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bobkatt013 posted:Why? The Governor is still out there and we know he is going to try to kill everyone? He has used zombies before as foot troops and if he has an army at this point its very tiny since he killed them all. And we run into this issue where the Governor, hell bent on revenge makes his way through the hordes, scales the fence and feeds them from behind, then scales the fence and leaves every day instead of, you know, ramming down the damned fence with a truck again. Same with a supposed plant in the prison. Nothing like endangering yourself and your friends/family to do something the governor could literally do in five minutes at night and seriously gently caress the place over without all the James Bond espionage bullshit. Fog Tripper posted:What would be the point of ANY of the built-up backstory of the girl? Well, gee, I dunno. Thinks zombies are pets/people, refuses to stab zombies...I dunno. Perhaps to show that she's not Badass McStabby-deathbringer people are attributing her to be. Hence why I'm rather certain it's her feeding the walkers, she insists on treating them all like pets up to this point, it's not hard to add that all up. And surprise, it doesn't require taking large leaps of faith to get there or some conspiracy involving a fall guy to do it. Honestly, this is like the whole "The chopper was shot down" last season Theglavwen posted:Weeeellll, keeping in mind that I think it's an obviously wrong idea, this bit sort of makes more sense considering that she thinks walkers are just 'different' people. Since she figures Walkers are people too, it might make more sense to her to kill people who are suffering in this life, so that they won't have to be bothered by it when they return. Improving their lot, and all that. Killing them by destroying the part of them that brings them back and burning the corpses kinda screams a giant NO to that SocketWrench fucked around with this message at 08:59 on Nov 9, 2013 |
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Nov 9, 2013 08:40
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the posted:But on the show they make it seem like the zombie bite gives them this rapid infection that kills them very quickly, as though they've become infected with the zombie virus. If it's just a standard infection, does this mean that antibiotics can treat a zombie bite? I think in theory it is something survivable, but we haven't really encountered a situation on the show where a bite that wasn't on a limb you could amputate didn't already put the character in fatal range anyway, and if their bite looked survivable, the characters weren't really equipped to deal with it in terms of medication to find out anyway. I mean, the whole premise of the past few episodes has been to find some medicine for this flu-like infection, nevermind full blown hospital tools and technology. Scratches are supposed to be bad too, but I don't think that's come up in the show that I remember.
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Nov 9, 2013 10:26
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cycomatix posted:I think in theory it is something survivable, but we haven't really encountered a situation on the show where a bite that wasn't on a limb you could amputate didn't already put the character in fatal range anyway, and if their bite looked survivable, the characters weren't really equipped to deal with it in terms of medication to find out anyway. Did the wife of the guy at the CDC die from the infection? I doubt the CDC lacked penicillin.
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Nov 9, 2013 10:44
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That's a good point. I mean, maybe she let herself die to show the path of the mutation or whatever, but that doesn't sound plausible the way Dr. Jenner talked about her. It does sound likely they would have treated her, and it didn't help, so if you get bitten, you're probably just hosed.
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Nov 9, 2013 10:56
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I kind of choose to believe the Mira Grant Newsflesh series' explanation: everyone's infected, but a bite activates the zombification process early (when it would normally start after dying).
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Nov 9, 2013 13:27
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What evidence is there for that? Amy, the sister from the first season, took all night and didn't turn until the morning. Shane turned within minutes and had no bites.
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Nov 9, 2013 13:49
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moths posted:Zombie Apocalypse is probably the dumbest setting for a whodunnit murder-mystery, anyway. There's always a plausible defense even if you're caught knifing some dude's brains out through his ear. Counterpoint: Zombie Apocalypse covering 4(+) seasons would not do well without variety of storylines. Something just occurred to me. They took the refugees from Gov-Town. Yet they are never shown returning for loot runs there. Didn't they have a rather good medical clinic, storehouse, supplies, clothing... Fog Tripper fucked around with this message at 15:51 on Nov 9, 2013 |
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Nov 9, 2013 15:46
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I don't quite remember the end of last season but was there some reason why they didn't just take up the Governor's town? Seems like it would be must smarter to stay there than in the prison.
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Nov 9, 2013 16:03
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Fog Tripper posted:Something just occurred to me. They took the refugees from Gov-Town. Yet they are never shown returning for loot runs there. Didn't they have a rather good medical clinic, storehouse, supplies, clothing... The half a year gap between seasons was more than enough to strip that place clean.
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Nov 9, 2013 16:13
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MeLKoR posted:I don't quite remember the end of last season but was there some reason why they didn't just take up the Governor's town? Seems like it would be must smarter to stay there than in the prison. I think they may have felt the prison was easier to defend. I know I would really like all that open acreage with the fence line, too.
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Nov 9, 2013 16:27
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Svanja posted:I think they may have felt the prison was easier to defend. I know I would really like all that open acreage with the fence line, too. That wire fence seems pretty flimsy compared to the wall they had around the town but you might have a point about the tillable soil.
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Nov 9, 2013 16:38
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The wall in Woodbury can't be too safe. Are we forgetting Rick's crew snuck in easily enough, and then snuck back in to get Darryl? Imagine what would have happened if they wanted to kill people. They probably could have massacred the town that first night if that was the goal.
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Nov 9, 2013 16:43
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The wire fence may not be the best, but the prison itself is very defensible, especially with being able to fall back into deeper cell-blocks -- all with locking doors that were built to stop a horde of people from being able to pound through. They chose a pretty weird window of time to cut out though between seasons. It's like, we get a huge group of people and then smash cut to them all dying of sickness. The end result is going to be picking up 1 or 2 actual characters and whatever redshirts are left. I suspect the last time we are going to see the "community working together" was them BBQing in the season premier.
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Nov 9, 2013 16:45
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Svanja posted:I think they may have felt the prison was easier to defend. I know I would really like all that open acreage with the fence line, too. Add to that the governor knows the town, he doesn't know the prison. So upon his return, he existing still being a threat looming, it'd be better to stay where they are than move into town where your enemy knows all the nooks and crannies. That and should the fences fail, they've gor rather strong walls to hide behind, unlike Woodbury where if it gets overrun (and it has in the past) there's poo poo all to do but wait to die in a small room
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Nov 9, 2013 16:59
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SocketWrench posted:Killing them by destroying the part of them that brings them back and burning the corpses kinda screams a giant NO to that Keep in mind, the people holding the theory seem to be claiming that Carol would have burnt the bodies after the killed killed, or tried to kill, them. The stabbing them in the head thing, as has already been discussed, is of course a legitimate objection. Unless somebody wanted to claim that she tried to kill them, bungled it, ran to Carol, who put them out of their misery by stabbing them in the heads then burning them, and the flashback just cut out the part before Carol got there in a brilliant and subtle case of misdirection!!! Come to think of it, I think I've seen that argument made already.
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Nov 9, 2013 17:53
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Baldbeard posted:They chose a pretty weird window of time to cut out though between seasons. It's like, we get a huge group of people and then smash cut to them all dying of sickness. The end result is going to be picking up 1 or 2 actual characters and whatever redshirts are left. I suspect the last time we are going to see the "community working together" was them BBQing in the season premier. They wanted to give the group a long period of peace and relative prosperity so they could feel like they were reestablishing the lives they lost and building a civilization, and then uproot it with a new crisis they hadn't yet faced in serious illness. That means no major zombie attacks, character deaths, or crisis' during that period. That would have made for a pretty low key run of episodes. It makes more sense to me to skip over that stuff that we should be smart enough to be able to follow and skip right to the soul crushing stuff.
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Nov 9, 2013 17:56
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STAC Goat posted:Probably because the time period they skipped had no major incidents. It would have been a season's worth of civic lessons while the Council forms, Rick learning to farm while dealing with anger management and grief counseling, Carl being retaught the morals and ethics of killing, Tyreese and karen falling for each other, Darryl doing runs and finding random people, and a whole lot of complaining about room accommodations. Yeah, it definitely makes sense to keep the more interesting story going. I just think we could have seen a few more runs with new characters before most of the group died. The final feeling at the end of the last season was "oh poo poo! how are they going to manage this many people?", and then it's like, oh, they just die off immediately. Like in an action movie where a hero saves the world and gets girl X. Then in part 2 of the movie the girl is nowhere to be seen and they just use a line like "Uh yeah, it didn't work out." I guess I don't think they really sold Rick being a farmer long enough before they uprooted him (hehe) back into the fight. But hey, this season is way better than the last 2, so maybe this speed is just better.
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Nov 9, 2013 18:08
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STAC Goat posted:Post-Lost Viewing. I think this post got a lot right. It's also nearly unheard-of for a show to introduce a TRAITOR IN OUR MIDSTS! mystery, and then absolutely 100% resolve it amicably as a misunderstanding within an hour. TV doesn't usually move that swiftly, and especially TWD. It's a massive storytelling gear-change from previous seasons (where's Sofia?). Even after watching Carol stab her in a flashback, people are still skeptical - It was Rick envisioning the killing maybe. I'm still waiting for the other shoe to drop, and I know it won't. I'm waiting for her "I killed them" to be amended with "...when I armed and trained that little girl!" or "...after the council decided it was best!" It's not going to happen, and I understand that - but TV doesn't have much history of working this way. It's unconventional, and I dig it, but I'm not 100% comfortable buying it yet.
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Nov 9, 2013 18:24
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Theglavwen posted:Keep in mind, the people holding the theory seem to be claiming that Carol would have burnt the bodies after the killed killed, or tried to kill, them. The stabbing them in the head thing, as has already been discussed, is of course a legitimate objection. Unless somebody wanted to claim that she tried to kill them, bungled it, ran to Carol, who put them out of their misery by stabbing them in the heads then burning them, and the flashback just cut out the part before Carol got there in a brilliant and subtle case of misdirection!!! Come to think of it, I think I've seen that argument made already. It's really stupid no matter which way you look at it. We've got a kid that wouldn't kill walkers or people, period. Now suddenly in 24 hours or less she does a complete 180 based on nothing and sticks two people knowing already that damaging the head is what kills walkers. For this to be what happened is poo poo writing.
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Nov 10, 2013 04:30
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moths posted:Even after watching Carol stab her in a flashback, people are still skeptical - It was Rick envisioning the killing maybe. We really do need Sunday's episode so we have something else to discuss, haha. I am going to do a rewatch Sunday, but I remember it as Rick putting the pieces together and 'seeing' how the crime unfolded.
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Nov 10, 2013 11:22
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I wonder if they're going to revisit, hell, if someone will even remember, that they heard someone on the radio. Or was that just nothing but a setup for the poor driving?
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Nov 10, 2013 17:25
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SocketWrench posted:For this to be what happened is poo poo writing. No offense, but are you suggesting that "poo poo writing" is something this show has a record of NOT having? I mean jesus, didn't we just do a virtual entire season of poo poo (beyond 2 or three decent episodes) writing? For the record I am OK either way; if the girl is guilty or truly Carol. But for those justifying the latter because the alternative might be "poo poo writing", what were you watching last season? This ain't no Justified, people. Svanja posted:We really do need Sunday's episode so we have something else to discuss, haha. Yeah, I will rewatch before tonight's episode as well. That brings me to a gripe about AMC. Why in the everliving gently caress must they have the "On the NEXT Walking Dead" preview seconds before the next episode airs? What is the point? (that goes for any and all shows that have "on the next..." previews for their shows.) Fog Tripper fucked around with this message at 19:07 on Nov 10, 2013 |
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Nov 10, 2013 19:04
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q≠e
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Nov 10, 2013 19:06
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Adam Savage is one of the Talking Bad guests today. I'm sure there will be a myth busted joke prepared by Hardwick.
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Nov 10, 2013 19:09
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Have Carol and the Governor ever been on-screen at the same time? Because if not then I think I just figured out everything
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Nov 10, 2013 19:12
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PootieTang posted:Have Carol and the Governor ever been on-screen at the same time? IIRC neither were Lori and the Governor. And we never actually say Syrio... er, Lori, die. 
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Nov 10, 2013 19:17
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Fog Tripper posted:IIRC neither were Lori and the Governor. And we never actually saw Syrio... er, Lori, die. Now it all makes sense. The Governor has been infiltrating Ricks group since even before the zombie apocalypse, disguising himself as a woman, giving birth to Carl so that Rick be distracted and misguided by his emotions towards his son, and then sleeping with Shane in order to sow discord in the group hoping they would both kill each other, simultaneously disguising himself as Carol through advanced puppetry and ventriloquism skills. Constantly moving between both the main groups camps and Woodbury, faking his own death by Walkers, and gaslighting Rick by appearing again in the Lori disguise to make him feel like he's going crazy, then using his Carol persona to drive Rick to more harsh and extreme measures knowing the rest of the group would turn on him. Not only that, but he has also been feeding the walkers and training the children of the prison to become murdering psychos like him, framing himself in the guise of Carol for the murders actually committed by that little girl so that she can remain inside as his plant.
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Nov 10, 2013 19:23
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PootieTang posted:Now it all makes sense. The Governor has been infiltrating Ricks group since even before the zombie apocalypse, disguising himself as a woman, giving birth to Carl so that Rick be distracted and misguided by his emotions towards his son, and then sleeping with Shane in order to sow discord in the group hoping they would both kill each other, simultaneously disguising himself as Carol through advanced puppetry and ventriloquism skills. Constantly moving between both the main groups camps and Woodbury, faking his own death by Walkers, and gaslighting Rick by appearing again in the Lori disguise to make him feel like he's going crazy, then using his Carol persona to drive Rick to more harsh and extreme measures knowing the rest of the group would turn on him.  My god, man, you just blew my mind!Put that poo poo in spoilers before you get probated!
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Nov 10, 2013 19:34
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Fog Tripper posted:No offense, but are you suggesting that "poo poo writing" is something this show has a record of NOT having? I mean jesus, didn't we just do a virtual entire season of poo poo (beyond 2 or three decent episodes) writing? For the record I am OK either way; if the girl is guilty or truly Carol. But for those justifying the latter because the alternative might be "poo poo writing", what were you watching last season? This ain't no Justified, people. The things that characters have said and done so far this season mean that it makes absolutely no sense for the killer to be the little girl, whereas it makes a lot of sense for the killer to be Carol. If they decide to throw out a "twist" and have it be the kid it would be really, really poo poo writing that easily rivals the dumbest things the show has done up to yet, it's probably by far the dumbest from a character development position. The writing on the TWD can be a bit iffy at times but I can't think of an example of the writers blatantly contradicting themselves in such an obvious manner.
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Nov 10, 2013 20:19
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In season one, you could argue that Shane is never going to turn into a Lori-assaulting Otis-murdering psycho usurper because it would have be "poo poo writing." I mean, look how he takes care of everybody and makes pragmatic decisions! I actually work with a guy who is still confused as to why Shane wasn't a good guy. 
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Nov 10, 2013 21:48
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MeLKoR posted:No, but we have castles and a spear is easy to make.
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Nov 10, 2013 21:52
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moths posted:In season one, you could argue that Shane is never going to turn into a Lori-assaulting Otis-murdering psycho usurper because it would have be "poo poo writing." I mean, look how he takes care of everybody and makes pragmatic decisions! Shane was shown to be off kilter from early season 1.
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Nov 10, 2013 21:52
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Redundant posted:Just because the show has had instances of poo poo writing in the past doesn't mean that people should look for the dumbest solution to things every time. Just because people are theorizing about a specific plot point does not mean it is happening every time.
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Nov 10, 2013 21:53
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Fog Tripper posted:No offense, but are you suggesting that "poo poo writing" is something this show has a record of NOT having? I mean jesus, didn't we just do a virtual entire season of poo poo (beyond 2 or three decent episodes) writing? No, I'm not suggesting it's something this show is above. But for it to truly be, then basically you've got the same "doesn't make sense" in why the shows have been written well enough around this single event and why this one event has to be such a giant poo poo. It basically asks more questions than it answers, a pandora's box sort of deal Fog Tripper posted:Why in the everliving gently caress must they have the "On the NEXT Walking Dead" preview seconds before the next episode airs? What is the point? (that goes for any and all shows that have "on the next..." previews for their shows.) Funny things about recorded shows, am I right? it's almost like they were recorded a certain way and playing them back gives the same results time after time. SocketWrench fucked around with this message at 21:55 on Nov 10, 2013 |
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Nov 10, 2013 21:53
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socialsecurity posted:Shane was shown to be off kilter from early season 1. He was shown to be a misogynistic douchebag in his first scene of season one.
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Nov 10, 2013 21:54
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SocketWrench posted:No, I'm not suggesting it's something this show is above. But for it to truly be, then basically you've got the same "doesn't make sense" in why the shows have been written well enough around this single event and why this one event has to be such a giant poo poo. Some of us do not see it as a giant poo poo.  quote:It basically asks more questions than it answers, a pandora's box sort of deal I'm cool with that. Again:  SocketWrench posted:Funny things about recorded shows, am I right? it's almost like they were recorded a certain way and playing them back gives the same results time after time. What is your point? Are you saying there is a legitimate purpose to showing sneak peaks of the show you are about to watch mere seconds later? Fog Tripper fucked around with this message at 21:58 on Nov 10, 2013 |
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Nov 10, 2013 21:56
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q still doesn't equal e
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Nov 10, 2013 21:57
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moths posted:In season one, you could argue that Shane is never going to turn into a Lori-assaulting Otis-murdering psycho usurper because it would have be "poo poo writing." I mean, look how he takes care of everybody and makes pragmatic decisions! Fog Tripper posted:Just because people are theorizing about a specific plot point does not mean it is happening every time.
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Nov 10, 2013 21:58
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Redundant posted:
I didn't ignore it this time, nor the other times you've outlaid your case for Carol. Others have outlaid the case for the girl, which you continually fall back onto "poo poo writing". Once again, I am cool whichever way it turns out. It is fun to theorize. If anyone is interested in true poo poo writing, THE FOLLOWING has just hit netflix.
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Nov 10, 2013 22:00
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Fog Tripper posted:I didn't ignore it this time, nor the other times you've outlaid your case for Carol. Others have outlaid the case for the girl, which you continually fall back onto "poo poo writing".  if you think that "poo poo writing" is my point. Stating that a plot development would be poo poo writing is not the same as me saying "this is wrong because if it happens it would be poo poo". Theorising is fun but when the show is going to such lengths to show you that you're wrong I aren't sure why you'd persist with a theory that would make the show worse 
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Nov 10, 2013 22:05
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