|
Morally Inept posted:Urban Smurf, you getting a bit butt hurt because even the mods think you post too much whacked out poo poo? Sometimes your "theories" are a bit over the top that even Einstein would ask for clarification. Wow and you havn't even seen his Battle Star Galactica theory.
|
#
?
Jun 20, 2013 17:27
|
|
|
|
| # ? Jun 3, 2024 13:26 |
|
|
Morally Inept posted:Urban Smurf, you getting a bit butt hurt because even the mods think you post too much whacked out poo poo? Sometimes your "theories" are a bit over the top that even Einstein would ask for clarification.
|
|
#
?
Jun 20, 2013 17:27
|
|
|
Deteriorata posted:It appears that Preiss was quite clear that he meant Spain. Consequently, I think your idea is nuts and am not willing to invest any time in it. Respectfully, I made an edit to my previous post. I'm just curious to see if there is a basis for the author to put work into making any part of this hunt challenging by means of misdirection. Just that had the parenthetical Spain not been there, how would we have considered this? Its an intelligent question, framed and focused with citation and its shocking to think you think such process is nuts. Furthermore, I'm not even that concerned if you agree with me. I just noted the tenacity in these forums and took that as a sign people here don't believe everything they read. I assumed you wouldn't be milquetoast. Preiss has hosed with us for 30 years and you act way too nonchalant about it. I intend to research and ask questions to solve the puzzles problems. I don't wish to invest my time solving your personal problems. ( But PM me if you really want to talk about it.) Urban Smurf fucked around with this message at 17:56 on Jun 20, 2013 |
|
#
?
Jun 20, 2013 17:35
|
|
|
I had a dream last night that you guys found a cask. I guess I've been bitten by the bug as well. I only wish I lived closer than 4 hours to the one closest to me (Charleston) so I could assist in helping. This thread has become easier to read once I put a few select people on "ignore" status. There is a lot of good work being done here, mostly by people on the ground who are seeing what Preiss would have seen. I hope some digging starts happening soon, and that we unearth at least a couple of these damned things.
|
|
#
?
Jun 20, 2013 17:37
|
|
|
rookhunter posted:Wow and you havn't even seen his Battle Star Galactica theory. Please don't bring that up. I debunked it long ago. You're eating into my 1 crazy theory post quota.
|
|
#
?
Jun 20, 2013 17:39
|
|
|
AARP LARPer fucked around with this message at 01:57 on Jan 23, 2016 |
|
#
?
Jun 20, 2013 17:40
|
|
|
I just noticed something that I think will really help us get on track:
|
|
#
?
Jun 20, 2013 17:45
|
|
|
Urban Smurf posted:Respectfully, I made an edit to my previous post. I'm just curious to see if there is a basis for the author to put work into making any part of this hunt challenging by means of misdirection. Just that had the parenthetical Spain not been there, how would we have considered this? Its an intelligent question, framed and focused with citation and its shocking to think you think such process is nuts. The process isn't nuts, the particular question is. You asked if it was possible that's what he meant. BJG gave a pretty clear answer showing that it wasn't. Asking the question is not the problem. Ignoring the direct evidence supplied to you is.
|
|
#
?
Jun 20, 2013 17:50
|
|
|
Deteriorata posted:The process isn't nuts, the particular question is. You asked if it was possible that's what he meant. BJG gave a pretty clear answer showing that it wasn't. I'm sorry I still don't see where Hadras is defined. I came up with very little on it when I googled. It said a U.S. teacher of Classics. My classes at the University in the subjuct of Classics were heavily if not entirely focused on ancient Greece. Don't you think its odd to use Hadras to mean Spain?
|
|
#
?
Jun 20, 2013 18:03
|
|
|
xie posted:I don't understand how you can spend years trying to solve this and have such a poor grasp of how the puzzles work. I don't mean just getting things wrong, there's nothing wrong with throwing some stuff against the wall, but I mean trying to deconstruct them into some sort of geometry puzzle or weird tie ins to the Iberian peninsula or whatever the gently caress. Seconded. I admit I had some crazy ideas involving google maps and overlays at first, but yeah I don't think there is any way that Priess spent the amount of time involved in precise mapwork...in 1981. Honestly I'm starting to think his "riddles" are lovely, and the chances of any of these other casks being found without the use of a backhoe and ground penetrating radar, are slim to none. Still, I've learned a lot about Milwaukee I never knew...maybe knowledge is the REAL treasure. 
|
|
#
?
Jun 20, 2013 18:10
|
|
|
Urban Smurf posted:I'm sorry I still don't see where Hadras is defined. I came up with very little on it when I googled. It said a U.S. teacher of Classics. My classes at the University in the subjuct of Classics were heavily if not entirely focused on ancient Greece. Don't you think its odd to use Hadras to mean Spain? Now that's easy. Look at the scan of the introduction (which was linked on the last page). It doesn't say "hadras". It says "hadas". Which is the spanish word for "fairies".
|
|
#
?
Jun 20, 2013 18:15
|
|
|
Urban Smurf posted:
When I think "shy flower" I think of the violet. Technically it is a "shrinking violet", but the phrase is coined as a "shy violet". This is a pretty common term afaik. I am not sure of any other flower that is likened to being "shy". Dr. Bit posted:Milwaukee As with many other gemstones that are quartz they can vary in color. While the amethyst is traditionally purple, it can be red or blue in hue as well. So, maybe it is still an amethyst but instead a blue one, if that is true, then there must be a reason he would've picked it to be blue over the traditional purple amethyst. Although, I am at a loss as to what the significance is.
|
|
#
?
Jun 20, 2013 18:15
|
|
|
For flowers, check here: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Language_of_flowers I'd always heard it as "shrinking violet" though.
|
|
#
?
Jun 20, 2013 18:35
|
|
|
PunkNickel posted:When I think "shy flower" I think of the violet. Technically it is a "shrinking violet", but the phrase is coined as a "shy violet". This is a pretty common term afaik. I am not sure of any other flower that is likened to being "shy". I tend to think of shy flowers as ones that are small and hard to see. They may be lost among other foliage, or downturned, or closed most of the time. A daisy or sunflower would be a bold flower, always bright and open and impossible to miss. There's also the touch-me-not, which is sometimes called the "shy flower". It's got touch-sensitive leaves that will fold up when touched (animated gif and video at the link). It is native to Central and South America. I'm not sure how relevant it is.
|
|
#
?
Jun 20, 2013 18:42
|
|
|
Neutrino posted:Just to clarify, the actual verses are: They could well be separate verses, you're right! I should have accounted for that! As for the pace -- they both do exist even today. The single-step one is sometimes called the "military pace" and the two-step one the "geometric(al) pace" or "great pace"; it did not end with the Roman Empire. EDIT: The Oxford English Dictionary cites "geometrical pace" as late as 2008. homullus fucked around with this message at 19:36 on Jun 20, 2013 |
|
#
?
Jun 20, 2013 19:14
|
|
|
AARP LARPer fucked around with this message at 01:57 on Jan 23, 2016 |
|
#
?
Jun 20, 2013 19:24
|
|
|
Cask 2 - Charleston, SC Today I went to White Point Gardens on my lunch hour (despite what looks like a thunderstorm that could happen any minute here.) This is a picture of the triangulation marker in the Battery.  If you lie down on the Battery and look straight out over the marker, this is what you see. That is Fort Sumter dead ahead. The wide end of the triangle is closest to me, the tip of the triangle is pointing straight at Fort Sumter.   For better or worse, I've convinced myself at this point. It was worth all of the weird looks from tourists for lying on my stomach on High Battery in a dress and heels, trying not to drop my iphone in the damned harbor.  I placed the request to dig via an online form, but when I got back in the office I tried calling them directly. Got the voicemail but I'm going to keep trying, I want to get an answer from them as soon as possible.Edit: Still got voicemail, left a message. They closed at 4pm, but I think I will stop by their office tomorrow on my lunch hour. bonestructure fucked around with this message at 23:18 on Jun 20, 2013 |
|
#
?
Jun 20, 2013 20:21
|
|
|
rookhunter posted:Wow and you havn't even seen his Battle Star Galactica theory.
|
|
#
?
Jun 20, 2013 20:30
|
|
|
Sham I Am posted:I just got approved at Q4T, now I have to go find this theory. Looks, dude's got weird theories but I'm more tired of listening to criticism of him than his weird theories. He/she only gets one a day and you can always just press ignore. I'm loving the Charleston thought process!
|
|
#
?
Jun 20, 2013 20:47
|
|
|
Do Not Resuscitate posted:San Francisco -- Verse 7 -- Portsmouth Square Theory The Transamerica building is a mile and a half from Aquatic Park and calling it an Ace because it barely resembles an A is ridiculous. There's also nothing to indicate Portsmouth vs. any other park in the area. The object of Twain's attention gives you the direction to face, but it isn't visible from anywhere near the Transamerica building. The treasure is buried within sight of Twain's attention. Also 'Sounds from the sky / Near ace is high' should be taken as one line to symbolize the air raid sirens: The sirens being the sound from the sky, the near ace being the plane/pilot.
|
|
#
?
Jun 20, 2013 20:51
|
|
|
First I really love this thread, and all the possible clues and all the puzzle solving that goes on in here. I havent finished reading this thread yet, but I wanted to point one little thing out, that just crossed my mind, maybe its even come up already. I noticed that a lot of people are not only using google maps for historical reference but also to compare the images to shapes in the pictures. I dont thing this is the right thing to go about this. This puzzle was created in the 80s and supposed to be solvable by common people reading the books in the 80s. These people didnt have easy access to sattelite images and maps. I think, for the most part, that clues in the images refer to shapes that you see at the ground. When you are actually at the place, not when looking at the place top down. Of course I realize that we have to use old sattelite images and maps because a lot of things have changed, but I dont think we can directly compare clues in the pictures to those images.
|
|
#
?
Jun 20, 2013 21:19
|
|
|
Cask 2 Interesting note for those searching near white point. There appears to be some map theme in the picture.   I also found out that the Arthur Ravenel Jr bridge replaced two bridges, the Grace Memorial bridge and the Pearman bridge rookhunter fucked around with this message at 21:39 on Jun 20, 2013 |
|
#
?
Jun 20, 2013 21:20
|
|
|
bonestructure posted:For better or worse, I've convinced myself at this point. It was worth all of the weird looks from tourists for lying on High Battery in a dress and heels, trying not to drop my iphone in the damned harbor. If you hear back and you need some help digging, let me know. Even if you don't need help, let me know so I can stand around and watch awkwardly. I really think you're on to something here.
|
|
#
?
Jun 20, 2013 21:20
|
|
|
demonicon posted:This puzzle was created in the 80s and supposed to be solvable by common people reading the books in the 80s. These people didnt have easy access to sattelite images and maps. They also did not solve the puzzles. I think that there is no problem with using google and google maps because there have been some interesting things found that seem to match quite well doing this. I agree, however, that being on the ground (but in the right place!) is the most important thing.
|
|
#
?
Jun 20, 2013 21:30
|
|
|
AARP LARPer fucked around with this message at 01:57 on Jan 23, 2016 |
|
#
?
Jun 20, 2013 21:32
|
|
|
Invicta{HOG}, M.D. posted:Looks, dude's got weird theories but I'm more tired of listening to criticism of him than his weird theories. He/she only gets one a day and you can always just press ignore. roanoke Anyway, I read the Verse 11 and Illustration 3 threads at Q4T, and I didn't see very much that we hadn't already arrived at ourselves in the first couple of days. A couple of things that I did see... They think the spoon in the bottom right is a pea spoon and that it represents pea island which is pretty close to Roanoke, though I still think it is a lever. At one point some of them were making a connection between the bells and the glass insulators on a telephone pole. Someone posted an image of a lantern that hangs all over the Gardens and that has some resemblance to a bell. There seemed to be a lot of interest in associating the wizard of oz to the puzzle. I didnt really pay attention to individual posters while I was reading, so it could be just a single poster pushing one or all of these ideas. Oswald Kesselpot fucked around with this message at 22:18 on Jun 20, 2013 |
|
#
?
Jun 20, 2013 21:37
|
|
|
demonicon posted:First I really love this thread, and all the possible clues and all the puzzle solving that goes on in here. I havent finished reading this thread yet, but I wanted to point one little thing out, that just crossed my mind, maybe its even come up already. Road maps showing what streets look like from above have been available for 100 years or more. It is not at all unreasonable to think he might include those sorts of things. Hell, the Cleveland image included a map of Ohio. Using Google maps and whatnot is simply a shortcut to do easily what would have been a pain (but quite possible) 30 years ago. I can also use street views to get a look at locations I would have no access to otherwise. I don't have to live in San Francisco to get an idea of what the general layout of the city is, and what landmarks are visible from various places. He clearly didn't intend for them to be solved with stuff like Google maps, but I have no problem with using those tools if they help us figure them out faster. Ultimately, we have to have somebody on the ground at possible locations to verify our theories, but anything and everything is fair game to get to that point.
|
|
#
?
Jun 20, 2013 21:47
|
|
|
Deteriorata posted:Road maps showing what streets look like from above have been available for 100 years or more. It is not at all unreasonable to think he might include those sorts of things. Hell, the Cleveland image included a map of Ohio. You are right, maps were certainly available, and I should have been more clear in my post about that. I dont think you can use a map to identify the city a gem is in, because people in the 80s financially wouldnt have been able to buy maps of all major cities in the U.S. and compare them to the images. They might have bought a map if they were very positive about the location though, but I am still not convinced, that the author intended maps to be used that much. I generally agree with you though, that we should use all tools available and I certainly think that we should think in all directions possible, but I also think a lot of overanalyzing is done here. We should always keep in mind the situation an average guy in the 80s was in. My theory is that the author intended the verses to be used to identify the general location and the starting point for someone trying to find the casks and then the images to be used along with the verses at the starting point and on the ground to find the exact location. Using the verses like this and not the images as a starting point would have been much easier for people 30 years ago. I really dont wont to discourage anyone from doing anything though  edit: Exluding easy things in the pictures like latitudes and longitudes or the shape of the Ohio state which you could even recognize without a map of course. I really dont want to derail the thread with this though and will try to only post again when I have a real contribution
demonicon fucked around with this message at 23:07 on Jun 20, 2013 |
|
#
?
Jun 20, 2013 22:29
|
|
|
Invicta{HOG}, M.D. posted:They also did not solve the puzzles. I think that there is no problem with using google and google maps because there have been some interesting things found that seem to match quite well doing this. I agree, however, that being on the ground (but in the right place!) is the most important thing. The other thing with using Google Maps, and in particular Google Earth with historic imagery, is that in some cases, this is all the record we have of where things were in 1982. For instance, the SP982 train that everyone likes for the 982 reference in the Houston verse is no longer located there and was moved slightly around the lake in Herman Park before the relocation to Minute Maid park. Unrelated to the quest: Considering that it was such a big deal to move it -- there's an episode of Mega Movers on it -- I wonder how they moved it previously. It didn't go nearly as far, but it would seem to me that moving a locomotive 50 feet would require the same kind of work as moving it a mile. einTier fucked around with this message at 22:33 on Jun 20, 2013 |
|
#
?
Jun 20, 2013 22:30
|
|
|
I just moved to Cleveland last weekend so sadly I can't go around searching for one of the unfound casques, but I did pop over to the Cleveland Cultural Garden today to take a look at where that one was found. Took some pictures as well since there's been discussion about how close the drawings are to the actual objects they represent. The Greek and Italian gardens are right next to each other. The lion fountain is in the Italian one  Walking up to the 'front' of the Greek garden, you see this  Close up of the column  Closer to the Wall.The Greek names are inscribed below the 'windows' on the wall  Backside of the wall  The location of the Cleveland casque 
|
|
#
?
Jun 20, 2013 22:53
|
|
|
demonicon posted:I dont think you can use a map to identify the city a gem is in,  
|
|
#
?
Jun 20, 2013 23:04
|
|
|
Cask 1 Verse 7 : Crazy San Francisco Theory (6/20/13) At stone wall's door Stone wall (idiom): We've run into a stone wall in our investigation. Unable to solve a problem: The Thinker (sculpture). The air smells sweet "heir" "sugar" fits rather well with Alma Spreckels, heiress to a fortune from sugar plantation, friend of Rodin and placed his work at the Palace of the Legion of Honor. Not far away High posts are three Several triple-lamp posts line the curved portion of the parking lot that fits the curve around the woman's head, the very tops of the lamps are an exact match to the top of the watch on table, notice the new location for the terminus marker for the Lincoln Memorial Highway:  Education and Justice For all to see “and justice for all.”: last four words of The Pledge of Allegiance, conceived to promote American nationalism to children in schools, The Pledge's final four words are "and justice for all" and is performed while facing a flag. Sounds from the sky “Fore!”: golf term for “look ahead”. Near ace is high Ace (cards), alphabet version: the letter A, if it's high, then it's considered one step greater than the king, the letter K, which is the letter L. Ace high is one step higher in rank than the King, the letter K. One letter beyond K is the letter L. This line translates to "Near the letter L". There happens to be a large letter L on the terminus marker for the Lincoln Memorial Highway inserted just next to the Three Shades sculpture. Numeric version: A = 14, nearest numbers are 13 or 15. The 15th hole on the golf course is just beyond the balustrade. I prefer the Lincoln Marker solution.  Running north, but first across The Golden Gate Bridge runs north across the bay and is itself first across. In jewel's direction Is an object Of Twain's attention Alcatraz Federal Penitentiary (Pen): Twain (pen-name) uses this object (pen) to write. This is an instruction to use a map to set a course in the direction of the Pen. Giant pole Betsy Ross Memorial Flagpole Giant step To the place The casque is kept. Keep in mind that sometime since 1981 the Betsy Ross Memorial Flagpole has been replaced with a big red metal sculpture. The Three Shades have been removed. The Lincoln Highway marker has been moved a good distance to the edge of the lot. All we can do is look at the few pictures we've been lucky enough to find and some crappy historic aerials to get a sense for their positions. A) The Betsy Ross Memorial Flagpole B) Terminus Marker for the Lincoln Memorial Highway (original location) C) Alcatraz, the answer to the object of Twain's attention: a Pen (Penitentiary) I thought the first obvious spot would be just over the edge (giant step) and at the base of the wall beyond the parking lot. Maltedfalcon at Q4T has done real shoveling to confirm it's not the spot unless it's buried much deeper than we think. I then thought, what in the verse tells us to follow that line to an obvious spot beyond the wall? I thought "near ace is high" could be inspired by A=14 (one higher than a King in cards) and therefore the 15th hole could be thougth of as near 14. Does that tell us to go onto the golf course grounds? I'm unable to determine a spot on the course itself that draws me in to justify a dig. I want to avoid the sense of it feeling too random. I then consider to continue along that line until I bump into a novel looking site, which takes me to the bench on the road below the course. At the bench we see the Golden Gate Bridge, which could be "Running north but first across". The bench also fits my idea for the first line where at Stone wall's door sits The Thinker sculpture and I believe it becomes relevant when we have to sit down on something to think: a rock, a chair or a bench.  I've made an adjustment to the angle I've been estimating based on taking an exact line to Alcatraz from the center of the spot where the Betsy Ross Flagpole use to be. The area I think it puts us has this view: I like the curvy tree crossing over on itself, maybe it looks like the arms of the woman in the image. Yes, I think I've found a convincing match. 
Urban Smurf fucked around with this message at 05:25 on Jun 21, 2013 |
|
#
?
Jun 20, 2013 23:07
|
|
|
Cool Cleveland pics! So the finders had to dig up a shrubbery? I guess they replaced it. But that does bring to mind the likely condition of the casks: in addition to weight, pressure, water, the freeze/thaw cycle, and the ravages of time, there's also roots, most likely. What is left is a buried field of broken plexiglass and pottery shards. Retrieving the remaining casks wouldn't require bulldozers and backhoes, but small spades and brushes (like an archeological dig).
|
|
|
#
?
Jun 20, 2013 23:18
|
|
|
Peenigrippe posted:Cool Cleveland pics! So the finders had to dig up a shrubbery? I guess they replaced it. Well then I guess it's a good thing that a spade is the only shovel I have. 
|
|
#
?
Jun 20, 2013 23:30
|
|
|
Peenigrippe posted:Cool Cleveland pics! So the finders had to dig up a shrubbery? I guess they replaced it. From the look of that one that was found, the key was broken. After so many years I'm sure the whole thing may have just disintegrated into the soil (except for any metal parts).
|
|
#
?
Jun 20, 2013 23:32
|
|
|
Peenigrippe posted:Retrieving the remaining casks wouldn't require bulldozers and backhoes, but small spades and brushes (like an archeological dig). Is this really new info?
|
|
#
?
Jun 20, 2013 23:34
|
|
|
While only seeing this thread last night and not reading ~60 pages of postings, what am I missing where there is a green dot in Salt Lake City as a location of one of these; but none of the verses seem to go with it. Was the old wiki incorrect on this? I apologize in advance if this has already been explained, I live in salt lake and would love to get in on old treasure hunting!
|
|
#
?
Jun 20, 2013 23:34
|
|
|
demonicon posted:This puzzle was created in the 80s and supposed to be solvable by common people reading the books in the 80s. The Rand-McNally road atlas is releasing its 90th anniversary edition. I assure you that in addition to stone tools and fire, we had cheap and readily-available maps in the 1980s.
|
|
#
?
Jun 20, 2013 23:36
|
|
|
Somewhat Heroic posted:While only seeing this thread last night and not reading ~60 pages of postings, what am I missing where there is a green dot in Salt Lake City as a location of one of these; but none of the verses seem to go with it. Was the old wiki incorrect on this? I apologize in advance if this has already been explained, I live in salt lake and would love to get in on old treasure hunting! People thought the Boston cask corresponded to Salt Lake City because one of the rocks around the window is shaped a little bit like Utah or something.
|
|
#
?
Jun 20, 2013 23:37
|
|
|
|
| # ? Jun 3, 2024 13:26 |
|
|
Somewhat Heroic posted:While only seeing this thread last night and not reading ~60 pages of postings, what am I missing where there is a green dot in Salt Lake City as a location of one of these; but none of the verses seem to go with it. Was the old wiki incorrect on this? I apologize in advance if this has already been explained, I live in salt lake and would love to get in on old treasure hunting! It's an old map. It was made when people thought there might be one in SLC, but those theories have since been discarded. There's no guarantee they're right, though.
|
|
#
?
Jun 20, 2013 23:39
|
|