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RogueLemming
Sep 11, 2006

Spinning or Deformed?

Uncle Jam posted:

Is the PE a thing mostly for Civil or ME? I've never seen it for any job listing I checked out, I don't know anyone who has it where I work now, and none of my friends in Engineering that I know of sat for it.

The big distinction is what type of product you are delivering, and has a lot to do with liability. If you are delivering drawings or designs to a client, they will have to be stamped by a PE. The stamp certifies that the Engineer of Record approves and endorses the design to fulfill whatever function and meet code, and establishes responsibility in the event of a design error. It also limits the engineer's liability due to errors of anyone who does not properly follow the design.

If you are delivering a final product (say a widget or piece of software), it typically does not need stamped because the end user doesn't have/need access to the design. You don't need the EOR's stamp to establish who is liable if the product malfunctions. If a different company designed the product than manufactured it, chances are a PE was involved somewhere up the line.

So, yes, a PE applies a lot more to Civils and MEs. As grover said, a PE is a necessity in construction, since the whole job is creating drawings and then having contractors work off those drawings.

Metapod posted:

I'm a junior in high school and I would like to know what does it take to be a civil engineer?

All engineering takes a base level of math...physics isn't different for different branches of engineering. For any engineering, I would strongly recommend you learn some sort of programming language (in high school if you can). Beyond the common curriculum, I would say civils tend to be more visually intuitive. The courses are generally less math heavy, unless you choose to pursue more math-intensive options (usually grad school).

Civil is a very broad term. It encompasses structural (buildings, bridges), transportation (traffic planning, highway design), and geotechnical (soils, foundations). It also traditionally includes environmental, but that's sort of breaking off into its own field.

Your question is kind of open ended. Why are you interested in engineering, and what makes you say civil in particular?

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RogueLemming
Sep 11, 2006

Spinning or Deformed?

Senor P. posted:

On the subject of P.E. licenses I don't think it is fair to discrimate those who have not gone to college. People coming from craft backgrounds have been able to get their P.E's ahead of time. My old boss managed to get his P.E. before going and getting his degree.

A lot of this is public perception. Part of the PE is instilling trust in the public that standards are in place to protect them. No one cares that a tradesman could be more competent than an "official" engineer, they want to see that piece of paper. It's the same reason a 21 year old music major is "more qualified" to be a manager at Target than someone who has worked there 20 years.

Let's say a building falls over and hundreds of people die. Which account will people find more acceptable?
1. The stamping engineer has a degree in engineering and 10 years of experience, but made a design error. The firm will be financially responsible and the engineer will be stripped of his license.
2. The stamping engineer had no formal schooling, but 20 years of "trade experience" (including the inital "foot in the door" years of sweeping the shop floor). The firm will be financially responsible and the engineer will be stripped of his license.

If I were a lawyer, I'd have a field day with that second one. The firm would probably not survive the ordeal, and then no one would hire non-degree PEs anyway.

movax
Aug 30, 2008

Metapod posted:

I'm a junior in high school and I would like to know what does it take to be a civil engineer?

A crystal ball for the economy in six years. If it's at a low, no one is building poo poo and no one needs to hire fresh people.

CCKeane
Jan 28, 2008

my shit posts don't die, they multiply

I work under a man who has a tremendous amount of experience as an engineer and no degree. I have learned a great deal from him and consider him a fine engineer, however an engineering education provides a broader platform for understanding some concepts that might not get much exposure in industry.

I think I tend to lean degree requirement on this one, unless the test is very comprehensive.

Senor P.
Mar 27, 2006
I MUST TELL YOU HOW PEOPLE CARE ABOUT STUFF I DONT AND BE A COMPLETE CUNT ABOUT IT

RogueLemming posted:

A lot of this is public perception. Part of the PE is instilling trust in the public that standards are in place to protect them. No one cares that a tradesman could be more competent than an "official" engineer, they want to see that piece of paper. It's the same reason a 21 year old music major is "more qualified" to be a manager at Target than someone who has worked there 20 years.

Let's say a building falls over and hundreds of people die. Which account will people find more acceptable?
1. The stamping engineer has a degree in engineering and 10 years of experience, but made a design error. The firm will be financially responsible and the engineer will be stripped of his license.
2. The stamping engineer had no formal schooling, but 20 years of "trade experience" (including the inital "foot in the door" years of sweeping the shop floor). The firm will be financially responsible and the engineer will be stripped of his license.

If I were a lawyer, I'd have a field day with that second one. The firm would probably not survive the ordeal, and then no one would hire non-degree PEs anyway.

20 years experience, because he still managed to get his license, has worked on numerous projects, has worked in the field, and has worked with numerous PE engineers, design engineers, operations, and others. How does trade school not count as formal schooling? You do know craft have to be able to read drawings, do math, know their applicable codes, right? Do you think that there is no education involved in learning how to weld? Repair HVAC equipment? Be a millwright, electrician or pipe fitter?

Compared to an engineer with a PE, 10 years of experience of sitting in the office and not being able to handle working in a field environment and know how things are done or how the equipment they're involved in actually works.

The choice seems obvious to me.

single-mode fiber
Dec 30, 2012

The difference is in knowing how to do real math. The guy with 20 years of trade experience may make for a pretty good project manager. But, the guy with 10 years experience, and can actually whiteboard a boundary value problem, will, for most people, warrant more trust as the lead designer.

CCKeane
Jan 28, 2008

my shit posts don't die, they multiply

Senor P. posted:

20 years experience, because he still managed to get his license, has worked on numerous projects, has worked in the field, and has worked with numerous PE engineers, design engineers, operations, and others. How does trade school not count as formal schooling? You do know craft have to be able to read drawings, do math, know their applicable codes, right? Do you think that there is no education involved in learning how to weld? Repair HVAC equipment? Be a millwright, electrician or pipe fitter?

Compared to an engineer with a PE, 10 years of experience of sitting in the office and not being able to handle working in a field environment and know how things are done or how the equipment they're involved in actually works.

The choice seems obvious to me.

Look, it really depends on the application, and it's REALLY easy to miss some stuff on, say, how materials respond to thermal shock without a comprehensive curriculum. It's really easy to have education gaps in the best of times, I think without a comprehensive curriculum this would only make the gaps greater and more frequent.

KetTarma
Jul 25, 2003

Suffer not the lobbyist to live.

grover posted:

May be less the ability to sit for the PE, and moreso removing the requirement to sit for the PE. Virginia permits "experience" candidates to skip the FE completely and go straight to the PE.

The protest that they filed most recently basically said that allowing anyone other than someone with a 4 year hard engineering degree was detrimental to society as a whole by eroding the quality of design. It also called for the creation of an "engineering technologist" license to be a catch-all for anyone that lacked the hard degree.


Being the literal "person with 10 years trade experience" that's going through engineering school now.. I can say that I am learning a lot. My knowledge of thermodynamics has expanded greatly, I understand more about how electricity works on a theoretical level, and I am definitely a thousand times better at using math to solve problems instead of "gut experience."

SeaBass
Dec 30, 2003

NERRRRRRDS!

single-mode fiber posted:

The difference is in knowing how to do real math. The guy with 20 years of trade experience may make for a pretty good project manager. But, the guy with 10 years experience, and can actually whiteboard a boundary value problem, will, for most people, warrant more trust as the lead designer.

And get paid more, be considered for management, etc.

Olothreutes
Mar 31, 2007

So both of the department heads in my department are PEs, but honestly I don't know how much it means in either Chemical or Nuclear. The school encourages us to sit for the FE exam, but do you guys think it would be worth it for a nuclear engineer?

The Experiment
Dec 12, 2010


Since we're talking about PEs, I believe one of the requirements is that you need to work under a PE. However, I have never done that even though I am an engineer. If I go up a couple layers of management, I could stretch the definition and say that I am working under a PE, but will anyone accept that?

grover
Jan 23, 2002

PEW PEW PEW
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:circlefap::circlefap::circlefap:
:circlefap::circlefap::circlefap:
:circlefap::circlefap::circlefap:
:circlefap::circlefap::circlefap:

The Experiment posted:

Since we're talking about PEs, I believe one of the requirements is that you need to work under a PE. However, I have never done that even though I am an engineer. If I go up a couple layers of management, I could stretch the definition and say that I am working under a PE, but will anyone accept that?
Unless your state does it differently, you don't need to work for a PE, you just need to be able find enough PEs that know you and your work well enough to vouch for you professionally. Your supervisors don't need to be a PE, but do need to attest that your experience is actual engineering experience.

Kolodny
Jul 10, 2010

Olothreutes posted:

So both of the department heads in my department are PEs, but honestly I don't know how much it means in either Chemical or Nuclear. The school encourages us to sit for the FE exam, but do you guys think it would be worth it for a nuclear engineer?

Whether or not you'll need it down the line, it's incredibly easy when you're in school and you don't lose anything by having it on your resume. I did it as an aero, and did the mech portion for the second half instead of the miscellaneous catch-all. I was a bit wary because I had to teach myself refrigeration and do a lot of thermo review on the spot, but I passed just fine. Also, whatever discipline you are doesn't necessarily slot you in that specific area for the rest of your life, so it could still come in handy at some point even though nuke or chem don't specifically require it.

Hed
Mar 31, 2004

Fun Shoe
Grover's got it right, you just need current PEs to vouch for you in all of the states I've researched and filed in.

Senor P. posted:

Also I really don't think graduate school should count an additional 2 years out of the necessary 4 to a P.E. license. (Graduate research and work are not the same.)

They're not, but you still have to qualify it just like any other postgraduate job you do. I don't see how it's a problem, 2 years of researching, designing, and building radar systems under the prof who designed one for a Mars probe should probably hold up just as much as the guy who went directly to Honeywell or Raytheon right out of school.

Olothreutes posted:

So both of the department heads in my department are PEs, but honestly I don't know how much it means in either Chemical or Nuclear. The school encourages us to sit for the FE exam, but do you guys think it would be worth it for a nuclear engineer?

I'm not sure about your field. Your school is offering it because having more people attempt and pass the FE helps their stats. It is very straightforward for someone still in school to attempt and pass. So if you ever feel it would be useful, I'd knock it out now. Personally, I'm in a field (EE / CompE) where having it doesn't matter as much but like it or not my PE credential adds a known competency trigger to my interactions. It has helped me out big time as I've started doing my own engineering consulting.

Hed fucked around with this message at 01:19 on Sep 9, 2013

OctaviusBeaver
Apr 30, 2009

Say what now?

Uncle Jam posted:

Is the PE a thing mostly for Civil or ME? I've never seen it for any job listing I checked out, I don't know anyone who has it where I work now, and none of my friends in Engineering that I know of sat for it.

Quite a few EEs in the power industry get it too. Electronics/embedded programming/controls type people not so much afaik.

CatchrNdRy
Mar 15, 2005

Receiver of the Rye.
I always thought of it as more the type of company: if you work for a "corporation" that has publicly traded stock probably not. If you work for a "firm" or directly for the government, probably should get a PE.

Xeom
Mar 16, 2007
So I have two GPA's my current schools(FSU), and my cumulative GPA which includes my previous schools GPA. Florida state seems to report both of them to me, but would it be wrong to put my cumulative GPA on my resume? I kinda took a lot of electives in my community colleges exploring stuff. My major GPA across both schools would still be just as high, but I am not sure if they report that.

Goons what should I do in this case? Also what do employers usually request from schools when they go to check the GPA? Do they just ask about the GPA or the entire transcript?

Xeom fucked around with this message at 22:10 on Sep 10, 2013

Tide
Mar 27, 2010

by FactsAreUseless
So things are moving pretty fast.

Work will entertain the idea of paying for me to get my BSME or BSEE. For now, the response from higher ups has been overtly positive. In a bad economy (and despite the company being very profitable), no one has said 'Not no, but gently caress no'. I've been here 10 years, made alot of contacts, and have a solid reputation - so that helps. Anyway, the idea of working full time (plus some overtime), going to school full time, being a dad, being a husband and keeping my sanity has me all :stonklol: but I'm excited.

Spoke to the head of the local 4 year about the community college AS route. Great news in that the CC AS program is specifically tailored to transition to the 4 year school, all STARS approved, so no worries there.

Out of curiosity, lets assume I get my BSME in ~4 years. By that point, I'll have two degrees (BS in Business Admin and BSME or BSEE), and near 20 years experience in logistics. Despite being a green engineer, how marketable all this combined make me? I am expecting my company to want me to sign a contract as per the terms of being reimbursed for tuition, but it would be nice to hear opinions about the potential value of the above when I'm done.

KetTarma
Jul 25, 2003

Suffer not the lobbyist to live.
Anyone here ever get the Xilinx FPGA IDE to work in Windows8? I'm getting frustrated enough that I'm going to spin up a VM and try it under Linux if I cant get it working soon.

movax
Aug 30, 2008

KetTarma posted:

Anyone here ever get the Xilinx FPGA IDE to work in Windows8? I'm getting frustrated enough that I'm going to spin up a VM and try it under Linux if I cant get it working soon.

Checkout the Verilog thread in CoC but are you using ISE or Vivado? Both run fine for me under Win7 and Win8; spinning up a Linux VM to run it would be an even worse decision. No one gives a poo poo about their UIs in Linux and Vivado is full of all sorts of fun glitches under Linux. (Command-line though works great!)

mitztronic
Jun 17, 2005

mixcloud.com/mitztronic
Just want to post my success story. After 2 years of working in a job (out of graduate school), I was incredibly dissatisfied and was almost to the point of regretting getting an engineering degree (MS Microwave/RF EE).

In May I applied for a transfer within my company and didnt expect to get the job, but I was wrong and started it at the end of June. Now I design space based communication systems (Ka-band) and it's rad as gently caress and I see myself doing this for the next 5+ years.

It feels incredibly satisfactory to every day make decisions that have a real life impact.

DirtyTalk
Apr 7, 2013

Hed posted:

Grover's got it right, you just need current PEs to vouch for you in all of the states I've researched and filed in.


They're not, but you still have to qualify it just like any other postgraduate job you do. I don't see how it's a problem, 2 years of researching, designing, and building radar systems under the prof who designed one for a Mars probe should probably hold up just as much as the guy who went directly to Honeywell or Raytheon right out of school.


I'm not sure about your field. Your school is offering it because having more people attempt and pass the FE helps their stats. It is very straightforward for someone still in school to attempt and pass. So if you ever feel it would be useful, I'd knock it out now. Personally, I'm in a field (EE / CompE) where having it doesn't matter as much but like it or not my PE credential adds a known competency trigger to my interactions. It has helped me out big time as I've started doing my own engineering consulting.

My program (EE) didn't even mention the FE to us. The only reason the EE's and CompE's knew about it was due to our Mechie and Civil friends that were studying furiously for it.

Although hitting the books again is the last thing I want to do, I have told myself I will still make an attempt at the FE as its worth a drat shot. But I agree with you. A PE definitely weighs heavier in some industries than others.

Uncle Jam
Aug 20, 2005

Perfect

mitztronic posted:

Just want to post my success story. After 2 years of working in a job (out of graduate school), I was incredibly dissatisfied and was almost to the point of regretting getting an engineering degree (MS Microwave/RF EE).

In May I applied for a transfer within my company and didnt expect to get the job, but I was wrong and started it at the end of June. Now I design space based communication systems (Ka-band) and it's rad as gently caress and I see myself doing this for the next 5+ years.

It feels incredibly satisfactory to every day make decisions that have a real life impact.

Hey, that's awesome! How is the documentation process for a system like that? I'm considering moving into space stuff in a few years but I could do without eternal doc'ing.

Was your previous jobs at one of those companies that just sell like a bunch of passive components, and you spend your time noodling around with 10dB couplers on test equipment while all of your colleagues are old men who actively try to live the least exciting life possible? I always see those guys behind counters at conference expos trying to sell people coax cable terminations with marketing that hasn't been updated since the 70s and looking like they have no ability to express any kind of emotion. I want to know if its as soul sucking as it seems to be.

mitztronic
Jun 17, 2005

mixcloud.com/mitztronic

Uncle Jam posted:

Hey, that's awesome! How is the documentation process for a system like that? I'm considering moving into space stuff in a few years but I could do without eternal doc'ing.

Was your previous jobs at one of those companies that just sell like a bunch of passive components, and you spend your time noodling around with 10dB couplers on test equipment while all of your colleagues are old men who actively try to live the least exciting life possible? I always see those guys behind counters at conference expos trying to sell people coax cable terminations with marketing that hasn't been updated since the 70s and looking like they have no ability to express any kind of emotion. I want to know if its as soul sucking as it seems to be.

My old job was at the same company, as a reliability engineer for RF active units (I did do some work on passive units but that poo poo was boring), as well as entire spacecraft systems (which was a bit more interesting, but I was looking for something more). It wasnt very exciting, I made very few improvements on designs and even then, the changes I was able to implement were so small they didn't really affect anything. THAT job was mostly paperwork/contract fullfillment. Even when working as a system rel engineer, I wasn't able to make any important decisions. During the course of an entire design, I was able to give feedback once.

Regarding passive type-stuff, things like general coax cables and so forth are pretty boring, but items like multiplexers and filters are probably a bit more interesting, although still rather limited in scope. There are also a surprising number of different types of cabling, connectors, etc, but I don't know how interesting it would be to work on them. We buy our cables as far as I know. They are all fancy, really expensive, low loss type of stuff.

My job now is very little paperwork, thank the gods. The space industry in general is paperwork heavy. I'll also say that in the space industry, there aren't many jobs that rival the amount of design control and responsibility I have. :)

Boris Galerkin
Dec 17, 2011

I don't understand why I can't harass people online. Seriously, somebody please explain why I shouldn't be allowed to stalk others on social media!
I'm starting to get anxious/worried about finding a job. The thing is, I did a classical engineering degree for my bachelor's (mech) and was dead set on staying in academia all my life so I focused on something very narrow (CFD) for my master's. Well plans change and I withdrew from my PhD after getting a master's.

I had internship experience during my undergrad in a well known company but it was quality engineering, and gently caress if I'm going to be a paperwork proofreader and the most hated 'engineer' in a company (but it was my first (and only) internship so I took whatever).

Since I did CFD in grad school my set of skills are programming and HPC related stuff. Maybe I'm not looking in the right places, but HPC jobs are hard to find and most of the times it seems they are actually looking for system maintainers and admins, which isn't actually what I do at all. My friends hear me say programming and they they say "join a startup and make millions :v:" which actually wouldn't be bad cause I'd love to move out to the Bay but my programming expertise is C/Fortran which isn't anything like Ruby or web application scaling or whatever toolset every single startup needs.

So I feel like I'm just being overlooked by every position I'm applying for because I don't have the experience to do something like say systems engineering at Boeing but I also don't have the user facing/webapp experience for software/program engineering jobs I find. I guess I'm just venting and moping around :(

Big Ol Marsh Pussy
Jan 7, 2007

I don't know whether the right thread is this one, or the resume thread, but I'll start here:

I'm a civil engineering bachelor's student, graduating in the spring, focusing in transportation. This will be my second bachelor's degree, I also graduated with a bachelor's in sociology several years ago, minoring in statistics. On my resume I make two references to my first bachelors: one time just mentioning that I did it and my GPA, and another time mentioning a sociology paper I wrote that I took to conference, won awards with, and would have published had I not decided to leave the field (long story short, didn't get into a phd program with a stipend due to the recession cutting grad school funding).

I've been applying to internships, and recently made it through to the final round of interviews with a local city's public works department. During the final interview they were extremely interested in my sociology background and had me talk about my paper. However, I just got the call saying I didn't get it, and they mentioned that they felt I was overqualified and suggested that I should leave the information regarding my sociology bachelor's off of my resume. Is this actually good advice? Not only do I think that it seems wrong to leave some of my biggest accomplishments off my resume, even if it wasn't in my field, but I also feel if there's one field in all of engineering where sociology would actually be relevant, it's the public side of transportation due to the political nature of the industry (and the statistics minor, though just a minor, absolutely is relevant). Anyone have any thoughts? It would really suck to be considered overqualified for internships and then graduate without one and seem underqualified compared to everyone else.

CatchrNdRy
Mar 15, 2005

Receiver of the Rye.

EnterYourNameHere posted:

I don't know whether the right thread is this one, or the resume thread, but I'll start here:

I'm a civil engineering bachelor's student, graduating in the spring, focusing in transportation. This will be my second bachelor's degree, I also graduated with a bachelor's in sociology several years ago, minoring in statistics. On my resume I make two references to my first bachelors: one time just mentioning that I did it and my GPA, and another time mentioning a sociology paper I wrote that I took to conference, won awards with, and would have published had I not decided to leave the field (long story short, didn't get into a phd program with a stipend due to the recession cutting grad school funding).

I've been applying to internships, and recently made it through to the final round of interviews with a local city's public works department. During the final interview they were extremely interested in my sociology background and had me talk about my paper. However, I just got the call saying I didn't get it, and they mentioned that they felt I was overqualified and suggested that I should leave the information regarding my sociology bachelor's off of my resume. Is this actually good advice? Not only do I think that it seems wrong to leave some of my biggest accomplishments off my resume, even if it wasn't in my field, but I also feel if there's one field in all of engineering where sociology would actually be relevant, it's the public side of transportation due to the political nature of the industry (and the statistics minor, though just a minor, absolutely is relevant). Anyone have any thoughts? It would really suck to be considered overqualified for internships and then graduate without one and seem underqualified compared to everyone else.

not to reference my dad again, but he leaves off his master's in some bioscience (I don't even really know what it is) mainly because of fears of age discrimination, as he was in his early 40s when he got his EE BS. why would a company hire an older guy whose previous experience is irrelevant over someone younger with the same engineering experience? the company will get less years and have increased insurance costs. his fears weren't unfounded, as he was part (and won) an class action age discrimination some years ago from Honeywell.

that being said, its a different time now, and I don't think it has bearing if you are under 40. but also, i don't think a sociology degree will really be of much benefit on a resume other than a "that's interesting" for most technically minded managers.

RogueLemming
Sep 11, 2006

Spinning or Deformed?

EnterYourNameHere posted:

I've been applying to internships, and recently made it through to the final round of interviews with a local city's public works department. During the final interview they were extremely interested in my sociology background and had me talk about my paper. However, I just got the call saying I didn't get it, and they mentioned that they felt I was overqualified and suggested that I should leave the information regarding my sociology bachelor's off of my resume. Is this actually good advice? Not only do I think that it seems wrong to leave some of my biggest accomplishments off my resume, even if it wasn't in my field, but I also feel if there's one field in all of engineering where sociology would actually be relevant, it's the public side of transportation due to the political nature of the industry (and the statistics minor, though just a minor, absolutely is relevant). Anyone have any thoughts? It would really suck to be considered overqualified for internships and then graduate without one and seem underqualified compared to everyone else.

Leave it off, and don't bring it up in interviews unless you have a VERY good reason to (like, if you happen to find the one other engineer on earth that also has a degree in sociology)*. It will raise more questions and doubts than assurances, since it has nothing to do with the position they are hiring for. If they showed interest, it was probably because they already had someone picked out for the job and that was something different to talk about and pass the time, while not completely letting you know you didn't even have a chance.

The number one thing you need is experience in transportation. Do whatever you have to do to be proficient in relevant software (Civil 3D, Microstation, Synchro, VISSIM, whatever). If you can't get into an internship, weasel your way into a graduate lab. When you are job hunting, you need to prove you have useful skills, not that you can expound on Max Weber's theory of signal timing.

* A good reason would be to display the quality of your writing. Transportation and planning has a lot of reports and interactions with government, and they want people that can write well (better than the typical "I don't need to spell, that's why I'm an engineer. Hurrrr"!). Even still, you should focus on how you have a strong background in writing and can adapt that to technical reports rather than the sociology subject matter.

Big Ol Marsh Pussy
Jan 7, 2007

RogueLemming posted:

* A good reason would be to display the quality of your writing. Transportation and planning has a lot of reports and interactions with government, and they want people that can write well (better than the typical "I don't need to spell, that's why I'm an engineer. Hurrrr"!). Even still, you should focus on how you have a strong background in writing and can adapt that to technical reports rather than the sociology subject matter.

Yeah, I included the paper primarily because, despite being sociology, it was heavily quantitative (I collected data and used logistic regression to analyse it) and focused on that aspect of it. But I think I should have focused more on how it's an example of why I'm a good candidate because of the writing involved, which I actually do think is something that sets me apart. I think I'll be leaving it off in the future, even though on a visceral level it feels really lovely leaving productive, but ultimately mainly irrelevant years of my life off my resume.

KetTarma
Jul 25, 2003

Suffer not the lobbyist to live.
If it makes you feel any better, I leave off the bulk of a decade of my life during which I did things very few humans get to do (nuclear plant operator) simply because it's not relevant to design.

Olothreutes
Mar 31, 2007

KetTarma posted:

If it makes you feel any better, I leave off the bulk of a decade of my life during which I did things very few humans get to do (nuclear plant operator) simply because it's not relevant to design.

Would you recommend being a plant operator to someone? It's not my first choice for things to do, but I'd rather do that than something weapons related.

KetTarma
Jul 25, 2003

Suffer not the lobbyist to live.
Pay: Amazing (People without college degrees making 130k as a senior reactor operator)
Industry: Stagnant-shrinking (since 2010, we've shut down 4 sites and started building 2 new reactors at existing sites. Each site has 1-3 reactors. You dont want to work ops at a 3 reactor site)

Life/work ratio: Medium to Poor (usually 12 hour shifts, usually rotating shiftwork, SRO qualifications are hell for the 18 months they last. You do get 4+ day weekends often due to the way the shifts are usually laid out though)
Stress: High (Nuclear Regulatory Comission constantly watching you waiting for a mistake, no mistakes allowed. gently caress up and youre on CNN)

Right now there's a glutt of operators looking for jobs due to the closure of Crystal River, Vermont Yankee, and SONGS. The really lovely thing about the nuclear power industry is it is possible to memorize every location that you can work as an operator since there aren't that many. It is also possible that a thousand or so people can be left unemployed due to a mechanical failure (ie containment cracking at Crystal River deemed too expensive to repair)

I would recommend it to build up a nest egg but not as your only option in life. The "Nuclear renassiance" died when Fukashima got slammed. People, of course, don't focus on one of the largest natural disasters in human history occuring. Rather, some hard-to-describe amount of contamination release. It's frustrating when they describe things in the trillion Bq scale rather than "3 curies worth." It's like saying THIS OVER A BILLION NANOMETERS LONG


Edit: It's worth noting that as a nuclear operator, you'd be one of the few people with a degree. If you want to work in Ops, go download the practice POSS exam and try to get an interview. The requirements are basically: be able to carry a clipboard or PDA around and write down/wave PDA at things. Make sure that the numbers are still the same as they were last hour or have changed in a way that make sense. If you are filling a water tank, is the water level rising? Is the flowrate meter greater than 0? Is the voltage of this switchboard still within tolerances? Is anything leaking? Is anything on fire? That's the essence of what you'd be doing. It is important to be smart enough to figure things out ("Ok this tank temperature is rising that could mean a leak from this high energy system into this pipe which connects here. I should tell someone then go tighten down on that valve if they want me to" "There's a 0.2 hert oscillation in frequency. Maybe the governor system needs repair") though not necessarily in the way engineers do.

KetTarma fucked around with this message at 12:14 on Sep 21, 2013

KetTarma
Jul 25, 2003

Suffer not the lobbyist to live.
I'm posting this on another line so it's clear:

If you want to actually use your degree, don't go into ops. Kinda like getting an aerospace engineering degree to be an airline pilot.

Pander
Oct 9, 2007

Fear is the glue that holds society together. It's what makes people suppress their worst impulses. Fear is power.

And at the end of fear, oblivion.



Olothreutes posted:

Would you recommend being a plant operator to someone? It's not my first choice for things to do, but I'd rather do that than something weapons related.

I'm a nuke, and a lot of my friends are in training to be reactor operators. Most of them have to live in podunky areas (nuke plants tend not to be near major metropolitan centers), work random shifts (nights and afternoons every so often), and take on an awful lot of knowledge quickly.

The first two points are why I'm not working at a nuke plant directly, although I do some contract work at them frequently.

grover
Jan 23, 2002

PEW PEW PEW
:circlefap::circlefap::circlefap:
:circlefap::circlefap::circlefap:
:circlefap::circlefap::circlefap:
:circlefap::circlefap::circlefap:
:circlefap::circlefap::circlefap:
:circlefap::circlefap::circlefap:

Pander posted:

I'm a nuke, and a lot of my friends are in training to be reactor operators. Most of them have to live in podunky areas (nuke plants tend not to be near major metropolitan centers), work random shifts (nights and afternoons every so often), and take on an awful lot of knowledge quickly.

The first two points are why I'm not working at a nuke plant directly, although I do some contract work at them frequently.
What might be even worse than that is a working nuke plant overhaul/refuelling where now only do you work in nowhere podunk towns, but you do so at different nowhere podunk towns states away from home. And, what, probably for months at a time on each, on around-the-clock shifts with brutal hours? Is it any less sucky on the engineering side?

grover fucked around with this message at 16:18 on Sep 21, 2013

KetTarma
Jul 25, 2003

Suffer not the lobbyist to live.

Pander posted:

I'm a nuke, and a lot of my friends are in training to be reactor operators. Most of them have to live in podunky areas (nuke plants tend not to be near major metropolitan centers), work random shifts (nights and afternoons every so often), and take on an awful lot of knowledge quickly.

The first two points are why I'm not working at a nuke plant directly, although I do some contract work at them frequently.

Yeah, it's worth pointing out that out of every reactor plant in America, there were only 5 of them that I would even consider working at just based on wanting to be in a city. Kind of limits you.

C-Euro
Mar 20, 2010

:science:
Soiled Meat
Any goons in here feel like sharing their thoughts on Chemical Engineering? I just finished a Master's in Chemistry where I was on a PhD track until I realized I didn't like/was bad at straight lab work and research and no longer wanted to be a professor. Right now I'm trying to find work but my girlfriend thinks I would good at engineering and should get a degree in it. Right now I'm broke and not really looking to go back to school or take out the loans to do so, but maybe in a few years once I'm on my feet again it could happen.

How do chemistry and chemical engineering differ? What sort of careers does a ChemE degree offer that a straight Chemistry degree doesn't? If I went back to school, how would what I've studied so far help me in pursuit of an engineering degree? What are chemical engineering programs like, in terms of cost/courses/time?

Corla Plankun
May 8, 2007

improve the lives of everyone
All of the chemical engineers I know just do a ton of process optimization and Aspen stuff, not any actual chemistry. I don't know very many ChemEs though, so maybe there are some overlaps.

usernamen_01
Oct 20, 2012

dxt posted:

I am. Ladder logic/PLC programming is what I do with most of my time, so try to learn that if you can.

Hey, PLCs are a field I am trying to enter after the Navy. Do you recommend anything as far as professional certifications or classes/coursework that would help me learn how to program, operate, and troubleshoot them?

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KetTarma
Jul 25, 2003

Suffer not the lobbyist to live.
What made you want to go into PLC programming?

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