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greatn posted:There's a serious possibility the god drat Ouya will outsell the WiiU for several months. If Sony hadn't stopped production of the PS2 it would probably be outselling the Wii-U despite being 13+ years old.
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May 21, 2013 15:29
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greatn posted:There's a serious possibility the god drat Ouya will outsell the WiiU for several months. because when i think next gen i think of a kickstarter console that has less processing power than even mid-tier Android phones for the exact same cost (and that you already own) I'll be curious to see where the discussion of the WiiU is in two years. Can they replicate the slow growth popularity of their handhelds like the DS/3DS? Or will it continue to stall and sputter until finally dying out sometime in 2016 and being relegated to ports of NES/SNES/64 games. However everyone arguing about graphics this and that, the number one biggest advancement in the new generation of consoles, from a development standpoint, is the massive increase in RAM. Even WiiU with its paltry 1gb compared to PS4's 8gb is an ocean of memory relatively speaking to current systems (too bad it suffers from bottlenecking) I can't even begin to sum up the number of emails that fly around AAA studios because Level 3 is 2megs over 360 budget and is crashing the system, or character package A can't be loaded at the same time as enemy packages B, C and D because total character load exceeds memory budget by 50kb. This could really be Sony's generation to clean house again with a more open approach to indie dev and programming (hooray x86 processor architecture!) while Microsoft actively makes everything they offer more difficult, obtuse, and expensive to develop for. Honestly I think this is one of the least clear cut generations to try and prognosticate than any previous. edit: to clarify a bit regarding graphics and memory. Yes to a certain extent you will see a greater graphical/audio fidelity with more memory because of the things it allows you to do: more polys, better textures, more FX, better quality sound, less compression on animation data, etc. Personally I'm more excited about the potential of DX11 adaptive tessellation as far as poly counts are concerned and the ability of developers to render tens of millions of tris in real-time. Probably the biggest boon, at least in the short term (until developers start wasting so much memory that they need to start worrying about optimization again) is going to be build/game stability and framerate. With that much memory we'll be seeing games that look better than current gen...but not *that* much better (at first) but they will run a whole hell of a lot smoother. treeboy fucked around with this message at 15:44 on May 21, 2013 |
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May 21, 2013 15:29
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Is there a person here that doesn't think this would've helped? http://imgur.com/KujlFG9 The name alone is insanely bad.
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May 21, 2013 15:52
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Everyone told Nintendo that Wii was a terrible name and turned out to be wrong. So this time when they had a really terrible name and everyone told them so they didn't listen... even after having the exact same brand confusion problems with 3DS.
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May 21, 2013 16:02
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Shyfted One posted:This still wouldn't happen because of the price point Nintendo likes to put it's consoles and because they always make money on their console sales, but like I said, it'd be fun. You're aware that this isn't true anymore, right? The Gamecube had a significant stretch where it was being sold at a loss (if I'm not misremembering), the 3DS was being sold at a loss for some time after Nintendo had to cut the price to save it, and the Wii U has been selling at a loss from the start.
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May 21, 2013 16:18
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Samara posted:Is there a person here that doesn't think this would've helped? I think more people would have understood it's a new console if it had been called the Wii2. After all, that's how the Playstation was handled. Or maybe they should have used Nintendoland for the name of the console 
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May 21, 2013 16:27
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My little brother as super excited about getting a Wii U. He kept talking about how much he was going to play it with me. Several months later the thing isn't even hooked up anymore just because we have nothing to play on it. I expected there to be more big name games coming out in the Wii U by now but there's nothing. I mean my little brother is a huge Nintendo fanboy and even he can't find any games he wants to play on it other than Pikmin 3, which has apparently been delayed for months again. Kind of sucks, I'd like some new games to play with him but nothing is coming out 
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May 21, 2013 16:32
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The name is a problem, but I do think it wouldn't be an issue at all if there were more worthwhile games for the console. If there were any games people loved for the Wii U, word-of-mouth would do a plenty good job of spreading knowledge of the console.
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May 21, 2013 16:34
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A clip from the 2nd console war http://youtu.be/n_E2lh1lgmk
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May 21, 2013 16:38
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Samara posted:Target is selling the Wii U basic for $239 now. Basically giving it away because no one is buying them. Isn't buying the 8GB model basically pointless because of how much of that space is already reserved by the system, though? Like, it's even more crippled than the 4GB Xbox 360? Maybe they're just getting rid of the basic sets so they can put more Deluxe sets on their shelves. Or, yeah, because no one's buying the system in general 
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May 21, 2013 16:55
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Rageaholic Monkey posted:Isn't buying the 8GB model basically pointless because of how much of that space is already reserved by the system, though? Like, it's even more crippled than the 4GB Xbox 360? It doesn't matter which system you get, if you play to use it for any serious amount of digital stuff, you're going to need an external for it. Might as well save $100 and invest half of that in a 1 TB hardrive.
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May 21, 2013 16:59
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Artix posted:It doesn't matter which system you get, if you play to use it for any serious amount of digital stuff, you're going to need an external for it. Might as well save $100 and invest half of that in a 1 TB hardrive. Yeah, for $239 I might buy one and a 1TB/500GB drive... Just because there might one day be something worth owning it for :P
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May 21, 2013 17:42
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As if I'm buying any games digitally with Nintendo's lovely accounts system.
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May 21, 2013 19:18
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Macaluso posted:I think more people would have understood it's a new console if it had been called the Wii2. After all, that's how the Playstation was handled. They should have called it "The New Wii" much like they name their 2D Mario titles. "Hey, Nintendo is releasing the New Wii!" Or like most sequels in movies, by the sixth you just call it by the first. So they should have called it, "The Nintendo". To be constructive, what do people think Nintendo should have done with this new console? I mean, aside from the obvious posters who just wish Nintendo would release games on their Playstation or X Box.
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May 21, 2013 19:22
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I think they should of delayed it until Pikmin 3 was finish, that way they would have some kind of console seller. They could of advertised it a bit better too, but I think (hope) they're saving that kind of stuff for when games actually do start coming out this year.
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May 21, 2013 19:33
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So, after Microsoft's new console reveal, is it time to start the "Is the Xbox One Microsoft's Dreamcast?" thread yet?
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May 21, 2013 19:40
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Magossa posted:I think they should of delayed it until Pikmin 3 was finish, that way they would have some kind of console seller. They could of advertised it a bit better too, but I think (hope) they're saving that kind of stuff for when games actually do start coming out this year. That's still dumb. WHY would you wait a year after the console comes out to properly advertise it? I think it really boils down to Nintendo having the mindset that they could half-rear end advertising cause surely EVERYONE would rush to the nearest store on launch day and buy a WiiU. It's the PS3 all over again, except more confusing. Even if they do start going apeshit with advertising once something worth buying does come out, it won't mean poo poo if most of your potential market doesn't even know that it's actually a new product.
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May 21, 2013 19:45
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Xbox One: Does Tvii like the WiiU but faster. No games, just like the WiiU, but you found out about it faster! But games are coming down the line, exclusives and new IP, but we aren't showing any of it yet, just like the WiiU! And just like the WiiU we have an unprecedented partnership with EA!
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May 21, 2013 19:46
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Paper Jam Dipper posted:Or like most sequels in movies, by the sixth you just call it by the first. So they should have called it, "The Nintendo". This was my favorite rumor before they announced the name. quote:To be constructive, what do people think Nintendo should have done with this new console? I mean, aside from the obvious posters who just wish Nintendo would release games on their Playstation or X Box. Since Nintendo can't compete on hardware and specs they probably needed to just go more affordable with the thing. The thing is $350 + what $50 for a hard drive? $400 is a lot for people who go with their regular console and then a Wii U for their Marios and Zeldas. And $300 is probably nothing to sneeze at for budget consious Wii only owners. The controller is some neat tech but I wonder if it was worth however much it adds to the price of the console.
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May 21, 2013 19:50
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Even the XBox One's name is, like Wii U, a one-way ticket to layman confusion land. It vaguely suggests being some kind of pared-down/downgrade/throwback model. Microsoft will be more eager to throw around the big marketing bucks, though.
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May 21, 2013 19:52
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Magossa posted:I think they should of delayed it until Pikmin 3 was finish, that way they would have some kind of console seller. I'm sorry, but no matter how good it turns out to be, Pikmin is just not a system seller. it just happened to be one of the more prominent Wii U games, since Nintendo's been announcing and re-announcing it for years.
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May 21, 2013 19:56
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Magossa posted:I think they should of delayed it until Pikmin 3 was finish, that way they would have some kind of console seller. They could of advertised it a bit better too, but I think (hope) they're saving that kind of stuff for when games actually do start coming out this year. Pikmin is not a console seller even to most Nintendo fans in the Real World, though, much less the audience Nintendo had in mind when they designed the Wii U. It might benefit from having little in the way of competition, though. Paper Jam Dipper posted:To be constructive, what do people think Nintendo should have done with this new console? I mean, aside from the obvious posters who just wish Nintendo would release games on their Playstation or X Box. -Offered one comprehensive model at a price that is competitive with other current gen consoles. Of the two models offered, the Deluxe has blown the standard model out of the water. -Launched with more actually interesting Nintendo games beyond NSMBU (or at least make NSMBU the pack in) -A Unified account structure that combined with the 3DS and makes Digital Purchases not feel like you're taking a risk -An OS that wasn't totally garbage at launch, one that didn't require a multiple hour long download even on high speed connections. -Launched with VC that featured all games available on the Wii, and allowing you to redownload games you already own from the Wii's VC without a bullshit fee. (Considering how much poo poo Sony got and MS is about to get over their seemingly abandoned digital content on their current gen systems, the Wii U doesn't get a pass for more or less doing the same thing -The ability to make Paper Jam Dipper actually read the thread (launch window patch perhaps) -That they listened to developers and offered them a reasonable facsimile of features that they wanted. -To have never focused so much on supporting both the Gamepad AND Motion Controls (and then throw Motion Controls under the bus by not even including the device that makes the most use of it with any of the available launch units). If you're going to have features be a selling feature on a console, at least make considerably better use of them than this at launch. As it stands, the only people who really give a poo poo about wiimote support are people who already own wiimotes (and they haven't exactly shown up for the system). fivegears4reverse fucked around with this message at 20:12 on May 21, 2013 |
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May 21, 2013 19:58
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Paper Jam Dipper posted:To be constructive, what do people think Nintendo should have done with this new console? I mean, aside from the obvious posters who just wish Nintendo would release games on their Playstation or X Box. I wish they had waited a year and released hardware that was competitive with the two new consoles so that it could play cross-platform releases.
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May 21, 2013 20:05
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Pikmin really isn't a system seller, though. I think they should have, first and formost, not gone with 'Wii U'. There was a rumor floating around before E3 that year that a name under consideration was 'Current' which isn't a great name but still distinguishes it from the Wii. The problem we have here is that Sony and Microsoft both have a consistent brand with their consoles. PlayStation isn't just a product, it's a division of the company. Nintendo used to know how to do iterative branding. NES > Super NES. Gameboy > Color > Advance. But they stopped doing that with their home consoles, and the DS iterations didn't really make much sense. What does the i in DSi mean? It's not immediately clear. And everyone is familiar with what happened with the 3DS. They seem to have launched when the console wasn't really finished, as well. The operating system at launch was incredibly slow and buggy, they didn't (and still don't) seem to have adequate server capacity for their eShop. And from what I've heard they've not been all that helpful to 3rd Party developers trying to figure out their hardware--probably because they're not sure themselves how to develop HD games. Launching any later wouldn't have helped, though, so what they should have done is start serious development earlier. Also, come up with a design that's more visually distinct from the original Wii. Say what you will about Xbox One, but nobody's going to be mistaking it for a 360. A lot of other things are sort of out of their hands, like changing market factors and EA's abrupt about-face on their faith in the system. And perhaps most importantly, they really should have shown the Next Smash Brothers a lot sooner than this. I was sold on the Wii from the moment they played the first Brawl trailer, and that game didn't even come out until two years after launch.
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May 21, 2013 20:08
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I agree with most of your list, but it can support more than one gamepad. This has been confirmed numerous times by Nintendo themselves and by hardware hackers. They simply haven't made any games that do it yet, it is not a hardware issue.
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May 21, 2013 20:08
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greatn posted:I agree with most of your list, but it can support more than one gamepad. This has been confirmed numerous times by Nintendo themselves and by hardware hackers. They simply haven't made any games that do it yet, it is not a hardware issue. Huh. Learn something new every day.
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May 21, 2013 20:10
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Chaltab posted:What does the i in DSi mean? It's not immediately clear. What? It means the same thing as the 'i' in Apple products. Pretty obvious dude.
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May 21, 2013 20:14
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So is the fact that the Wii U is the only next gen system not using x86 architecture going to be a big deal in terms of developing games for it?
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May 21, 2013 20:15
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Atomicated posted:So is the fact that the Wii U is the only next gen system not using x86 architecture going to be a big deal in terms of developing games for it? The original Xbox was a Pentium 3. So no, probably not as much as you'd think.
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May 21, 2013 20:17
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computer parts posted:The original Xbox was a Pentium 3. So no, probably not as much as you'd think. Although the Xbox series went from x86 to PowerPC to x86-64,* I don't think it's relevant what an old ran on. The important thing is that the PC, XBOX ONE, and the PS4 all use x86(-64), and the Wii U doesn't. This, along with the weaker hardware and lack of support for middleware, means that it's unlikely to keep up with third party releases. Especially is EA flat-out says that they're not doing any. *x86 is 32-bit, and supports up to 4GB of RAM. x86-64 is 64-bit.
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May 21, 2013 20:27
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Yeah, if the architecture alone is an obstacle, it's less of one than the processor with five fewer cores and the relatively small RAM size. The x86 architecture is an issue with backwards compatibility because they can't just recode the games already on the disks, and emulation of hardware as complicated as Cell and Xenon is... well impossible given the specs of PS4 and XBO. Wii U is only backwards compatible because the processor is basically a faster, multi-core version of the Wii's.
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May 21, 2013 20:34
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thefncrow posted:You're aware that this isn't true anymore, right? Nope. Wasn't aware, so thanks for pointing that out. How big of a loss are they taking on the Wii U and 3DS? I'm still going to end up picking up a Wii U at some point, but it will probably be later in its lifespan once more first party games are out. I'm thinking around the time that Retro and Monolith Soft put out their games may be when I finally jump in. Honestly, with mostly being a PC gamer it's not very hard to justify buying a Nintendo console for the exclusives. I don't care about the PS4 exclusives and I REALLY don't care about Xbox One's exclusives since they all revolve around sports games and CoD. vvv That still doesn't sound too bad. What kind of loss were the 360 and PS3 selling at? Wasn't at least one of them at over $100 per console? I also can't imagine the Xbox One or PS4 not selling at an even greater loss considering the hardware and packaged Kinect/Eye. Shyfted One fucked around with this message at 21:43 on May 21, 2013 |
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May 21, 2013 21:31
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Shyfted One posted:Nope. Wasn't aware, so thanks for pointing that out. Enough of a loss that selling one game per console does not cover the loss, but they won't elaborate any further than that.
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May 21, 2013 21:40
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Atomicated posted:So is the fact that the Wii U is the only next gen system not using x86 architecture going to be a big deal in terms of developing games for it? The processor architecture isn't going to be the major roadblock as much as the rest of the hardware will be.
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May 21, 2013 21:41
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Question about RAM- I heard once that the 360 was originally only going to have 256 MB of RAM, until some developer begged them to up it to 512 MB so they could actually make their planned launch title (maybe Bethesda? I feel like it was an Oblivion post-mortem). With that split I believe they said it was 256 for the OS and 256 for games on the 360 for the past eight years. I feel like the Wii U having 1 GB for games isn't as terrible as people are making it out to be. Yes it looks bad compared to the 5 GB that the XBO will have for games (and whatever volume the PS4 will have for games), but we won't know for certain how 1 GB vs 5 GB will limit the Wii U until we know more about next-gen games. Not just in terms of graphics but all the AI details that people have mentioned too. I'm not a software engineer or developer so while I can say that 1 < 5, I don't know what that extra 4 GB will mean for games. Probably a lot but no one seems to want to actually show games right now, as Microsoft's press conference today demonstrated.Shyfted One posted:The Wii U has a better chance of being Nintendo's Gamecube than Dreamcast. This is my feeling too, I love my Gamecube and all this Gamecube hate is a strange new thing for me to experience  That was when third parties still released the same game on all three consoles at once too!VV Yeah, but I want to see what games taking advantage of 5+ GB of RAM actually look like and what they do. Everyone is talking about how that amount crushes the Wii U but no one's brought out any games showing "hey this is a title running on 5 GB RAM". I think that's me being impatient for seeing next-gen games more than anything though, that MS press conference was huge blue balls. I have no doubts that 5 GB is more than 1 GB, but I want to see what that translates to in terms of gaming experience. C-Euro fucked around with this message at 21:57 on May 21, 2013 |
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May 21, 2013 21:43
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C-Euro posted:Question about RAM- I heard once that the 360 was originally only going to have 256 MB of RAM, until some developer begged them to up it to 512 MB so they could actually make their planned launch title (maybe Bethesda? I feel like it was an Oblivion post-mortem). With that split I believe they said it was 256 for the OS and 256 for games on the 360 for the past eight years. I feel like the Wii U having 1 GB for games isn't as terrible as people are making it out to be. Yes it looks bad compared to the 5 GB that the XBO will have for games (and whatever volume the PS4 will have for games), but we won't know for certain how 1 GB vs 5 GB will limit the Wii U until we know more about next-gen games. Not just in terms of graphics but all the AI details that people have mentioned too. It was Epic that hounded Microsoft to up it to 512. And 1GB for games really is horrible. Next gen games will absolutely take advantage of whatever RAM the XO and PS4 give them and the Wii U will either be left with severely neutered ports or just not get those games at all. Microsoft and Sony aren't just throwing 8GB in there for shits and giggles, they're doing it because developers don't want limited RAM to be a bottleneck.
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May 21, 2013 21:49
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Crowbear posted:It was Epic that hounded Microsoft to up it to 512. *though judging by the reveal today it seems like gaming is a secondary function of XBO.
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May 22, 2013 03:05
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Yea loving over the consumer seems to be the XBO's primary function.
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May 22, 2013 03:25
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Crowbear posted:It was Epic that hounded Microsoft to up it to 512. 1GB is a sea of memory compared to 512, I can't stress this enough. Wish it could be more? Sure. 2 or 4gb of dedicated game memory would've been awesome, but 8gb is honestly kind of unnecessary at the moment. Remember every beautiful game you've ever played on the PS3 or 360 was maxing out that 512mb. With literally twice as much memory so many things become easier. FWIW most devs i've chatted with have no idea what they're going to be doing with 8gigs aside from not compressing anything and having a field day being as un-optimized as possible. The biggest issue with the WiiU actually seems to be cpu/gpu bottle-necking of the memory. It's like you've got an ocean of water but a straw to drink. (semi-exaggeration)
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May 22, 2013 04:34
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Do you not understand the shortcuts and limitations in other systems that were put in place for the 512 limit and how 5 for the XBone and 7 for the PS4 is an insanely good thing in terms of look and complex systems right.
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May 22, 2013 04:39
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