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I would be surprised if Fuji didn't implement a better EVF with the split focusing screen on the new iteration of the X-Pro, then you're pretty much most of the way there as far as shooting like a Leica M body.
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May 17, 2013 14:14
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krooj posted:Leica user forums are literal proof that Solms syndrome is real. Fixed that.
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May 17, 2013 16:55
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bobfather posted:It's my understanding that Leica hasn't ever produced a digital camera body that was on-par with current generation digital cameras. Every review I ever read would go something like "it has a sensor smaller than a babies' fingernail and noise starts appearing at 800 ISO, but IT'S A LEICA!!!" If you really want to use a rangefinder, or if you already have M lenses and want to continue using your film cameras, there is going to be some legitimate appeal to have a digital M body. First, there are exactly 0 other digital rangefinders on the market. Second, it's the only way currently available to make your lenses work correctly. People don't want their fancy 50mm Leica lenses to sit in a bag unused with an all-of-a-sudden crapass field of view, or their wide angle lenses to become slow normal lenses with blurry purple corners. The fact that a Sony NEX gets more dsomarks means very little if your lenses aren't useful on it. Yeah, there are plenty of greybeards out there who think that setting a Leica facing outward on the table at the coffee house (and the 'post your camera' threads on rangefinderforum are pretty much 100 pages of this) turns them into dos equis man or something. If using a rangefinder or mounting M lenses are *not* important to you, there is no reason to buy a digital M. That said, there are actual photographic reasons for owning one.
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May 17, 2013 16:55
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I'm going to wander around today and see what I make of the OVF on the X-Pro1. From the onset, I can see why this camera would have a lot of returns: you must, must, must know how to recompose after autofocusing to handle the parallax error at close distances. The manual doesn't explain this clearly, nor are there any good hints in camera that recomposing is needed. I suspect a lot of buyers would be put off by the fact that the centre box doesn't identify the point of focus in all instances. I am thinking the parallax correction could be handled more elegantly.
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May 18, 2013 15:29
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Has anyone bought the chinese speedboosters? The fd-nex is particularly tempting but there are reports of a blue spot when shooting against bright light.
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May 18, 2013 16:53
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krooj posted:I'm going to wander around today and see what I make of the OVF on the X-Pro1. From the onset, I can see why this camera would have a lot of returns: you must, must, must know how to recompose after autofocusing to handle the parallax error at close distances. The manual doesn't explain this clearly, nor are there any good hints in camera that recomposing is needed. I suspect a lot of buyers would be put off by the fact that the centre box doesn't identify the point of focus in all instances. I am thinking the parallax correction could be handled more elegantly. The X100 took quite a beating regarding this on forums a few years back and a lot of folks thought their camera was defective. Fuji added in the parallax correction box in a firmware update that helped some but I don't think it is enabled by default. I haven't seen the same with the X100s but that may be the limited availability.
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May 18, 2013 17:51
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teraflame posted:Has anyone bought the chinese speedboosters? The fd-nex is particularly tempting but there are reports of a blue spot when shooting against bright light. Sounds like a reflection from the sensor or ghosting. The coatings are probably not the best in the world.
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May 18, 2013 18:24
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krooj posted:I'm going to wander around today and see what I make of the OVF on the X-Pro1. From the onset, I can see why this camera would have a lot of returns: you must, must, must know how to recompose after autofocusing to handle the parallax error at close distances. The manual doesn't explain this clearly, nor are there any good hints in camera that recomposing is needed. I suspect a lot of buyers would be put off by the fact that the centre box doesn't identify the point of focus in all instances. I am thinking the parallax correction could be handled more elegantly. You have to enable parallax correction in the options. It'll then show a corrected focus box but you still have to guess a bit to know where it's going to be (not that difficult). Also firmware updates reset the options to default which is really annoying.
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May 18, 2013 21:37
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Shot a concert with the E-mount 35mm f/1.8 OSS. The image quality is great, the stabilization is a godsend, but god drat the slow AF is almost heartbreaking. Like I said before, hopefully it'll be faster with a newer body.
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May 19, 2013 16:07
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Which body are you using? Is it phase det. AF or contrast det.?
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May 19, 2013 16:08
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Martytoof posted:Which body are you using? Is it phase det. AF or contrast det.? 5N. Contrast only.
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May 19, 2013 16:09
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Malcolm XML posted:You have to enable parallax correction in the options. It'll then show a corrected focus box but you still have to guess a bit to know where it's going to be (not that difficult). Yep - had it enabled. While I initially thought the parallax would be a problem, in practice it wasn't. In the vein of making MF through the OVF more usable, it would be nice if Fuji could show the adjusted frame lines for a given focus distance, similar to a Leica. I guess when the X-Pro gets updated with a phase-detection capable AF system, they can add focus confirmation to MF mode as well. The OVF does force you to think about what you're doing in relation to what the camera will capture. It's refreshing and a minor challenge. There are certainly instances where you can outright ignore the parallax information, such as shooting subjects with little or no depth, like a wall. Interestingly, the 35/1.4 has a hell of a time focusing at close distances with the OVF. When you switch to the EVF, it gets focus every time. IQ is ... well, I had an X-E1 that a sold to fund the Leica, so IQ was a known quantity, and it's excellent. I sometimes wish there were more pixels to push when I want a tighter crop, though. I'm really excited to see where Fuji takes the X series in the next year, and I am equally happy with the cost / quality of the system lenses. It's really cool that Zeiss is throwing some weight behind the system as well (I think it really adds to the credibility and staying power). Some examples:  
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May 19, 2013 16:59
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HPL posted:Shot a concert with the E-mount 35mm f/1.8 OSS. The image quality is great, the stabilization is a godsend, but god drat the slow AF is almost heartbreaking. Like I said before, hopefully it'll be faster with a newer body. Yeah, was shooting a friend's birthday show one-handed with the 35 1.8 on Saturday (drink in the other hand) and the shitpile AF of my NEX-3 was really frustrating. Been thinking about getting a 6/7 soonish, but I could see myself jumping ship for Fuji if they'd release something with an articulating LCD.
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May 20, 2013 00:23
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Well, I got an email today saying my Ricoh GR just shipped, so it looks like there aren't going to be any Fuji x100 kind of supply problems for this camera. Maybe there's less demand for it than it seems from the enthusiasm for the GR on the internet? Or maybe they just have got their manufacturing down better. I ordered mine weeks after pre-ordering started, yet mine is shipping before the official release date, so it looks like everybody who wanted one should be pretty happy.
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May 23, 2013 08:08
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Costello Jello posted:Well, I got an email today saying my Ricoh GR just shipped, so it looks like there aren't going to be any Fuji x100 kind of supply problems for this camera. Maybe there's less demand for it than it seems from the enthusiasm for the GR on the internet? Or maybe they just have got their manufacturing down better. I ordered mine weeks after pre-ordering started, yet mine is shipping before the official release date, so it looks like everybody who wanted one should be pretty happy. Looking forward to your report on it, my GRD IV arrives tomorrow. I have wanted a GRD for a little while and have kept an eye out during my daily local Craigslist scan but one has never popped up. Adorama had a used IV for $390 so I jumped on it as a chance to own the last one in the model line (GR seems more of a reboot). I figure that I have enough APS-C options as is and there are places I avoid carrying around an expensive system. If I enjoy the experience then I'll get a GR. it seems like Ricoh users really like the system.
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May 23, 2013 08:34
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Costello Jello posted:Well, I got an email today saying my Ricoh GR just shipped, so it looks like there aren't going to be any Fuji x100 kind of supply problems for this camera. Maybe there's less demand for it than it seems from the enthusiasm for the GR on the internet? Or maybe they just have got their manufacturing down better. I ordered mine weeks after pre-ordering started, yet mine is shipping before the official release date, so it looks like everybody who wanted one should be pretty happy. Is it before the official release date? When I was looking at it on B&H it said May 15th estimated arrival- but now there is no date on it.
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May 23, 2013 14:08
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 Leica Mini M coming next month. I wonder if compete with N7 directly? I would give them a lot of credit if they get together a 1.3x sensor. edit: who am I kidding, it's probably Leica version of "Lunar", a.k.a. the Leica-taxed Panasonic GX2. whatever7 fucked around with this message at 17:26 on May 23, 2013 |
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May 23, 2013 17:21
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I'm still amazed at the arrogance of the current Leica management who decided that this last one was the definitive "M" camera they have made. (therefore doing away with numbers)
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May 23, 2013 17:50
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whatever7 posted:edit: who am I kidding, it's probably Leica version of "Lunar", a.k.a. the Leica-taxed Panasonic GX2. Leica Rumors is claiming it's an entirely German product and since it's being tagged as above the X2, one can only hope that true. I'm betting it's either an RX1 competitor or an FF ILC without a rangefinder.
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May 23, 2013 18:44
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moonduck posted:Leica Rumors is claiming it's an entirely German product and since it's being tagged as above the X2, one can only hope that true. It's probably going to be a rebadged POS from Panasonic with enough fiddling done in Germany to get the legal stamp.
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May 23, 2013 18:59
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Malcolm XML posted:It's probably going to be a rebadged POS from Panasonic with enough fiddling done in Germany to get the legal stamp. Panasonics are POS now?
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May 23, 2013 19:59
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The LX5 is a Good Camera 
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May 23, 2013 20:34
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RustedChrome posted:Panasonics are POS now? When you charge Leica prices for them they are.
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May 23, 2013 20:36
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My guess is that they don't do enough volume with Truesense to keep the CCD FF sensor in production to feed the M-E and M9 warranty work, so they're just going to shitcan the M-E and re-introduce it as the mini. So, probably an M RF without live view or some of the other few things that distinguish the full M. Where that gets interesting is with warranty on existing M9/E users. I expect Leica would offer an "upgrade" to the M or mini. Lots of ppl think this is going to be some AF wunderkind, but nearly everyone in the MILC market would steal their lunch money and send them home crying. They know better than this.
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May 23, 2013 20:43
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Dpreview thinks it will be like the Leica M, but with the internal rangefinder assembly removed so it can take both SLR and rangefinder lenses (without rangefinder function). I'm so indifferent that I can't even be assed to come up with an opinion.Shmoogy posted:Is it before the official release date? When I was looking at it on B&H it said May 15th estimated arrival- but now there is no date on it. That's what B&H said at first, then switched it to May 27th. Who knows.
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May 23, 2013 22:30
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Considering that the new M (240) is $7k and the X2 is at $2k, whatever they're going to release is going to be way too expensive. Not that that's unexpected.
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May 24, 2013 13:46
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Mest0r posted:Considering that the new M (240) is $7k and the X2 is at $2k, whatever they're going to release is going to be way too expensive. Not that that's unexpected. My guess is it will come in around $4500 US. Gotta be cheaper than the M-E, cause it's a less complicated device if there's no RF. Still, if/when Sony releases FF NEX it might as well be game over.
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May 24, 2013 15:20
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Its going to be a M8 style digital without bells and whistles and no AF and its gonna cost a million dollars and plated in unobtainium and wont produce a good image over ISO 400, but blows you away from iso 100-200. Ya know, the Leica Way My money is on a CL style Digital RF to directly battle Fuji/Sony RX1 sales which have eaten into Leica's business. Will it be FF or APS-C? I really do not know and have little care. I am not their target audience of graybeard/romantic fanatics who argue for product namesake more than they shoot photos. I think you are right Krooj, If sony pushes a FF Nex out sooner than later, its night-night for more Leica sales. That is of course if the price is right on that FF Nex. Id say Fuji will come to market with one soon, but they went on record about tinkering with FF but its not the focus at the moment. I honestly am not sure Leica can keep up at this point since there are plenty of cameras to adapt their lenses to that are far cheaper and produce better IQ when paired with M Glass. Maybe they should focus on glass/film bodies and move away from the digital RF market.
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May 24, 2013 15:33
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Musket posted:I honestly am not sure Leica can keep up at this point since there are plenty of cameras to adapt their lenses to that are far cheaper and produce better IQ when paired with M Glass. Maybe they should focus on glass/film bodies and move away from the digital RF market. There will always be a market for "Luxury" cameras, as retarded as that sounds. In Asia it's a thing, since not everyone owns a car or a big house. Anyways I don't think Leicas are being cross shopped against NEX's very often. I say Leica should keep doing what it's doing; Focus on good glass and niche bodies, and don't cheapen the brand.
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May 24, 2013 16:01
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I'm interested in seeing what it is, at least. Rangefinders aren't all that well suited to most of my photography, but a FF mirrorless camera that is designed to work with rangefinder lenses would be great. I'm betting its going to be a FF M mount mirrorless with no EVF, immovable LCD, and leftover M9 sensors for $4500 - that's definitely something I could use, but not at all justifiable at that kind of price. I should probably just get the complete set of Sigma DPs and be done with it.
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May 24, 2013 16:16
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I reckon if and when Sony release their FF mirrorless body (for say $2500), the market should be able to afford another FF mirrorless body slight above it. So Leica, Contax, Fujifilm or whoever want that niche market can go ahead. Both Zeiss and Fuji have better working relationship with Sony than Leica.
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May 24, 2013 19:08
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It's a funny situation, cause you'd figure a sound way to go about this competition would be to keep your specialized bodies, like the M and the MM, as well as your specialized lenses, but also capitalize on the emerging MILC market by making lenses for those platforms. I mean, they claim to make the best photographic glass out there, right? Adapters are cool and all, but they're still just that: an adaptation. If Leica were to start making AF lenses with their glass for X and ZE, I'm sure people would consider them over Zeiss, especially on higher end bodies like a FF NEX. Hell, Leica could very well sell their glass and let the first parties manufacture the lens body around that glass if they had no interest in the electronics. I really feel mixed about that company: on one hand, they do make excellent glass and some very unique products. On the other hand, they seem to have little interest in producing something that is affordable for even a working professional, preferring to price themselves into a luxury brand. I hate, hate, hate that so much.
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May 24, 2013 19:25
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whatever7 posted:I reckon if and when Sony release their FF mirrorless body (for say $2500), the market should be able to afford another FF mirrorless body slight above it. So Leica, Contax, Fujifilm or whoever want that niche market can go ahead. You mean a FF MILC? Because the rx1 is out already iirc.
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May 25, 2013 19:35
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Any word on the GX2? So far I've been lusting after and OM-D but quite possibly the GX2 will take it's place in my wet dreams.
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May 25, 2013 19:53
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Martytoof posted:You mean a FF MILC? Because the rx1 is out already iirc. The RX1 has a fixed lens though doesn't it?
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May 25, 2013 20:11
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terriyaki posted:The RX1 has a fixed lens though doesn't it? Yeah, that's why I specified MILC. I guess I might be the minority but I consider fixed lens cameras mirrorless as well.
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May 25, 2013 20:14
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spankmeister posted:Any word on the GX2? So far I've been lusting after and OM-D but quite possibly the GX2 will take it's place in my wet dreams. 43rumors has a pretty good list of suspected features up. IBIS, tiltable evf, 18mp sensor, some other stuff. No idea how solid it is.
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May 25, 2013 20:15
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Martytoof posted:Yeah, that's why I specified MILC. I guess I might be the minority but I consider fixed lens cameras mirrorless as well. Oh wait whoops I misinterpreted what you were talking about with whatever7. My bad! Who here actually has an RX1 anyways? Just curious.
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May 25, 2013 20:20
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terriyaki posted:Who here actually has an RX1 anyways? Just curious. whatever7 might, he just has to check under his couch cushions. 
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May 25, 2013 20:37
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terriyaki posted:Oh wait whoops I misinterpreted what you were talking about with whatever7. My bad! I have one and I love it. It's become my everyday carry camera.
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May 25, 2013 20:46
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