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Badmana posted:Quick question: Would anyone know how much GPU overhead (if any) SLI uses? Why don't you pull one of the cards out and see if the performance remains tolerable? My suspicion is that at 2560x1600, a single 580 won't be enough unless you start dialing down graphics settings in games. The 2012 charts on Tom's Hardware show average framerates for a lone 580 hovering around 30fps at 2560x1440 with settings cranked up. Realistically, this means dips into sub-30fps land where things just aren't fun.
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May 24, 2013 18:33
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Klyith posted:I don't see how his setup can possibly go over 350 watts, the 780 doesn't draw that much power. Anandtech's system with an i7 overclocked to a nutso 4.3 ghz barely broke 400w, and TR's more normal setup was just over 300. There's a common misconception that a higher capacity power supply has lower efficiency at lower loads, I think this leads a lot of people to buy lower-capacity power supplies than they really should. In fact, low and high capacity models have very similar performance at the same low draw conditions, the higher capacity models just have much wider optimal efficiency bands and drop off in efficiency later in the high-end. Here's a Silentpcreview article on the Kingwin Lazer Platinum 1000W power supply, as you can see efficiency remains above 80% down to 65W. Miffler posted:I'm not planning on a 780, but out of curiosity would I be in the same boat with a M12II 620 and an over clocked 3570k? If you're buying a power supply and know it will be paired with a GTX 780, it doesn't make much sense to me to get something less than a good quality 750W. That insures peak load will remain within the lower range of the optimal band, and lets you overclock both the CPU and GPU (or maybe even add a second videocard) without pushing noise or heat to excessive levels. Think about system balance, why are you hooking up a $650 videocard to a power supply that costs 5% of that? Edit: The above post contains my opinion and some people disagree with me. Alereon fucked around with this message at 22:27 on May 24, 2013 |
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May 24, 2013 18:39
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Are the 770 / 760s likely to draw less power than a 780? I'm looking at overclocking a 3370k to somewhere in the 4.2 - 4.5 GHz range (with luck, been awhile since I OC'ed anything), combined with 2x of one of those models, or just 670s depending on price. As far as I can tell I'm on the border between a 750W and 850W PSU.
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May 24, 2013 18:46
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Alereon posted:hooking up a $650 videocard to a power supply that costs 5% of that? 13.8% on sale. SeaSonic is a drat good brand, altho spending a little more for a gold rated one would be reasonable if you can drop $650 on the videocard..
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May 24, 2013 18:48
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Hamburger Test posted:13.8% on sale.
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May 24, 2013 18:59
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Alereon posted:Seasonic is a good brand but every brand has a low-end line, and below 600W or so component and design quality generally also drops off a lot. Not exactly, they have a 560W X-Series which is built every bit as well as its bigger brothers, and the the fanless Platinum from 400-520w
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May 24, 2013 19:28
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Alereon posted:Even 100W more capacity would really help in this case, as it gives you a wider optimal band and more headroom before the fan gets too loud. That said, your overclocked CPU is eating up most of that headroom. It really depends on how much you care about noise and heat output from the power supply, if you decide to buy a high-end videocard then upgrade your power supply along with it if you want a quieter and cooler system. If you're not using or planning to use a high-draw (or especially overclocked) videocard, that power supply is probably fine for your system. Interesting. PSU's are a much more interesting component than I ever imagined prior to reading SH/SC. 
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May 24, 2013 21:09
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Miffler posted:Interesting. PSU's are a much more interesting component than I ever imagined prior to reading SH/SC. If you're interested in PSUs: http://www.jonnyguru.com/ OklahomaWolf's reviews are not only entertaining, but thorough. The forums are also a wealth of PSU minded people.
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May 24, 2013 21:56
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HalloKitty posted:If you're interested in PSUs: http://www.jonnyguru.com/
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May 24, 2013 22:15
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Last page someone asked about how replacing PSUs after X years: I think every 3 years is probably being over-cautious, but they don't last forever. PSUs have large liquid electrolytic capacitors which have a limited lifespan, and 6 years starts getting close if you're like many of us that 24/7 our desktops.Alereon posted:You want the load on the power supply to be 50% or lower, beyond that you get progressively worse noise levels, efficiency, and power delivery quality. On that Seasonic power supply, the fan is ramping up to noticeable levels at 60%, and 80% is about the point where the noise and heat output are excessive. That power supply isn't BAD, it'll keep supplying functional power up to its limit, but it was a low-cost power supply when it was new and is a bit behind the curve today. It was a great choice for a lower-draw system, the problem comes when you try to use that same cheap power supply for a system with a top-end videocard. I don't think there's any real reason to buy a 800w PSU for a 300w system. Even overclocking a CPU is only adding a few tens of watts if you're doing normal, non-heroic OC. But I do think that if someone is going to spend 650 dollars on a graphics card, they shouldn't complain about buying a PSU that's over $100.
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May 24, 2013 23:26
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Klyith posted:Higher loads will lead to more fan noise, and a bigger capacity PSU will help. Marginally -- the size of the load doesn't change. If you are comparing two PSUs with the same efficiency curve the bigger one might be a percent or three more efficient because it's using less capacity. So there's 90w of waste heat instead of 100w, woo. And I strongly disagree that delivered power quality is unacceptable at 80% load for decent brands of PSUs. One big negative of operating at very high loads is to reduce the lifespan of the PSU. quote:I don't think there's any real reason to buy a 800w PSU for a 300w system. Even overclocking a CPU is only adding a few tens of watts if you're doing normal, non-heroic OC. But I do think that if someone is going to spend 650 dollars on a graphics card, they shouldn't complain about buying a PSU that's over $100. Alereon fucked around with this message at 00:54 on May 25, 2013 |
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May 25, 2013 00:47
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Alereon posted:You want the load on the power supply to be 50% or lower, beyond that you get progressively worse noise levels, efficiency, and power delivery quality. Thats a bit of a sweeping statement, if you have an average build quality PSU then yes this will most likely be the case as they usually never are actually capable of supplying the quoted watts in an efficient way. Get something with some level of 80 plus certification and that will give you at least 80% efficiency all the way up to 100% load, usually this has a knock on effect of managing to keep heat and noise down (unless you live in the tropics) due to the over engineering to meet the efficiency requirements.
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May 25, 2013 01:47
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noxiousg posted:Why don't you pull one of the cards out and see if the performance remains tolerable? My suspicion is that at 2560x1600, a single 580 won't be enough unless you start dialing down graphics settings in games. The 2012 charts on Tom's Hardware show average framerates for a lone 580 hovering around 30fps at 2560x1440 with settings cranked up. Realistically, this means dips into sub-30fps land where things just aren't fun. Well, I only got Sli in the last 3 months so I know what a single card can do (barely run Skyrim no AA/AF with the high texture pack). I still can't crank up the settings (max AA and AF) as it stutters and I'd rather have buttery smooth 60 FPS without putting the cards under too much stress (I might actually be hitting a memory cap as well). I'm only wondering if the GPU usage is literal. 50% on both cards equals 100% on a single GPU. Thus, when I see the GPU usage at 80% whether I'm actually getting 160% output of a single card. Also, regarding PSU usage, I found that GPU/CPU power usage seems to be over rated. My SLI 580s with an OC'ed 3770K at 4 GHz and 6 drives (including 1 SSD) doesn't exceed 550 watts according to my Cyberpower UPS display at the wall. My PSU is a Corsair Gold AX850 so figure actual system wattage at ~495. Noise can be a problem but that's because my video cards crank up to 100% fan usage when gaming (and bouncing off 90C temps). Sounds like a jet taking off.
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May 25, 2013 01:57
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Badmana posted:Well, I only got Sli in the last 3 months so I know what a single card can do (barely run Skyrim no AA/AF with the high texture pack). I still can't crank up the settings (max AA and AF) as it stutters and I'd rather have buttery smooth 60 FPS without putting the cards under too much stress (I might actually be hitting a memory cap as well). If you're still using the high texture pack with a resolution of 2560x1600 I imagine you are maxing the memory out.
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May 25, 2013 02:15
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Skyrim? High texture pack? 2560x1600? If you've got 1.25 GB 580s, you're VRAM limited. What are you using to measure the cards' output? GPU-Z can show independent loads for each card, it might give you more insight into what's going on.
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May 25, 2013 02:15
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Factory Factory posted:Skyrim? High texture pack? 2560x1600? If you've got 1.25 GB 580s, you're VRAM limited. 1.5 GB buddy  I'm using MSI afterburner. I've got usage, fan speed, temps and memory usage showing (I figure it's only showing me allocated memory, not what's actually being used). Both cards in sli mode are used at the same percentage. Will GPU-z be more accurate?
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May 25, 2013 03:15
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Badmana posted:1.5 GB buddy High res texture pack at that resolution will be filling up that 1.5GB. People were filling 2GB at 1920x1080 with texture packs.
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May 25, 2013 03:25
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Put in an order for a 780 which will be a nice upgrade over my ancient 580. How easy is it to overclock one of these? EVGA standard version was all I could get my hands on.
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May 25, 2013 03:25
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Max out the power target and watch your temperatures and it'll kind of overclock itself. (Dump your bios so I can see what kind of figures they're working with)
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May 25, 2013 03:49
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Badmana posted:1.5 GB buddy Nah, Afterburner should be accurate. Your bottleneck is just somewhere other than the compute performance of the cards. it's the VRAM
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May 25, 2013 03:54
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lovely Treat posted:High res texture pack at that resolution will be filling up that 1.5GB. I'm running the official High Res texture pack, as well as a few other visual mods at 2560x1440. My VRAM usage rarely goes over 1.5GB, it's usually in the 1.4 area though which would be a problem for this guy. But 2GB at 1920x1080 sounds like hyperbole, or people who install 4K grass textures.
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May 25, 2013 11:44
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cheesetriangles posted:Put in an order for a 780 which will be a nice upgrade over my ancient 580. How easy is it to overclock one of these? EVGA standard version was all I could get my hands on. Looks pretty good.
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May 25, 2013 11:51
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Hamburger Test posted:I'm running the official High Res texture pack, as well as a few other visual mods at 2560x1440. My VRAM usage rarely goes over 1.5GB, it's usually in the 1.4 area though which would be a problem for this guy. But 2GB at 1920x1080 sounds like hyperbole, or people who install 4K grass textures. What program are you using to determine vram use? I'm only using the HD pack, some nude mods, and all the unofficial official patches. I run ultra settings 2560x1600 with no AA/AF and it runs 60 FPS solid and averages ~80% GPU usage. I can add a little AA/AF but it tends to hiccup outdoors and I can't really notice the extra graphics anyways.
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May 25, 2013 12:56
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Badmana posted:What program are you using to determine vram use? AA eats up vram, sticking high res textures in the mix increases it more. Shitty Treat fucked around with this message at 13:27 on May 25, 2013 |
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May 25, 2013 13:25
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Badmana posted:What program are you using to determine vram use? MSI Afterburner. And yea, it sounds like you'd be right near the cap without AA. You should be able to crank up AF I believe. There's also a mod that reduces some of the textures in the HD pack without giving up a lot of the visuals, since some of the textures in that pack are also larger than they need to be.
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May 25, 2013 13:33
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Factory Factory, my circumstances have changed pretty drastically as a result of the severe worsening of my preexisting injury, and the surgery isn't going to change it back. Suddenly a graphics card is really just a graphics card. Titan doesn't mean much for me anymore, I think. I think I'm going to upgrade from a 680 to a 780. The overclocking is what seems like it'll make it worth it, I generally upgrade if I can get better than 25-30% performance while still keeping it single GPU. When 2014 rolls around I figure I'll do a full system build, including a new card from the new architecture then. When I get a 780, I'll have a 580 and a 680 to do god knows what with. Hah. And a 280, but that only counts as continuity in getting the highest end of whatever nVidia has to offer at any given generation. I want a team green sticker. 
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May 26, 2013 15:07
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Agreed posted:Factory Factory, my circumstances have changed pretty drastically as a result of the severe worsening of my preexisting injury, and the surgery isn't going to change it back. Suddenly a graphics card is really just a graphics card. Titan doesn't mean much for me anymore, I think. What's that, you want a 780 that's faster than Titan for less cost than Titan? http://hexus.net/tech/reviews/graphics/55725-evga-geforce-gtx-780-superclocked-acx/
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May 26, 2013 15:35
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HalloKitty posted:What's that, you want a 780 that's faster than Titan for less cost than Titan? http://hexus.net/tech/reviews/graphics/55725-evga-geforce-gtx-780-superclocked-acx/ 
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May 26, 2013 16:18
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Oh god, I just realized Driver Fusion has steam achievements.
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May 26, 2013 16:21
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Agreed posted:Factory Factory, my circumstances have changed pretty drastically as a result of the severe worsening of my preexisting injury, and the surgery isn't going to change it back. Suddenly a graphics card is really just a graphics card. Titan doesn't mean much for me anymore, I think. Oh man, I'm really sorry to hear that. I hope you and your family are doing as okay as possible.
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May 26, 2013 16:50
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HalloKitty posted:What's that, you want a 780 that's faster than Titan for less cost than Titan? http://hexus.net/tech/reviews/graphics/55725-evga-geforce-gtx-780-superclocked-acx/ Already have that pinned for when it becomes in-stock again.
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May 26, 2013 16:51
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As long as you're not VRAM bound, a Titan or 780 should smoke a Quadro K5000 at GPGPU tasks given the number of cores on the latter right? No real GPGPU special sauce for the Quadro K5000?
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May 26, 2013 17:45
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HalloKitty posted:What's that, you want a 780 that's faster than Titan for less cost than Titan? http://hexus.net/tech/reviews/graphics/55725-evga-geforce-gtx-780-superclocked-acx/ That's a hell of a cooler. 
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May 26, 2013 18:41
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Miffler posted:That's a hell of a cooler. EVGA makes some pretty great stuff, love that dual fan cooler. I know some folks prefer the reference coolers that exhaust air out of the case but drat, as long as you got enough airflow, that heatsink/fan combo does a better job and looks to be a bit quieter than the ol' "dustbuster" cooler.
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May 26, 2013 18:56
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I'm really looking at getting that evga card. Any idea how long these cards take to get in Stock at launch?
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May 26, 2013 21:46
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We usually only get hard release dates when the NDA lifts, and the info we got was "Reference out now, semi-custom soon." So... soon.
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May 26, 2013 21:50
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I'm just wondering what I should do. I currently have a 580 gtx that runs hot as poo poo. It always has. Right now it's idling at 86 degrees. When I was playing STO last night, it was hitting 98 degress at 100% fan. That's way too loving hot for my comfort level. So here I am, thinking of a new card. The 780 gtx is looking like a beast of a card, but I'm just unsure of what I should do. Should I pick up one of the reference models from Gigabyte, Galaxy, or Zotac that are available right now? Do I hold off for potentially weeks to get the ACX from EVGA? Do I wait for the 770, which could be announced next week or in a couple of months? Do I wait for other after market cooling solutions to come out for the 780 gtx? I'm just really at a loss for what I should do.
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May 26, 2013 22:55
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Agreed posted:Already have that pinned for when it becomes in-stock again.
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May 26, 2013 22:58
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Zotix posted:I'm just wondering what I should do. I currently have a 580 gtx that runs hot as poo poo. It always has. Right now it's idling at 86 degrees. When I was playing STO last night, it was hitting 98 degress at 100% fan. That's way too loving hot for my comfort level. So here I am, thinking of a new card. The 780 gtx is looking like a beast of a card, but I'm just unsure of what I should do. Should I pick up one of the reference models from Gigabyte, Galaxy, or Zotac that are available right now? Do I hold off for potentially weeks to get the ACX from EVGA? Do I wait for the 770, which could be announced next week or in a couple of months? Do I wait for other after market cooling solutions to come out for the 780 gtx? I'm just really at a loss for what I should do. Zotac makes quality stuff. They are trying to become to nVidia what Powercolor was to ATI during the height of their relationship. Look back to the 560Ti-448 launch for closer partnership with Zotac than any other brand of note. Gigabyte makes really iffy, beancounter decisions that kill cards (and motherboards and CPUs sometimes too). Galaxy is one of those brands where you're rolling the dice because it might as well be OEM. That said, a 580 shouldn't idle much above 45ºC even in a poor airflow case. Hot under load, fairly so. But you're idling at full load temps. Fix that first.
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May 26, 2013 23:04
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My CPU is at 38 degrees, which is an i5-3570k OC'd to 4.3ghz on air. It's not a case airflow problem. I have two intake fans on the front, 1 large one on the side, and 1 exhaust top back, as well as 2 exhaust fans on the top. It's a corsair 500r http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16811139009 It's definitely an issue with the card, not my case airflow. My question is regarding the Zotac, since it's basically a reference card, is there OCing potential in it? I saw this review earlier on my phone, http://extremespec.net/zotac-geforce-gtx-780-review-design-testing-performance/ . I'm just not sure if I want to bite the bullet on a reference card. Zotix fucked around with this message at 23:13 on May 26, 2013 |
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May 26, 2013 23:10
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