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Bell_ posted:Oh, I definitely don't see her lasting into the next intermission. But most of the criticism I've seen stems from attributes Vriska may very well monopolize. Yeah to be fair, Areana only seems to have tackled the logical issues so far. I mean hell, just a few pages ago we were talking about the likelihood of Jade getting possessed again, cue Areana making absolutely sure that doesn't happen. Areana isn't evil, just ruthless and overconfident in a way only a Serket could be.
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Sep 15, 2013 01:10
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Thundarr posted:Well, as a billions-of-years-old re-lifed ghost who knows everything about everything, she's probably in on the villain's handbook and knows that if somebody has even the slightest chance of stopping her at some point, they will. As a Serket who Always Knows Best and has difficulty grasping what the whole point of Sburb/Sgrub is, she'd have no problem with killing everybody she needs to if that is the simplest way to make sure she wins / is proven right / gets to Be The Hero. The answer is "because Jade and Jane didn't tell her Aranea was there because they wanted to not waste her time".
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Sep 15, 2013 01:19
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), then you'd think the Thief of Life would be the ideal person to deal with that wrinkle too.
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ALEX TRILLTON posted:So is the deal that andrew hussie is terrified of emotional investment or is it just that he really wants to hammer the theme that ~much like homestuck, growing up is meandering and anticlimactic~ and pat himself on the back for interjecting a major theme of the comic into the structure of the comic? It's a mystery. Probably the latter! To me, Homestuck feels like a mockery of the traditional hero's journey. Yeah, the main characters might not be doing anything impressive like getting magical swords or slaying great beasts, but that's okay becuase that stuff isn't really useful anymore, and the kind of people who do get obsessed with that kind of journey end up become emotionally stunted manchildren who make life miserable for everyone because they never took the time to make friends and grow as a person. I dunno, maybe its because I don't get too wrapped up in the stupid fan stuff, and I take breaks from the comic every once and awhile, but I'm not too worried with the way the comic will end.
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Sep 15, 2013 01:21
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Clip-On Fedora posted:Probably the latter! To me, Homestuck feels like a mockery of the traditional hero's journey. Yeah, the main characters might not be doing anything impressive like getting magical swords or slaying great beasts, but that's okay becuase that stuff isn't really useful anymore, and the kind of people who do get obsessed with that kind of journey end up become emotionally stunted manchildren who make life miserable for everyone because they never took the time to make friends and grow as a person. As opposed to Homestucks heroes who...don't do much of all and become more broken as time goes on. (I mean Look at Dave, dude's kissing an alien who doesn't even know his name!)
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Sep 15, 2013 01:24
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All these flaws in homestuck are making me worried about how Hussie will handle the Namco dating sim 
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Sep 15, 2013 01:35
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ZenMasterBullshit posted:As opposed to Homestucks heroes who...don't do much of all and become more broken as time goes on. (I mean Look at Dave, dude's kissing an alien who doesn't even know his name!) Everybody should want to kiss the mayor. That is a perfectly normal thing to want to do.
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Sep 15, 2013 01:37
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Yonic Symbolism posted:All these flaws in homestuck are making me worried about how Hussie will handle the Namco dating sim I'm pretty sure he'll be forced to have an editor for a major company's published game. And that alone will help his writing massively.
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Sep 15, 2013 01:42
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ZenMasterBullshit posted:As opposed to Homestucks heroes who...don't do much of all and become more broken as time goes on. (I mean Look at Dave, dude's kissing an alien who doesn't even know his name!) Oh c'mon like you wouldn't kiss the mayor. 
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Sep 15, 2013 01:51
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I hope Jade comes back but only if she's still evil Jade. Regular Jade is boring as hell.
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Sep 15, 2013 02:03
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Evil Jade is boring as hell too, honestly.
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Sep 15, 2013 02:21
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Clip-On Fedora posted:Probably the latter! To me, Homestuck feels like a mockery of the traditional hero's journey. Yeah, the main characters might not be doing anything impressive like getting magical swords or slaying great beasts, but that's okay becuase that stuff isn't really useful anymore, and the kind of people who do get obsessed with that kind of journey end up become emotionally stunted manchildren who make life miserable for everyone because they never took the time to make friends and grow as a person. I tend to avoid fan stuff as well, for extremel obvious reasons; the only reason I'm worried is because in order for the point to really be effective the ending has to be unsatisfying, which is sort of a catch-22 for a fun read, and homestuck is about Kids And Fun. Homestuck has enough goodwill built up for it to unironically go on a "totally epic, bro" tangent like what's happening now, since Andrew Hussie's writing oozes charm, but if he does that the feel of the ending is going to be really "off". People say that Homestuck needed to be edited extremely badly, and it probably does, but at the same time the theme is tied into its structure and it might not work as well if it's tightly edited since a big part of Homestuck is despite all the flash,wit, and appearance of plot motion, nothing actually happens for the vast majority of it, which is probably why people on tumblr have such a bad time explaining what the plot is.
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Sep 15, 2013 02:26
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ALEX TRILLTON posted:I tend to avoid fan stuff as well, for extremel obvious reasons; the only reason I'm worried is because in order for the point to really be effective the ending has to be unsatisfying, which is sort of a catch-22 for a fun read, and homestuck is about Kids And Fun. Homestuck has enough goodwill built up for it to unironically go on a "totally epic, bro" tangent like what's happening now, since Andrew Hussie's writing oozes charm, but if he does that the feel of the ending is going to be really "off". I don't know about editing, but having someone or something that doesn't let Hussie just run completely rampant would help.
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Sep 15, 2013 02:38
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I really sort of have to assume this whole thing's going to make sense when the intermission's done with. I'm sure those retconn-y powers are going to be used, I'm just not sure in what capacity. I do find it kind of funny to read this thread, though. "Bleh, it's just death, she's gonna get better, death has always been super-duper irrelevant when in the Stuckest of Homes, especially for God Tiers." *8R8K* "Hussie, what you're doing is narratively destructive and inconsistent!"
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Sep 15, 2013 03:00
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No, what we're saying is "oh, I guess THAT method of resurrection is out, that just leaves, oh, the other 20 still available." I really have to agree with the others that I'm far less invested in Homestuck than I was a year ago. At first, I put it down to the new kids being really boring and flat characters, but then I realized it was because Hussie doesn't do anything to advance the growth or direction of the characters. All their development happens offscreen, so we never get a feel for their relationships with each other other than second-hand references. None the characters have done anything to meaningfully defeat the bad guy that's being increasingly cluttered with 3 or 4 others and whose identity, origin, and ultimate goals are still somewhat vague. It all contributes to a feeling of confusion about what are we supposed to care about and indifference to the updates as they feel less like advancements for the plot and more of a way for Hussie to jerk the audience around with anticlimaxes. Observe how we still all go "meh" to Jade first being de-grimbarked and then killed, since we all expect the changes to be reversed in a second.
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Sep 15, 2013 03:07
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Oxxidation posted:You all laughed at me back in the middle of Jakechat! You called my criticisms mad! Well, WHO'S LAUGHING NOW!? Aaaaaah ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha haaaaa! Because you're like the lost souls of tv iv. You cannot leave alone t h at which you claim to hate. In five months you and the others like you will still be here, still posting about how bad homestuck is now. How you dislike the new kids. How much you hate the fandom. Negative upon negative upon negative. But you will never leave this thread. That's why we laugh. But maybe the more proper response is to cry.
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Sep 15, 2013 03:17
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I just like homestuck 
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Sep 15, 2013 03:22
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I don't know that I have much to add to the discussion that hasn't been said by others already, but I can definitely echo the sentiment of not feeling as invested as I was. Jade was my favourite of the initial group. Squeal Like A Pig And Fertilize Some Plants won me over initially, the way she was willing to just go along with the ridiculous instruction and really enjoy it tickled me. Then seeing her grow to the point she was swearing at Karkat won her a special place in my affections. I don't mind admitting I got a little moist of eye during Cascade when she ascended to Dog Tier with that big smile on her face letting Davesprite know everything was going to be ok. Then going on to do the epic Spacey Thing had me cheering her on. It was a moment of major triumph for a character who'd just come back from a major shaving foam related defeat. And yet these past couple of updates, my only response has been a vague sense of wry amusement over how Hussie's going about how she's dead. She's really dead. Look, even the clock says she's dead. Except She's not dead. She's just out of the story for a while. The only characters we've seen actually properly die are a horde of alternate timestream ghosts who got disintegrated to establish that LE is a threat beyond the plethora of available resurrection methods, and who gives a gently caress about them? It was said best up thread, they've stopped being characters and they've become plot elements. I'm still engaged. I want to see how the plot elements will combine to resolve the story. I've just lost the attachment to the characters I once had.
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Sep 15, 2013 03:32
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Yeah Man posted:No, what we're saying is "oh, I guess THAT method of resurrection is out, that just leaves, oh, the other 20 still available." And those things have saved precisely jack dick so far. I'm reasonably sure that the point of all those was to gently caress with your expectations, and people have fallen for it despite the fact that the tangible evidence is actually stacked pretty well against it. More god-tier players have stayed dead than come back to life, Jane's rez power is really restrictive and probably can't be used to solve the 'stuck under a house' problem (and we have no evidence against the fact this isn't Aranea's plan anyway), and Aranea has the Ring of Life. The only real Jade-saving mechanism that's definitely still in play is John stopping her from ever dying, and that relies on John getting there in time.
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Sep 15, 2013 03:35
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Cleretic posted:The only real Jade-saving mechanism that's definitely still in play is John stopping her from ever dying, and that relies on John getting there in time. I fail to see how that will be a problem for John as long as he has the retconned power.
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Sep 15, 2013 03:45
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Dude, if I've made it this far into Homestuck I can weather it out to the end. Act 5.2 was the point where I was the most miserable with this story. The worst Act 6 has really, honestly given me is a bunch of eyerolls. This is just one of them.
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Sep 15, 2013 03:54
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Tollymain posted:I just like homestuck I feel the same way; while everyone is getting all worked up about the nearly non-existent narrative consequences of death or whatever, I'm just over here, having a chuckle over Dave giving the Mayor a smooch on his forehead. 
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Sep 15, 2013 03:57
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I like Homestuck but I'd like it a lot more if it actually focused on the characters who are supposedly the main ones. I don't think they even comprise a majority of the plot at this point.
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Sep 15, 2013 04:07
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Dave quit talking into your rear end.
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Sep 15, 2013 04:12
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Cleretic posted:And those things have saved precisely jack dick so far. Still, the story has going to the extreme to show how you still have agency and influency despise being dead, that takes away any tension from the plot. and having John showing up to retcon any event on the story is also kind of lame since everything we're seeing would be pontless since never happened.
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Sep 15, 2013 04:22
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Tollymain posted:I just like homestuck   I think I prefer the small, silly things and ongoing jokes in HS more than the overall story (which I don't dislike, mind you). Maybe that's why I don't really ever feel frustrated by it. I guess the only point where I really was "haha what?  " was the trickster segment, but that seemed intentionally unsettling.Another important factor is that I only started reading and catched up around Vriska (fresca)'s death, so I haven't been following since the beginning.
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Sep 15, 2013 04:24
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Cleretic posted:The only real Jade-saving mechanism that's definitely still in play is John stopping her from ever dying, and that relies on John getting there in time. He can travel through time, it's fine. He might not save her though, who knows.
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Sep 15, 2013 04:27
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Arbitrary Number posted:He can travel through time, it's fine. He might not save her though, who knows. I feel like saying 'John can travel through time' is disingenuous, and a more accurate phrase is 'John is traveling through time'. John doesn't really have control over this. He's turned up in places he doesn't want to be, places he can't normally access, and even places that aren't places. While he's theoretically able to save Jade, his ability to hinges much more on random chance than anything else.
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Sep 15, 2013 04:35
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Cleretic posted:John doesn't really have control over this. He's turned up in places he doesn't want to be, places he can't normally access, and even places that aren't places. While he's theoretically able to save Jade, his ability to hinges much more on random chance than anything else.
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Sep 15, 2013 04:41
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I feel like the mouth close up motif has been run into the ground pretty hard. Usually when Hussie uses something repetitively for humorous effect it's more...spaced out I guess? The rapidity of it here is just jarring and kind of annoying.
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Sep 15, 2013 04:49
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The next mouth close-up is going to be of a guardian or exile. Completely black or white screen. Also: Tollymain posted:I just like homestuck *highfive* Also John isn't travelling through time, that's just his limited perspective on it (possibly not-so-limited if the things he was yelling at Roxy weren't just for comedic effect).
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Sep 15, 2013 04:53
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Not going to complain about the fan costumes though:
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Sep 15, 2013 04:58
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SynthOrange posted:Not going to complain about the fan costumes though: 
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Sep 15, 2013 05:08
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Captain Oblivious posted:I feel like the mouth close up motif has been run into the ground pretty hard. Usually when Hussie uses something repetitively for humorous effect it's more...spaced out I guess? The rapidity of it here is just jarring and kind of annoying. I was getting kinda tired of it, but scribble Karkat and single-line Dave mouths were at least funny to me.
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Sep 15, 2013 05:12
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If there's anything I've learned from Hussie, it's that a joke worth tell is worth running into the ground until the joke is no longer the joke, the fact that you can't leave it alone is. I don't mean this as criticism, I do actually enjoy this.
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Sep 15, 2013 05:23
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ZenMasterBullshit posted:As opposed to Homestucks heroes who...don't do much of all and become more broken as time goes on. (I mean Look at Dave, dude's kissing an alien who doesn't even know his name!) Dude has totally grown. He's gone from completely hiding his feelings to being completely genuine with them.
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Sep 15, 2013 06:21
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ALEX TRILLTON posted:I tend to avoid fan stuff as well, for extremel obvious reasons; the only reason I'm worried is because in order for the point to really be effective the ending has to be unsatisfying, which is sort of a catch-22 for a fun read, and homestuck is about Kids And Fun. Homestuck has enough goodwill built up for it to unironically go on a "totally epic, bro" tangent like what's happening now, since Andrew Hussie's writing oozes charm, but if he does that the feel of the ending is going to be really "off". Hah! Can't argue with you there. Hussie's gotta close every loop, no matter how inconsequential. Guess that's the programmer in him. As for the idea of nothing happening, I guess that depends on your definition of nothing happening. Externally yes, nothing is happening, but internally, there are motherfucking fireworks going off everywhere in this shindig. I understand that's not everyone's cup of tea, but I find the so called "degrassi poo poo" some people are complaining about to be terribly exciting. Additionally, people might see dave's interaction with the mayor as proof that he is broken, but I see it as him experimenting with that strange and alien emotion known to the strikers as sincerity. I don't have an issue describing homestuck. It's a web comic about kids growing up with the Internet, and how idepending on their interactions it can make them worse people or better people.
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Sep 15, 2013 06:22
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Cthulhuchan posted:If there's anything I've learned from Hussie, it's that a joke worth tell is worth running into the ground until the joke is no longer the joke, the fact that you can't leave it alone is. I, too, enjoy Andy Zaltzman and the Bugle.
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Sep 15, 2013 06:49
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I for one miss the data structure jokes. I am 100% serious.
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Sep 15, 2013 07:03
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ThisIsNoZaku posted:I for one miss the data structure jokes. I still believe that during Homestuck's climax, just as everything seems lost, John will screw up and launch something out of his sylladex that turns the entire situation around. I've had this idea since the early days of Homestuck, and I'm not letting it go. Mostly because I want it to happen rather than any real evidence. 
Boneless Jogger fucked around with this message at 07:13 on Sep 15, 2013 |
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Sep 15, 2013 07:10
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Blackheart posted:Another important factor is that I only started reading and catched up around Vriska (fresca)'s death, so I haven't been following since the beginning. All this stuff Aranea's doing feels like the Bad Ending in a video game, and that's reasonable because video games are what make Homestuck tick. Would you rather Hussie didn't show off the Bad Ending? If nothing else, if John retcons all this it'll give him an idea of the great power (and great responsibility) he now holds.
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Sep 15, 2013 07:35
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