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Oops, I may have just committed a faux pas. Still a nice painting though.
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Jul 6, 2013 16:55
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I'm going to have to go a second time. Honestly, I wasn't able to see everything the first time around. Today however, I got into the Catacombs. Holly effin poo poo!
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Jul 6, 2013 18:27
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My GF and I are going to Europe for ~16 days in mid October. We're sold on Paris and Rome for catacombs and Forum strata and cathedrals you could dock spaceships in. Everyone I've talked to could not get enough of Paris, so we're booking a full 7 days there (including some day trips). Originally we were thinking of spending the full second week in Rome, but I have hesitations after doing some reading and talking to friends with the unpopular "spend less time in each place, see more places" mindset. Now we're considering 3/4 days somewhere else, maybe the Swiss countryside?, between the week in Paris and 4 days in Rome. Does anyone have any thoughts or suggestions? City stuff, especially historical, primarily appeals to us, but I also like the idea of breaking up the two city stays with a rural interlude.
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Jul 7, 2013 04:36
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You need more time in Rome than Paris, in my opinion. Depends on what you want to see and do.
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Jul 7, 2013 04:49
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I was in Paris for 6 days and while it was a very full on week we did manage to see everything that we wanted to see around the city, with a free day to boot. We also managed to do a day trip out to Orleans which was really nice. As was being discussed above, the Louvre is an absolute must, plan for a full day there. However I would say that while it is a good idea to go see the Eiffel Tower, don't go up. It takes hours and hours with all the crowds there and its not really that impressive at the top, I really regretted doing that in the end, I would have much rather just taken a picnic and spent lunch time underneath it on the massive grass area there, The Champ de Mars. I know for anyone who has never been to France before (I was this person) the Eiffel Tower is like poster child for Paris but it is impressive on ground level too, and you can spend 3 hours there and it would still be less time than it takes to get to the top and down again.
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Jul 7, 2013 06:24
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Total agree. I don't bother going up. Stayed on the ground and ate over priced ice cream.
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Jul 7, 2013 10:07
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I've said it before and I'll say it again: I think it's absolutely worth going up the Eiffel Tower. It didn't take me anywhere CLOSE to 3 hours of waiting, but I took the stairs for the first two floors. I think I had to wait 15 or 20 minutes for the stairs, maybe 10 minutes for the elevator to the top, and 10 minutes for the elevator back down. If I found myself in Paris again, I'd do it again.
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Jul 7, 2013 10:21
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hand of luke posted:My GF and I are going to Europe for ~16 days in mid October. We're sold on Paris and Rome for catacombs and Forum strata and cathedrals you could dock spaceships in. Everyone I've talked to could not get enough of Paris, so we're booking a full 7 days there (including some day trips). Since you should fly from Paris to Rome, Switzerland isn't really on the way at all. Also it's crazy loving expensive, which may or may not be an issue for you. I've spent full weeks in Rome and Paris in the last couple years and never gone out for day trips. Theres just so much to do in the cities. Hard to spend too much time in one place. I don't think I'd recommend doing a trip with less than 3 days in any one location unless the travel time between the two places is negligible. Even then would not recommend less than 2 days in any place. For big cities like Paris or Rome I'd say 4 minimum.
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Jul 7, 2013 10:35
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I'm one of the guys that gets tired of a place after 3-4 days. I'm also a Paris Paris is something that a well traveled person should experience once, but is a very grinding experience. I feel the same way about Paris as I do Florence and Vienna. My wife agrees with me on this, it isn't "romantic" and it's more noisy and grinding than it is a vacation (in the sense of getting away) destination. There's people everywhere, the town can be hot in the summer usually without AC, and I find it to be a little dirty and chaotic. It's something that is good to experience, good history, good culture, interesting people, but best in small and/or limited quantities. Don't do the tower if it takes more than 90 minutes to get to the top. Do Notre Dame, do only 4-5 hours in the Louvre (it's exhausting), see another art museum or two, go to Versailles one day for a side trip, see Napoleon's tomb and the military museum, etc., but I'm going to be someone that suggests staying 3-4 days max and then using time between Paris and Rome in some place like Florence (also grinding and chaotic) but worth the investment in time for someone that would consider themselves well traveled. I've never been, but Southern France and the Italian/French Alps looks like a completely different world and I'd love to go sometime. Maybe that's a good "half way" point as well.
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Jul 7, 2013 11:08
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I've been here since Thursday and my flight home is Wednesday. So far I've experienced the louvre, the catacombs, numerous gift shops, food stands, the Eiffel Tower and Père LaChaise cemetery. I have only but a few more spots I wanna visit such as the military museum and maybe a boat ride. I figure Tuesday will be a relaxed day full of logistics and food. Other than that I don't see myself here for any longer.
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Jul 7, 2013 11:15
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LaserWash posted:I'm one of the guys that gets tired of a place after 3-4 days. I'm also a Paris This might shock you, but not everyone is looking for a quiet restful romantic destination when they travel. Wow! People like different things. Stop projecting your (not just LaserWash -- everyone) tastes on others. Tell them facts and let them decide what they want to experience and what they want to avoid. edit: And in my opinion, Paris is more than "a bit" dirty. A lot of European cities are grimy and filled with piss. Kind of a bummer. sleepy gary fucked around with this message at 11:44 on Jul 7, 2013 |
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Jul 7, 2013 11:41
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DNova posted:A lot of European cities are grimy and filled with piss. Kind of a bummer. Haha, are you from Singapore? I went up Eiffel tower at night and the view was really cool. Took an hour or so to get to the top. I would say spending a week in Rome/Paris each is fine. From Paris you can do a bunch of daytrips to Orleans, Reims or other nearby cities if you get bored. If you really want to put something else in I would suggest taking the TGV south from Paris to Avignon, it only takes a bit more than 3h. The city has a great historic centre and in the area are some other historic sites like Pont du Gar or Nimes arena. Plus Provence is beautiful. Then take a plane to Rome from Marseille or whatever is close. Edit: Just saw you are going in October, don't go to Switzerland in October if you have the option to go near the mediterranean, because the weather in Switzerland might suck. elbkaida fucked around with this message at 12:01 on Jul 7, 2013 |
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Jul 7, 2013 11:56
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elbkaida posted:Haha, are you from Singapore? I'm from the US but I've lived in Europe twice (including right now). But I'm curious why you asked that in particular. I assume that in Singapore pissing on the sidewalk is a very bad idea, from a legal perspective.
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Jul 7, 2013 12:04
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No, Singapore is just super clean (especially compared to nearby SEA countries). I did not find the USA to be much different in cleanliness from Europe, on average.
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Jul 7, 2013 12:07
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elbkaida posted:No, Singapore is just super clean (especially compared to nearby SEA countries). I did not find the USA to be much different in cleanliness from Europe, on average. It doesn't bother me most of the time, but maybe where I grew up in the US was above average in cleanliness. Are you from Singapore? I've never been there, but I certainly will go someday. I think that urban cleanliness is an indicator of the general respectfulness of the citizens.
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Jul 7, 2013 12:21
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DNova posted:I've said it before and I'll say it again: I think it's absolutely worth going up the Eiffel Tower. It didn't take me anywhere CLOSE to 3 hours of waiting, but I took the stairs for the first two floors. I think I had to wait 15 or 20 minutes for the stairs, maybe 10 minutes for the elevator to the top, and 10 minutes for the elevator back down. Yeah. Unless you are infirm there is no reason not to take the stairs for the first two levels. It is a lot cheaper and the line is a 20 minute wait tops compared to a several hour wait for the elevators.
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Jul 7, 2013 12:27
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DNova posted:This might shock you, but not everyone is looking for a quiet restful romantic destination when they travel. Wow! Not everybody is looking for a hostel type trip either. So it is nice to get different viewpoints.
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Jul 7, 2013 12:34
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Thoguh posted:Not everybody is looking for a hostel type trip either. So it is nice to get different viewpoints. Absolutely. I'm not saying any one viewpoint should be represented exclusively. But this idea of "Well, I don't like that kind of thing, so it sucks and nobody should do it!" bothers me.
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Jul 7, 2013 12:55
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And to be fair, large parts of Brussels, Paris and Rome do permanently smell of piss. Edit: and probably other cities as well, but these I just remember smelling it.
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Jul 7, 2013 13:02
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DNova posted:This might shock you, but not everyone is looking for a quiet restful romantic destination when they travel. Wow! Maybe you should inhale deeply and think happy thoughts for a while because there was nothing in this guy's post that was out of line, at least not when compared to the rest of T&T forum.
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Jul 7, 2013 14:11
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Doctor Malaver posted:Maybe you should inhale deeply and think happy thoughts for a while because there was nothing in this guy's post that was out of line, at least not when compared to the rest of T&T forum. I really wasn't try to specifically call him out, but I didn't make that clear enough I suppose. It's just a growing attitude in this thread that I've noticed lately and I hope will stop.
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Jul 7, 2013 15:05
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I've had some morbid smells everywhere I've gone. Some of piss and some of pure poo poo. Paris hasn't been nearly as bad as I expected/heard it would be.
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Jul 7, 2013 15:45
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Kolta posted:I've had some morbid smells everywhere I've gone. Some of piss and some of pure poo poo. Paris hasn't been nearly as bad as I expected/heard it would be. I'm hoping to make a long (3-5 weeks) trip to India soon. Maybe when I get back to Europe I won't notice the piss everywhere as much, haha.
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Jul 7, 2013 15:50
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Berlin was surprisingly enough the worst smelling city I've ever experienced in Europe. Anyway, I would defintiely do a week in Paris and a week in Rome. I've spent months in Paris and still had stuff to do, and two weeks in Rome wasn't nearly enough, I can't wait to go back there. And yeah, take the stairs up the Tour Eiffel. They're built at a height that makes them ridiculously easy to climb, my grandad used to take me up them when he was well into his 70s, and 99% of the fat, lazy tourists won't do it. I guarantee you if you do the stairs you'll meet no other Americans.
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Jul 7, 2013 16:01
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It's a bummer that the stairs don't go all the way to the top. Another small piece of advice, if you decide to go up the Eiffel tower, you might want to try to time it to be at the top half an hour or so before sunset. That way, you get daylight views, sunset views, and night views. That happened to me and my friends by happy accident. It was really wonderful. They don't try to rush you off, so you can linger as long as you want.
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Jul 7, 2013 16:07
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Also this place has the best gelato in Rome by so far. It's like 50 cents more expensive than most of the tourist trap places in the Fontana di Trevi/Spagna area, but SO WORTH IT. http://www.ciampini.com/en
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Jul 7, 2013 17:29
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HookShot posted:Also this place has the best gelato in Rome by so far. It's like 50 cents more expensive than most of the tourist trap places in the Fontana di Trevi/Spagna area, but SO WORTH IT. This man could not possibly be any more right.
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Jul 7, 2013 18:47
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So I'd like to post my thoughts on Poland. My wife and I visited Krakow, which was a really neat city. There wasn't much international tourism that I could spot. It really had a lot of tourists... from well, within Poland as far as I could tell. Doesn't seem like a tourist hotspot and the city is really not overrun at all by overpriced food and lodging. I paid somewhere around $1000 for a flight from AirBerlin and six nights in four star accommodations. The price for that was unbeatable in my mind. Unfortunately it seems that there are no direct flights to Krakow from JFK that I could tell so you're going to have to get a connecting flight in Berlin, which is literally the worst international airport I have ever flown out of. Supposedly there's a secret second level that has a Starbucks but I haven't found it. That airport rivals bush airports in the US for badness. We stayed at the Hilton in Krakow and it was really nice. Really good beds, good air conditioning (which is nice, because it seems that the people of Poland don't really do air conditioning in general), a decent bar, and a full breakfast in the morning. The hotel was a little far from the Old Town and most attractions, but a taxi ride ended up being around like 21 zloty (probably $7). The Old Town was a really great place to just hang out. It's sitting in the shadow of Wawel Castle and there are a ton of great shops and restaurants. It's also neat to just wander into some historic building or church and just gawk at the architecture. The entire area is just immensely beautiful and fun to wander around. And all the restaurants we went to that weren't on the main market square were cheap, delicious, and an incredible value. We're talking like a ribeye steak and potatoes for $14 kind of value. A cup of gelato here is 2.5 zloty, which is less than a buck. Wawel Castle itself was a bit of a disappointment. The museums there are just kind of thrown together haphazardly but the view is awesome and the buildings themselves a gorgeous. I was eyeing to be a museum professional so my standards might be a bit high. My wife and I also went to the Salt Mines outside Krakow. Holy poo poo what a tour. You have to walk down 780 steps for a three hour tour. There are just all these awesome chambers carved out of the rock and statues made out of the rock salt they mined. It was a well put together narrative of the history, although our tour guide had a bit of an incomprehensible accent. I wasn't sure what to make of the Auschwitz museum. It was a two hour bus ride from Krakow and hellishly hot. It wasn't a well put together museum either. It seemed to focus a lot on the Polish experience as opposed to the history of the camp itself. The camp is just kind of... preserved. There's not much to be explained I guess? I wish there had been more memorials or something just to give it all some context. The only major oddity I found was that the locals don't seem to do ice cubes in their water, they don't do free public bathrooms (you have to pay one or two zloty to get in), and air conditioning isn't the norm. Most folks seem to speak English just fine and there's not much of a language barrier. Most signs are bilingual in some way. All in all, it was a very inexpensive European vacation. Excellent food. Charming country. Really a good place to go if you want to just take it easy and soak everything in and don't want to be crushed by tourists.
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Jul 7, 2013 18:52
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elbkaida posted:Haha, are you from Singapore? Thanks for the idea. The decision is tough because I'm sure we'd enjoy both options -- I don't think we'll want for things to do in either city; I'm just trying to get a feel for whether people would rather spend a week in each or add a third destination. HookShot or anyone else: feel free to bombard me with more Paris/Rome suggestions at your leisure.
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Jul 7, 2013 21:00
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hand of luke posted:
Make sure you do Sainte-Chapel after you go to Notre Dame. My jaw literally dropped to the floor upon seeing those windows.
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Jul 7, 2013 22:06
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For Auschwitz you want to get a tour because the written explanations are indeed not too good.
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Jul 7, 2013 23:35
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Mr.AARP posted:Make sure you do Sainte-Chapel after you go to Notre Dame. My jaw literally dropped to the floor upon seeing those windows. The conciergerie right next to Sainte-Chapel is also worth a look, you can see where Marie Antoinette spent her last hours. Paris: Explore the ruins under Notre Dame. The entrance to them in outside, about 50 meters from the church entrance. Jean Paul Hevin on Rue St Honore does the best chocolates in Paris. They're expensive but holy hell are they good. I literally brought back over 500 Euros worth with me last time. When you're at Versailles, make sure to visit Marie Antoinette's trianon and her little village where you can pet a bunch of farm animals. It's so quaint and adorable, it's one of my favourite parts of Versailles (and holy poo poo is the whole place impressive). This isn't exactly what you expect when you hear Versailles, but it's awesome:  Versailles by hookshot88, on Flickr Go up Tour Montparnasse at night for the best view of Paris. Visit St. Denis if you like looking at the tombs of ancient kings and queens. Tour guides will tell you it's dangerous, but only really because tourists seem to be afraid of black people I guess. Just don't go on Friday night or anything and you'll be completely fine. As a result, no one ever visits St. Denis and it's got among the best stained glass in Paris and amazing history that you can pretty much enjoy all by yourself. The parthenon is also cool and holds one of my ancestors! Rome: If you like art, Santa Maria della Vittoria is a short walk from Republica, and houses the Ecstasy of St Theresa. Before you go there, visit Santa Maria delli Angeli, right across from the Metro entrance. It was designed by Michelangelo in his 80s and has thousands of years of history built in. When you go to the Roman Forum, you can actually walk up a little hill until you're across the street from the Colloseum, and you'll get probably the best view of it in all of Rome. No one else goes there, and there's also the ruins of some temples behind, but it's hands down the best view. Here's a picture I took from it:  Colosseum by hookshot88, on Flickr Make sure you have an actual guide to the Roman Forum. You'll miss cool things like the spot where the emperors' thrones were and that sort of stuff that isn't marked. In the Sistine Chapel, wait for a tour group to leave out the side door at the back right hand corner of the church and meld in with them. You'll get to take the shortcut to St. Peter's without having to leave the museum and walk to the other side of the Vatican. You also won't have to line up again to go through security. Take the trip to the top of St. Peter's, to the dome. My "God's eye view" photos are some of my favourite from the whole trip:  San Pietro by hookshot88, on Flickr A warning though: don't do this if you're claustrophobic. The climb to the very top to get the view outside of Rome is SO NARROW. Sorry, I tend to ramble a bit, especially about Paris, which I've been to so many times. If anyone has any more questions or wants recommendations for things, I'm always happy to help.
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Jul 8, 2013 00:13
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This is all amazing. Thank you. I may be asking more questions very soon.
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Jul 8, 2013 07:40
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Insane Totoro posted:
They don't do ice cubes like anywhere in Europe, even in Italy and Spain it's a rarity--you'll often get like one or two ice cubes, which immediately melt and make your drink cold for about 30 seconds. It's like ice has to still be dragged in from glaciers in Norway or something. This and everything being closed on Sundays are my two biggest peeves about Europe (admittedly, not a huge deal).
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Jul 8, 2013 08:56
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Saladman posted:They don't do ice cubes like anywhere in Europe, even in Italy and Spain it's a rarity--you'll often get like one or two ice cubes, which immediately melt and make your drink cold for about 30 seconds. It's like ice has to still be dragged in from glaciers in Norway or something. This and everything being closed on Sundays are my two biggest peeves about Europe (admittedly, not a huge deal). And it's rare in some places (e.g. Austria) to just get a glass of water with your food (but you get one by default with your coffee  ) so when I ask for one, I get maybe 200mL. I'm used to drinking a lot of water, so that blows. And, no, I don't want to pay 3.50 euros for 0.5L of soda water with the juice from one lemon in it. Argh!
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Jul 8, 2013 11:43
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Thoguh posted:Yeah. Unless you are infirm there is no reason not to take the stairs for the first two levels. It is a lot cheaper and the line is a 20 minute wait tops compared to a several hour wait for the elevators. It's not that much cheaper, if you arrive at 8.45am you'll be waiting only twenty minutes for the lifts anyway and on a nice sunny day, it saves you from being sweaty and manky for the eest of the day. No shame in taking the lift. I did it to save my thigh muscles for the rest of the day (I'm slim and healthy - but walking up the Arc de Triomphe made my legs ache, so I sure as hell didn't want to walk halfway up the Eiffel Tower!)
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Jul 8, 2013 11:47
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Ask for tap water if you want water in a restaurant or bar, that way you won't have to pay for it. If you just ask for water, you be given a bottle and you will have to pay for it. Ice cubes: Fewer ice cubes = more drink Seconding the, Krakow is a great city and there is a lot to do in the area. PlantHead fucked around with this message at 12:50 on Jul 8, 2013 |
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Jul 8, 2013 12:47
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Pickpocket story: My brother got pickpocketed in Paris last week. We think it happened near the arc de triomphe and he was a bit careless having his wallet in his back pocket. Sure he is an idiot having all his cards, his id and drivers liscense in there to begin with, but having it in your back pocket is an easy mistake to make if you don't think about it all the time. He didn't feel a thing and it was a pain in the rear end to find a police station. In there no one spoke english (or german, but we didn't expect that anyway )or at least they pretended not to speak it. I know the french are supposed to be a bit stubborn when it comes to speaking languages, but come on, it's the champs elysees. There are millions of foreign tourists from all over the world right around the corner, at least one officer should be able to help you in english.
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Jul 8, 2013 13:53
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He's a bit of a muppet for putting his wallet into his back pocket, though. Who even does that?
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Jul 8, 2013 13:59
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Of course he is, but thats the way it's done around here and if you're used to that, it's hard to switch. It's basically muscle memory.
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Jul 8, 2013 14:03
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