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AASman posted:I love Mikami games and I always wanted to try PN03. Is there anybody here that likes it? It's not a terrible game, it's just really undercooked. At the time they were trying to spin it as an experiment to see whether people would accept games constructed by smaller teams like in the old days, but Mikami has recently admitted that it turned out the way it did because they made the entire thing in a rush to fill Viewtiful Joe's former release slot and because he'd totally checked out after a couple months. Even the name P.N.03 is just an acronym for "Project Number 3" that stuck because the producers vetoed Mikami's original choice and he didn't care enough to come up with another one before it launched.
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Jun 19, 2013 08:54
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It's a pretty... interesting game and I want to like it, but I just can't get into it. I'd love an action-oriented Space Channel 5 game made in the Vanquish engine, though. No, don't ask me how it would work. I imagine PN03 but with more varied enemies and better music. The biggest problem with PN03 is that you have to unlock a whole bunch of moves before the game gets even remotely fun, and it doesn't really explain any mechanics. This video does a pretty god job of showing off what you can do in the game. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mmedqjv7nbY EDIT: Love the hand movements she does! Renoistic fucked around with this message at 09:12 on Jun 19, 2013 |
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Jun 19, 2013 09:10
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If Nintendo ever starts to really look like they're gonna lose bad time they can always unleash the secret money printing machine they have the idea for: THE POKEMON MMO People would buy a WiiU if it could play that.
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Jun 19, 2013 11:06
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El Estrago Bonito posted:If Nintendo ever starts to really look like they're gonna lose bad time they can always unleash the secret money printing machine they have the idea for: There is no way to make a pokemon MMO without massively changing the game play, and once you do that you lose the majority of people who would want to play it. The best I could think of would be a Diablo like, so you could play single player or you could team up with some friends and explore dungeons of some sort? Also pokemon games don't sell nearly as well on consoles as they do on the handhelds. Besides Pokemon X and Y look like they're going to have all the Internet features you would want plus character customisation.
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Jun 19, 2013 11:14
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That will never ever happen because: 1: Nintendo are deadly afraid of this whole 'Internet' thing and treat multiplayer that isn't local like it's a plague victim. 2: Pokemon on a non-handheld? I'm not sure of the reasoning but I haven't seen it in a long time.
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Jun 19, 2013 11:17
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This "Nintendo is afraid of the Internet" line of argument is so silly considering how every Pokémon game since the old DS has had several online features, and 3DS games like Mario Kart 7, Kid Icarus, and Luigi's Mansion are fully online featured. They didn't add online multiplayer on Nintendo Land because it was made for local parties. They aren't adding online multiplayer on Super Mario Cat World because it's not possible to get that twitch platforming right on an online environment without some breakthrough like GGPO for platformers -- ask Ubisoft why their two new 2D Rayman games don't have online multiplayer either.
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Jun 19, 2013 11:23
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They've already released a Pokemon game with NFC unlocks in Japan, which is almost as exploitative (or would be if Nintendo wasn't so hesitant to actually release the figurines).
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Jun 19, 2013 11:23
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El Estrago Bonito posted:If Nintendo ever starts to really look like they're gonna lose bad time they can always unleash the secret money printing machine they have the idea for: That exists and it's terrible. I'm honestly surprised they haven't been sued to oblivion yet.
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Jun 19, 2013 11:24
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PaletteSwappedNinja posted:It's not a terrible game, it's just really undercooked. At the time they were trying to spin it as an experiment to see whether people would accept games constructed by smaller teams like in the old days, but Mikami has recently admitted that it turned out the way it did because they made the entire thing in a rush to fill Viewtiful Joe's former release slot and because he'd totally checked out after a couple months. Even the name P.N.03 is just an acronym for "Project Number 3" that stuck because the producers vetoed Mikami's original choice and he didn't care enough to come up with another one before it launched. Yeah P.N.03 is like a beta version of a bigger game that never came out.
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Jun 19, 2013 14:52
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I liked PN.03 a lot more before they switched it up. It was going to be a game much like Devil May Cry, but they overhauled it into what we got.
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Jun 19, 2013 16:17
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It feels like one of those 2k budget games like Zombie vs. Ambulance and Bikini Samurai. It really does try to work with the simple aesthetic though. It's sort of like Killer 7 in that the game is really open and empty but it doesn't feel odd or strange. I classify it in that odd category of games that I really enjoy but aren't what I would consider amazing games (Cubivore, Samurai Western, Cy Girls and Gladius are in a similar vein in my mind).
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Jun 19, 2013 23:57
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El Estrago Bonito posted:If Nintendo ever starts to really look like they're gonna lose bad time they can always unleash the secret money printing machine they have the idea for: There's no reason for Nintendo to drastically revise their formula for Pokemon because it's financially feasible as is - it sells gangbusters as is. The problem is people thinking "if we just make X into an MMO then it'll be a World of Warcraft killer", when World of Warcraft is the exception as opposed to the norm and there's like a generation or two of failed/F2P MMOs out there that prove it. The amount of work required to build and supervise the new MMO for multiple years, and possibly multiple systems, isn't necessarily guaranteed to yield a greater financial benefit. Multiple systems definitely now that I think on it - people might buy one Nintendo console for the MMO, but would they buy the one after it when the first console's dedicated servers inevitably shut down? On top of the monthly/yearly subscription fee? The amount of work required to build and supervise the new MMO for multiple years, would cut into and actively compete against their current business models - at the moment it's with the 3DS and Wii U, in that point in time you're talking whatever massively-successful handheld is on the market that might be undermined by/undermining the PokeMMO. You're attracting a different audience that's toxic to the demographic and atmosphere that Nintendo wants, and supervising/censoring that demographic would be detrimental to the standard social-interaction model of MMOs. Pre-determined selections of dialogue? Chat that isn't sent in real-time but supervised and scrutinized for profanities? Notifications from other players that played the same level/gym/whatever you just failed on? Nobody thinks that is a good compromise for an authentic online experience, and conversely nobody wants to be told their mother wears army boots by some furry-roleplaying troglodyte with six LV100 Sableyes using Wonder Guard. Remember how popular Dragon Quest X was? Because I don't. Nintendo wants people to interact with each other in real life and socialise over their games. That was half the reason the Pokemon games were made in the first place, to use the Link Cable and to have different exclusive catchable monsters on different cartridges. I'd be lying if I said "making people pay for two copies of what is mostly the same game" wasn't a key factor as well, but the big push was getting kids to socialise in real life instead of over a keyboard. The gameplay/combat of Pokemon is pretty limited compared to MMOs, and changing up the system will detract from it being considered a 'main' game in the series. If you're sticking to the core template you run into problems. How do you handle characters with high-level pokemon making GBS threads all over the people who just started their game? How would trading work? Why would anyone ever need to trade with another player? How do we handle one-time-encounter Pokemon, like every Legendary ever? Do we leave them as one-time-encounter, basically making them worthless as trades, or do we treat them like uber-rare drops, like in other MMOs? Legendaries actually highlight one of the biggest problems with turning Pokemon into an MMO, and that is, unlike in a standard MMO, your strength as a player is determined entirely by what Pokemon you encounter. If you make Legendaries actually rare, then you only give the advantage to those who got lucky, and/or played the game for poo poo-tons, long enough to have statistics on their side. This creates a snowballing effect that basically destroys the metagame, and makes the game very unfriendly to newer players. That's the LAST thing you want in a Pokemon MMO. Quickly, someone call me a mongoloid
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Jun 20, 2013 01:53
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Harlock posted:I just don't see what point the Wii U has in the current market. I don't really like what the handhelds are offering and how they're getting more and more locked down. I grew up on being able to stick a gameshark into my system and do what I wanted with the games I bought. I grew up being able to (later on) emulate those games on my PC later on my pc if I wanted to. They feel so locked down and formulated and "You can have fun how WE say you can have fun. *laugh sign lights up*" It stretches to the 3DS (which I do enjoy minus complaints), the Vita seems to be overly expensive in software and hardware, the Xbox One sounds like one loving awful idea after another to the point of absolute absurdity, the ps4 sounds like a good idea that is going to be driven into the ground of mediocrity, and the wii u sounds like a wii with slightly better hardware and a tablet that (in the few minutes I used while playing DXHR on the system) yet again gimmicky and unnecessary. I suppose PC is where I belong. I want customization. I want modularity of my hardware. I want to take a screenshot of every game. I want to change the FOV, I want to be able to use a keyboard/mouse in FPS games. I want to have AA on my game, even if it brings me down to sub 60 or sub 30 fps just to be less jaggy. I want to scale the UI. I want users to be able to submit their OWN DLC for free, and have custom skins and stories. I want to install completely to the hard drive and never use the drive again if I choose to. I want to share the game to someone else without needing a CD Key. I want to have someone else make a neat useful app and be able to use it on my console. If I don't like something about the thing I'm buying, I want to be able to change it into something that will make me like it. GreenBuckanneer fucked around with this message at 02:35 on Jun 20, 2013 |
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Jun 20, 2013 02:30
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El Estrago Bonito posted:If Nintendo ever starts to really look like they're gonna lose bad time they can always unleash the secret money printing machine they have the idea for: Hey, people loved KOTOR. You know what would be an absolutely amazing seller? An MMO set in that world, where people could chose to be a Jedi, or a Bounty Hunter, or a Smuggle, or a Sith. And have it be made by the people who made KOTOR. I see absolutely no way that game could be a financial failure.
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Jul 9, 2013 22:48
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There's already a Pokemon MMO. It was tacked onto the lovely Mists of Pandaria expansion for WoW.
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Jul 9, 2013 22:57
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I've said it before and I'll say it again. People say they want a Pokemon MMO, but I really really don't think they grasp what "Pokemon MMO" would be like. People say they want it but holy poo poo can you imagine how loving awful it would be if it was the game they imagined? Unless they changed literally everything about the mechanics it would be a Pokehell from which no good can escape. Basically the only good thing about it would be battling and trading Pokemon which you can do already.
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Jul 9, 2013 23:01
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ImpAtom posted:I've said it before and I'll say it again. I don't know why, but it makes me envision a Star Wars Galaxy level of gently caress up.
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Jul 9, 2013 23:05
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Maybe I'm just old and out of touch, but I thought most people stopped giving a poo poo about Pokemon a decade ago. Do they even still make the cards and the cartoon show?
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Jul 9, 2013 23:22
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Almost Smart posted:Maybe I'm just old and out of touch, but I thought most people stopped giving a poo poo about Pokemon a decade ago. Do they even still make the cards and the cartoon show? Yes, and it's wildly successful.
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Jul 9, 2013 23:24
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Almost Smart posted:Maybe I'm just old and out of touch, but I thought most people stopped giving a poo poo about Pokemon a decade ago. Do they even still make the cards and the cartoon show? The cartoon show is one of the longest running anime series out there. The card games still sell gangbusters (and are commonly available in corner stores and such which don't sell any other kind of card.) The Pokemon games are generally among the best-selling in any given year they come out, beaten only by Call of Duty. Pokemon doesn't quite have the ridiculous popularity it had a decade ago where it was a cultural phenomena, but it is still insanely successful by any possible metric. ImpAtom fucked around with this message at 23:28 on Jul 9, 2013 |
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Jul 9, 2013 23:26
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Almost Smart posted:Maybe I'm just old and out of touch, but I thought most people stopped giving a poo poo about Pokemon a decade ago. Do they even still make the cards and the cartoon show? It makes billions of dollars a year.
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Jul 10, 2013 00:09
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ImpAtom posted:I've said it before and I'll say it again. My friend was showing me that Pokemon thing someone is making where it's 3D, your Pokemon comes out and fights wild Pokemon in the field and how it's supposed to one day be fully online and all I could picture was a thosuand of the same Pokemon clustered on a 2 frame per second screen with nobody able to tell which Snorlax was theirs.
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Jul 10, 2013 00:11
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And they do keep improving and evolving the gameplay mechanics. The series by and large gets better with each installment with some exceptions. (Diamond/Pearl were good but slowed the battle speed to a ridiculous degree). I think people chanting for an MMORPG don't realize the series already has many of these features. You can trade and battle online with strangers and team up with friends without issue. The new one will even have 3d graphics. Really I think people just want that experience but with console graphics and polish. That just isn't efficient use of development though. The games are cheaper to make and have a much wider install base on handhelds.
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Jul 10, 2013 00:14
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Almost Smart posted:Maybe I'm just old and out of touch, but I thought most people stopped giving a poo poo about Pokemon a decade ago. Do they even still make the cards and the cartoon show? If I'm not mistaken, it's Nintendo's biggest selling franchise next to Mario. In fact I see kids everywhere either with Pokemon toys or playing the game. It's still WILDLY successful and I have to give Nintendo props for managing to keep the game fresh in kids' minds since the 90s. I was in middle school during Red & Blue and it's pretty amazing seeing all these kids nowadays playing Pokemon. Granted most of Nintendo's franchises have had real staying power, but there's something about Pokemon that's different I think.
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Jul 10, 2013 00:19
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So, news has happened, as it usually does, and its bad for the WiiU, as news for the WiiU usually is. First up, Ubisoft are really committed to the idea of dual screen gameplay. They think that sort of thing is the future of gaming. With things like Remote Play and Smartglass, they can really make new gameplay. Just not on the WiiU. Although you can't blame Ubisoft for being skeptical of the WiiU, since ZombiU, what was suppsed to be the game to prove to publishers that the WiiU was ready and willing for a hardcore audience, didn't make enough money to cover its budget. And we're not talking a Tomb Raider "Didn't meet infinity billion sales projection" thing, according to the comments, it failed to sell more than half a million copies. For such a high profile launch title, well, its certainly not good. And whats Nintendo doing to counter this run of bad news? Well, they've done some soul searching, looked at what their fans wanted, and have decided to bravely keep region locking securely in place.
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Jul 10, 2013 03:35
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I'm less and less confident in the Wii U's future. There were some good games shown off at E3, but once again half of them are next year and a good deal of them are of the "I'd consider buying it if I already had the console" sort. Third parties aren't exactly clamoring to get their games on the console. I'd say there's a significant price drop and/or revision coming down the pipes at some point, but with Nintendo who knows.
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Jul 10, 2013 03:47
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Fulchrum posted:Hey, people loved KOTOR. You know what would be an absolutely amazing seller? An MMO set in that world, where people could chose to be a Jedi, or a Bounty Hunter, or a Smuggle, or a Sith. And have it be made by the people who made KOTOR. They hosed up because they didn't use the company that made the good KOTOR.
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Jul 10, 2013 04:02
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GreenBuckanneer posted:They hosed up because they didn't use the company that made the good KOTOR. Yes, that was the sole reason the game failed to do well with an audience. It was all down to the fact that Bioware has such a tiny, unknown prescence in gaming, whereas Obsidian have an absolutely unprecedented love from the average gamer.
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Jul 10, 2013 04:26
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Fulchrum posted:Hey, people loved KOTOR. You know what would be an absolutely amazing seller? An MMO set in that world, where people could chose to be a Jedi, or a Bounty Hunter, or a Smuggle, or a Sith. And have it be made by the people who made KOTOR. The Old Republic was a pretty good MMO ran by a super incompetent developer that is really greedy and doesn't understand their market.
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Jul 10, 2013 04:45
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OLIVIAS WILDE RIDER posted:There's already a Pokemon MMO. It was tacked onto the lovely Mists of Pandaria expansion for WoW. That expansion and the added pet system were actually pretty rad. Only problem with the latter is they got a little too greedy and made various "rarities" of each pet to try and get nerds to do even more farming than usual. Like EV points in terms of "features meant for  s" but even worse somehow.Also TOR's issues root from the standard cause of theme-park MMO failure: developers having huge visions that take years to actually create, meaning that the game is automatically outdated by the time it's released. I have no doubt a Pokemon MMO would suffer from relatively the same thing, in addition to the complications people already mentioned.
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Jul 10, 2013 05:08
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Fulchrum posted:Yes, that was the sole reason the game failed to do well with an audience. It was all down to the fact that Bioware has such a tiny, unknown prescence in gaming, whereas Obsidian have an absolutely unprecedented love from the average gamer. No it's because Bioware has been getting more and more fucktarded since the first Mass Effect, whereas Obsidian have shown they're above average.
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Jul 10, 2013 06:21
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GreenBuckanneer posted:No it's because Bioware has been getting more and more fucktarded since the first Mass Effect, whereas Obsidian have shown they're above average. Alpha Protocol
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Jul 10, 2013 08:38
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This is getting rather off-track, but the reason for BioWare's declining quality had a lot to do with executive intervention than anything else. Dragon Age 2 was EA trying to make it a yearly franchise, TOR had dudes at the helm who had various other failed MMOs under their belt, and for ME3 they decided to lock the writers out of the room when it came time to do the ending (I don't recall why). To bring this back, I talked to someone recently who owns a Wii U, and they mentioned Darksiders 2 was buggy as gently caress. This doesn't surprise me at all, considering I was on the internal testing team for it and we never even touched that version for some reason. I'm really wondering if this was a fault with the developer, or if Nintendo just didn't provide enough dev kits considering they hadn't unveiled the final controller yet at the time.
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Jul 10, 2013 08:47
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DA2 also had the entire writing staff changed, and from interviews it seems they just wrote a game for themselves, complete with mary sue stand-ins.
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Jul 10, 2013 09:07
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miscellaneous14 posted:This is getting rather off-track, but the reason for BioWare's declining quality had a lot to do with executive intervention than anything else. Dragon Age 2 was EA trying to make it a yearly franchise, TOR had dudes at the helm who had various other failed MMOs under their belt, and for ME3 they decided to lock the writers out of the room when it came time to do the ending (I don't recall why). Considering the state THQ was in at the time, I think it's something that was probably rushed the hell out.
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Jul 10, 2013 09:12
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GreenBuckanneer posted:No it's because Bioware has been getting more and more fucktarded since the first Mass Effect, whereas Obsidian have shown they're above average. Huh. And here Obsidian is the company I use to benchmark every other game company against, usually finding them falling short. I can't really see them as close to average, because I literally can't think of any company that is really better than them at what they do, the setting. Okay, Bioware used to be pretty good, but I don't know why they fired most of their good people. I'm trying really hard to think here, but I just don't think other companies hold up as well.
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Jul 10, 2013 09:23
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Most of the reason I ended up convincing my mom to get me a Gamecube rather than any other console during that generation was because I really liked Nintendo. It wasn't a very good console, but I would play Halo over at my friends house because, dammit, Nintendo was good to me. I sat up from bed recently, and decided to spend a stupid amount of money on a 3DS. The idea of replaying Starfox 64 and Ocarina of Time on a trip felt kinda appealing, and I really wanted to play Animal Crossing. I get home, drop the $40 on AC and then come to discover that if I wanted to buy the same games that I had convinced my parents to pay for 15 or so years ago, I'd have to spend $80. Maybe Steam spoiled me or maybe it just costs much, much less to develop something on PC, but I was really frustrated when I found myself unable to impulse buy a nostalgia trip. It's not that I can't afford to buy both of them so much as understanding that the magic would be lessened if I let a lovely plan win. They remade stuff, added features, and uprezzed the models, sure. There's just something very frustrating about when, after looking at the price tag, you instantly realize that Nintendo's marketing department priced those games very specifically. They know that if a Nintendo fan buys a 3DS, it's partially for nostalgia's sake. Yet they refuse to validate my brand loyalty by letting me spend $20 on a rerelease where I'd assume almost all of the target market has played both games at least once. Super Mario 3D Land was 40 bucks 2 years after launch, but I felt OK paying for a first-party game built specifically for the console. I'm halfway through SM3DL now, and it's a testament to Nintendo's design. It's an incredible 3D platformer, and I totally understand that they'd do the Nintendo thing and refuse to make the game cost what a 2 year old game should. It's that same nostalgia that lead to me feeling weird about the Wii U. I was invited to a Nintendo press event in Arizona to show off the console. The only time they had open was 9 AM, and I had to do an all-nighter before. I quickly scarfed down something fast-foody and disgusting because it was close to the airport and drove to the event. These two overly polite guys invited me into their cool Nintendo RV at 9 in the morning and tried their hardest to make the console look fun. I don't know if it was the food poisoning I came down with later, the sleep deprivation, or if the quality of the games are exactly what makes me hate the Wii U, but I do. It seems like the ultimate testament to the gap between what Nintendo does perfectly and what they consistently do wrong. Every time they try something weird, interesting, or dream-like it's a perfect experience. The Wii, I think, is the testament to this style of release. It's instantly recognizable as different, approachable, while inspiring our collective imagination in ways that no other console really could have managed to achieve at the time. The N64, SNES, and NES are all consoles that generally worked with the hardware at the time. The first party support was there, but it wasn't until the Wii that Nintendo brought its trademark cartoon world design to the physical space and won big for it. The Wii U is, I think, a limbo system. It's a product with a very specific gimmick that will only work under very specific circumstances These circumstances are either if you really, really want to play the next Zelda game or if you like Nintendo enough to keep buying their hardware. I would have been the latter, I think, had a frustratingly large number of events similar to discovering that Nintendo decided to price 2 games that every single brand evangelist for the company would want to play at $40. Me telling my nerdy friends that the 3DS is cool and showing them Starfox and how much cooler/better it is now would be a much more effective strategy than asking them to put their face in front of the camera thingy. Also, it is weird how the 3DS commands the friend that plays Face Raiders to return the 3DS to me after they're finished. I don't think the Wii U is Nintendo's Dreamcast but mostly because I pine for the Dreamcast. I don't think that games like ZombiU are going to take up the same space in my brain that Jet Set Radio does. But, then again, maybe that's just nostalgia. (available now for $15 on XBLA)
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Jul 10, 2013 10:30
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Hey, thread. It's been a while! Interesting analysis here, I think we all realized that NSMBU was the only thing resembling a 'hit' on the Wii U at the moment, but it's pretty crazy to think that one game could account for some 20% of total software sales. Anyway, the portion about third party support after this fall was similarly interesting - sure, there are quite a few games coming out, but as mentioned, those have all been in development well before the Wii U's dismal sales numbers came to bear. Ubisoft has been a key supporter, for example, but after their recent comments about ZombiU being 'nowhere near profitable', I have to wonder how long that support will continue as opposed to EA's 'wait and see' approach winning out. Also, I didn't realize we're only a few weeks away from Nintendo's earnings report. I can't imagine anything's significantly improved since the last one. ImpAtom posted:For one just off the topic of my head, the topic creator flat-out said in another thread they only created this one because they have anti-Nintendo bias and enjoy talking about their failures. v Hey man, that was supposed to be a joke!  I honestly do find the discussion interesting though, and any console warrior-ing in my posts is intended satirically.
The Illusive Man fucked around with this message at 03:47 on Jul 11, 2013 |
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Jul 11, 2013 03:44
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Space Racist posted:Also, I didn't realize we're only a few weeks away from Nintendo's earnings report. I can't imagine anything's significantly improved since the last one. They've actually probably improved but not largely because of the Wii U. The 3DS has had a pretty successful year so far and Animal Crossing was an insanely good seller from most reports. Even if it doesn't look bad, that isn't inherently good for the Wii U.
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Jul 11, 2013 04:46
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So August is when the Wii U finally starts getting a trickle again of what should be great games. Here's what I would consider the standout titles of the fall/winter release schedule: Aug 4 - Pikmin 3 Sep 3 - Rayman Legends Sep 15 - Wonderful 101 Oct ?? - Wind Waker HD Oct 29 - Assassin's Creed IV Nov ?? - Donkey Kong Country: Tropical Freeze Nov 19 - Watch Dogs Dec ?? - Super Mario 3D World Dec ?? - Wii Fit U Three of those are multiplatform Ubisoft titles, but subtract those and you've still got a quality exclusive title a month for the next five months. If Nintendo wants to drive hardware sales with these titles, which are the best to emphasize? I'd be wary of leaning too hard on SM3DW, since a 4-player Mario title is what they launched with last year and that didn't set things on fire. Wii Fit U is going to be really dependent on how they bundle it, and whether the crowd that enjoyed the previous titles are up for investing in a new console for it (I will not pretend to have my finger on the pulse of this demographic). Ideally it'd have been great if they could have fast-tracked Mariokart 8 to be the big holiday release, since that's probably the biggest crowd-pleaser on their upcoming slate.
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Jul 11, 2013 07:39
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