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HiKaizer
Feb 2, 2012

Yes!
I finally understand everything there is to know about axes!
Does the game differentiate between militia and standing forces? Because the tutorial recommended landing troops and if they're different to militia, maybe your troops weren't good enough.

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Demiurge4
Aug 10, 2011

HiKaizer posted:

Does the game differentiate between militia and standing forces? Because the tutorial recommended landing troops and if they're different to militia, maybe your troops weren't good enough.

Militia troops are basically your population, they're always green and fairly weak against all things. You can build infantry at the game start, they're a lot stronger in both attack and defence and you can research 3 more troop types. These are armored troops (tanks) who specialize in attack, special forces who have a higher chance of piercing planetary shields and bypassing defences and can disable the shields to let you bombard. Lastly you can research planetary defence troops, they're hard to transport because they're very big but they will try to shoot down landing craft before they reach the surface.

sg54
May 9, 2012
I've been doing quick automated runs through the game to get a feel for it and I'm surprised how smart the AI is, even the military AI; strikes against shipping, blockades and full-up invasions. I've probably sunk 5-6 hours into it since I bought it last night, so I'm only scratching the surface, but the beginning feels really deep. I feel like a space president.

Sankis
Mar 8, 2004

But I remember the fella who told me. Big lad. Arms as thick as oak trees, a stunning collection of scars, nice eye patch. A REAL therapist he was. Er wait. Maybe it was rapist?


I'm so terrible at this game (and adore it). I always fall behind so fast and I'm never really sure what I should be doing. How is everyone else playing? Do you guys tend to focus on one or two things and automate everything else? I'm wondering if I'm just trying to do too much and am too impatient.

William Henry Hairytaint
Oct 29, 2011



I handle everything but exploration ships and construction ships manually, but I certainly didn't start that way. Best way to learn is to hand everything over to the AI and then start taking things over slowly. The AI will do a pretty good job (but not an optimal one) on most things. A lot of things you can set to "AI suggests <whatever", which is basically giving half control to the AI. It'll decide what needs to be done and then ask you to approve or decline. Great way to learn the ropes and have some control while letting the AI do the heavy lifting.

If you're having trouble with any one area in particular mention it here and I'm sure those of us with more experience can offer some advice. The real answer to learning this game though is to just put the hours in.

Bouchacha
Feb 7, 2006

Did the latest expansion fix the "exploit" that allows you to empty the AI's bank account with tech trading?

Sankis
Mar 8, 2004

But I remember the fella who told me. Big lad. Arms as thick as oak trees, a stunning collection of scars, nice eye patch. A REAL therapist he was. Er wait. Maybe it was rapist?


Is there a difference between the various Empire starts aside from the default settings? Is there more being decided than "prewarp empires" when I decide to play a shadow game, for instance?

Frog Assassin posted:

I handle everything but exploration ships and construction ships manually, but I certainly didn't start that way. Best way to learn is to hand everything over to the AI and then start taking things over slowly. The AI will do a pretty good job (but not an optimal one) on most things. A lot of things you can set to "AI suggests <whatever", which is basically giving half control to the AI. It'll decide what needs to be done and then ask you to approve or decline. Great way to learn the ropes and have some control while letting the AI do the heavy lifting.

If you're having trouble with any one area in particular mention it here and I'm sure those of us with more experience can offer some advice. The real answer to learning this game though is to just put the hours in.

Yeah, that's more or less what I figured. I think i'll just start over and default most stuff to automation or asking for confirmation.

By the way, there was a patch earlier today and I didn't see it mentioned:

Erik Rutins posted:

CRASH FIXES
- fixed crash at game startup on some PCs (ManagementObject)
- fixed another rare crash

BUG FIXES
- fixed bug where could have two smuggling missions for a colony if both manually request and then also accept advisor suggestion
- fixed problem where certain races do not start with Resupply Ship when playing as pirate
- fixed colors of pirate bonuses (Empire Summary screen) so that penalties are red and bonuses are green

FREIGHTERS AND RESOURCES
- Construction Ships now also deliver initial retrofit resource cargo to bases they build, thus mining stations have retrofit resources without freighters needing to deliver them afterwards
- bases present at game startup (e.g. mining stations, etc) now have retrofit resource cargo presupplied
- now have less freighters built by private economy, especially in large empires
- now use less Carbon Fibre in components

USER INTERFACE
- Mining Station list in Empire Navigation Tool now shows resources mined instead of cargo
- remapped Screenshot key to "/" key on numeric keypad (instead of "0")
- added hotkey for opening/closing Ground Report screen ("[", open bracket)
- added pirate stats to *own empire* when selected in Diplomacy screen
- now properly adjust size of Ground Report screen so that edges are not off-screen when enlarged
- altered default values for scroll and zoom speed in Game Options so that zooming and scrolling is slower and smoother

OTHER
- AI is now properly sending advisor suggestion to player before sending a pirate fleet to carry out an assigned Defend mission - i.e. not overriding manual control of fleets

Bloodly
Nov 3, 2008

Not as strong as you'd expect.
There are currently other issues at present pirate-side. There are issues with the automation not working.

RandomBlue
Dec 30, 2012

hay guys!


Biscuit Hider
I'm seeing a lot of adviser build recommendations for ships that have no actual ships selected when I open it up. Is this a new issue? Didn't really play the game much prior to this expansion. So far it seems about 3/4ths of their build recommendations are like this. However, I'm still very early in the game, haven't even researched FTL yet.

Sankis
Mar 8, 2004

But I remember the fella who told me. Big lad. Arms as thick as oak trees, a stunning collection of scars, nice eye patch. A REAL therapist he was. Er wait. Maybe it was rapist?


I think that might happen if you have less money than when they suggested it.

Sankis fucked around with this message at 04:45 on May 26, 2013

RandomBlue
Dec 30, 2012

hay guys!


Biscuit Hider

Sankis posted:

I think that might happen if you has less money than when they suggested it.

Nope, I have enough money to cover their recommendations.

Necroneocon
May 12, 2009

by Shine

Bouchacha posted:

Did the latest expansion fix the "exploit" that allows you to empty the AI's bank account with tech trading?

Yes. They fixed everything you can think of.

Demiurge4
Aug 10, 2011

Well as expected there's a ton of bugs in the game, apart from clone troopers having 2.4 million defence strength I think the worst bug I've found is that using boarding pods on abandoned ships will immediately claim and activate them regardless of how damaged they are. If they have a hyperdrive, great they'll go repair themselves, if not you can still repair them without fear of another empire grabbing it.

I just found a pirate constructor that had almost finished a desolation moon. 20 boarding pods later it was mine with 9 components still unbuilt.

Lowen
Mar 16, 2007

Adorable.

I just bought this yesterday and completed an age of shadows game as a smuggler.

One thing I noticed is that only a tiny fraction of my freighters actually did anything, the rest just kind of sat around. Near the end I was taking a lot of smuggling missions, but I had something like 40 freighters and maybe 5 of them at most would be doing anything. Some of them didn't even take on fuel after being built.

I don't know why this is, maybe I was playing too violently? I wanted to try out raids and stuff, and mostly terrorized the independent worlds until they started emerging as empires. Maybe there's an "independent" faction you can't piss off too much? I know I was on really good terms with at least one empire due to doing missions for them (you'll pay me *how much* for destroying the pirate fortress of my hated rivals, who routinely get into brawls with my fleet and raid planets I'm trying to build hidden pirate bases on? don't mind if I do!), but they were far away and nearly everyone else hated me.

Or maybe it's a bug or something else.

In the end I suppose it doesn't matter. Even though the vast majority of my income came from planet control, I still held the most smuggling mission income victory condition from early on (smuggling lead for a bonus of 5 per lead). Eventually my fleets got good enough and I had control over planets with 50% of the galactic population, that's what tilted me over into victory, I guess. Blowing up the two nearby pirate factions that were both competing with me for planet control and directly fighting with me probably helped.

Lowen fucked around with this message at 22:43 on May 26, 2013

William Henry Hairytaint
Oct 29, 2011



^ I saw a report about freighters not fueling up, that's a bug. It's been reported that saving/reloading fixes it. Seems freighters are a little wonky in general right now though, especially pirate ones.

Yeah the robotic troop one is a biggie. Not too fond of fighters continuing to attack captured ships either. I think the worst one though is construction ships that flee from enemies will forget what they were doing once the danger has passed. I'm going to hold off for a patch or two and let them fix the bigger problems. On the bright side that Erik fellow over at the Matrix forum seems to be on the ball with all the bug reports.

Looking at the forum I see there's also one where ships with tractor beams will fire them at space monsters, bringing them into melee range, where of course the monsters need to be to do their shield-piercing damage. That one I actually find funny, though. No more drinking vodkol on duty, guys.

Sankis
Mar 8, 2004

But I remember the fella who told me. Big lad. Arms as thick as oak trees, a stunning collection of scars, nice eye patch. A REAL therapist he was. Er wait. Maybe it was rapist?


I can't make money for the loving life of me. Once I get out of the prewarp phase, I just completely go in the red. I have no god drat idea what I'm doing wrong. I'm not building a ton of ships or anything.

William Henry Hairytaint
Oct 29, 2011



Check your tax rates. You should be able to tax the dogshit out of your homeworld, as long as they're not overall unhappy. Don't tax your new colonies though, it inhibits growth. I try not to tax any planet until its population reaches 2 billion.

How's your private sector? Build more mines and gas mines with your constructors, that will spur growth in the private sector. New colonies will do likewise. All private ships are purchased from the state, so private growth means money in your coffers. Trade with other empires will bring in money as well, so make contact ASAP and try to make friends. Even without a free trade agreement your private citizens will trade with other empires. Just gotta find everybody.

If your private sector is strong you'll be bringing in enough money from them and from trade that running in the red on taxes isn't a big deal. Also once you buddy up to some AIs enough that they're willing to trade techs you can sell them techs they don't have for a fair amount. It's actually possible to fund yourself entirely by brokering tech, because the AI will buy any tech they don't have, even if it's something they don't necessarily need, but I find doing this to be gamey so I don't do it much.

Lowen
Mar 16, 2007

Adorable.

Oh nice, loading up the savegame not only made all my freighters refuel, but they actually started working and I started pulling in cash.

Sankis
Mar 8, 2004

But I remember the fella who told me. Big lad. Arms as thick as oak trees, a stunning collection of scars, nice eye patch. A REAL therapist he was. Er wait. Maybe it was rapist?


I guess the AI is just bad at taxing. I started doing it myself and I'm raking in money now.

Also an AI issue: Any way I can get them to step the gently caress off and stop sending lone ships into pirate sectors? Is there anyway to give a "Hey, don't loving go there, moron" order?

Edit: Jesus gently caress this AI. It seems so much worse than I remember. I can't get it to stop loving itself, and it can't make fleets for loving poo poo.

Sankis fucked around with this message at 03:30 on May 27, 2013

William Henry Hairytaint
Oct 29, 2011



Sankis posted:

Is there anyway to give a "Hey, don't loving go there, moron" order?

Nope. Enjoy watching your explorers enter the same system again and again, only to turn right around and flee because there are hostiles in-system. It's one of the few failings of the AI.

Best you can do is click on the offending ship and send it elsewhere. For explorers you can click any sector of the galaxy and order them to "explore all systems in this sector". That will keep them busy for awhile.

Sankis
Mar 8, 2004

But I remember the fella who told me. Big lad. Arms as thick as oak trees, a stunning collection of scars, nice eye patch. A REAL therapist he was. Er wait. Maybe it was rapist?


Frog Assassin posted:

Nope. Enjoy watching your explorers enter the same system again and again, only to turn right around and flee because there are hostiles in-system. It's one of the few failings of the AI.

Best you can do is click on the offending ship and send it elsewhere. For explorers you can click any sector of the galaxy and order them to "explore all systems in this sector". That will keep them busy for awhile.

I do this but then these stupid fucks just cancel my order because they decide that not attacking the homeworld of the enemy is a better move and instead decide to gently caress off in the middle of deep space. I don't even know. I just had my last game ruined because I couldn't properly wage war with them counteracting all of my orders, even though I thought I had it off.

Edit: I bet I forgot to turn off individual automation. :suicide:

I also need to start designing my own ship. I don't know if the default builds arn't updated or what but even after going heavy into beams my ships seem to be built with lasers. I also have yet to make anything bigger than a destroyer because ???. Also no ship seems to ever have point defense.

Sankis fucked around with this message at 03:41 on May 27, 2013

Lowen
Mar 16, 2007

Adorable.

Sankis posted:

I do this but then these stupid fucks just cancel my order because they decide that not attacking the homeworld of the enemy is a better move and instead decide to gently caress off in the middle of deep space. I don't even know. I just had my last game ruined because I couldn't properly wage war with them counteracting all of my orders, even though I thought I had it off.

They should never cancel your orders unless something really high priority comes up. Not even if they're automated, they'll still do the thing you told them to do before going back on automatic.

Like civilian ships will always run away from attackers.

From the sound of it though, I'm guessing your military ships are trying to escape from combat after their shields got below 50%. If so that's by design, it's the default behavior for military ships. You can change that in ship design to 20% shields or a few other options if you want.

The AI ship designer tends to think the latest thing you got is the best thing, even if it's lower in the tech tree. So you might want to tweak the designs you get.

The escort/frigate/destroyer/cruiser classes are arbitrary, in that you can design them whatever size you want. The ship design AI will typically design cruisers and capitol ships larger than you'll be able to build with starting tech.

HiKaizer
Feb 2, 2012

Yes!
I finally understand everything there is to know about axes!
My current project management figuring out how to fight the space monsters in my home system in the dark age and not feed them a parade of light snacks, such that they grow to 800+ hp.

Zombie #246
Apr 26, 2003

Murr rgghhh ahhrghhh fffff
How does the lategame compare in this expansion to the pre-expansion game? I had to set stuff manually to create gigantic fuckoff empires to face off against in the editor (basically giving the insect races the super evil church on their homeworld, and putting the other insect races near them), but that wasn't too tough in retrospect.

Is it intense enough that you have alot on your hands?

Darkrenown
Jul 18, 2012
please give me anything to talk about besides the fact that democrats are allowing millions of americans to be evicted from their homes
I don't understand the research screen. I have my total potential research stat, ok, but then I have a research number for each field and then an adjusted total for each of them. Which of these should I be comparing to my potential to see if I need more/less labs? Do I need to sum them? If so why doesn't the screen do it for me? Argh.

Bloodly
Nov 3, 2008

Not as strong as you'd expect.
Take your maximum total potential. Divide it by three. That's how much each area can generate total, which is why it notes how much is in each area. The game never tells you this. Uncertain whether research bonuses can break that cap.

Mayveena
Dec 27, 2006

People keep vandalizing my ID photo; I've lodged a complaint with HR
Here's a post and further discussion on how to start a game as a newbie:

http://www.matrixgames.com/forums/tm.asp?m=3333889

Sankis
Mar 8, 2004

But I remember the fella who told me. Big lad. Arms as thick as oak trees, a stunning collection of scars, nice eye patch. A REAL therapist he was. Er wait. Maybe it was rapist?


In my most recent shadows game I seem to be stuck in a loop. I need ~9k to colonize a nearby planet, but once I get to about 5k I suddenly lose it all on something. Is there some kind of budget to see where it's going? I have all of my constructors off so the AI isn't building mining bases.

Edit: ugh. I can't get anywhere. The beginning of shadows takes like 2 hours, too. It's 2117 and I'm stuck on the same loving colony :( I've been playing for like 4 hours and I always get stuck in some loving loop where I can't do much of anything. This is even with the difficulty lowered similar to that newbie post. I have no idea what's up considering I had like 3 other games that I did decently in at the start.

Sankis fucked around with this message at 04:14 on May 28, 2013

Lowen
Mar 16, 2007

Adorable.

Sankis posted:

In my most recent shadows game I seem to be stuck in a loop. I need ~9k to colonize a nearby planet, but once I get to about 5k I suddenly lose it all on something. Is there some kind of budget to see where it's going? I have all of my constructors off so the AI isn't building mining bases.

Edit: ugh. I can't get anywhere. The beginning of shadows takes like 2 hours, too. It's 2117 and I'm stuck on the same loving colony :( I've been playing for like 4 hours and I always get stuck in some loving loop where I can't do much of anything. This is even with the difficulty lowered similar to that newbie post. I have no idea what's up considering I had like 3 other games that I did decently in at the start.

Weird, after I did the Age of Shadows smuggler game I went to an age of shadows empire game on normal settings, and it was barely even a speedbump to my empire building. I kind of like it though, it has more of a fresh start feel compared to the old one where you already had a bunch of mining bases in a nearby system every time.

The empire report (F6) shows your budget, but you might just want to try just taking everything off automation while you save up? That means constructors, troop recruitment, anything that could spend money. You could always put them back on. Also make sure you don't have any missions going, if you have a smuggling mission for lead or something it could easily cost you 5000 per load.

I remember getting that first colony was a big deal financially, the moment it got plopped down my private sector decided it needed to double the number of ships it had, giving me a huge cash influx. It's not any different than it was in legends mechanically, except you have a lot less when it happens.

PS! 1.9.0.2 is out, I got it with the patcher in the launcher. Details here.

Demiurge4
Aug 10, 2011

I got really boned with my latest Age of Shadows start, I'm using increased tech costs (320k base compared to normal 120k) and as a result I've been stuck with slow hyperdrives for a number of years now. I have 2 systems within easy reach of my homeworld and it's a mixed blessing, one system had two independent colonies that I was able to invade and take over, but none of the systems have a gas giant with caslon so my only source of fuel is smugglers. I'm making do however and I'm just having a blast, I love the fact that I'm highly dependent on the smugglers right now.

As for the guy above with problems, you probably have automatic ship building on, and your AI is trying to build a military. You can turn that off or increase taxes but if you're having difficulties with the age of shadows start I recommend you use normal tech levels. There's a few big differences between normal and pre-warp starts and one of them is that your home system is incredibly poo poo in the pre-warp because it's designed to be that way. In a normal tech start your home system will potentially have double the planets.

Sankis
Mar 8, 2004

But I remember the fella who told me. Big lad. Arms as thick as oak trees, a stunning collection of scars, nice eye patch. A REAL therapist he was. Er wait. Maybe it was rapist?


Jesus loving christ. I swear, there's always one god drat thing to completely grind my games to a complete loving halt. This time I have my money under control but there is no Krypton, Aculun, or Nekros Stone in any of the adjacent systems and my ships and bases are all refusing to finish until they get this bullshit.

Since no bases are finishing, my ships have to go back to my home colony to refuel. As soon as they loving jump away, some loving pirate jumps in and destroys whatever I had built. My first couple games went off fine but now there's always some loving problem. I really don't get it. I love(d) this game and really want to play it but this is really pissing me off.

I've tried smuggling missions but I never get anything from that, either. I've waited in game years and nothing has come from any of this so I may as well abandon it because there's no chance I'll be able to catch up to the AI at this rate.

Demiurge4 posted:

I got really boned with my latest Age of Shadows start, I'm using increased tech costs (320k base compared to normal 120k) and as a result I've been stuck with slow hyperdrives for a number of years now. I have 2 systems within easy reach of my homeworld and it's a mixed blessing, one system had two independent colonies that I was able to invade and take over, but none of the systems have a gas giant with caslon so my only source of fuel is smugglers. I'm making do however and I'm just having a blast, I love the fact that I'm highly dependent on the smugglers right now.

As for the guy above with problems, you probably have automatic ship building on, and your AI is trying to build a military. You can turn that off or increase taxes but if you're having difficulties with the age of shadows start I recommend you use normal tech levels. There's a few big differences between normal and pre-warp starts and one of them is that your home system is incredibly poo poo in the pre-warp because it's designed to be that way. In a normal tech start your home system will potentially have double the planets.

I played the hell out of the original stuff. I just want to play shadows :(. The game sure doesn't seem to want it, though.


Edit: I feel like I'm complaining too much. I love this game but the seemingly random fuckery that can happen in the first 2 hours of a shadows game is driving me nuts.

Sankis fucked around with this message at 09:30 on May 28, 2013

The General
Mar 4, 2007


One of the expansions says you can play in windowed mode, yet there is no option for it? :smith:

V for Vegas
Sep 1, 2004

THUNDERDOME LOSER
An onscreen option in the game? :lol: This is a matrix game. You have to edit startup.ini and delete the following.

Distant Worlds startup settings

screenwidth 1024
screenheight 768

Sankis
Mar 8, 2004

But I remember the fella who told me. Big lad. Arms as thick as oak trees, a stunning collection of scars, nice eye patch. A REAL therapist he was. Er wait. Maybe it was rapist?


Okay, so is there any kind of in depth economy guide? Even after having the basics explained to me, I just can't understand how to make money and keep making money. Even controlling my taxes for all of my planets and adjusting it based on population, it's just constantly fluctuating. Even with automation turned off, it's fluctuating. One moment I was making 40k per whatever period of time the next it sank all the way down to -120k and I was constantly in the red. I've looked over the in game "How does my empire make money?" poo poo many times and as far as I can tell everyone is trading. I also have hundreds of little private sector ships buzzing around and dozens of mining facilities all over the place on a variety of resources. I'm guessing I'm just expanding too much but there's no feedback if that's the case. Well, except the falling income but it's not exactly telling me why. I feel like I've finally got a grasp on starting out okay but this games economy is just so confusing and poorly documented.

Also Pirates feel really overpowered in Shadow. I get that it's the entire point, but even after crippling a faction (or so I thought) they'll send in a dozen ships to harass my colonies. It's also really, really, REALLY loving annoying that as soon as you colonize anything they'll raid it about 12 times. Is the AI just cheating? I know previous iterations had some pretty egregious examples of AI rubberbanding.

Sankis fucked around with this message at 08:34 on May 29, 2013

Demiurge4
Aug 10, 2011

Sankis posted:

Okay, so is there any kind of in depth economy guide? Even after having the basics explained to me, I just can't understand how to make money and keep making money. Even controlling my taxes for all of my planets and adjusting it based on population, it's just constantly fluctuating. Even with automation turned off, it's fluctuating. One moment I was making 40k per whatever period of time the next it sank all the way down to -120k and I was constantly in the red. I've looked over the in game "How does my empire make money?" poo poo many times and as far as I can tell everyone is trading. I also have hundreds of little private sector ships buzzing around and dozens of mining facilities all over the place on a variety of resources. I'm guessing I'm just expanding too much but there's no feedback if that's the case. Well, except the falling income but it's not exactly telling me why. I feel like I've finally got a grasp on starting out okay but this games economy is just so confusing and poorly documented.

Also Pirates feel really overpowered in Shadow. I get that it's the entire point, but even after crippling a faction (or so I thought) they'll send in a dozen ships to harass my colonies. It's also really, really, REALLY loving annoying that as soon as you colonize anything they'll raid it about 12 times. Is the AI just cheating? I know previous iterations had some pretty egregious examples of AI rubberbanding.

Basically, what I do is secure the most important strategic resources in the game. With a shadows start I'll build 3 slowboating explorers and check things out, meanwhile I'm building constructors and sending them to build mines. The most important resources for you in the early game are steel and caslon, caslon is your fuel and steel is used in almost everything. My strategy to doing it is to just send a constructor and scrap it when it's done if it's on the other end of the system.

I also like to superboost my homeworld by saving up a bunch of money at 40% tax rate (this is easy as there's not much to spend it on in the early game) and when I have around 80k I'll reduce taxes to 0 and watch my population explode. In my current game I got my homeworld to 21 billion before I even left the system and that was around 180k income.

Pirates will only raid weak planets, station at least 3-4 troops on new colonies and expand slowly so you can leave fleets in orbit to protect it. Design a barebones stardock for your colonies with at least a tractor beam and a bunch of weapons to take out small raiders. You'll still get raided by big fleets occasionally though.

Basically if you're in the red you're expanding too fast, military upkeep especially is a killer. Expand slowly by invading independents and secure them before moving on. I recommend enforcing a colony distance when you create a game because it'll let you avoid AI's stealing your targets but also allow them to be more defensible themselves.

The General
Mar 4, 2007


Edit: nevermind. Sorry.

The General fucked around with this message at 14:43 on May 29, 2013

Abyss
Oct 29, 2011
What is usually the optimum time to retrofit your ships/bases/etc? My advisers tend to recommend a retrofit nearly every time a new tech is implemented, so my fleets tend to constantly be in an infinite loop of going back to the nearest spaceport to get the latest toy. Are there some large advancements in which retrofitting is a must? I just think that the AI is trying, in good faith, to keep all my ships up to date but I know I wouldn't be able to do this with a warmongering race.

knob
May 25, 2005

knob
So I'm pretty clueless about this game and not much of a 4X pro to begin with. I'm playing a game as the Ackdarian right now and kind of fumbling my way through it.

Almost everyone is annoyed with me because "I refuse to trade valuable resources with them." What does this mean? I assumed it had to do with free trade agreements, but no one will take me up on the offer. Even the few I've bribed to friendly and/or are naturally friendly with refuse.

Also, I found the Devastation Moon. How long does this thing take to repair? I feel like I've been at this forever and it's still going (is there a way to see progress, or do I just have to wait and hope it gets done soon)?

Edit: Yep, I guess I have Loros Fruit. I almost feel silly for missing the box now that it's been pointed out. Thanks

knob fucked around with this message at 23:13 on May 29, 2013

Lowen
Mar 16, 2007

Adorable.

^^^ You have a source of one of the super rare luxury resources, there should be a checkbox at the very bottom of the diplomacy summary for that race for each super rare luxury resource you have. Tick the boxes to authorize trading the resource to them.

If it doesn't show it might be because there's too much crap on your diplomacy window. Unfortunately I don't know of any way around that.

Sankis posted:

Okay, so is there any kind of in depth economy guide? Even after having the basics explained to me, I just can't understand how to make money and keep making money. Even controlling my taxes for all of my planets and adjusting it based on population, it's just constantly fluctuating. Even with automation turned off, it's fluctuating. One moment I was making 40k per whatever period of time the next it sank all the way down to -120k and I was constantly in the red. I've looked over the in game "How does my empire make money?" poo poo many times and as far as I can tell everyone is trading. I also have hundreds of little private sector ships buzzing around and dozens of mining facilities all over the place on a variety of resources. I'm guessing I'm just expanding too much but there's no feedback if that's the case. Well, except the falling income but it's not exactly telling me why. I feel like I've finally got a grasp on starting out okay but this games economy is just so confusing and poorly documented.

This is a really neat expansion pack for a really neat game, I feel bad that you're having a hard time with it. I hope I can help.

Trading actually doesn't make you that much money. You need to do it in order to secure the strategic resources you need to build stuff and the luxury resources you need to bring your world development levels up (which leads to more happiness/higher growth or more taxes), but once the resources are secured you'll generally just build up a buffer. The trading income itself though is very small and tends to fluctuate a lot besides.

It's also possible to drive maintenance costs up if you have shortages or sudden surges in demand for commodities. Check the expansion planner screen (F3) and sort by the "unfullfil" column in the middle and compare that to your stock. If the stock isn't much larger, then the cost of that resource can easily double. When the price of a resource changes, the cost of maintaining designs that use that resource change accordingly.

I have a late game empire with an extremely strong economy and steel is at 1.7 from an apparent resting point of 0.8 simply due to the sudden demand for new spaceports around all my colonies. Resource shortages like this also make colonies unhappy.

That's a lot easier to do early in the game because you might not have things like necros stones or dilithium crystals, but you might do research on new ship systems that use them. You'll also have smaller stockpiles of things you do have source for, so even a small surge in building can tax your existing supplies.

Anyway, if you do have a strategic resource shortage consider issuing a smuggling mission. Also consider smuggling missions if you don't have 10 different luxury resources.
The missions will cost you money in the short run but may also save you money by decreasing your maintenance costs.

Also check your ship designs and try not to use components that use resources you have shortages in, they'll be highlighted in yellow. Try not to build in surges.

Speaking of revenue - maintenance, the number you should be looking at is your colony tax income on the empire summary screen (F6). That's the only thing you can count on to be about constant. Compare that to your maintenance costs. If the maintenance costs are bigger, then you need to reduce the amount of maintenance you're paying. Retire some ships, bases, or troops.

You probably won't want to retire any spaceports though.

If you've captured any ships, definitely retire those first, because taking apart foreign ships will generally give you huge tech boosts. Even if they aren't bigger than you can build or have components you can't build, you'll generally get something from them.

Sankis posted:

Also Pirates feel really overpowered in Shadow. I get that it's the entire point, but even after crippling a faction (or so I thought) they'll send in a dozen ships to harass my colonies. It's also really, really, REALLY loving annoying that as soon as you colonize anything they'll raid it about 12 times. Is the AI just cheating? I know previous iterations had some pretty egregious examples of AI rubberbanding.

If they still have ships, they aren't crippled. I guess you killed their spaceport? Pirates start with a constructor, they can have as many bases as they can afford. They can lose their first spaceport and build another elsewhere.

When they park ships near colonies they get influence with the colony, which gives them passive money, like tax income. Sometimes they randomly get new constructors from worlds they have influence with (they can't build constructors themselves, without planets). Raids also increase influence, in addition to all the loot.

They make money and get resources by raiding with their ships. If they have ships to raid you with, then they are in no way shape or form crippled, they're making money and potentially getting constructors. Bottom line, cripple the pirates by defending your colony and killing their ships. Even if you can't stop the raids for whatever reason (you need some troops for this), if you can blow up or capture one of their ships you hurt their bottom line in the long run.

Another thing to check is the colonies screen (F2). Look for any colonies with facilities, then look at the list of facilities. If you see any pirate bases, drop a bunch of troops (I think as of 1.9.0.2 you need more than 100k strength for the first level of base) on the planet and then attack the facility. If you've colonized any independent worlds you may be suffering from a massive loss in income if pirates have managed to build any bases there. Pirate income drains money from you!

Lowen fucked around with this message at 23:10 on May 29, 2013

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William Henry Hairytaint
Oct 29, 2011



Retrofit whenever you can afford to have a chunk of your Navy out of action for a little while. Do it in waves, don't send every fleet at once. Doing that will leave you with zero defense and will clog your space ports up with traffic, making it take forever to get the retrofit finished.

As for when, again, anytime you can spare a chunk of your Navy being inactive and you've got the funds. Off the top of my head though, Ion Cannons, Damage Control, new shields, engines, and reactors are all worth pushing out ASAP. New engines and reactors in particular are good reasons to do a refit, usually a new generation of these means you'll need fewer of them on your ships, freeing up space for other components. New weapon techs (i.e. concussion missile -> assault missile) are good too, as obviously you want to deploy the stronger ones ASAP. When you get a tech that just enhances something you already have you don't have to worry about refitting.

Don't be afraid to put off retrofitting for awhile if the situation is right. If you're at peace, not constantly fending off pirates, and you've got a ton of new techs coming shortly, let it wait a bit. Just don't get lazy about it.

knob posted:

Almost everyone is annoyed with me because "I refuse to trade valuable resources with them." What does this mean? I assumed it had to do with free trade agreements, but no one will take me up on the offer. Even the few I've bribed to friendly and/or are naturally friendly with refuse.

Also, I found the Devastation Moon. How long does this thing take to repair? I feel like I've been at this forever and it's still going (is there a way to see progress, or do I just have to wait and hope it gets done soon)?

There are three resources in the game that are "special" luxuries and provide a much bigger boost to colony growth, and you have at least one of them if you're getting this message. There should be a little checkbox at the bottom of the diplomacy screen for each empire that says "trade our <whatever with them". Check it if you like, but be careful not to deplete your stock because it'll hurt your colony growth.

Can't help you with the Moon as I keep story events off and I'm pretty sure that removes them from the game, but it'll take a long time.

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