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LordLeckie posted:9 is all you'd ever really need unless you really really really REALLY want master enslave to penetrate. It will upgrade your minor bless (+4 attack to +5, +4mr to +5, etc.), but yeah, it's really not worth it except for very specific niche cases.
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Oct 8, 2013 11:11
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I guess if you want to do a crazy one man master enslave strategy by researching only thaumaturgy without needing points into construction for boosters, S10 is sort of plausible.
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Oct 8, 2013 13:52
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This came up recently on the Desura forums. Putting aside the issue of whether it is actually worth it, and focusing on what should end up in the manual: Paths usually boost pretender stats Extra paths make many combat spells more effective, be it area of effect, damage, or reduced casting fatigue. As already mentioned, bless. Extra paths make some summoning rituals more effective (you can get a lot of ogres). Each extra path makes global rituals harder to dispel (equivalent to investing five additional gems into the casting in Dom3). Since the cost for each point is based on how many you've -bought- not how many you have, that tenth point would only cost 56 on a lich that starts with 3 death. On a chassis that only starts with one, or god forbid zero points, then the eighth point would cost 56, let alone the ninth or tenth. I think it maxes out at 80? V Thanks, that clears up a lot. LordSloth fucked around with this message at 15:02 on Oct 8, 2013 |
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Oct 8, 2013 14:18
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LordSloth posted:*I cannot figure out what water is boosting. It should be defense, but it is either bugged or changed. Dom4 changed A, W, and F to be lightning, frost, and fire resistance instead of precision, defense, and attack respectively.
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Oct 8, 2013 14:34
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amuayse posted:I guess if you want to do a crazy one man master enslave strategy by researching only thaumaturgy without needing points into construction for boosters, S10 is sort of plausible. Wouldn't a singular mage casting master enslave kill himself? The spell has 800 fatigue cost. Admittedly, I don't know much about what happens when you go over 200 fatigue except that I've killed a number of my own communion slaves in TestPantheon that way.
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Oct 8, 2013 16:24
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I think that you cannot kill yourself with spell fatigue, you will just go to 200 fatigue. Slaves however can die.
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Oct 8, 2013 16:31
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Well you need S8 to cast it, so with 2 paths higher so 800 divide by half twice would get you to 200 fatigue. I'd suggest having some encumbrance reducing items so your guy doesn't take fatigue damage by going over 200 fatigue.
amuayse fucked around with this message at 16:46 on Oct 8, 2013 |
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Oct 8, 2013 16:36
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If you cast a spell that would set you over 200 fatigue you automatically get put to 200 fatigue. The only time this doesn't apply is when a master casts a spell that would set a communion slave over 200 fatigue, then it starts doing damage to the communion slaves. Also having 2 path ranks over a spell doesn't decrease the fatigue to 1/4th, it decrease it to 1/3rd. The formula is 1/1+n where n is the number of paths you have over the required amount.
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Oct 8, 2013 16:48
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Ah, gotcha.
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Oct 8, 2013 16:55
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Burnsaber posted:I think that you cannot kill yourself with spell fatigue, you will just go to 200 fatigue.
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Oct 8, 2013 16:57
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I don't remember the mechanics, but I also believe the game may use additional gems to reduce fatigue above and beyond the cost.
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Oct 8, 2013 17:00
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LordSloth posted:I don't remember the mechanics, but I also believe the game may use additional gems to reduce fatigue above and beyond the cost. I used a Debug Sensei empowered to S10 to cast Master Enslave with the bare minimum 8 gems, and they were at 189 fatigue after casting. With extra gems, it was 115.
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Oct 8, 2013 17:10
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jBrereton posted:It totally does. Errr, did it have anything else on it in terms of boosting items or special abilities (lots of reinvig?). At just base S10 and 10 pearls you couldn't get master enslave down to 115 fatigue so I'm curious to hear about your setup.
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Oct 8, 2013 18:44
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Lilli posted:Errr, did it have anything else on it in terms of boosting items or special abilities (lots of reinvig?). At just base S10 and 10 pearls you couldn't get master enslave down to 115 fatigue so I'm curious to hear about your setup. Magic 3 scale probably.
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Oct 8, 2013 18:55
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Lilli posted:Errr, did it have anything else on it in terms of boosting items or special abilities (lots of reinvig?). At just base S10 and 10 pearls you couldn't get master enslave down to 115 fatigue so I'm curious to hear about your setup. Quite naked, S10 just through empowerment rather than anything else.
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Oct 8, 2013 19:48
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jBrereton posted:Made sure to test it again in a province definitely without Magic scales, goes to 163 fatigue with extra gems, then goes down by five points per turn, so I'm pretty sure there's no additional reinvigoration (there's certainly none listed in the unit information tab). No, the 163 makes sense and is exactly what I would expect. Thanks!
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Oct 8, 2013 19:57
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Are underwater provinces still unaffected by temperature scales? What's EA R'lyeh's best troop/strategy for expanding, assuming no SC? Or do they pretty much require an SC to function well?
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Oct 8, 2013 20:42
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Maerland does a lets play with EA R'lyeh in D3 His strategy centres around using polypal mothers to freespawn https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=thnjw6zbecE And also lulling people with that hypnotic voice. The guy should read children's audiobooks for a living. tooterfish fucked around with this message at 21:43 on Oct 8, 2013 |
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Oct 8, 2013 21:40
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tooterfish posted:Maerland does a lets play with EA R'lyeh in D3 Maer's strategy only works in CBM, a mod that we don't have for Dom4. That said I'm sure his videos contain good info for EA R'lyeh, but you can't use that strat in Dom4 or unmodded Dom3.
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Oct 9, 2013 00:24
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Right, the main, crucial difference between CBM and non-CBM EA R'lyeh is that your Aboleths and all related creatures are purely aquatic in the vanilla game. You need W1A1 to make an Amulet of the Fish just to get the commanders out of the sea, and Giboleth/Gibodai are stuck down there, since afaik there's no underwater equivalent to the Barrel of Air. Basically, you're extremely resilient under the waves, but overland expansion is a non-starter unless you build your pretender around it (which you definitely have to). That means W1A1, probable high Death magic too for path variegation, and a lot of RPs, to kickstart research up to Construction 4 as soon as possible. Probably want something like an awake Dom 10 Void Lurker A2W2S6D4 with O3S3C3G1M1M3.
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Oct 9, 2013 00:38
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Sorry guys, never noticed. That voice, it just switches off mah brain.
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Oct 9, 2013 00:49
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They have an official Desura release date, manual and all: October 10th. P.S. My thoughts: This is the most anticipated manual of 2013! P.P.S. What have I become? LordSloth fucked around with this message at 02:07 on Oct 9, 2013 |
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Oct 9, 2013 02:01
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I am super pumped for this manual. I had the old wire bound one and it was the only video game manual I looked at more then once. But, I am still surprised it delayed the release date.
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Oct 9, 2013 02:50
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I kept trying Dom3 and failing miserably at getting into it despite loving the concept. I'm having better luck with Dom4, enough to the point where I'm thinking joining some multiplayer games wouldn't be a bad idea once it's "officially" released, but I have a few questions: 1) What does it take to claim a throne? Does it have to be a pretender or can a high level priest/mage do it? 2) Is there a movement queue system? I don't remember one being in 3 but I'd hoped that would have come with the improvements in 4. 3) Another missing improvement, is searching for sites still a one by one by one manual deal, or is there some way to automate it? 4) What all does the Dominion value represent for Pretender choice? Is the higher ranks just faster spread of your scales, or does it actually affect your pretenders stats when on different values of friendly dominion? nessin fucked around with this message at 05:58 on Oct 9, 2013 |
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Oct 9, 2013 05:56
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1)Pretender, or sacred 3. 3)Manual 4)A 9/10 Dominion score gives youR pretender 1/3 points of awe. According to the wiki, a pretender without inherent awe has a -1, so this comes out to 0/2 for most pretenders. Someone try a 10 dom Virtue build for me please. Pomp fucked around with this message at 06:16 on Oct 9, 2013 |
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Oct 9, 2013 06:03
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nessin posted:3) Another missing improvement, is searching for sites still a one by one by one manual deal, or is there some way to automate it? You can set up site searching spells to chain cast monthly until they run out of provinces within range (rituals have ranges now in Dom4 - Auspex is the biggest offender with a mere range 2), but sending mages off to sitesearch is still manual, yes.
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Oct 9, 2013 06:29
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nessin posted:I kept trying Dom3 and failing miserably at getting into it despite loving the concept. I'm having better luck with Dom4, enough to the point where I'm thinking joining some multiplayer games wouldn't be a bad idea once it's "officially" released, but I have a few questions: 1) Pretender or H3 priest (usually prophet) 2) Nope. 4) The Dominion value represents the chance for a candle to be generated and the max dominion of a province, and apparently you can up both by temples in Dom4. Dom 9 and Dom 10 give the pretender Awe of varying levels. Scale spread is dependent on the number of candles in a province.
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Oct 9, 2013 07:28
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Dirk the Average posted:You can set up site searching spells to chain cast monthly until they run out of provinces within range (rituals have ranges now in Dom4 - Auspex is the biggest offender with a mere range 2), but sending mages off to sitesearch is still manual, yes. How do you do that, I've used the spells but don't see any option to repeat.
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Oct 9, 2013 08:07
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nessin posted:How do you do that, I've used the spells but don't see any option to repeat. Use 'M' instead of 'R' to cast the spell. Same goes for monthly forging, use 'O' instead of 'F'.
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Oct 9, 2013 08:12
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uPen posted:Use 'M' instead of 'R' to cast the spell. Same goes for monthly forging, use 'O' instead of 'F'. For clarity, if you have no commander selected, hitting those keys will issue orders to the command your mouse cursor is hovering over. If you have a commander selected, then hitting the key will issue orders to that commander regardless of cursor position.
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Oct 9, 2013 08:50
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Speaking about site searching spells, Gnome Lore (Earth), Auspex (Air), and Voice of Apsu (Water) are all Level 4 research spells so it might be more prudent to go site searching manually for nations that heavily invest in those paths due to the fact research is harder.
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Oct 9, 2013 16:38
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^Also, it feels like the site distribution is now skewed more to level 1 and 2 sites that can be easily found by manually searching, and less to crazy level 4 sites that require manual searching by a VERY high-end mage or sitesearch spell. The overall effect is to make manual site-searching probably the best option for most nations with only a few exceptions - if you know a specific province has an elevated site chance for example.
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Oct 9, 2013 16:44
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I'm pretty sure that throne provinces have a massively increased chance of sites, those might even be worth the 25 pearl "Find All" ritual.
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Oct 9, 2013 17:26
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esquilax posted:I'm pretty sure that throne provinces have a massively increased chance of sites.
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Oct 9, 2013 18:27
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jBrereton posted:Based on what, exactly? A few single player games that I played, where provinces with thrones had a lot more sites than normal. They were big maps with site frequency all the way up to 75. Most provinces had 0-2 sites, but provinces with thrones had like 3 to 8.
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Oct 9, 2013 18:43
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esquilax posted:A few single player games that I played, where provinces with thrones had a lot more sites than normal. I'm going to run some tests myself, because I have a feeling that thrones will not only not make other sites more likely, but that they will probably cap out a province much earlier-on, which would be the expected behaviour.
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Oct 9, 2013 19:45
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Just won my first-ever game of Dominions, this game is loving amazing. And frustrating. I watched four successively larger armies (topping out around 850 heavy infantry with 15-20 mages) get completely wiped out by the enemy's pretender in his capital, a statue of war with mistform, fire shield, deflection, fear, and a bunch of other ridiculous poo poo. I ended up going for the thrones instead, which worked a hell of a lot better. I'm not even sure what I'd have done otherwise - what the hell do you do with a god that can kill an army that size without going below 50% health?
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Oct 9, 2013 21:08
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I'd cast shatter a few times and call it a day. Or horror mark the poo poo our of it and hope Scabiel does the hard work for me.
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Oct 9, 2013 21:10
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When up against either Supercombatants or in this case an immobile with ridic buffs (which is essentially an SC for one province) army size basically is irrelevant. You need to specifically target areas they don't have covered. A statue of war will get destroyed by 4 flying thugs with dual dusksdaggers and mr+defensive items. Possibly you might have trouble if it leads with skellyspam. Also you can preach out the cap to lower its stats, then go after it with MR resists save-or-die spells. e: Army is often a liability in such situations. Don't bring what won't be effective. TheDemon fucked around with this message at 21:25 on Oct 9, 2013 |
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Oct 9, 2013 21:13
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Jines posted:Just won my first-ever game of Dominions, this game is loving amazing. And frustrating. I watched four successively larger armies (topping out around 850 heavy infantry with 15-20 mages) get completely wiped out by the enemy's pretender in his capital, a statue of war with mistform, fire shield, deflection, fear, and a bunch of other ridiculous poo poo. I ended up going for the thrones instead, which worked a hell of a lot better. I'm not even sure what I'd have done otherwise - what the hell do you do with a god that can kill an army that size without going below 50% health? Drop a rock on its head. If your opponent is using magic, you should probably be doing the same thing - just tossing mages in there isn't necessarily going to do the trick. You're probably going to need to form a communion, pass out boosters/gems, or really just take some time to plan out what spells you want to bring the big guy down. For instance, if you had buffed your infantry with things like weapons of sharpness, strength of giants, fire resistance, and other such things, the statue would have likely been destroyed. What happened in your case is that the enemy you went up against is able to simply chew up and spit out virtually unlimited numbers of unbuffed infantry. You need something with a bigger punch, whether it be buffed up infantry, thugs with weapons designed to counter the enemy statue, or a supercombatant with nice gear. The phrase "quantity has a quality all of its own" was not developed in a world where giant undead gods pulled from the depths of tartarus roam the lands.
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Oct 9, 2013 21:22
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