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Pesky Splinter posted:You've reminded me how much I hate FFXII's final boss design. Doesn't he literally bond with parts of the battleship Bahamut? They're probably trying to evoke that visual.
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Jul 23, 2013 19:24
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^^^ [e]: Yeah it is. I still don't like it that much. It just feels too much like "We need to make a final boss thing - this'll do". It's hard to explain. Sex_Ferguson posted:Don't think too much about Cloud and Sephiroth's representations in the KH and Dissidia games, Nomura didn't either. He just wanted some dudes who were too cool for school and picked two the two guys from the most popular FF at the time to have done so. And at the time, it was pretty cool too. At that time we hadn't been completely saturated by it, like we are in every other form of media to have Cloud and Sephiroth together in it. Pesky Splinter fucked around with this message at 19:37 on Jul 23, 2013 |
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Jul 23, 2013 19:24
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Now Lightning and uh... Lightning can do that 
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Jul 23, 2013 19:29
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I was also very underwhelmed by the appearance of The Undying. Boss music and build-up was absolutely superb but the design...yuck. FFX-2 is kind of a break with tradition now I think on it. You fight a giant doomsday robot and then you fight Shuyin. He's pretty drat easy but he's not really a "symbolic final boss" like the last fight with Sephiroth or YU Yevon.
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Jul 23, 2013 19:43
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NikkolasKing posted:I was also very underwhelmed by the appearance of The Undying. Boss music and build-up was absolutely superb but the design...yuck. "From the Undying Ones, the world is freed. You shall not tread this path alone. Together we go. Come".  And then it's just disappointment and Palings. 
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Jul 23, 2013 19:57
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Pesky Splinter posted:And Zeromus was a hosed-up bug/lobster thing. I still remember my reaction to seeing this for the first time. "... Why did he turn into something out of Gradius III/Super R-Type?" 
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Jul 23, 2013 20:16
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We were talking a ton about XIII before final boss chat and yet no one's mentioned Orphan. Yay or nay on it coming kinda out of nowhere? And its design? I mean, technically it didn't just pop up randomly but all Bart's talk about destroying Orphan never made me think we'd have to fight the thing ya know? It was kinda neat how it had "two sides" in its fake form and then the symbolic final boss was its true form or something. I liked the music and the big sword attack while it said "the crystals light our path."
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Jul 23, 2013 20:32
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NikkolasKing posted:We were talking a ton about XIII before final boss chat and yet no one's mentioned Orphan. I loved the fight, the music was shockingly good. I know the rest of the soundtrack to xiii was good but that bossfight was a treat. Visually i think it is a bit over-designed but it was fine enough.
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Jul 23, 2013 20:37
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W.T. Fits posted:I still remember my reaction to seeing this for the first time. Well, technically he is a Space Alien 
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Jul 23, 2013 20:38
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With all the allusions to Renaissance art in FF6, the final phase of the battle with Kefka most likely recalls the Cathedra Petri, tying into his delusions of divinity. (The hint is the golden sunbeams.) It can't be too direct a reference, as Kefka's egotism would have him corresponding to the central dove rather than the angels surrounding it. The figures in the tower of bodies leading up to Kefka himself are also references to particular Renaissance artworks but I can't recall which at the moment.
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Jul 23, 2013 20:38
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ImpAtom posted:Doesn't he literally bond with parts of the battleship Bahamut? They're probably trying to evoke that visual. He gets a loving arm cannon and the thing above his head shoots his cutscene attacks. I find it hard to hate a boss who's that over the top, especially considering the previous boss form. I mean, in gameplay terms the fight is artificially lengthened by palings, so that's no fun. I do like how his stats scale with how many Espers you have, though. It's too bad you never get to fight an Occuria in earnest, that'd be pretty cool for a superboss. Gamma Nerd fucked around with this message at 20:45 on Jul 23, 2013 |
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Jul 23, 2013 20:43
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I liked the art-deco inspired Robo-Pope, and the weird serpent-woman cradling Orphan. Not too keen on the fact that their lower halves are a giant sword though. Orphan's design is okay, I guess. I'm not overly keen on it. And I think Born Anew and Nascent Requiem are among the most boring of all the final boss themes the series has had.
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Jul 23, 2013 20:44
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I got really freaked out by Vayne's final form. It looks like he's in pain, and the thing moves like it's in a stop-motion movie.
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Jul 23, 2013 20:52
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Renoistic posted:I got really freaked out by Vayne's final form. It looks like he's in pain, and the thing moves like it's in a stop-motion movie. It definitely looks like something from a Trent Reznor video. It is kinda unsettling, and personally I do think Vayne is in pain; I don't think this form was his idea at all. It's an interesting take on the cliched Winged Final Boss.
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Jul 23, 2013 20:55
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NikkolasKing posted:We were talking a ton about XIII before final boss chat and yet no one's mentioned Orphan. I hate a lot of the tech and city environments for 13 for looking really generic sci-fi city, but I really like what they tried to do with the Fal'cie. Just covering them in opulent golden decorations and making bits of them made of marble and covered in scripture and little cherub heads, its a great way to do the 'machine-god' look. I like Orphan the most because its not a nebulous overdesigned mass like some of the less important Fal'cie and it isn't humanoid at all. Its a big knife with a big religious frieze-looking sculpture on top of it and one of its arms tries to claw at you, and then its just a big circular sculpture with a baby face. I like it because it isn't humanoid at all or really trying to be, which I think is a really smart design choice considering that not caring about humans and not being like humans is a big part of the Fal'cie characters.
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Jul 23, 2013 20:57
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Well with Vayne merging with parts of the fortress he pretty much becomes its' namesake, Bahamut. I thought the design of the boss fight was alright but I never really liked all the Paling stuff in FF12s battles. Made some of the hunts especially annoying to try and deal with.
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Jul 23, 2013 21:01
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Red Bones posted:I like it because it isn't humanoid at all or really trying to be, which I think is a really smart design choice considering that not caring about humans and not being like humans is a big part of the Fal'cie characters.
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Jul 23, 2013 21:03
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NikkolasKing posted:We were talking a ton about XIII before final boss chat and yet no one's mentioned Orphan. Orphan is a loving awesome final boss, but I'm partial to XIII-2's for being pretty simply designed and Invisible Depths being one of the best final boss themes in the series.
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Jul 23, 2013 21:04
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Thinking on it a bit XII and XIII do have a few similar themes since they both have the backdrop of humanity being/having been guided along a particular path. I always found the Occuria stuff interesting and I kind of like that they left them rather mysterious and largely unexplained.
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Jul 23, 2013 21:05
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Last Emperor posted:Thinking on it a bit XII and XIII do have a few similar themes since they both have the backdrop of humanity being/having been guided along a particular path. Despite the poor presentation of it, the Fabula Nova Crystallis mythology is actually really interesting and the connection the Gods, the demigod fal'Cie, and humans have is all very cool. There's a running theme in the mythology, and to a lesser degree in the games, that no one, not even the gods themselves, fully understands the universe they inhabit. Even Bhunivelze is afraid of the Unseen World, the other half to reality that he wouldn't dare step in even after Mwynn lost herself in it.
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Jul 23, 2013 21:08
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Renoistic posted:I got really freaked out by Vayne's final form. It looks like he's in pain, and the thing moves like it's in a stop-motion movie. Schwartzcough posted:It definitely looks like something from a Trent Reznor video. It is kinda unsettling, and personally I do think Vayne is in pain; I don't think this form was his idea at all. It's an interesting take on the cliched Winged Final Boss. Well you can very easily make the argument Venat was the real villain of the game and Vayne and Cid were both just its puppets. It never expected Vayne to succeed - when he was on the verge of death, everything was perfect and Venat was fine with it. So when Venat merged with him and they fused with the ship, it probably didn't take into account how this might all feel to Vayne. THe Occuria's bodies are kinda ethereal too so it probably didn't know much about the limits of physical humes. Last Emperor posted:I always found the Occuria stuff interesting and I kind of like that they left them rather mysterious and largely unexplained. The Occuria were pretty awesome indeed. I liked the additional stuff you could extrapolate about them from the lore and the stuff written in the PHaros. You only really talk to the Occuria once and yet they have such a great presence in the story. NikkolasKing fucked around with this message at 21:14 on Jul 23, 2013 |
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Jul 23, 2013 21:08
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Here's a video of the final boss of FFXII, by the way. The awful stuff begins at 5:00 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JGJlipc-TBk Now that I think about it - I think Vayne might be the only human character who we actually get to witness transforming. The games normally just fade to black and voilá - the boss is now an inhuman abomination! Renoistic fucked around with this message at 21:19 on Jul 23, 2013 |
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Jul 23, 2013 21:15
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Pesky Splinter posted:I liked the art-deco inspired Robo-Pope, and the weird serpent-woman cradling Orphan. Not too keen on the fact that their lower halves are a giant sword though. This. My reaction to Merciless Judgement was as follows: "Oh poo poo he's gonna Supernova me... Wait what. Why is he a giant slab under the golden things? Did they run out of budget or something?" After his attack "...so he belly flops and takes off almost all my health. Okay then." And then I could never take it seriously ever again.
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Jul 23, 2013 21:17
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Vayne's actual bossfight is kinda crap, but I actually found the build-up and context of it pretty poignant and bittersweet. Thanks to the actions of the party, he's won the cosmological war against the Occuria but lost the conventional one against Rozzaria and Rabanastre, he's a dead man and his final form is basically Venat giving him a chance to go out in a blaze of glory as gratitude for overthrowing the old order, I don't think even Venat even expected or intended them to survive the day. It's certainly a different spin on the traditional Final Fantasy god-monster final boss and a good send off for Vayne's morally ambiguous and somewhat sympathetic character.
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Jul 23, 2013 21:48
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DACK FAYDEN posted:It made me think of Bayonetta. Was that just me? Nope. Bayonetta had the same sort of design for the Angels, but did it way better than FFXIII. (Also had better choral boss themes.)
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Jul 23, 2013 21:51
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Of course, once you see where the world goes in Vagrant Story and Tactics, there's also the question of whether it was worth it, because I think it's implied that without the Occuria's influence, magic comes to a slow end.
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Jul 23, 2013 21:55
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NikkolasKing posted:We were talking a ton about XIII before final boss chat and yet no one's mentioned Orphan. Orphan had a presence in the story (discussed in cutscenes and everything, pretty remarkable clarity for FF13) so it doesn't really belong on a list with Necron, Griever, and Caius's 3 multicoloured backup Bahamuts.
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Jul 23, 2013 21:55
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Sex_Ferguson posted:Don't think too much about Cloud and Sephiroth's representations in the KH and Dissidia games, Nomura didn't either. He just wanted some dudes who were too cool for school and picked two the two guys from the most popular FF at the time to have done so. They changed a lot of the Final Fantasy characters they ended up using in the first Kingdom Hearts, for instance Yuffie was originally going to be played by Rikku, but her name was too similar to Riku. Cloud was originally going to be played by Vincent, which would explain his costume and personality. Unfortunately Cloud's demeanour was very popular, and became the template for Advent Children.
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Jul 23, 2013 22:18
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That loving Sned posted:They changed a lot of the Final Fantasy characters they ended up using in the first Kingdom Hearts, for instance Yuffie was originally going to be played by Rikku, but her name was too similar to Riku. Riku and Rikku's names legit confused me back when KH1 and FFX were new. I am part of the problem 
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Jul 23, 2013 22:28
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Well, ya know, Cloud feeling sad about Aerith dying is understandable. She was nice to him and he did kinda almost chop her in half. Plus, even if he didn't directly kill her, he contributed to her death. Vincent mourning Lucrecia though... That's unfathomable to me. Seriously, in all the FFVII Universe, there is no worse character than Lucrecia.
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Jul 23, 2013 22:28
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NikkolasKing posted:Well, ya know, Cloud feeling sad about Aerith dying is understandable. She was nice to him and he did kinda almost chop her in half. Plus, even if he didn't directly kill her, he contributed to her death. ...Hojo? Anyway, whatever happened with Type-0? Was it good? Did it get a fan translation?
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Jul 23, 2013 22:36
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Kefka may have started the angel wing thing, but the tower of "crazy poo poo glued together" you fight beforehand is amazing. It's like HR Giger crossed with Cho Aniki.
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Jul 23, 2013 22:38
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NikkolasKing posted:Well, ya know, Cloud feeling sad about Aerith dying is understandable. She was nice to him and he did kinda almost chop her in half. Plus, even if he didn't directly kill her, he contributed to her death. I thought at first you were talking about his appearance in Kingdom Hearts, where Aeris is alive and well, and they meet up during the ending credits. He's still unhappy in the second game, because of his rivalry with Sephiroth or something, despite the fact that you're never chasing the real Sephiroth in Final Fantasy VII, just bits of Jenova. To him, Cloud's just a Shinra grunt who happened to catch him off guard and throw him into the lifestream, and was easy to manipulate because of the Jenova cell experiments performed on Cloud afterwards. Pyroxene Stigma posted:Anyway, whatever happened with Type-0? Was it good? Did it get a fan translation? You can follow the fan translation here: http://gbatemp.net/threads/final-fantasy-type-0-romhacking.340183/ E: There's more information here: http://skybladecloud.wordpress.com/projects/final-fantasy-type-0-english-translation/ I don't know how Type-0 handles co-op, but it would be great if PSP emulators let you play with other people online. Fister Roboto posted:It's like HR Giger crossed with Cho Aniki. I never noticed Angel Kefka's boner before. That Fucking Sned fucked around with this message at 22:55 on Jul 23, 2013 |
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Jul 23, 2013 22:42
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Fister Roboto posted:Kefka may have started the angel wing thing, but the tower of "crazy poo poo glued together" you fight beforehand is amazing. It's supposed to be Kefka merged with one of the Statues at each level.
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Jul 23, 2013 22:46
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Red Bones posted:I hate a lot of the tech and city environments for 13 for looking really generic sci-fi city, but I really like what they tried to do with the Fal'cie. Just covering them in opulent golden decorations and making bits of them made of marble and covered in scripture and little cherub heads, its a great way to do the 'machine-god' look. I like Orphan the most because its not a nebulous overdesigned mass like some of the less important Fal'cie and it isn't humanoid at all. Its a big knife with a big religious frieze-looking sculpture on top of it and one of its arms tries to claw at you, and then its just a big circular sculpture with a baby face. I like it because it isn't humanoid at all or really trying to be, which I think is a really smart design choice considering that not caring about humans and not being like humans is a big part of the Fal'cie characters. Hate to break your Orphan Bubble but when you stagger him, there is a humanoid form inside.  A loving creepy rear end baby humanoid inside. Level Slide posted:Is that Etro's gate back there? Yup, here's the view before you stagger Orphan, you can see it better. It's the purple thing. 
Hit or miss Clitoris fucked around with this message at 23:00 on Jul 23, 2013 |
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Jul 23, 2013 22:54
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Is that Etro's gate back there?
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Jul 23, 2013 22:57
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Okay, fine, I guess I'll ask: who?
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Jul 23, 2013 23:05
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Dragonatrix posted:Okay, fine, I guess I'll ask: who? It's Bhunivelze's mom.
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Jul 23, 2013 23:11
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Mwynn created Bhunivelze. Bhunivelze killed Mwynn in a power grab. Bhunivelze thought she was plotting revenge from the underworld (actually she couldn't handle it and just dissolved). Pulse and Lindzei were made to prepare for a war between the two worlds (Etro was a mistake, she got kicked out and killed herself). -- This is where the games happen --
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Jul 24, 2013 00:13
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Tempo 119 posted:Mwynn created Bhunivelze. The great deceiver of man, the goddess Lindsey....
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