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Slime posted:The ranks aren't really absolute indications of power, they're granted by people from within the tower. It would be no real surprise if someone's rank was determined by their political clout as it was by their actual abilities. The heads are probably pretty drat powerful sure, but you can't really use the ranking system as a precise indication of just how powerful. There's been literally dozens of SIU blurbs that talk about the family heads and princesses and irregulars fighting each other to determine who's the most powerful. Admittedly there is definitely conjecture (Zahard never fought the irregulars who are ranked ahead of him, for instance) but SIU would've had to be lying about a lot of stuff if the ranking's determined by political clout. The irregulars don't even have political clout as all of them but Mazino have disappeared. They got their ranking for doing ridiculous things you couldn't do without being absurdly powerful. Phantaminium for apparently making a mockery of Zahard's forces, Enryu for killing a guardian, and Mazino for scaling the tower faster than anyone and soundly defeating the previous 4th ranked (and now 5th ranked) ranker in Arie Hon. Two Tone Shoes fucked around with this message at 14:00 on Nov 7, 2013 |
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Nov 7, 2013 13:51
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Two Tone Shoes posted:There's been literally dozens of SIU blurbs that talk about the family heads and princesses and irregulars fighting each other to determine who's the most powerful. Admittedly there is definitely conjecture (Zahard never fought the irregulars who are ranked ahead of him, for instance) but SIU would've had to be lying about a lot of stuff if the ranking's determined by political clout. Yeah, I get the impression the rankings are pretty accurate. Urek may believe he's the strongest, but that's simply arrogance. SIU's blog posts and other supplementary material imply that Phantaminum is actually massively more powerful than Enryu; Phantaminum is a godlike being made of narrative or something like that, while Enryu is just a very powerful Shinsoo user.
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Nov 7, 2013 19:36
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Silver2195 posted:Yeah, I get the impression the rankings are pretty accurate. Urek may believe he's the strongest, but that's simply arrogance. SIU's blog posts and other supplementary material imply that Phantaminum is actually massively more powerful than Enryu; Phantaminum is a godlike being made of narrative or something like that, while Enryu is just a very powerful Shinsoo user. Phantaminum is some very special thing from an older story of SIU's (in the same universe apparently) that he seems to have done a pretty good job of erasing from the Internet since he doesn't like how he did it. And yeah, Phantaminum is absurdly powerful - it just showed up in Zahard's court, smashed through everyone up to the man himself, then abruptly chose to leave without doing anything to Zahard and has disappeared as far as anyone in the Tower knows.
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Nov 7, 2013 21:42
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There is way, way too much stuff in this story that never happens in the comic. I mean I guess it's cool if you like wikis and stuff but it seems like half the story is in blog posts
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Nov 8, 2013 04:23
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To be fair it'll probably be explained eventually, it just doesn't matter right now.
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Nov 8, 2013 04:27
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Some of it has to do with SIU's older comics, which he's taken off the web to redo at a more professional standard. But mostly I think he just did a of world building before sitting down to write TOG. I wouldn't be surprised if he kind of regrets introducing Phantiminium to TOG. The whole premise of the Talze Uzers ("tales users") kind of strikes me as needing development before being used in published material. As far as I can tell, the universe selects people to be protagonists in a cosmic drama, and in return, they get abilities that alter reality in a specific way around them. Within that space around them, which varies in size, nothing can interfere with them or their power until their personal story is complete. How these guys even could fight each other is an interesting question (he did write comics about them so he clearly worked that part out), but they're basically invulnerable to anything else.
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Nov 8, 2013 10:10
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While we're on the subject, is it supposed to be public knowledge, both in-universe and out, that the "top" of the tower is just the 134th floor? Out-of-universe, SIU did mention in a blog post that some of the background information isn't supposed to be public, like that stuff about Slayers. It makes me wonder if the 134th floor thing is supposed to be a plot twist. In-universe, how common is that knowledge? All the rankers would know about it, and people like Koon might as well. And come to think of it, most of the reasons for climbing the tower stated in the series don't actually require the person to reach the actual physical top. Other than Rachel's goal, of course.
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Nov 8, 2013 10:30
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I don't know if it's well known that there is a top that is meant to be reached. The info on the "three lords" mentions that the more progressive lord advocates advancement to the next floor, though.
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Nov 8, 2013 11:06
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lil baby anime posted:There is way, way too much stuff in this story that never happens in the comic. I mean I guess it's cool if you like wikis and stuff but it seems like half the story is in blog posts This is why you should always read the Company's translation when it comes out, they usually translate his blog posts at the end.
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Nov 9, 2013 17:31
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It's like the LotR. There is a metric rear end-ton of work the writer has done to help shape the narrative in his mind and make it all hang together, but there isn't necessarily an organic way to show it all in the actual story [Or even a need to]. It's just information that helps build the world, but none of it is strictly required reading. Do to the magic of 'internet', he can post that poo poo in little asides while doing the main work. Read it if it interests you or you have questions, but otherwise it is ignorable.
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Nov 9, 2013 18:54
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Genocyber posted:This is why you should always read the Company's translation when it comes out, they usually translate his blog posts at the end. I might just skim the chapter and just read the blog stuff from their version if I can remember to do it during the week.
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Nov 9, 2013 21:54
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lil baby anime posted:I might just skim the chapter and just read the blog stuff from their version if I can remember to do it during the week. They didn't start adding his daily blogs for a while, but there's a thread here that has a whole bunch of blog/background information scattered throughout.
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Nov 10, 2013 16:30
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http://www.mangareader.net/tower-of-god/166 I like how this is going
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Nov 11, 2013 00:53
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Aguero and Leesoo's teams working together now. Finally. Kinda want Baam to free himself from this instead of just having people rescue him but I have no idea how he'd even do it in the first place.
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Nov 11, 2013 03:39
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lil baby anime posted:Aguero and Leesoo's teams working together now. Finally. Kinda want Baam to free himself from this instead of just having people rescue him but I have no idea how he'd even do it in the first place. The first thing that I thought was that the last time he couldn't use shinsoo, he used his current thorn. Maybe he can do the same here, or his irregular powers could bloom. Anyways it's exciting. 
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Nov 11, 2013 04:51
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He's probably going to be saved by being summoned by Koon, like Koon mentioned for his/Leesoo's plan. I'm OK with this, since it wouldn't really make any sense for Baam to be able to free himself here; FUG planned this out with the fact that he's an irregular in mind, and them simply overlooking some aspect of Baam's abilities would be a pretty lame way for this situation to be resolved.
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Nov 11, 2013 17:05
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Sleepy Owl posted:While we're on the subject, is it supposed to be public knowledge, both in-universe and out, that the "top" of the tower is just the 134th floor? I thought they said that the "top" is just as far as anyone has gotten?
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Nov 12, 2013 01:06
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KoB posted:I thought they said that the "top" is just as far as anyone has gotten? I'm pretty sure I remember reading this too, as well as that the guardians and their tests are vastly, vastly more difficult after the "top" of the tower.
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Nov 12, 2013 01:10
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Right, but has that been said in the actual series? I think there's at least one place where it's implied, but I can't recall it ever being outright stated.
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Nov 12, 2013 03:06
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I think it was stated pretty much outright early on. I'm pretty sure someone has mentioned how they should be forging ahead and going to higher levels of the tower, and how Zahard is being complacent. Then again that might have been someone in one of the major families and the information isn't common knowledge among regulars. Wasn't Rachels reason for climbing the tower wanting to see the real stars?
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Nov 12, 2013 20:01
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You have to imagine that the test at the "top" floor of the tower is something incredible if nobody has bested it in all the time people have inhabited the tower. Theres been 3 immensely powerful irregulars and hundreds of thousands of rankers, and nobodys managed to do it? I doubt its a matter of Zahard being complacent, theres got to be some sort of kink in the rules that makes it almost impossible.
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Nov 12, 2013 20:23
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I wouldn't be surprised if the irregulars don't even care, and it seems like the family heads are pretty much retired at this point. Zahard is sleeping or something as well.
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Nov 12, 2013 21:14
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RatHat posted:I wouldn't be surprised if the irregulars don't even care, and it seems like the family heads are pretty much retired at this point. Zahard is sleeping or something as well. SIU's blog, I think posted:Zahard is currently resting, leaving the outside activities to his daughters, but a lot of people are expecting that the day Zahard is on the move again would be the day when the limit to The Tower goes another Floor up.
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Nov 13, 2013 01:50
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About Zahard's rumored son thing, didn't "season 2" start with it vaguely hinting Wagnan might be that, or somehow connected to Zahard? I seem to remember it getting mentioned, then Baam showed back up and Wagnan fell off the radar pretty much entirely. I'm going to laugh at this point if Zahard turns out to be some kind of Warhammer 40k style Emperor, where he basically died ages ago and is being kept alive so they can make more princesses.
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Nov 13, 2013 02:02
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It was almost outright stated that he's the prince of Zahard, yeah. SIU has said that he hasn't unlocked his true power as well.
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Nov 13, 2013 02:04
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RatHat posted:It was almost outright stated that he's the prince of Zahard, yeah. SIU has said that he hasn't unlocked his true power as well. Wagnan will make the best princess.
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Nov 13, 2013 02:17
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RatHat posted:It was almost outright stated that he's the prince of Zahard, yeah. SIU has said that he hasn't unlocked his true power as well. Holy crap, really? Can someone point me to where this was hinted at/stated?
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Nov 13, 2013 19:26
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Ytlaya posted:Holy crap, really? Can someone point me to where this was hinted at/stated? Didn't he have a ring that was dear to him that had Zahard's symbol? http://mangafox.me/manga/tower_of_god/v02/c009/39.html CVE fucked around with this message at 20:00 on Nov 13, 2013 |
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Nov 13, 2013 19:56
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Ytlaya posted:Holy crap, really? Can someone point me to where this was hinted at/stated? The closest thing to an outright statement is by Hwa Ryun in Season 2 Chapter 35, where she calls him "Prince of the Red Light District." Now I have no idea if that phrase has the same meaning in Korean as it does here or what it's supposed to mean. It's the closest thing there is to a direct statement though. There a few other things that support it.He has a red Zahard ring, something normally only worn by princesses if I recall correctly; and also he aspires to become King. Now for someone who has only shown fairly mediocre power so far, this seems a fairly unrealistic ambition to have unless he knows he actually has the potential to somehow overthrow or succeed the ruler of the whole tower.
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Nov 13, 2013 20:04
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Beyond what's already been said, if I recall correctly, the second arc of ToG (i.e the one that introduces Wagnan as a secondary protagonist), is called the Return of the Prince of Zehard, or something among these lines.
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Nov 13, 2013 21:06
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Rahul posted:The closest thing to an outright statement is by Hwa Ryun in Season 2 Chapter 35, where she calls him "Prince of the Red Light District." Now I have no idea if that phrase has the same meaning in Korean as it does here or what it's supposed to mean. It's the closest thing there is to a direct statement though. It's about time for a re-read for me, but had Wagnan shown any real power besides his Pokeball grenades? Is that his shinsoo or just good explosives? I can't recall at all since he's basically just been a comedic/bait character so far.
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Nov 13, 2013 21:37
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Reiche posted:It's about time for a re-read for me, but had Wagnan shown any real power besides his Pokeball grenades? Is that his shinsoo or just good explosives? I can't recall at all since he's basically just been a comedic/bait character so far. Half were explosives, half were shinsoo bombs, and he purchased them with what cash he could spare. He was upset in his fight against Viole that he ran out of "good" (shinsoo) bombs because they were more expensive; the irony being that the actual explosives worked against him when the shinsoo ones were worthless.
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Nov 13, 2013 23:01
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To be fair, he lasted longer against Viole than just about anyone.  CVE posted:Didn't he have a ring that was dear to him that had Zahard's symbol? http://mngacow.com/tower-of-god/v2-35/3/  Also for what it's worth, Ja Wangnan written backwards is apparently Korean for "I'm a prince."
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Nov 13, 2013 23:26
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Sarcophallus posted:Half were explosives, half were shinsoo bombs, and he purchased them with what cash he could spare. He was upset in his fight against Viole that he ran out of "good" (shinsoo) bombs because they were more expensive; the irony being that the actual explosives worked against him when the shinsoo ones were worthless. Wangnan getting a lucky strike with a "bad" bomb and forcing Baam to guard with his wierd lobster thing since he wasnt expecting a non-shinsoo attack is one of my favorite moments in the story. Even as strong as an irregular is he can still get suckerpunched (even if Wangnan didnt know it was a suckerpunch)
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Nov 13, 2013 23:43
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Sleepy Owl posted:To be fair, he lasted longer against Viole than just about anyone. Also to be fair, even that far into his resigned depressed Viole persona Baam still didn't want to kill people FUG didn't explicitly tell him to so he wasn't trying very hard
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Nov 13, 2013 23:46
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Sleepy Owl posted:To be fair, he lasted longer against Viole than just about anyone. Nicely spotted - I don't think I ever caught the ring on creepy fug dude the first time around.
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Nov 14, 2013 01:26
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Bybus Slago posted:About Zahard's rumored son thing, didn't "season 2" start with it vaguely hinting Wagnan might be that, or somehow connected to Zahard? I seem to remember it getting mentioned, then Baam showed back up and Wagnan fell off the radar pretty much entirely. The princesses aren't Zahard's actual children, it's just a title for people chosen by Zahard to inherit a bit of his power.
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Nov 14, 2013 07:37
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About the whole 'top' of the Tower thing, I actually think the reason for a lack of advance has less to do with it being too hard to advance and more to do with most of the family heads and Zahard (highest ranking guys in their Empire) having no reason to risk a climb via their own strength. From what I've understood from blog posts, Zahard and the family heads (save one, sort of) are effectively immortal on any floor from the 'top' down, but on floors above that the contract granting them immortality would not apply. Basically, on Zahard's side the Tower's strongest fighters just aren't even trying to advance beyond breeding or 'adopting' or weaponizing expendable children to do it for them. Because, really, they have all the time in the world (literally) to keep plopping out or leveraging unauthorized children without risking death themselves, making advance just a matter of time. To me the 'challenge' of the next floor seems to be one of two things: the 10 Families aren't working together to beat it and have all been challenging it separately or they're in the 'building power to clear it before the other families can' phase, a cold war of sorts as they wait to even take a stab at it out of fear of failing and losing the team they worked so hard to build. That said, there's nothing to say that nobody has advanced beyond the 'top'; we only know that the Zahard+10 Family Empire has yet to advance beyond the 'top'. I suspect that some of the irregulars (phantawhatever) have already advanced higher, potentially even making contracts that would make Empire advance even harder. Though, maybe we'll found out more on that next season when we'll likely get a feel for whether or not Urek has tested himself on the 'top' yet and, if not, what caused a man as cocksure as him to be so baby about it. I mean, I don't suspect many people have tried it and lived because if it wasn't inherently fatal why not keep trying at it? And, just as a thing, I'm now noticing that the theme of season 2 seems to be "the Tower super hates children", which doesn't bode too well for its titular 'prince(s)'.
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Nov 16, 2013 00:20
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http://www.batoto.net/read/_/206363/tower-of-god_v2_ch86_by_the-company Company translation is up, seems a bit easier to understand.
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Nov 16, 2013 23:30
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Brave GNU World posted:The princesses aren't Zahard's actual children, it's just a title for people chosen by Zahard to inherit a bit of his power. The point is they can't inherit his power if he's dead.
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Nov 16, 2013 23:32
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