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I posted this on the Paradox forums but I figured I'd double it up here to increase the odds that a dev sees it: Re: diplomats, you should be able to send a diplomat who is already on a long term mission (such as improve relations) to do another job (such as deliver a peace treaty) without actively cancelling the long term mission first. It would simply add the time taken for the diplomat to 'return home' onto the normal time taken for the mission to take place, and then the diplomat would go back to his old job as soon as he came off cooldown again. This would save a massive amount of micromanagement and waiting. You should also be able to queue up multiple missions, so for example you could tell a diplomat to make an alliance, then a royal marriage, then a guarantee on the same state. I realised that I literally spent about half my time in one play session clicking around inside the diplo menu and waiting around for diplomats to get freed up for a new mission and it made me sad.
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Aug 9, 2013 13:33
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Puella Magissima posted:What's up with the trade goods value mapmode? Almost all the provinces besides gold are red. Are the trade goods in the east way better or something? Early on no one has the buildings that increase trade value so everything is low.
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Aug 9, 2013 13:34
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RabidWeasel posted:I posted this on the Paradox forums but I figured I'd double it up here to increase the odds that a dev sees it: I agree with this and think it should apply to merchants too. If I remember right to switch a merchant from collecting to steering you have to recall him first, then send him out again. In the time between these two actions I usually start doing something else and then forget all about the second action (same with getting distracted while waiting for diplomats to return).
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Aug 9, 2013 13:44
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Dr. Video Games 0031 posted:EU4's battle AI is still incredibly frustrating. Allied troops will still happily let all of your soldiers get slaughtered as they sit around sieging useless provinces right next to major battles even though your forces combined could repel the enemy. And then once your forces get defeated of course theirs gets slaughtered in turn. Maybe one day this issue will be fixed in Paradox's games and the AI will actually co-operate with the player in warfare, but it's not in this iteration, which is a really big disappointment. I kind of like the battle AI, I had an army that would stay behind and deal with rebels as the ottomans when I went to war and I found that everytime I went to war my allies would basically all blob up and attach themselves to the army that stayed behind to attack the rebels, so I would just send that one to the front instead. Maybe the AI will only attach units if it won't go over supply in an area?
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Aug 9, 2013 13:44
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fuf posted:I agree with this and think it should apply to merchants too. If I remember right to switch a merchant from collecting to steering you have to recall him first, then send him out again. In the time between these two actions I usually start doing something else and then forget all about the second action (same with getting distracted while waiting for diplomats to return). Actually if you click directly on the trade node and then click the button for what you want to do (collect, redirect power, whatever) then it lets you select from your full list of merchants and you can send one that's already busy, so you don't actually need to recall traders at all. This is kind of why it's so frustrating that it's not the same for diplomats who tend to swap jobs more frequently!
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Aug 9, 2013 13:51
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So there's no mapmode to view coalitions? Seriously?
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Aug 9, 2013 14:09
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RabidWeasel posted:Actually if you click directly on the trade node and then click the button for what you want to do (collect, redirect power, whatever) then it lets you select from your full list of merchants and you can send one that's already busy, so you don't actually need to recall traders at all. This is kind of why it's so frustrating that it's not the same for diplomats who tend to swap jobs more frequently! Yeah but if you already have a merchant in a node, and you want him to stay in that node and start collecting instead of steering (or vice versa), you have to recall him first and then wait to send him back out. Unless I'm missing something really obvious.
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Aug 9, 2013 14:14
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I didn't like it , although maybe so many new concepts are hard to assimilate
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Aug 9, 2013 14:16
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fuf posted:Yeah but if you already have a merchant in a node, and you want him to stay in that node and start collecting instead of steering (or vice versa), you have to recall him first and then wait to send him back out. Unless I'm missing something really obvious. You might be right there I don't think I tried that. It would be pretty handy! 
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Aug 9, 2013 14:18
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Am I mistaken or is there no such thing as population numbers in a province anymore? EDIT: Also, I do like EU4 so far. Still kind of confused by the exact workings of trade and when I want to be collecting or steering. All I know is I send a merchant somewhere and make light ships patrol and I get more money so I guess I'm doing it right.
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Aug 9, 2013 14:18
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You are not mistaken. Population numbers were both completely extraneous and frequently inaccurate so they were removed.
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Aug 9, 2013 14:20
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Bossie Lott posted:Am I mistaken or is there no such thing as population numbers in a province anymore? No they dumbed it down for the COD kidz. 
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Aug 9, 2013 14:20
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Fister Roboto posted:You are not mistaken. Population numbers were both completely extraneous and frequently inaccurate so they were removed.
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Aug 9, 2013 14:38
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Wolfgang Pauli posted:Now cities grow and shrink by the tax modifiers of whoever is occupying them. A highly tax bonused nation occupying a highly tax malused province will see visible growth of city sprawl overnight. In my cheating-my-rear end-off 28 year WC there was so much sprawl that I couldn't read province names. I will say that sprawl conforms to terrain really nicely, though. Huh, so the on-map city actually grows based on the total tax output of the province? That's really cool.
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Aug 9, 2013 14:48
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I've been experimenting with the map, and I'm proud to present two whole new mods for EU4! Aqua Mundi In which giants prowl the shallow seas of the world, as they vie for dominance of the few spots of land left behind after The Great Flood.  Acidus Mundi In which a Venetian merchant ship accidentally spilled its cargo of LSD into the Mediterranean.  Seriously though, it's always such as hassle to make Paradox maps do what you want.  Which brings me to a question; any chance we could get borders on the coasts, like in CK2, Paradox? I really think it helps make the map look much tidier, and it could just be an option in case some people prefer them not to be there.  The game already has one kind of border for the islands, so it doesn't seem like a huge hassle to do from where I'm sitting. Unlike perhaps these requests  :1. The option to make non-transparent water, especially for the political map mode, where the "realistic" water clashes horribly with the way the land looks. 2. An option to have the map be completely flat. (Looks like it would need those borders mentioned above to look good though, otherwise it's jagged as hell and looks kinda floaty.) 3. A different way for the terrain map to interact with the political map. Currently it looks like it's something like the Overlay effect in Photoshop, where I think a Multiply would enable modders to make much prettier maps. Basically, I want the ability to draw much more map like textures of mountains and poo poo, and not just have them disappear into the country color like they do now.
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Aug 9, 2013 14:57
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RabidWeasel posted:Huh, so the on-map city actually grows based on the total tax output of the province? That's really cool. Well it grew in EU3 too, it was just based on the actual pop number. I believe the 'stages' were something like 10,000 25,000 and 100,000.
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Aug 9, 2013 15:08
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A Buttery Pastry posted:
Something like a 'Terrain Effect' slider would be nice. That way, you can just straight up decide how much of the terrain map mode you want to bleed into the others.
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Aug 9, 2013 15:16
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Are accepted cultures still tied to how large of a percentage they contribute to taxes? If so that's a good reason to not use the cultural conversion option. If you convert enough provinces to the point that they stop being accepted, then it makes further expansion into that culture's territory more costly.
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Aug 9, 2013 15:23
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I can't imagine a situation where I'd dump diplomacy points into cultural conversions unless it's overseas and even then, I'd feel iffy about it. 100 diplomacy points is a quarter of an idea and early game you'll generally want to drop military points into leaders and tech and admin points into expansion, so most early ideas will be diplomacy ones.
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Aug 9, 2013 15:44
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ThePutty posted:Something like a 'Terrain Effect' slider would be nice. That way, you can just straight up decide how much of the terrain map mode you want to bleed into the others.  for DLC that did nothing else than making it possibly to recreate the HandDrawn Map Mod from EU3 in glorious HD. (I would actually settle for just straight up using that map, low resolution included, that's how much better I think it looks than the EU4 map.)Cynic Jester posted:I can't imagine a situation where I'd dump diplomacy points into cultural conversions unless it's overseas and even then, I'd feel iffy about it. 100 diplomacy points is a quarter of an idea and early game you'll generally want to drop military points into leaders and tech and admin points into expansion, so most early ideas will be diplomacy ones. A Buttery Pastry fucked around with this message at 15:49 on Aug 9, 2013 |
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Aug 9, 2013 15:45
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Vaos posted:Agreed, basically like in EU3 there's not much reason to not paint your whole empire to your religion. Maybe if Jizya (the extra tax for non-muslim people) was better implemented in game, and conversion was harder, it would be interesting to have the choice to convert (for less revolt risk after converting and better religious unity) or not to convert (no revolt risk now because of conversion, more money, better relations with neighbors having that religion).
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Aug 9, 2013 15:49
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Reddit has been naughty and removed the 1520 time limit. You can also change countries.
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Aug 9, 2013 15:52
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Dibujante posted:Conversion of religions and cultures just happens way too quickly. It's not feasible for an Iberian colonizer to convert mesoamerica to Catholicism and/or an Iberian culture within the timeframe of the entire game. There were still enough Mayans in Mexico in the 19th century to launch a prolonged uprising. To this day, when I go to Yucatán, I need an interpreter in some parts because Spanish is still not spoken 100%. Yeah, you really have to wait until you develop machine guns for that to happen. I don't think it's possible to get a historically sensible framework for cultural conversion in a game like EU without having a punishing Ubik-level model of it, at which point most people probably wouldn't even bother, so I'd just rather leave it out of the player's hands altogether. Cultural fractures have been -- and continue to this day to be -- the bane of empires, so any one-button solution is going to feel a bit off. That said, I'm still eagerly anticipating the game, especially sinking my teeth into the trade system. I'm still not sure how it works at all, but I like staring at those flowing arrows...
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Aug 9, 2013 15:59
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Vodos posted:Reddit has been naughty and removed the 1520 time limit. You can also change countries. Not that I'm a masochist, but I wonder if the same thing is possible to do for
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Aug 9, 2013 16:02
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CharlieFoxtrot posted:Yeah, you really have to wait until you develop machine guns for that to happen.
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Aug 9, 2013 16:04
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Dibujante posted:Not even machine guns,bro. There are still more than 6 million mayans in Mexico. Compare this to less than 1 million native americans registered living in reservations in the United States. You just can't effectively eliminate a population that big (although the Spanish and later the Mexican government have tried repeatedly). It's just bogus for new world colonies to not be constantly plagued by indigenous revolts throughout the entire time period. Hence the reason for why we need a colonies DLC that makes colonial dynamics way more interesting. It was a joke about Victoria 2, but I digress. I agree about the historical erasures that happen with current models of cultural relations, but I wonder what exactly "Colonial DLC" would entail, as in how you would tastefully model the fact that, playing as a state, oppressed peoples will continually confound your ambitions -- and not having it be as gameplay-frustrating as "Framed!" or "Barbary Pirates gently caress you again"
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Aug 9, 2013 16:14
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I just went through the tutorial and I still feel like I don't know most of the mechanics... oh well, time to learn by play.
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Aug 9, 2013 16:14
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Dibujante posted:Conversion of religions and cultures just happens way too quickly. It's not feasible for an Iberian colonizer to convert mesoamerica to Catholicism and/or an Iberian culture within the timeframe of the entire game. There were still enough Mayans in Mexico in the 19th century to launch a prolonged uprising. To this day, when I go to Yucatán, I need an interpreter in some parts because Spanish is still not spoken 100%. Yeah, I feel like culture conversion was fine in EUIII. Extremely rare and event driven. Religious conversion needs to be way longer and more expensive too. I was literally flipping Greek provinces to Islam in less then a year.
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Aug 9, 2013 16:15
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Dibujante posted:Not even machine guns,bro. There are still more than 6 million mayans in Mexico. Compare this to less than 1 million native americans registered living in reservations in the United States. You just can't effectively eliminate a population that big (although the Spanish and later the Mexican government have tried repeatedly). It's just bogus for new world colonies to not be constantly plagued by indigenous revolts throughout the entire time period. Hence the reason for why we need a colonies DLC that makes colonial dynamics way more interesting. Joke sailed over your head mate.
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Aug 9, 2013 16:16
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CharlieFoxtrot posted:It was a joke about Victoria 2, but I digress. I agree about the historical erasures that happen with current models of cultural relations, but I wonder what exactly "Colonial DLC" would entail, as in how you would tastefully model the fact that, playing as a state, oppressed peoples will continually confound your ambitions -- and not having it be as gameplay-frustrating as "Framed!" or "Barbary Pirates gently caress you again" I apologize for not acknowledging the Victoria 2 colonial life rating joke :< That said, I'd like to see a situation where your colonies receive their own interface, kind of like the shogunate system in Japan or something. So to people who are not you, Spanish Mexico just looks like your territory, but to you, you can see which provinces are occupied by your colonists, and which provinces are indigenous. You can do colony-level diplomacy with indigenous provinces (for example, set up an alliance with the Tlaxcalans to help you subdue the Aztecs) without having it carry over to a larger scale (Tlaxcala does not declare war on France when they attack your European holdings; Aztecs don't consider your unconquered Spanish territory when assessing their warscore against you, etc.). Conversion could be more of a back-and-forth (get a leader to agree to conversion as part of a diplomatic deal and things could be easier, but in exchange they might want autonomy - less tax revenue / supply limit / etc. for you, or try to convert them by the sword, which means you're going to have to deal with a province that is constantly at war with your colony). This could also feed into a more effective independence chain, where your colonial provinces could have a different relationship to you than your non-colonial provinces and have revolt risk be affected by different things.
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Aug 9, 2013 16:23
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Fintilgin posted:Yeah, I feel like culture conversion was fine in EUIII. Extremely rare and event driven. I think it could be a lot longer as well, but I didn't like it in EU3 either. In EU4 it's "OK, in 40 months you all are going to be Serbian" while in EU3 it was "oh hey we're all Serbian all of a sudden."
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Aug 9, 2013 16:26
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Aw, the requirement to form Romania requires Silistra... this is going to make my first proper game a lot harder. I have no idea how I'm going to be able to beat up the Ottomans.
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Aug 9, 2013 16:26
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Fister Roboto posted:I think it could be a lot longer as well, but I didn't like it in EU3 either. In EU4 it's "OK, in 40 months you all are going to be Serbian" while in EU3 it was "oh hey we're all Serbian all of a sudden." Pops are probably a bridge too far, but if we can deal with percentage pie wheels for trade, we can deal with them for provincial culture/religion. 
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Aug 9, 2013 16:28
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http://forum.paradoxplaza.com/forum/showthread.php?706954-RECRUITING-Game-Scripter East vs West wants you to help make their game a success!
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Aug 9, 2013 16:30
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Saying that the Ottomans shouldn't be converting cultures and only teching up might not be the best way but we'll have to wait till launch to find out. To westernize you have to be a certain number of tech levels behind. Maybe it's better to fall behind early in the game when the tech advantage isn't that huge. You can just avoid teching up a certain category and use those points for cultural shifts. If you just kept teching up you would westernize way later and the difference in tech in the mid game is probably going to be way more decisive.
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Aug 9, 2013 16:33
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Patter Song posted:http://forum.paradoxplaza.com/forum/showthread.php?706954-RECRUITING-Game-Scripter This game is never going to be released, isn't it?
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Aug 9, 2013 16:34
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Should I feel bad about hex editing the demo file if I already bought EU4 weeks ago?
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Aug 9, 2013 16:42
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fspades posted:This game is never going to be released, isn't it? Paradox going to steal all the assets for HOI4.
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Aug 9, 2013 16:44
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Patter Song posted:http://forum.paradoxplaza.com/forum/showthread.php?706954-RECRUITING-Game-Scripter Is it just me or did the interface change a bit? It seems more compact somehow. Better, actually.
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Aug 9, 2013 16:44
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Trujillo posted:Saying that the Ottomans shouldn't be converting cultures and only teching up might not be the best way but we'll have to wait till launch to find out. To westernize you have to be a certain number of tech levels behind. Maybe it's better to fall behind early in the game when the tech advantage isn't that huge. You can just avoid teching up a certain category and use those points for cultural shifts. If you just kept teching up you would westernize way later and the difference in tech in the mid game is probably going to be way more decisive. E: Something completely different, but much more serious. Paradox broke my heart. They never fixed the coastline in Nordjylland, even when they said they would. 
A Buttery Pastry fucked around with this message at 16:52 on Aug 9, 2013 |
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Aug 9, 2013 16:47
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