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cokerpilot posted:Was that guy talking about getting you a pair of swim trunks inside his wagon coming on to mister Dewit or am I imagining things.
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# ? Sep 10, 2013 22:37 |
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# ? Jun 10, 2024 05:12 |
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The beginning of Battleship Bay bugs me. You fall from the sky into the fake sea, along with several chunks of a smashed up bridge and a pissed off Songbird... but no-one notices. No-one thinks anything's amiss until the clouds clear and they see the ruined statue. The locals must really be into their sunbathing. Also, I think you missed one of the more unpleasant conversations on the beach: a woman complains about her mentally disabled brother to a friend, who then suggests that she knows a man who can "take care" of him hint hint; apparently, having a "simple" relative brings shame to your family on Columbia. Contrasting beautiful surroundings with terrible people is kind of a cliche, but goddamn Binfinite does it well.
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# ? Sep 10, 2013 22:42 |
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Sundowner posted:I keep forgetting about some of the incidental stuff Elizabeth might do. I'll go back and record a little bonus video soon to show more of Battleship Bay off with Elizabeth being around, I definitely want people to realize just how great a job Irrational did with her. What about that one part in the video when she starts moving and fidgeting like a crazy person because she's trapped in a crowd of nearly featureless nobodies that won't stop staring at you for no reason?
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# ? Sep 10, 2013 22:47 |
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Real hurthling! posted:What about that one part in the video when she starts moving and fidgeting like a crazy person because she's trapped in a crowd of nearly featureless nobodies that won't stop staring at you for no reason? Yup, I specifically chose not to say she was prefect. She isn't. I don't think any game AI is perfect, is it? I meant all things considered they done a great job with her incidental and idle animation/action stuff. It would be silly to assume I meant otherwise!
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# ? Sep 10, 2013 22:51 |
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Some other little touches, the bits before the ambush of people trying to act natural. "Do you sell... sauerkraut" and the guy saying it was a dollar when the sign on the stand says two gets me every time.
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# ? Sep 10, 2013 23:01 |
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Kinda late, but why do you leave the numbers and crits up. It's kinda annoying in combat since this ain't borderlands.
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# ? Sep 10, 2013 23:04 |
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Sundowner posted:Yup, I specifically chose not to say she was prefect. She isn't. I don't think any game AI is perfect, is it? I meant all things considered they done a great job with her incidental and idle animation/action stuff. It would be silly to assume I meant otherwise! I'm only callin em likes i sees em from looking at a very small sample of footage of her that contained a pretty funny pathing bug.
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# ? Sep 10, 2013 23:09 |
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Bruceski posted:Some other little touches, the bits before the ambush of people trying to act natural. "Do you sell... sauerkraut" and the guy saying it was a dollar when the sign on the stand says two gets me every time. Don't forget the musician playing out of tune. Or the guy sweeping the floor being both white and kind of rude to you (which the signs in the maintenance areas said was against protocol). There are a ton of signs those guys are not legit and I wish the ticket taker hadn't been made so obvious.
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# ? Sep 10, 2013 23:18 |
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Brainamp posted:Kinda late, but why do you leave the numbers and crits up. It's kinda annoying in combat since this ain't borderlands. Yeah, there's no reason for it being on. It's partly because I never bothered to turn them off from when I first played the game and because I don't even notice them when I'm playing anymore. I'll turn them off for the next-next update and beyond. On that note, If there's anything else I can tweak or stop/start doing for future recordings let me know now so I can start doing it sooner rather than later.
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# ? Sep 10, 2013 23:28 |
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Another excellent video from Sundowner, another pile of meaningless babble from me:
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# ? Sep 10, 2013 23:57 |
If Mrs. Comstock was Booker's wife, then wouldn't he recognize her? Also, if Elizabeth was Booker's daughter, then how did she get to Columbia in the first place? Think of the timeline here.
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# ? Sep 11, 2013 00:36 |
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I can mention this since it's not a spoiler, but the reason Esther had that bit with Elizabeth was to confirm that it was actually Elizabeth. It was part of the setup for the ambush. It was a little unclear, but "Elizabeth? Oh, what a nice name" bit was part of the general "everyone is really suspicious" leadup.
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# ? Sep 11, 2013 00:48 |
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Booker does sound a little bit like an indulgent brother or father figure with his "That airship is going to Paris!" trick. Though part of me wants to believe he means it, since he also sounded disgusted by the fact they treated her like a lab rat in the earlier update. (Also it says how naive she is when she totally believes him about it. I was like "DeWitt that is an obvious lie", but she fell for it.)
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# ? Sep 11, 2013 01:03 |
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GenHavoc posted:[*]I mentioned the Strength Through Leisure antecedents in the last video's comments, but it occurs to me at the very beginning of this video that we might see more support for the "ultra-racist, gender-progressive" nature of Columbia here. The man and woman at the beginning of the video on the beach are wearing nearly identical bathing costumes. Both are the ludicrous turn-of-the-century striped monstrosities that were common to the time, but the woman is not sequestered into a private section of the beach, nor made to use a swimming carriage, nor any of the other Victorian/Edwardian-era contraptions that were in common use among "civilized" folk back then. Could be nothing, but it caught my eye. They're not gender progressive, and the subtitle was wrong and meant to be miscegenists. The women weren't using the bathing booths because then you couldn't see them and listen in on them, basically. The other woman was without an escort, (I assume just at the time, because her husband went off elsewhere, and Booker is apparently gorgeous enough to get hit on by everyone.) but she was expected to have one, this isn't exactly progressive. And in addition to the "Pregnant unmarried women should go to the slums to have an illegal abortion/ abandon their bastard to die in an alleyway." discussion, I figure I should mention three conversations Sundowner missed. Back before the raffle, there were two men and a woman discussing their role models. One of the men mentions a military guy who won battles, another mentions Comstock, who made Columbia and founded a religion, and the woman of course, is devoted to Lady Comstock, who didn't do anything at all but marry Comstock, die, and look pretty. Another, outside the Arcade, had one woman mention to another that her sister had a job. The second woman is absolutely appalled, and the first woman starts making hasty excuses about how it's just as a journalist. The second woman then responds, "It may be modern, but that doesn't make it right!" The third was the crying boy and his mother to the right of the "Irish Problem" kinetoscope. The mother is scolding the son to the effect of, "You can sexually harass all the girls you want, boys will be boys, but don't let me catch you kissing irish or colored girls, that's just wrong, and makes your parents look bad!" The people of Columbia are basically just as sexist as you'd expect of the era, and a subtitle typo's thrown you all off into misunderstanding the whole setting. Yeah there's lady soldiers, but that's because this is the "Second amendment is the only important amendment " crowd with a comparatively small population. And for other, lazier, and more spoilery reasons I'll bring up later.
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# ? Sep 11, 2013 02:31 |
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GenHavoc posted:
I do hope Sundowner is able to play around more with the Duke & Dimwit skits, either in a separate video or otherwise; they really are a great little piece of insight into the psychology of Columbia, as well as... ah, drat, next update, next update... Keep going, I like your speculation! But yeah, this was a great little area. Lizzie's day out! Shame it had to end with her so freaked out... Still, the most important thing is, we have a shotgun now! It's not an FPS without one. Also, Louispul5: cut that out. There's too much evidence to the contrary to stomp on the sexual politics speculation, and the examples you quoted don't even refute what GenHavoc is speculating about. We don't know the woman on the beach is expected to have an escort, we don't know enough about Lady Comstock yet to say that all she did was "look pretty," the mother and the crying boy had more to do with racism (and speaks of different social mores: it wasn't ok at all for boys to interact with girls in any capacity in turn of the century society), and while I'll give you the journalist conversation, that that person is seeking such a profession at all says this is a much different society from "every other place from the time period." Discussion is fine, but don't try to stamp out speculation.
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# ? Sep 11, 2013 02:56 |
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Yeah, that part about the guy ordering saurkraut on his hotdog was supposed to sound stilted, it was some sort of Spy Speak like "The spotted cuckoo bird is flying backwards!" "It's a cold day for pontooning!" Too bad Esther was a plant, it was nice to meet someone acting friendly for once.
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# ? Sep 11, 2013 02:59 |
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resurgam40 posted:I do hope Sundowner is able to play around more with the Duke & Dimwit skits, either in a separate video or otherwise; they really are a great little piece of insight into the psychology of Columbia Yeah, that's the thing. I had this entire update recorded and it had a bunch more stuff in it then I went and accidentally deleted the files, upon re-recording I missed some things. I'm going to put together a bonus video tomorrow showing off more incidental bits with Elizabeth around the Bay and get the rest of the Duke & Dimwit plays (all of which I had recorded previously) and whatever else I come across. Louispul5 posted:They're not gender progressive, and the subtitle was wrong and meant to be miscegenists. To be fair, it's pretty drat clear that he says misogynists, too, which is where the confusion comes from.
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# ? Sep 11, 2013 03:09 |
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GenHavoc posted:Now... why would the lifeguard be concerned about being overheard talking about Darwin? I mean, the racism of Columbia would seem to be based at least in part on the "Scientific Racism" of the turn of the century, which relied, at least in part, on a narrow interpretation of Darwinian "inherited characteristics" theory. The Phrenology study from a few videos ago would indicate that much. At the same time however, Darwin's evolution model was then, as now, considered in opposition to scriptural accounts of the creation of life in specific and humanity in general. Given Columbia's strong religious undertones (and overtones), I could see Darwin being somewhat of a bad word here. But plainly they are paying him some mind... Racists have contradictory and unsound beliefs, it's not really that difficult to understand. In regards to that guy saying misogynists, it's kind of funny everyone here just takes that guy at his word. He's a racist shithead who doesn't even know what the words he's using mean, it's not that difficult to me. Just another way of showing that the Columbians are a bunch of dumbasses. e: there is a specific reason I think that guy misspoke, but it's spoilers, I guess.
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# ? Sep 11, 2013 03:15 |
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Inferior posted:The beginning of Battleship Bay bugs me. You fall from the sky into the fake sea, along with several chunks of a smashed up bridge and a pissed off Songbird... but no-one notices. No-one thinks anything's amiss until the clouds clear and they see the ruined statue. The locals must really be into their sunbathing. Yup, it feels like they didn't know how to transition you from this area to the next so they just hope you don't really think about it. It seems really lazy. For all the work they put into the game, whoever was writing the script couldn't come up with a better transition than "Booker falls on a public beach but nobody notices"? I mean if he just fell from the sky it would be weird, but a giant metal bird fell in with him.
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# ? Sep 11, 2013 03:25 |
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GenHavoc posted:[*]These two again. Who is the man with Lutesce (I think it's been established extremely well that the woman is Lutesce) here? Someone in the thread called him her brother, but we've seen no evidence of that yet, to my knowledge. Moreover, Sundowner, I'm afraid I don't see why the Cage is more thematically appropriate than the Bird at this juncture. I would have assumed the opposite, but then perhaps you know something about the ongoing themes here that I don't. Honestly with regards to the cage thing, I'm getting (WELL) ahead of my self by even saying that. It shouldn't change anything and you'll see eventually why I think it's more "thematically sound", which might be a little injudicious of me to say. It's more so that it lines up with things in a nice way later but the Bird choice is probably just as likely to do so as well. Pretty sure we've seen Daisy's face long before this update, no? Any time we've heard an audiolog from her it pops up with her image. Unless I'm just not remembering when we started getting Daisy Voxophones. Also by the way, this post gets updated nearly every time I post an update. It has character pics/bios. I haven't been keeping tabs on Kinetiscopes as well as I have been Voxophones (as they feel more pertinent) so I apologize if there's some we've seen. I'll go back before next update and take note of what I've played before and skip them over for future updates. She slipped through the bars yes, I'd imagine in disgust that Booker just lay waste to a room full of people. EDIT: Regarding Booker and Elizabeth falling, although it's actually just a low LOD render of the beach for the sake of the cutscene, the beach is empty as they're falling. I'd imagine the assumption is that the beach was empty and there was some passage of time between Booker falling, going in to his weird P.I office dream sequence and being woken up by Elizabeth. Probably just grasping at straws for a reason here but I don't think they intended for people to just not give a poo poo about any of what happened. Sundowner fucked around with this message at 03:33 on Sep 11, 2013 |
# ? Sep 11, 2013 03:27 |
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Ulvirich posted:If Mrs. Comstock was Booker's wife, then wouldn't he recognize her? Also, if Elizabeth was Booker's daughter, then how did she get to Columbia in the first place? Think of the timeline here. Assuming Mrs. Comstock was Booker's wife, maybe she was pregnant when she left? But if she was, then either Booker's a big ol' dumb for not connecting the dots and assuming Elizabeth is his daughter, or her pregnancy wasn't showing when she left. It does make sense- I mean, you're a lady of good quality; would you want to spend the rest of your life with some tired old drunk, or an up-and-coming God-fearing genius of a man with his own flaying city (or plans for such)? THAT being said, it all relies on Mrs. Comstock being the connection between DeWitt and Comstock, which is something I don't think there's any support for, though I might have missed something. Personally, I think the real movers and shakers are the Luteces (they seem too connected to be strangers); they seem to operate on a near-omniscient level, they seem to appear where they don't have to, they appear supernaturally connected etc. If I may supply my own wildly unsupported theories, I think that they're perhaps brother and sister, or even parallel dimension versions of each other, which is why they're able to connect each others' sentences and such- apart from a chromosome, they're the same person. Maybe Elizabeth's tampering with time and space is causing the walls between dimensions to break down, and only geniuses (a genius?) of Lutece's (the Luteces'?) level(s?)* could hope to resolve it, and even then only by working together, which is where Booker somehow comes in. *Man, and you thought time travel tenses were bad. EDIT: As for the cage and bird thing, maybe the connection is that everyone is somehow caught in their own cage? Elizabeth was obviously locked in her tower, and if I get my story cliches right, will end up caged again somehow. Comstock's obviously trapped by his fanaticism (and to a lesser extent, so is the rest of Columbia). Booker's caught up by, I dunno, whoever/whatever AD is? His alcoholism? Something yet to be revealed, perhaps? CommissarMega fucked around with this message at 05:04 on Sep 11, 2013 |
# ? Sep 11, 2013 05:00 |
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CommissarMega posted:...which is why they're able to connect each others' sentences and such... That's just a matter of being close. My twin brother and I do it all the time, and I've seen other people do it as well once they've known each other for ages. It tends to feel odd to an outside viewer because if we do it ourselves it feels natural since our brains are supplying the context and the rest of the words. Like listening to one side of a telephone call.
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# ? Sep 11, 2013 05:07 |
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I think I know Sundowner's reasoning for choosing the Cage over the Bird Pendant. The Cage is empty while the Bird appears to be falling, dead or hurt.
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# ? Sep 11, 2013 05:24 |
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GenHavoc, your posts continue to be great but I swear to god if you write "Lutece" as "Lutesce" again I am going to murder something. Anyway. I'm going to be honest: A lot of things I post in this thread are basically going to be paraphrasings of a certain extremely wordy but excellent review of the game (written by a guy who's really good at writing really long reviews (although 4,000 of those words are about the boxart (and they're still fascinating (I'll probably link it when the LP is done-ish (it doesn't really spoil many things but it kinda skirts a lot of things))))), including this thing: I could totally believe that Elizabeth was not always going to be invincible. We can only speculate as to how her vincibility was going to manifest in the game - maybe you'd have to always be defending her, or maybe she'd actually fight - but given how completely stupid she acts in combat I reckon the developers suddenly realized they'd bitten off more than they could chew and just decided "no, gently caress it, not doing this, activate God Mode". I'll give them this; Elizabeth certainly acts in the totally carefree manner of someone who doesn't take damage from bullets.
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# ? Sep 11, 2013 05:25 |
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So I think, after this video, I can finally start going into why I think Elizabeth is one of the best sidekick characters in videogame history. The fact that she is pleasant, has a good personality and is key to the plot is simply icing on top of the cake. But that's not enough to make a good tag-along character. The fact is that way too often, these sorts of characters solely exist to cause problems for you, and otherwise have no redeeming features. Oh no, the character I'm escorting is being attacked, time to save them! Oh no, they've been kidnapped, again! I think Irrational took the right tack by making Elizabeth an effective non-participant in battles: she takes care of herself in that she knows how to stay out of trouble. But what really seals the deal is that Elizabeth is helpful. Really helpful. She doesn't directly fight, but she'll find things for you at the one moment when you need it the most, and she does it over and over again. So, in short, she's pretty great.
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# ? Sep 11, 2013 05:56 |
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Yeah. It can be a little jarring at times, but making her invincible was easily the right decision for this game. Her abilities are useful and she's likable enough, but having to constantly baby her would have offset that pretty quick. The Last of Us got away with dumber (in some respects) ally AI, and that game actually had stealth sequences to deal with, so I think we can forgive it here.
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# ? Sep 11, 2013 06:03 |
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Okay, I can finally say that terrible spoiler that I had to edit out before! That music at Battleship Bay! Listen to it again! Listen hard! Seriously, go back and listen to it for a few bars before you mouse over the spoiler. Did you go back and listen? It's Girls Just Wanna Have Fun arranged for pipe organ. This game. I thought it was especially appropriate that poor deprived Elizabeth runs off and starts dancing to this particular song as soon as she gets out of prison.
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# ? Sep 11, 2013 06:07 |
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JT Jag posted:So I think, after this video, I can finally start going into why I think Elizabeth is one of the best sidekick characters in videogame history. i disagree entirely shes clearly a ripoff of garnet from final fantasy ix gabe newell is a hackfraud for trying to ripoff something from Glorious Nippon. But in all serious yeah she's pretty great. Although she does actually bear quite a few resemblances to Garnet. They go though a similar character arc and everything also a ponytail. He will confirm this in the next part. Also fun fact if you get up on the stage you can jump off of it and bounce off the heads of the children. And it's patched now but you could do the same thing to the bathroom attendant, if you could angle yourself just right you could have bounced off of his head indefinitely. David D. Davidson fucked around with this message at 06:34 on Sep 11, 2013 |
# ? Sep 11, 2013 06:16 |
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GenHavoc posted:
I don't think it ever gets spelled out how they arrived there, but I assumed the Vox smuggled them there somehow. They don't show up if you don't choose to throw the ball at Fink; if you throw it at them a Fink representative gives you the gear as a gift from Fink "in appreciation of your savagery", while if you just let time run out nobody shows up at all.
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# ? Sep 11, 2013 06:16 |
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Arglebargle III posted:Okay, I can finally say that terrible spoiler that I had to edit out before! That music at Battleship Bay! Listen to it again! Listen hard! I don't want to steal your thunder or anything but, um....Sundowner kind of already pointed out exactly that in the video.
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# ? Sep 11, 2013 07:23 |
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Sosogomi posted:Booker does sound a little bit like an indulgent brother or father figure with his "That airship is going to Paris!" trick. Though part of me wants to believe he means it, since he also sounded disgusted by the fact they treated her like a lab rat in the earlier update. Yeah, the comment earlier in the thread about how this comment helps "humanize" Booker sort of overlooks the fact that it's a real obvious ploy just to get Elizabeth on the airship. Booker is super-focused on his mission and if his characterization up to this point is anything to go by he doesn't really care about straight-up lying to her in order to get that to happen. Of course this sort of makes Booker come across as incredibly stupid since he saw this person not 20 minutes ago (well okay, give or take a bout of unconsciousness) rip open a hole in the fabric of space-time. Even if he's not the sort of person to go "Egads, she's created a portal to a parallel universe/timeline!" he should still probably be a little warier about lying to someone like that even if she is sheltered, even if he is desperate to pay off this debt of his. This is one of the downsides to having a voiced protagonist because while on the one hand it can aid characterization tremendously on the other hand it can result in situations where the viewpoint character sees something that has the player going "holy loving poo poo, what was that!?" and the character is all "welp, doesn't matter, on with the mission." As to the beach landing and why nobody cared, I'll take Sundowner's explanation one step further; remember waayyyyyyyyy back at the beginning of the LP where some people are talking about the schedule of various floating districts linking up, how one guy's favorite park is only available a couple hours a day? If all the platforms work on a schedule like that, including Battleship Bay, then Booker and Elizabeth could have hit it during a part of the day when it's closed to citizens by virtue of not being adjacent to anything else, and then by the time Booker wakes up it's "docked" and opened for business.
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# ? Sep 11, 2013 08:13 |
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DukeofCA posted:I don't want to steal your thunder or anything but, um....Sundowner kind of already pointed out exactly that in the video. Just further proof.
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# ? Sep 11, 2013 08:55 |
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Kind of a cool little thing during this sequence is if you look in the baby carriage in the hallway between beach sections you find a pack of bullets, which I took as a reference to the gun in the baby carriage in the original BioShock. This game really rewards you for poking around everywhere.
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# ? Sep 11, 2013 09:22 |
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ParliamentOfDogs posted:Kind of a cool little thing during this sequence is if you look in the baby carriage in the hallway between beach sections you find a pack of bullets, which I took as a reference to the gun in the baby carriage in the original BioShock. This game really rewards you for poking around everywhere. There was another reference to Bioshock earlier which Sundowner didn't point out which is that after you arrive in Columbia and approach the priest who baptizes you he says "Is it someone new?," which is what a splicer says when Jack first arrives in Rapture.
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# ? Sep 11, 2013 09:51 |
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Elizabeth is a pretty adorable sidekick, yes. All the little things she does outside of combat are really nicely done and help her coming alive. The fact she's a huge boon in combat and not a liability is only a bonus.Kai Tave posted:Yeah, the comment earlier in the thread about how this comment helps "humanize" Booker sort of overlooks the fact that it's a real obvious ploy just to get Elizabeth on the airship. Booker is super-focused on his mission and if his characterization up to this point is anything to go by he doesn't really care about straight-up lying to her in order to get that to happen. Eh, it's understandable. He is a wanted man, and the whole of the city's armed forces are looking for them, so trying to get out asap is pretty sensible. He just doesn't have the luxury to consider hypothetical dangers considering how much proven, actual danger he is right now. Iceclaw fucked around with this message at 14:07 on Sep 11, 2013 |
# ? Sep 11, 2013 12:00 |
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Iceclaw posted:Eh, it's understandable. He is a wanted man, and the whole of the city's armed forces are looking for them, so trying to get out asap is pretty sensible. He just doesn't have the luxury to consider hypothetical dangers considering how much proven, actual danger he is right now. Yeah, I can agree with that, he's being very focused on the short term goals of 1). survive and 2). bring "them" the girl, but so far none of Booker's plans have really worked out all that well in the "things going smoothly" sense (I mean he's survived and progressed so far but with lots of yelling and shooting and things exploding and getting stabbed through the loving hand), so I can only imagine that promising Elizabeth that he's there to take her to Paris is going to yield similar results only instead of shooting and nosebleed-yelling it's going to be opening holes in reality over Pompeii or something. Also I went back and watched the leadup to the ambush again and it's actually really great how many details throughout the whole level were leading up to that moment and all without the game straight-up hammering you over the head with what was going on until right at the last minute (come on guy at the ticket counter, could you be any more obvious? Booker is the worst detective). I love that and it's a thing I wish more games would do even if it only really has that impact the first time you play it.
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# ? Sep 11, 2013 12:23 |
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Kai Tave posted:There was another reference to Bioshock earlier which Sundowner didn't point out which is that after you arrive in Columbia and approach the priest who baptizes you he says "Is it someone new?," which is what a splicer says when Jack first arrives in Rapture. I appreciate a woman who appreciates vaaaalueeeeeee! There are quite a few callbacks to the first Bioshock, but they kind of taper off around the midpoint then come back.
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# ? Sep 11, 2013 13:15 |
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Ulvirich posted:If Mrs. Comstock was Booker's wife, then wouldn't he recognize her? Also, if Elizabeth was Booker's daughter, then how did she get to Columbia in the first place? Think of the timeline here. Remember, my theory involves Anna leaving Booker when pregnant with Elizabeth, which was seventeen years ago. Booker's looking at an idealized poster drawn by hand in the early 20th century, after seventeen years of heavy drinking, of someone he last saw as a young woman. It's conceivable that he would not recognize Anna, especially given the other insane memory-tricks going on here. Louispul5 posted:They're not gender progressive, and the subtitle was wrong and meant to be miscegenists. The women weren't using the bathing booths because then you couldn't see them and listen in on them, basically. The other woman was without an escort, (I assume just at the time, because her husband went off elsewhere, and Booker is apparently gorgeous enough to get hit on by everyone.) but she was expected to have one, this isn't exactly progressive. I'm sorry, but I reject this analysis. I went back and listened to that misogynist/miscegenists line four times, and I certainly heard 'misogynist'. And the fact that there's lady soldiers is hardly an unimportant detail. Not one military or police force on the face of the Earth employed female officers in 1912, and you're expecting me to casually ignore their existence in Columbia for no reason? You're asking me to believe that the line, and the subtitle for the line were both wrong, and uncorrected, again on no evidence? It's possible the women were not in the changing/bathing rooms because then you could talk to them, but it's entirely also possible that they were not in them to make a point, and given that every detail in this game is loaded with meaning (or at least that we're pretending it is), I'm not going to selectively ignore piles of evidence just because they don't fit some other wildly unsupported theory. Whether the woman without an escort was without an escort by accident or because her husband stepped away or because of any other thing is beyond the evidence. She was without one. And nobody was hassling her for being without one, nor did she particularly seem to care about being without one. We can claim that this is just lazy programming, sure, but then we can claim that for any drat thing in the game, and if we're going to go down that route, then the whole exercise of trying to derive meaning from any of the game's clues is pointless. I see no reason thus far to disprove the theory of Columbia's gender-progressive politics. I do not accept that the misogynist subtitle is a typo, and I will continue to not accept that it is a typo until someone can point me to evidence better than "I said so" or "stop over-analyzing". If there is evidence to that effect that would be a spoiler to publish at this juncture, then we will get to it in due time. I've posted 18 different wildly unsupported theories already, and I am certain that most if not all of them will ultimately be proven wrong (hell, half of them contradict one another). The entire point of this exercise is to speculate wildly on the game based on such evidence as has thus far been presented to us, and everything I've seen so far points to Columbia, despite their deplorable racial policies, being oddly and anachronistically progressive on matters of gender, if not by 2013 standards, then certainly by period ones. Livingtrope posted:Racists have contradictory and unsound beliefs, it's not really that difficult to understand. Similar point as before. I take the guy at his word because there's no reason not to. If we assume he is an idiot who doesn't know what the word means, we might as well assume that any line in the game could be substituted for any other line we like because of "typos". The line makes sense to me in context and appears in both the audio and subtitle version. I can't think of any reason why I would choose to discount it. And while I can accept that there may be spoiler-related reasons to do so, those are beyond the evidence at this point. If I'm gonna post wild speculation, I can't just selectively ignore clues on the assumption that they may at some point later on be rendered erroneous. I might as well assume that the "Vox Populi" were actually supposed to be called the "Very Poors" because nobody on Columbia is smart enough to speak Latin and the name must be meaningless for reasons not in evidence. Similarly with the Darwin comment, if Sundowner thinks it important enough to call out in the video, then I'm gonna pay attention to it. And if the comment seems contradictory, then I'm going to speculate as to why. Because I'm not doing all this to dismiss possible clues to the world of Columbia as just "racists are dumb". A great many men in 1912 were self-avowed, virulent racists, including Presidents, industrial magnates, religious leaders, generals, and statesmen of note. Woodrow Wilson praised the KKK in public, for God's sake. It does not follow that because a man was a racist, that they were incapable of coherent thought, or that we are under some obligation to discount everything they say in this game, or treat such things as they say as thoughtless twaddle, to be dismissed without analysis. If we applied that logic consistently here, we could literally say nothing except "boy, racism sure is bad." I'm purposefully over-analyzing what I see in these videos. Because I enjoy it. And I'm almost certainly wrong about a great deal here. But until there's a reason not to do so, I'm gonna treat everything people say in this game as potentially important. Because that's how you analyze a piece of art. Sundowner posted:Pretty sure we've seen Daisy's face long before this update, no? Any time we've heard an audiolog from her it pops up with her image. Unless I'm just not remembering when we started getting Daisy Voxophones. Also by the way, this post gets updated nearly every time I post an update. It has character pics/bios. I actually don't think we've seen Daisy's face before this point. Or if we had, I didn't remember it. I also don't think we've heard her voice before either, which is plainly not an Irish one. That said, I could be completely insane. Oh, and please don't worry about repeating the odd Kinetiscope, Sundowner. This LP is fantastic so far, and a bit of repetition won't kill anyone. I leave each video wanting to see more. Fedule posted:GenHavoc, your posts continue to be great but I swear to god if you write "Lutece" as "Lutesce" again I am going to murder something. Crap... sorry! I thought it was Lutesce. I'll try to correct that in the future. GenHavoc fucked around with this message at 14:21 on Sep 11, 2013 |
# ? Sep 11, 2013 13:55 |
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Yes, Booker, just rest your right hand on the counter. No, don't worry about exposing the mark of The False Shepherd, it's not like it ever got you into trouble.
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# ? Sep 11, 2013 13:57 |
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# ? Jun 10, 2024 05:12 |
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Iceclaw posted:Oh, and looks like someone in the thread is trying to pass off prior knowledge of the game as speculation. That's kind of rude. Let's not do this, there's so much speculation you can't start trying to selectively edit what people are saying because then you end up spoiling things.
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# ? Sep 11, 2013 14:02 |