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ParanoidInc posted:Just trying to get a different perspective here, what don't you like about the combo system of Injustice? It's pretty much the first fighting game that I've ever gotten serious in and the easy combo system is one of the main reasons for that, I was wondering why FGC people don't seem to like it as much. I feel like most every combo is just a bunch of parts fitted together, most combos go something like string->string-> wallbounce/MB special->string->special. It's hard to articulate, but it just feels like there are too many universal moves and it ends up feeling like every character makes combos the exact same way, and some are just better at it because their 223 string knock up a bit higher, etc. And since combos feel so similar between characters, it gets frustrating playing someone who has a harder time comboing just because they have a little too much recovery on a key launching move of theirs. I think it makes for a more accessible system, which is admirable in it's own right, but lacks depth at high levels. and this might be a bit of a nitpick, but i really don't like how you can input strings in advance but have to time everything else just right, I personally found it really hard to get a rhythm going because of that.
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Jul 15, 2013 07:05
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I can see that, compared to MVC and SF. Thanks for the info, it's interesting. Also, Yardbomb, we gotta fight (well, more like you fight I die probably) sometime. I see you online alot but it's either when you're playing Last of Us or I'm about to leave haha.
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Jul 15, 2013 07:08
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Commissar Ken posted:The funny thing is I think with Supes most of his poo poo was fine. Eyelasers don't bug me. His super quick full screen special doesn't even bug me. I think if Superman didn't have those people would be all "Well this isn't a fighting Superman." the thing that seemed off just watching the stream was his f23 looked far too safe. Big lumbering looking shots and every single superman used them with impunity almost to slowly push people across the screen even while blocking. I think if that wasn't AS safe it would have been a far different tourney or at least the Supes there wouldn't just kinda strut across the finish. I wholeheartedly agree with everything you have said.
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Jul 15, 2013 07:10
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I'd like to see the amount of meter produced by his lasers lowered.
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Jul 15, 2013 07:15
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Also I don't think the complaints are as much about Superman being top tier so much as him being tragically autopilot and boring. Cyrax, Kabal, Zero, w/e are oppressive top tiers but at least they have execution requirements you can respect. People just hate the poo poo out of eye lasers and F23. It doesn't help that he's probably the worst animated character in the game.
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Jul 15, 2013 07:22
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So Yardbomb, I restarted my Ps3 while looking for answers about that Desync glitch and then when I booted up it immeadiately crashed with a "this system has become too hot" message so I guess I'm just having terrible luck with technical errors. From what I read about the desynch thing it's something to do with errors in compatibility packs so I'm going to delete my downloaded settings and redownload everything before I play again. Anyways, I'm out for the night. Thanks for those 10 seconds or so of matches!
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Jul 15, 2013 07:28
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ParanoidInc posted:So Yardbomb, I restarted my Ps3 while looking for answers about that Desync glitch and then when I booted up it immeadiately crashed with a "this system has become too hot" message so I guess I'm just having terrible luck with technical errors. From what I read about the desynch thing it's something to do with errors in compatibility packs so I'm going to delete my downloaded settings and redownload everything before I play again. Anyways, I'm out for the night. Thanks for those 10 seconds or so of matches! Yeah, something about compat packs and somehow custom button layouts causing that error.  Either way hopefully you're all good next time we get a chance, I was enjoying my 10 seconds of Lobo gameplay.
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Jul 15, 2013 07:30
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ParanoidInc posted:Just trying to get a different perspective here, what don't you like about the combo system of Injustice? It's pretty much the first fighting game that I've ever gotten serious in and the easy combo system is one of the main reasons for that, I was wondering why FGC people don't seem to like it as much. I honestly don't like dial-a-combos. They force you to commit when I'd rather try to poke more. I still like the game, and I've probably put more time into it now than I have with any non-anime fighter, but I'm not a fan of that system. Also, sometimes the input reads are stupid. No, game. I didn't do bf2, I did db2. No, I didn't do df1 I did db1 why the gently caress do you think I pushed forward?  Equilibrium posted:People say this but they've been extremely conservative with the patches this time around in comparison with MK9, where characters would go from monstrous to garbage overnight. Like the most drastic nerfs since the April day0 patch have been BA's non-MB divekick being made punishable, KF's trait getting recovery frames, and all the poo poo that happened to Scorpion/Deathstroke. The nerf to metropolis rooftop and the d2 buff were probably the most impactful changes otherwise. Superman has been "nerfed" like 4 separate times yet they are all barely worth mentioning. Actually, that is true and to be honest I was thinking more about MK9 than Injustice when I said that.
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Jul 15, 2013 07:30
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Mr.Unique-Name posted:No, I didn't do df1 I did db1 why the gently caress do you think I pushed forward? Stop it Grundy, I'm telling you to do Walking Corpse not a b3!
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Jul 15, 2013 07:35
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Yardbomb posted:Stop it Grundy, I'm telling you to do Walking Corpse not a b3! Hey, Grundy things are exactly what I was thinking of.  I think that part of the issue is that the controls are really, really lose when you have alternate control disabled. It's too bad that they become stupid when you enable it. Seriously why the hell would you have a half circle motion instead of back-forward?
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Jul 15, 2013 07:39
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Yardbomb posted:Stop it Grundy, I'm telling you to do Walking Corpse not a b3! Bane, no, don't do that horribly slow and insanely punishable shove! I wanted a charge!
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Jul 15, 2013 07:47
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Mr.Unique-Name posted:Hey, Grundy things are exactly what I was thinking of. I use alternate controls cause I'm fighting on a Xbox360 pad  I found that I was missing a lot more motions without it. I still have trouble with Batgirl's d2xxbf1 sometimes, but I'd miss it a lot more without alternate controls
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Jul 15, 2013 07:50
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sponsz posted:I use alternate controls cause I'm fighting on a Xbox360 pad I hadn't thought of that, maybe alternate controls are like they are so that you can use the 360 pad. I mean if you try to do back-forward with the pad on a 360 controller it's probably going to come out as half-circle forward anyways. Out of curiosity what does dbf, like Shazam's command throw, turn into with alternate controls on?
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Jul 15, 2013 07:56
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The alternate controls suck. Get that $100 stick in the Evo thread OP it's a good deal. Evo/CEO made this game look like poo poo and I don't blame anyone who watched it for thinking this game is absolute poo poo.
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Jul 15, 2013 07:57
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Mr.Unique-Name posted:I hadn't thought of that, maybe alternate controls are like they are so that you can use the 360 pad. I mean if you try to do back-forward with the pad on a 360 controller it's probably going to come out as half-circle forward anyways. QCB, F. It's a huge pain in the rear end, one of the main reasons I abandoned Shazam and Bane. 360 controller sucks anyway, so I'm not lookin for any other handicaps.
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Jul 15, 2013 08:02
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What stick are you guys talking about? I must be blind because I don't see anything about sticks in the evo op. Also I'd have gotten a hitbox but I'm holding off because I doubt the current crop will work on PS4/Xbone...speaking up I'm afraid of this game dying with the new generation 
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Jul 15, 2013 08:05
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Holy Calamity! posted:What stick are you guys talking about? I must be blind because I don't see anything about sticks in the evo op. Also I'd have gotten a hitbox but I'm holding off because I doubt the current crop will work on PS4/Xbone...speaking up I'm afraid of this game dying with the new generation My guess is that they mean the Madcatz TE stick, which is mentioned in the OP of the fighting game thread. You can also look at this: http://forums.shoryuken.com/discussion/137321?threads/what-stick-controller-should-i-buy.137321/ which is also referred to in the FG thread. I have the TE. It's a good stick. I thought it was more than $100 though. It sure as hell was when I got it. I've been thinking about getting a new stick, a PS3/360 compatible one (so I can actually find games in P4A) since what I have now is 360 only.
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Jul 15, 2013 08:14
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I love this game but everyone saying that top 8 was boring is right. The only thing even vaguely interesting was seeing some of KDZ's set-ups.
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Jul 15, 2013 08:26
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Thanks to IronMcHardSteel and Holy Calamity! for beating the crap out of me over and over. You guys are pretty nice to put up with a noob like me.
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Jul 15, 2013 09:11
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Having watched Evo with a bunch of StarCraft 2 & Dota 2 players, here's some complaints I heard about Injustice: - Characters look and move really awkward, like puppets on strings - Too slow, especially after KoF and SSBM. Only Batman has appropriate speed. - The realistic looks don't work, should be more comic-y, and more exaggerated proportions - Too "shiny" - No one liked the interactable mechanic - It's just Mortal Kombat - Superman is boring, he just does the same thing over and over - Why are there no different costume colors, Superman mirrors without alternate costumes are too confusing Overall no one liked it or plans to pick it up, so as a promo the Evo showing was a disaster. e: Most didn't like Marvel either ("too confusing"), though the live crowd hype made it slightly better (also everyone recognizes Justin Wong). KoF, SSBM and SF4 were liked by all. Double Bill fucked around with this message at 14:41 on Jul 15, 2013 |
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Jul 15, 2013 14:13
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Double Bill posted:Having watched Evo with a bunch of StarCraft 2 & Dota 2 players, here's some complaints I heard about Injustice: These are mostly very superficial (but very understandable or even true) statements but it would've been such a different story if top 8 had characters like Grundy, Hawkgirl,... and Hype Pig. No one got to see how good this game can really be and that is so crushingly disappointing. 
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Jul 15, 2013 14:30
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I like Injustice a lot and even I have to admit that it's pretty boring to watch when put against some of the Capcom fighters out there. However, I find it five bazillion times better when I'm playing myself, and I know that when I lose it's because I got outplayed, and not because of the stupidest comeback mechanic ever created (I'm looking at you, Marvel).
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Jul 15, 2013 14:31
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Double Bill posted:- No one liked the interactable mechanic Show them hype pig, convert everyone. I'm also guessing they are not big DC fans in the first place, so I mean yeah a chunk of Injustice's appeal is in the property and it not sucking poo poo
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Jul 15, 2013 14:35
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That top 8 was a really awful showcase. I think part if the problem is that NRS games are so unconventional and the built in systems have to be felt to be appreciated. I'll admit that I thought interactables were dumb as hell when I first saw them, but in mid game they actually feel ok and add a nice amount of strategic depth to the game. The FGC is prejudgemental as hell, and Injustice just doesn't look as slick as the others, and all the 3D MK games were bad, therefore MK9 and Injustice are bad games. The EVO thread was filled with "I don't know much about Injustice but..." comments and some of them were downright false. The FGC also hates to see OP characters win and all we've heard is how ridiculous Supes is. So yeah, game looks weird, Smash Bros items, history of bad games, and OP character wins. Case closed, don't even need to play it. Free Gratis fucked around with this message at 14:43 on Jul 15, 2013 |
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Jul 15, 2013 14:41
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Does anyone use a hitbox? I've used a TE stick since SF4 and I love it, it was like my own personal goal to become proficient in response to all those years as a young kid in the arcade that could barely get a fireball out. But, I'm incredibly intrigued by the concept and it seems to me that it would be far more efficient to turn stick motions into button presses. Anyone with experience?
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Jul 15, 2013 15:50
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Double Bill posted:- Why are there no different costume colors, Superman mirrors without alternate costumes are too confusing This. Why the gently caress don't they force alternate costumes or colors like every other fighting game ever?
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Jul 15, 2013 15:53
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CAPTAIN CAPSLOCK posted:This. Why the gently caress don't they force alternate costumes or colors like every other fighting game ever? The problem is two points -They are working with important characters where colors can't be negotiated. Batman is black, Superman is blue, and Green Lantern is green. Best they can do is shades and tones. -NRS decided to go for a realistic/textured look for the characters instead of more comic book look from MvC3. That means they can't do comic inspired alternate colors.
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Jul 15, 2013 16:02
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The alternate costume thing shouldn't be an issue once the GOTY/Complete edition of the game is out and has all the DLC costumes built into it. There's a lot more variety there, the base game doesn't really have any of the good alternates unlocked without playing through a bunch of story mode content or leveling up a bunch first. But they definitely should have had at least one very distinct alternate look per character available to everyone upon first boot-up, for tournament play if nothing else. Or some sort of code to just unlock everything.
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Jul 15, 2013 16:10
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Liar Lyre posted:The problem is two points MvC3 based its alternate colors on past costumes the characters had throughout their history. Couldn't they do the same as a sort of loophole?  Edit: right, that would be your second point. That still didn't stop them from using costumes from alternate versions of a character, I don't see how shades based on them would be any different. Krad fucked around with this message at 16:55 on Jul 15, 2013 |
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Jul 15, 2013 16:53
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Netherrealms should just give the tourney organizers a code that unlocks all the skins, because their alternate coloring on the base skins universally sucks. Even the Regime skins aren't different enough in some cases.
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Jul 15, 2013 16:58
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Krad posted:MvC3 based its alternate colors on past costumes the characters had throughout their history. Couldn't they do the same as a sort of loophole? Nope, because they have the highly detailed models. An alt color on Superman would be a sloppy palette swap. Plus they have a market of famous alt costume dlc that look fantastic.
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Jul 15, 2013 16:58
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The verisimilitude argument is worthless when you consider Batman and Harley Quinn wall bouncing people all over the place. I know, kryptonion nano machine pills and what not, but still. NRS improved by leaps and bounds from MK9 when it came to button config and training mode. It's surprising they didn't address the color issue. Free Gratis fucked around with this message at 17:08 on Jul 15, 2013 |
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Jul 15, 2013 17:01
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Not having basic visual clarity and distinction in a 2d fighter as a basic, ready to go feature is a pretty obvious issue for a game that's seeking to compete in the competitive fighting game tournament scene, hell for a fighting game in general it's a problem. They could have found some way, I'm sure. Why do you even need to unlock the Regime costumes anyway? It's super dumb.
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Jul 15, 2013 17:03
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I think part of the appeal of MvC is that it's bright and colorful and things are happening all the time always and a man is yelling congratulations at every combo and it's just fun to look at. Spider-Man is doing a little dance! Edit: there's also the fanservice (mango sentinel, Deadpool quoting Yipes, etc) Emo Szyslak fucked around with this message at 17:17 on Jul 15, 2013 |
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Jul 15, 2013 17:04
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Dan Didio posted:They could have found some way, I'm sure. Why do you even need to unlock the Regime costumes anyway? It's super dumb.
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Jul 15, 2013 17:05
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Being visually appealing tends to be an appeal thing, yeah.Liar Lyre posted:Single player content. They already had a wealth of costumes ready to go for the first wave of DLC and for the WB Unlock thing, they couldn't have just had those few costumes for the unlock placebo effect and kept the regime costumes as basic alternatives? I'd think basic functionality would be more appealing out of the box than having slightly more things for people to unlock in really simplistic and easy ways? Without knowing their budgeting and schedule, it seems really crazy that they A) didn't conceive of this problem with how much Netherrealm has been pushing their games in the competitive crowd and B) didn't allocate some time or resources to producing colour alts or costumes that remedied the problem. Say whatever you want about detail complexity (which is another issue to be mentioned, really) I'd rather take a sloppy recolor of Superman that's visually distinct than the mess that is two incredibly similar character models blitzing around the screen. With a lot of the mechanics that featured position swaps and the sheer agility demonstrated by most of the roster, it's even more insane. Shirkelton fucked around with this message at 17:10 on Jul 15, 2013 |
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Jul 15, 2013 17:05
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All they have to do is buy some DLC and there's no alt problem at all. It's not that hard 
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Jul 15, 2013 17:24
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Dre2Dee2 posted:All they have to do is buy some DLC and there's no alt problem at all. It's not that hard That shouldn't be a solution to basic functionality issues and isn't a solution for the tournament scene, which is in part what prompted this discussion. For similar reasons, alts being solely unlockable don't really work either. F-, see me after class. It's just a problem that shouldn't have existed in the first place and it's weird that Netherrealm either didn't anticipate it, or didn't care. Shirkelton fucked around with this message at 17:30 on Jul 15, 2013 |
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Jul 15, 2013 17:26
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Plus 3 characters don't have DLC costumes.
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Jul 15, 2013 17:29
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Liar Lyre posted:Plus 3 characters don't have DLC costumes. I thought it was just Black Adam and Sinestro?
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Jul 15, 2013 17:30
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