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Inquisitor right off the bat is pretty interesting. I'm wondering that means starting out as an Interrogator and working your way up, or if it's more like Black Crusade where the Inquisitor is really powerul, but is limited to a more behind the scenes role. Either way would be loving dope.
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Jul 24, 2013 20:20
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Dre2Dee2 posted:Inquisitor right off the bat is pretty interesting. I'm wondering that means starting out as an Interrogator and working your way up, or if it's more like Black Crusade where the Inquisitor is really powerul, but is limited to a more behind the scenes role. Either way would be loving dope. It's not reaaaally right off the bat, they're Elite advances. And they need the GM's permission, so it's entirely going to depend on the particular game you're in. Unless you just meant 'they're in the book right off the bat' and I read it wrong. S.J. fucked around with this message at 20:31 on Jul 24, 2013 |
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Jul 24, 2013 20:22
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I don't know if this is the right place to ask this question, and i didn't see anything in the OP about it: Can anyone suggest some good Dark Heresy/Rogue Trader podcasts?
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Jul 24, 2013 20:29
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The beta rules are $20 and you get $20 off buying the book when it releases so it's like getting the rules for free early if you're planning on buying it. I'm super stoked for this.
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Jul 24, 2013 21:05
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The real question is when will the first pbp beta games pop up 
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Jul 24, 2013 21:07
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Lots of nice stuff tightening up on the system. Man combat is nasty now, no longer will my guardsman blithely ignore big hits with a wound cushion.
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Jul 24, 2013 21:30
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HidaO-Win posted:Lots of nice stuff tightening up on the system. Uggghhh, I crave details but I can't afford to get the pdf right now 
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Jul 25, 2013 03:01
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S.J. posted:Pfft. It's the exact same core system. You'll be able to use them. I'm talking about monsters/adventures specifically here though not the character stuff. Its not, its really really not.
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Jul 25, 2013 03:11
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kingcom posted:Its not, its really really not. It doesn't use d% roll under your stat anymore?
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Jul 25, 2013 03:15
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kingcom posted:Its not, its really really not. Not very helpful to just say that without elaboration.
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Jul 25, 2013 03:19
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I don't have it myself, but I heard it doesn't have wounds anymore, for one thing.
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Jul 25, 2013 03:21
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FFG posted:Will Dark Heresy Second Edition be compatible with the first edition core rulebook and its supplements? So yeah. There's that. It may not be impossible to fudge things into 2e though, I haven't had a chance to pick up the PDF yet.
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Jul 25, 2013 03:22
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S.J. posted:It doesn't use d% roll under your stat anymore? It does but the way combat and NPCs work is very different now. For example, wounds dont exist anymore. You shoot an NPC and if it takes damage it dies if its a standard mook. Just 1 hit will do it on a normal guy, its designed to be working with a 'kick down the door' feel. Players dont have wounds either they just take critical hits and suffer injuries that pile up. Most can take like 4 hits or something (I forget) before they are in the danger zone. The game really shuffles up how numbers, talents and stats work so that old NPCs such that all previous supplements won't fit into the system unless you do a ton of work. Equipment is all different (e.g. guns dont have single/semi/full auto and instead have rof), characteristic advances, talents and classes are all different. Suffice to say they are incompatible with the old stuff. Inquisitors are not starting level though, you need a certain amount of influence (or whatever they are calling it now) to pick it as an elite advance.
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Jul 25, 2013 03:25
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Yeah, I'm aware of what that said. But if the basic core mechanic of d% is still in the game it probably wouldn't take me much effort to translate bad guys over unless they've completely redone almost every aspect of the game. e ^^^ I ran most mooks like that anyway, I'm interested to see what the changes are. Hopefully a buddy of mine will be buying it tonight or tomorrow.
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Jul 25, 2013 03:26
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S.J. posted:they've completely redone almost every aspect of the game. That. Also when I say '1 hit' I mean 1 hit. The rule is essentially a single point of damage kills them, one of the talents a mook can get is that they dont die on the first hit. The game kinds of breaks them into mooks, elites, masters like Deathwatch and sets up an xp cost for building encounters.
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Jul 25, 2013 03:29
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Yo if anyone wants to do an IRC game or a Roll20 or whatever, I'm in. Our Only War game a while back feel through and I have no one locally who wants to play any sort of RPG.
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Jul 25, 2013 03:43
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Babe Magnet posted:Yo if anyone wants to do an IRC game or a Roll20 or whatever, I'm in. Our Only War game a while back feel through and I have no one locally who wants to play any sort of RPG. I'd be up for something but I don't know if I explicitly want to play more Dark Heresy 2. I'll be honest and say I'm not a fan. The system is alright but doesn't seem to mesh too well with what they seem to think your going to do with it or at the very least what the designers are going for. EDIT: Oh man Adepts are still the best gunslingers and clerics the best psykers.
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Jul 25, 2013 03:50
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The talent trees...  Into the Jaws of Hell is the ultimate command talent. It requires Disturbing Voice. Which penalizes command checks.
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Jul 25, 2013 04:10
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That sounds a lot more streamlined. I wonder if they'll keep the same level of lethality though.
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Jul 25, 2013 04:12
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kingcom posted:That. Seems legit to me. I'd be happy to be wrong honestly if the game is better.
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Jul 25, 2013 04:36
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I'm very interested in the new rof rules, but want to hold out for the physical copy. Can anyone who got the beta summarize them?
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Jul 25, 2013 05:46
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The Psyker Power revamp is interesting; you get a Peril-equivalent if you push straight off the bat, no Psychic Phenomena, and there is a table for each power. On the other hand, it's impossible to get the 'die and be replaced by a Chaos Spawn' result without using the higher echelons of the PR-equivalent, so you end up with more horrible debilitating effects without actually killing your party. Unless I'm missing something, Damage only matters to see if you beat Toughness and Armour. I'm not the best mechanically speaking but it seems like high rate of fire weapons like the Hell-gun beat stuff like the Bolter and Plasma Gun handily against anything that doesn't have Great Unclean One levels of defence (especially as most pieces of armour have less AP than the old system).
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Jul 25, 2013 05:57
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S.J. posted:Seems legit to me. I'd be happy to be wrong honestly if the game is better. I think the system itself is good but it doesn't do the kind of things I want when I'm playing Dark Heresy I think. It's me, I'm the grognard. AnEndcat posted:The Psyker Power revamp is interesting; you get a Peril-equivalent if you push straight off the bat, no Psychic Phenomena, and there is a table for each power. On the other hand, it's impossible to get the 'die and be replaced by a Chaos Spawn' result without using the higher echelons of the PR-equivalent, so you end up with more horrible debilitating effects without actually killing your party. Your right but to be fair bolters have always been garbage weapons that only served as a good item because they were dirt cheap to buy (which again only matters in a system using currency). Theres some really cool features in there, the perils stuff especially. The thing is look at the requirements for a psyker. Then look back and see the section about rolling stats as the default. If you want to play a psyker you are essentially hoping you rolled the right stats or you cant buy/use powers until you start dumping xp into characteristics. You combine that with how a psyker needs multiple stats to use powers which often are stats which are extremely costly for him to actually improve means they have all these systems that don't actually combine properly together. kingcom fucked around with this message at 06:09 on Jul 25, 2013 |
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Jul 25, 2013 06:07
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kingcom posted:Theres some really cool features in there, the perils stuff especially. The thing is look at the requirements for a psyker. Then look back and see the section about rolling stats as the default. If you want to play a psyker you are essentially hoping you rolled the right stats or you cant buy/use powers until you start dumping xp into characteristics. You combine that with how a psyker needs multiple stats to use powers which often are stats which are extremely costly for him to actually improve means they have all these systems that don't actually combine properly together. Some of the requirements seem kind of high, but each Discipline has only one-non Willpower requirement for a small subset of powers, as far as I can see. With Telekinesis you can go all the way to the capstone power just pumping Willpower. If you're trying to to grab everything it's going to be a huge XP tax but I don't think they're trying to encourage that; a witch-tracker Seeker is going to mostly grab divination, a Primaris Psyker formerly attached to an Imperial Guard regiment is going to mostly focus on Telekinesis and Pyromancy, an Astropath Hierophant (honestly a decent role to model their connection with the Emperor) is going to focus on Telepathy, and so forth.
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Jul 25, 2013 06:24
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kingcom posted:I think the system itself is good but it doesn't do the kind of things I want when I'm playing Dark Heresy I think. It's me, I'm the grognard. Talk to me about skills and investigation. Talk to me dirty.
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Jul 25, 2013 06:30
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What about Tech Priest, did he get any fun new stuff 
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Jul 25, 2013 06:38
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What are the classes now? Same ones, just revamped?
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Jul 25, 2013 06:38
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AnEndcat posted:Some of the requirements seem kind of high, but each Discipline has only one-non Willpower requirement for a small subset of powers, as far as I can see. With Telekinesis you can go all the way to the capstone power just pumping Willpower. If you're trying to to grab everything it's going to be a huge XP tax but I don't think they're trying to encourage that; a witch-tracker Seeker is going to mostly grab divination, a Primaris Psyker formerly attached to an Imperial Guard regiment is going to mostly focus on Telekinesis and Pyromancy, an Astropath Hierophant (honestly a decent role to model their connection with the Emperor) is going to focus on Telepathy, and so forth. That doesn't seem a bit odd to you, that to be the all powerful puppet master you want to go and be a priest? Not to mention the 35 WP requirement that you need anyway. Seems a little stringent to me for what mostly doesn't amount to much. S.J. posted:Talk to me about skills and investigation. Talk to me dirty. Theres a whole tree for investigation now! I know it sounds terrible but I've played this system for a bit and thats about all I want of it, seems like they need to take this combat system and use it to replace only war. That would be a pretty cool game or maybe an Arbitrator game?
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Jul 25, 2013 06:40
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Yeah, I'm really just wanting a good investigation and social-combat system in there by release more than anything. And super deadly combat. But from what I'm reading on the official forums unless a bad guy is a mook it can be way too difficult to kill someone, combined with some really, really weird numbers for armor given by equipment - a robe is 3 armor and power armor is 6.
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Jul 25, 2013 06:48
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Ego Trip posted:The talent trees... Into The Jaws Of Hell doesn't require a test to work, though. It's just the ultimate expression of "He's terrifying, but I'll follow him to the Warp and back". I like it. EDIT: Besides, Disturbing Voice doesn't penalize command checks, it penalizes using Fellowship in a non-threatening manner. "Let not the Emperor find you wanting!" would not take a penalty, if those being commanded know what will happen to them if they are found wanting. 
Kenlon fucked around with this message at 21:19 on Jul 25, 2013 |
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Jul 25, 2013 06:49
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Kenlon posted:Into The Jaws Of Hell doesn't require a test to work, though. It's just the ultimate expression of "He's terrifying, but I'll follow him to the Warp and back". I think your all missing the absolute best part of that tree. To be unremarkable you need to be good at public speaking.  EDIT: The best quote: quote:The character has one of his internal organs destroyed, removed, or irreparably damaged. This could be anything from his spleen, one of his lungs, or even his heart. Characters with this condition can no longer recover fatigue by resting. kingcom fucked around with this message at 07:35 on Jul 25, 2013 |
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Jul 25, 2013 07:33
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Dre2Dee2 posted:What about Tech Priest, did he get any fun new stuff There's actually no Tech Priest class anymore, though a character with the AdMech background can simulate it just fine.
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Jul 25, 2013 08:03
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Night10194 posted:There's actually no Tech Priest class anymore, though a character with the AdMech background can simulate it just fine. I think I actually prefer this.
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Jul 25, 2013 08:49
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Night10194 posted:There's actually no Tech Priest class anymore, though a character with the AdMech background can simulate it just fine. So are there no classes period, just a bunch of backgrounds and stuff? Does it use an aptitude system? I'm interested but wary about these new combat rules, but I have to say I've always kind of disliked the way all the various games have had "the tech priest" and I'm glad to get rid of it. Whether you were in DH, OW, DW, BC, didn't mater. You were playing the Tech Priest. EDIT-I saw kinda because hey tech priest is fun and cool. He's just in every drat game, like a joke.
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Jul 25, 2013 10:37
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kingcom posted:I think your all missing the absolute best part of that tree. To be unremarkable you need to be good at public speaking. I think you'll find that the people that are terrible at expressing themselves in public are quite often the loudest and most noticeable. Also my grandpops had his heart irreparably damaged/removed (pacemaker), no wonder he's such a lazy fucker these days.
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Jul 25, 2013 10:51
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Jack B Nimble posted:So are there no classes period, just a bunch of backgrounds and stuff? Does it use an aptitude system? I'm interested but wary about these new combat rules, but I have to say I've always kind of disliked the way all the various games have had "the tech priest" and I'm glad to get rid of it. Whether you were in DH, OW, DW, BC, didn't mater. You were playing the Tech Priest. There's basically three steps to creating your character - Homeworld, Background and Role. Homeworld works pretty much the same as it always has - determining characteristic modifiers and fate points. Options are Feral, Forge, Hive, Highborn, Shrine and Void. Background is sort of like the DH 1e career, in that it defines your starting skills, talents and gear. Options are Administratum, Arbites, Astropaths, Mechanicus, Ministorum, Imperial Guard and Outcast. Role is exactly that - what kind of role you want to have within the team. Determines your characteristic and skill xp costs. Options are Assassin, Chirurgeon, Desperado, Heirophant, Mystic, Sage, Seeker, Warrior. From these, you're meant to create your own "career". If you wanted to do a standard Tech-Priest, you could choose Forge World, Adeptus Mechanicus, Sage. Alternatively, a Skitarii might be Forge World, Adeptus Mechanicus, Warrior. It's highly flexible, but at the cost of being very min-maxable.
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Jul 25, 2013 12:12
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Damage has massively changed, you no longer have wounds instead every hit that exceeds your toughness + armour goes onto a location and damage type specific chart to detail your misfortune. Each wound you've previously taken there adds +5 to the chart, each critical wound +10. Lots of maiming results. Cover has thus become important because you can't tank with armour, toughness and wounds anymore.
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Jul 25, 2013 12:33
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kingcom posted:That doesn't seem a bit odd to you, that to be the all powerful puppet master you want to go and be a priest? Not to mention the 35 WP requirement that you need anyway. Seems a little stringent to me for what mostly doesn't amount to much. Well Astropaths are the most potent human Telepaths, and they are the most faithful of the bunch as Psykers go (including their weird cults like the Elutrians) but yeah looking at the fluff of Hierophant that doesn't really look intended by the writers. I also don't like how Mystic's special role bonus is 'an Elite Advance basically anyone can get'. Don't think this has been mentioned; skills are decoupled from characteristics so you have stuff like Intelligence Command checks for co-ordination of forces, or the fact that voidship Piloting requires Intelligence while starfighters and bombers require Agility. Investigation as mentioned has a bunch of Talents that are designed specifically for it. Apart from that, you've got a 4-page mini-guide on how to run an Investgation (mostly GM notes rather than anything mechanical) and a new party stat called Subtlety which has mechanical impact on how NPCs 'in the know' view you, if they know you at all (worryingly, altering it seems to come down to 'you're the GM, you figure it out'). There's no social 'combat' like Tome of Excess, just a quick list of personality types of NPCs and how skills affect them and their disposition. It's a neat idea but some of it's straight up weird. I can buy Clever NPCs not liking being Commanded and Submissive ones being fine with it. I'm not sure why an Aggressive character's disposition is decreased from a successful Deceive, though. AnEndcat fucked around with this message at 13:17 on Jul 25, 2013 |
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Jul 25, 2013 13:12
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AnEndcat posted:Investigation as mentioned has a bunch of Talents that are designed specifically for it. Apart from that, you've got a 4-page mini-guide on how to run an Investgation (mostly GM notes rather than anything mechanical) and a new party stat called Subtlety which has mechanical impact on how NPCs 'in the know' view you, if they know you at all (worryingly, altering it seems to come down to 'you're the GM, you figure it out'). There's no social 'combat' like Tome of Excess, just a quick list of personality types of NPCs and how skills affect them and their disposition. It's a neat idea but some of it's straight up weird. I can buy Clever NPCs not liking being Commanded and Submissive ones being fine with it. I'm not sure why an Aggressive character's disposition is decreased from a successful Deceive, though. Thats my issue with, theres some cool ideas but they just don't come together. Also the subtly system seems like a big mess and I don't know how the resolution doesn't come down to 'you fail the adventure go home' or 'GM fudges something that lets you keep going'. The issue with these kinds of systems is that what has ever been to stop the players walking in and going 'Inquistion!'. If the answer 'because it will expose them/let the enemy get away' that just results in the scenario failing, move on. What if they play subtly but blow their rolls and everything unravels, the adventures get stunted and end. Its a cool idea but the way it's implement means its another dangerous roadblock that looks like a pain for the GM to be tracking without a direct noticeable gain for the system other than maybe encouraging players to be subtle. That then conflicts the game wanting you to be starting off as pretty important people so the inevitable 'FREEZE INQUISTION' moment happens anyway.
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Jul 25, 2013 14:14
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kingcom posted:Thats my issue with, theres some cool ideas but they just don't come together. Also the subtly system seems like a big mess and I don't know how the resolution doesn't come down to 'you fail the adventure go home' or 'GM fudges something that lets you keep going'. The issue with these kinds of systems is that what has ever been to stop the players walking in and going 'Inquistion!'. If the answer 'because it will expose them/let the enemy get away' that just results in the scenario failing, move on. What if they play subtly but blow their rolls and everything unravels, the adventures get stunted and end. Its a cool idea but the way it's implement means its another dangerous roadblock that looks like a pain for the GM to be tracking without a direct noticeable gain for the system other than maybe encouraging players to be subtle. That then conflicts the game wanting you to be starting off as pretty important people so the inevitable 'FREEZE INQUISTION' moment happens anyway. Well, I think the personality stuff can be hashed out by the beta, but Subtlety is more concerning. It's not like FFG don't have a history of leaving rules like that frustratingly vague for the neophyte GM, or systems that look cool on the surface but are a complete pain to actually use (Endeavours, why do you exist). (Not fake Latin enough; maybe 'DURATUS, INQUISITION!'). AnEndcat fucked around with this message at 15:01 on Jul 26, 2013 |
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Jul 25, 2013 14:29
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