Kickstarter now. Ad rates on Youtube are really horrible, by the way. If you get a dollar to a thousand views you're really lucky. A LP video of a game from a really popular Youtube channel maybe makes back enough money to cover the cost of buying the game at most, so as long as the amount of people who watch the video and then go buy the game is higher than ONE, the video game developer profits more than the video creator. The way that LPers make any real money on Youtube, and some of them definitely do, comes from constantly uploading videos. So, what happens here is that.. they'll replace Nintendo games in their queue with, basically anything else. Any one video, it doesn't do much. So they'll just work on other games. It hurts Nintendo more than it hurts them, because there are plenty of developers that either don't flag videos, or actively want people to post their content on Youtube and keep the ad money (like Valve, for example). So they'll work with those publishers. In the end, less people are bringing Nintendo to the attention of their audiences, some people will get flagged inappropriately by a poo poo rear end system for not doing anything wrong, and it just doesn't seem like it carries any benefit whatsoever? For a mega corp I can't imagine Youtube has any purpose other than promotion because the ad revenue generated is like less than pennies to them, even at the higher CPM they get. And promotion on Youtube is all about getting viral and getting out there and casting as wide a net as possible. Not being insular. CURATOR OF ANIME posted:On the January 23rd Nintendo Direct, Iwata said they're expecting a playable demo of the new 3D Mario game at E3. Is there any possibility that the demo would show up on the eShop? The 7th Guest fucked around with this message at 07:46 on May 16, 2013 |
|
#
?
May 16, 2013 07:25
|
|
|
CURATOR OF ANIME posted:On the January 23rd Nintendo Direct, Iwata said they're expecting a playable demo of the new 3D Mario game at E3. Is there any possibility that the demo would show up on the eShop? I wish E3 demos would show up in the eShop.
|
|
#
?
May 16, 2013 07:34
|
|
|
My issue with all of this is that it is a nuanced problem that Nintendo is approaching as anything but. There is a difference between raw gameplay footage, walkthrough, cutscenes only, boss guides, full LPs, commentaries, etc. But Nintendo is using an automated system to apply a single decision that is completely justified in some cases and absolutely insane in others. And more to the point, I simply don't understand the reasoning behind it. There are few enough people making relevant sums of money off their games that they could have just approached them individually with a reasonable offer for the type of content they produce. As it stands, any person making a living off producing LPs/streaming (who are generally the most popular ones anyway) will just not play your games anymore as they now make 0% of the money from those videos. And the less popular videos make so little money that it doesn't even matter. So what is the point? It just seems like an altogether poorly thought out and executed plan. Like some Nintendo Executive saw that popular reddit post on /r/games about complete cinematic videos with gameplay removed, freaked out, and implemented the fastest laziest fix they could think of. On a personal level, it also comes down to why people watch LPs/streams. I, personally, have a handful of people that I follow and will watch play basically any game they choose. I don't watch LPs specifically for the game, but more for the person playing them and the commentary. So while I agree it is completely fair that the developer/publisher deserves a cut if you are making money/a living off their content, I also think it is completely unfair for that cut to be 100%. It's insulting to the LPer/Streamer and to me the viewer to say that person's contributions to the overall value of the video is nothing.
|
|
#
?
May 16, 2013 07:55
|
|
|
Nintendo can't be criticized for being protective of their IPs, every media company ever does this and it definitely falls within their rights address these issues as they see fit. They can be criticized for completely failing to both understand and address why their latest console is trying to make the Vita look good, and they can definitely be criticized for failing at public relations. High-income LPers (and LPers in general, really) were not hurting Nintendo's bottom line nearly as much as, say, all but killing the Wii two years ago by allowing the flow of incoming games to dry up (forcing their fans to essentially beg for games to get localized outside of Japan), releasing an overpriced successor console with little in the way of appealing software, failing to secure major third party support, launching with an OS that needed at least another year in the oven, and launching their new console lacking in features and power compared to the competition that is less than a year away. They have made almost every mistake necessary to tank the Wii brand, which is really quite impressive. Going after LPers fixes none of their problems, and only serves to alienate a portion of their potential customers. Yeah, its a very small portion of the overall market, but it's not like they're in the same position of strength they were back when the Wii was at its prime AND the DS line was committing war crimes against any potential competition on the console and portable front. This is going to get spun negatively by folks, and I don't think Nintendo should be trying to drive that sentiment. I'm curious to see how other companies are going to handle the "threat" of LPs in the future. The PS4's Share Button (uuuuuuuugh) is basically there to help people make LPs/post snippets of gameplay with their own narration.
|
|
#
?
May 16, 2013 08:28
|
|
|
What is this thread even about anymore
|
|
#
?
May 16, 2013 08:28
|
|
|
AngryCaterpillar posted:What is this thread even about anymore The same thing it's always been about. Circular arguments in which people keep repeating the same points that have already been made, and no one's opinion is changed.
|
|
#
?
May 16, 2013 08:32
|
|
|
I was gonna suggest closing the thread until E3 but then I remembered Super Metroid was out, so, new plan: talk about how cool Super Metroid is until E3, yo.
|
|
#
?
May 16, 2013 08:37
|
|
|
All I'm saying is people don't know Wii U exists and Nintendos bold strategy so far this year has been: don't advertise anywhere, hide from E3, convince Youtubers not to want to promote them, and speak only to the echo chamber. Its so different from how aggressively they worked to get the original Wii in so many homes. It's so weird. You have to actually find Wii U promotion rather than it finding you. When the original Wii existed you couldn't get away from those We Would Like to Play ads. They had rented out large spaces in different venues to show off their poo poo, in malls, in convention centers, in mobile units. They bought time slots on Monday Night Football, and 24, and American Idol. They did everything they could to get everyone to look at it, see it in action, demo it. I wanna talk about Super Metroid too because it's one of my favorite games, although its 4 am here so I'll probably give it a spin tomorrow. I really hope they get Zero Mission up in the VC when the GBA section launches. The 7th Guest fucked around with this message at 08:50 on May 16, 2013 |
|
#
?
May 16, 2013 08:41
|
|
|
If anything I forgot you can dash in Super Metroid by holding B. A certain room gave me trouble to say the least  Also Rayman is still fun.
|
|
#
?
May 16, 2013 08:47
|
|
|
CURATOR OF ANIME posted:If anything I forgot you can dash in Super Metroid by holding B. A certain room gave me trouble to say the least The room in Brinstar with the collapsing bridge, right? I love that room, because you have to go through it, and it's impossible to get to the other side without running. It's a really good example of how Super Metroid organically teaches mechanics to the player.
|
|
#
?
May 16, 2013 09:06
|
|
|
DarkHamsterlord posted:The room in Brinstar with the collapsing bridge, right? I love that room, because you have to go through it, and it's impossible to get to the other side without running. It's a really good example of how Super Metroid organically teaches mechanics to the player. After getting the Charge Beam? Yes. a.lo fucked around with this message at 09:13 on May 16, 2013 |
|
#
?
May 16, 2013 09:11
|
|
|
Man I never stopped running in Super Metroid. I'm always amazed to read about people "missing" the function. I wonder how much of this game I've forgotten over the years 
|
|
#
?
May 16, 2013 09:17
|
|
|
Crowbear posted:How close were you to that 60 hour estimate? That's a commentary on my sleep issues not the quality of the game. 
|
|
#
?
May 16, 2013 10:13
|
|
|
fivegears4reverse posted:Man I never stopped running in Super Metroid. I'm always amazed to read about people "missing" the function. Some people got through Resident Evil 4 without knowing how to run either. There's a patch on Romhacking.net that brings the controls closer to Fusion and Zero Mission, if you don't mind playing it on an emulator. L is used to both aim up and down, R is used to switch between your normal beam and your equipped weapon, and the X-ray visor has its own button. It's also possible to be always running without needing to press a button, but the only downside is that you can no longer moonwalk 
|
|
#
?
May 16, 2013 12:16
|
|
|
Quest For Glory II posted:All I'm saying is I should hope everyone in this thread knows exactly what you are saying, considering you've made the same post nearly 400 times now.
|
|
#
?
May 16, 2013 12:22
|
|
|
|
| # ? May 31, 2024 01:16 |
|
|
Super Metroid hasn't aged particularly well. It was awesome back in the day, and many of my favorite 2D action platformers owe a lot of their inspiration to it, but Super Metroid feels so clunky and drab in comparison now. It's only $0.30 so buy it regardless, but I stopped at the second savepoint and doubt I'll ever load it up again.
|
|
#
?
May 16, 2013 13:03
|
|