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The actual Char figure in G Gundam is Master Asia.
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Nov 9, 2013 23:23
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ImpAtom posted:Char's a pitiable character because in another world, with less hosed up people, he could have done something amazing. On the other hand, in this hypothetical world Amuro probably would have stayed a bitter kid with family issues. So you win some, you lose some as far as legendary figures go.
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Nov 9, 2013 23:25
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Mecha Gojira posted:Quattro wasn't about forging a new identity and trying to find his own path; it was him running away from his responsibilities. Char truly believes in his father's ideology and believes in forging the path for the Newtypes to flourish, but as Quattro he can't do that. He's "just a pilot." He gets bossed around by bureaucrats and corporate executives. By not once again taking up the mantle of Char/Casval and taking responsibility himself, he's basically betraying himself and his ideals. In Zeta he is repeatedly called a coward for this. Yeah, Char's whole thing is that by the end of Zeta, and in CCA, he's accepted all the "versions" of himself rather than perpetually forming new identities to run away from his responsibilities. mr. stefan posted:Compare Amuro, who pretty much casts off his ties to the past at basically every turn and refuses to impose his will upon those who follow after him, and as a result actually inspires people to transcend being mere humans at the very end (his choice to sacrifice his life leading both Neo Zeon and Londo Bell forces to join together, creating the psychoframe energy field that pushes Axis back,) as opposed to Char's method just leading into the same cycle that has been happening all along despite his claims to the contrary. I don't think Char's success would have necessarily solved the underlying issues of the Universal Century, but that scene you're talking about is depressing as hell. Like - how does Amuro even "inspire" all those cats? By trying to push back an asteroid falling to Earth in a goddamn mobile suit. It's a suicidal act that maintains a broken status quo and it can't really change anything in the long term (see: Victory Gundam). Amuro has the same problem as Quattro in that he's "just" a pilot.
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Nov 9, 2013 23:29
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BlitzBlast posted:On the other hand, in this hypothetical world Amuro probably would have stayed a bitter kid with family issues. So you win some, you lose some as far as legendary figures go. I don't know, Amuro was a bitter kid with parental issues but he probably would have grown up to be a successful toy maker and marry Fraw or something without the outside influence. He'd probably have been overall happier than he even was as as ace Newtype pilot. It's hard to argue that anyone came off particularly 'better' from their time during the OYW. Maybe Kai, who actually got a pretty good dose of maturity, and ended up being the only guy from the White Base combat crew not to end up dying in battle at some point.
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Nov 9, 2013 23:43
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There's the chef. Without the OYW he would have never gotten that salt.
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Nov 9, 2013 23:49
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I like to believe Job John went on to have a happy fulfilling life after his time on the White Base.
Ethiser fucked around with this message at 23:57 on Nov 9, 2013 |
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Nov 9, 2013 23:50
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Oh yeah. The good people at Anaheim definitely seemed to prosper.
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Nov 9, 2013 23:56
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Raku posted:There's the chef. Without the OYW he would have never gotten that salt. I'm pretty sure that character disappears for a while and is replaced with a machine. A delicious hamburger vending machine. He was probably gunned down by one of Ramba Ral's commandos.
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Nov 9, 2013 23:59
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Without the OYW, Bright would never have gotten a delicious hamburger. The same can be said for Bernie.
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Nov 10, 2013 00:03
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Ethiser posted:I like to believe Job John went on to have a happy fulfilling life after his time on the White Base. He at least lives into the 0120s, working with SNRI on the Formula project. It's better than most of them can say.
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Nov 10, 2013 00:49
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The Chef is my favourite pointless peripheral character in MSG. Job John seems like a character they had planned more detail for, but had to sideline for time.
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Nov 10, 2013 01:02
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Hey so I'm playing Zeonic Front and it's pretty cool. Like a clunkier, smaller-scale Heavy Gear 2. Can someone tell me how to in the route planner make someone stop at a point and wait for a battle code before continuing? It happens some in the default routes but I don't know how to reproduce it.
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Nov 10, 2013 02:02
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On the subject of Char, I'm reminded of this picture I keep seeing pop up when people talk about him being different in CCA:
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Nov 10, 2013 02:27
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I'm Watching ZZ and they just made a joke about a zeon soldier wanting to flog an attractive female prisoner. That's pretty dark for such a throw away joke...
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Nov 10, 2013 02:35
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I just finished watching ZZ Gundam and it is a gigantic mess. Naïve rookie Glemy inexplicably leaps from his first fudged mission into a command chair and stares creepily at his vats of naked tweens. Villain characters disappear for half the season and Haman, the main villain gets a mere handful of appearances. I couldn't tell you what the neo-Zeon plans were. It seemed like deploy -> hobnob -> retreat to space. At least the protagonists know where they are going. Also the character designs were baffling after the restraint of the first two gundam series. I guess Yoshikazu Yasuhiko took a sabbatical. Is there a story about why Char and Amuro are absent from the series? I read somewhere it was because CCA got the green light, but that shouldn't prevent them from turning up. Characters keep mentioning them too.
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Nov 10, 2013 08:44
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None of the character designs I've ever seen for ZZ seem any more odd to me than the kind of weirdos in 0079, Char and Kycilia leaping immediately to mind for instance.
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Nov 10, 2013 08:48
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The main issue with ZZ is the tonal shift. Not the one from Zeta to ZZ, but the one in ZZ itself. I still clearly remember the scene where Judau is about to finish off an enemy, but stops when he hears the pilot crying to his mother. Said enemy pilot is part of Mashmyre's crew, and prior to this episode something like this would be entirely expected and played completely straight. But this time, the pilot sneers and reveals this was all a part of his plan to catch Judau off guard! The whiplash is ridiculous, and the fact that the episode it happens in (Sorrowful Cecilia IIRC) is as overly dramatic as hell only exacerbates matters. It's entirely possible (and interesting!) to have a light-hearted show steadily grim up, but ZZ utterly failed on the "steadily" part. And this cripples it, because the majority of the first half of the show ends up as entirely incompatible with the second half, leading to weird stuff like Glemy's sudden character shift (yet he's still in love with Roux because) and Mashmyre's sudden death. BlitzBlast fucked around with this message at 09:00 on Nov 10, 2013 |
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Nov 10, 2013 08:56
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Raku posted:Oh yeah. The good people at Anaheim definitely seemed to prosper. I guess that makes Anaheim Bandai.
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Nov 10, 2013 09:19
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Maarak posted:I guess that makes Anaheim Bandai. A big company that routinely manipulates both sides of a war to sell more mobile suits? Why, I never
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Nov 10, 2013 16:03
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BlitzBlast posted:The main issue with ZZ is the tonal shift. Not the one from Zeta to ZZ, but the one in ZZ itself. To add to this: Sorrowful Cecilia is one of the few tragic moments in Gundam that moved me, and it is right in the middle of the silly as heck first arcs of ZZ.
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Nov 10, 2013 16:35
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BlitzBlast posted:weird stuff like Glemy's sudden character shift (yet he's still in love with Roux because) Honestly, I maintain that he was the same creepy bastard all the way through. His attachment to Roux always seemed less like your common-or-garden affection and more like this creepy, entitled rich-boy possessiveness that foreshadowed his greed in all other aspects. Particularly  was the bit where he explained his attempt to murder Roux with "My mama once told me... that to be a man I must prove my aggressiveness to a woman." He's a guy who's been handed the world on a silver platter (particularly evidenced when he gets a command role through nothing but money and nepotism), and he thinks that he deserves the best possible girlfriend as well, whether she wants him or not.
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Nov 10, 2013 20:54
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Midjack posted:If you go for the earlier Battle games on PSP seriously just get Universe. I've played them all chronologically and I can tell you that each game includes everything from all the previous games in the series and adds more missions, factions, suits, and pilots; there is no reason to play the earlier games.  
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Nov 10, 2013 23:47
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Hell yeah. We may have to try some ad hoc party soon.
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Nov 11, 2013 01:09
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tsob posted:None of the character designs I've ever seen for ZZ seem any more odd to me than the kind of weirdos in 0079, Char and Kycilia leaping immediately to mind for instance. Those masks were stupid, but they were space-stupid, timelessly stupid. Not 'it's the 80's' stupid. The character designs in ZZ have aged like a sideways ponytail.
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Nov 11, 2013 02:46
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I can deal with a lot of ZZ Gundam but I hate Beecha more than almost any main Gundam character and certainly more than anyone else in the UC. He is just The Worst.
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Nov 11, 2013 04:43
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Not sure if. I should ask this here or the the Build Fighter thread itself, but how has the show been so far? If it's good I wouldn't mind picking up another series to follow.
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Nov 11, 2013 04:48
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Pureauthor posted:Not sure if. I should ask this here or the the Build Fighter thread itself, but how has the show been so far? If it's good I wouldn't mind picking up another series to follow.
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Nov 11, 2013 04:53
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Pureauthor posted:Not sure if. I should ask this here or the the Build Fighter thread itself, but how has the show been so far? If it's good I wouldn't mind picking up another series to follow. It is actually pretty decent! The fights are slick, the references are amusing withing being blatant about them, and the show knows when to be goofy. There are also hints that it will get crazy down the line. Definitely worth checking out.
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Nov 11, 2013 04:55
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Pureauthor posted:Not sure if. I should ask this here or the the Build Fighter thread itself, but how has the show been so far? If it's good I wouldn't mind picking up another series to follow. It's fun but extremely lighthearted and simple. There's nice animation and a lot of cute in-jokes but it's exactly what you expect from the concept. Basically the worst thing I can say about it is that it ain't exactly got a stellar treatment of its female cast so far, although it's (obviously) a step up from Age.
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Nov 11, 2013 05:04
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ImpAtom posted:It's fun but extremely lighthearted and simple. There's nice animation and a lot of cute in-jokes but it's exactly what you expect from the concept. Basically the worst thing I can say about it is that it ain't exactly got a stellar treatment of its female cast so far, although it's (obviously) a step up from Age.
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Nov 11, 2013 05:09
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ImpAtom posted:It's fun but extremely lighthearted and simple. There's nice animation and a lot of cute in-jokes but it's exactly what you expect from the concept. Basically the worst thing I can say about it is that it ain't exactly got a stellar treatment of its female cast so far, although it's (obviously) a step up from Age. As a fellow AGE survivor I gotta agree, it is certainly leaps and bounds ahead of AGE. It's basically the show AGE should have been. No idea how well it's doing but it's almost certainly doing a better job with the target demographic than AGE did (I have heard that the Gyan model kits sold out? It was a rumor so I'm not sure if that's true, but that would be neat if it were the case).
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Nov 11, 2013 05:11
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Pureauthor posted:Not sure if. I should ask this here or the the Build Fighter thread itself, but how has the show been so far? If it's good I wouldn't mind picking up another series to follow. It is a really fun show. Far from anime of the season, but the music is great, the battle choreography is miraculous after AGE, and there are in-jokes abound for all the hardcore Gundam fans. Really consistent quality too; out of the five currently released episodes, only episode 4 was kind of eh. Srice posted:No idea how well it's doing but it's almost certainly doing a better job with the target demographic than AGE did Since it's available online, TV ratings are pretty low (~1.4% or so?). Kids are actually watching it though, so big step up from AGE. And the main thing Bandai cares about is toy sales, and BF is doing marvelous at promoting that.
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Nov 11, 2013 05:12
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Srice posted:As a fellow AGE survivor I gotta agree, it is certainly leaps and bounds ahead of AGE. I'm honestly curious to hear how it is doing. The word on the early ratings is that they are rock-bottom but the sources I've seen for that are a little iffy (mostly internet postings) so it's hard to tell exactly, but if they're accurate it's actually bombing with kids. (A tremendous dropoff in kid viewers after the first episode, almost to the point of being nonexistant in episode 2). Instead it is mostly popular with 20-40 year old males. The actual television ratings are sub-Age but may be influenced by it being more widely available online. (Age was also available online though so it's hard to tell.) The toy sales appear to be pretty good though.
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Nov 11, 2013 05:13
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ImpAtom posted:I can deal with a lot of ZZ Gundam but I hate Beecha more than almost any main Gundam character and certainly more than anyone else in the UC. He is just The Worst. I'm almost done watching ZZ and this is the first time I've watched it, I was pretty disappointed they didn't just kick Beecha and Mondo off the ship after they kept running away and joining Neo-Zeon or whatever or causing the ship to be in direct danger. Are those two even newtypes??
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Nov 11, 2013 07:30
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BlitzBlast posted:The main issue with ZZ is the tonal shift. Not the one from Zeta to ZZ, but the one in ZZ itself. Glemy catapults into a command chair because he's a spoiled little rich kid with connections that matter. This spoiled "gently caress everyone I want it my way" thing with him is actually consistent across his entire character arc. He simply believes that he is above other people and he should be able to use and discard humans the way he wants. This is why he tries to rule Neo Zeon. It's also why he crushes on Roux(she's a pretty, smart, capable lady who doesn't immediately fall over herself to do his bidding) and why he makes an army of Puru clones to throw away into a meatgrinder without batting an eyelash. ZZ actually grims up rather steadily. Moon Moon is the high water mark of wacky hijinx and it fades away after that. You still have goofy slapstick and OH LORDY BEECHA STOLE SOMETHING IMPORTANT AGAIN idiocy but the main thrust of the plot moves beyond the "Judau trying to steal the Z Gundam to sell it for parts to fund his gang of feral children" phase permanently. It's still a little rocky but it's not THAT bad. Also Mashmyre's death is totally in character for his Haman-sama banzai attitude.
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Nov 11, 2013 07:45
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Pureauthor posted:Not sure if. I should ask this here or the the Build Fighter thread itself, but how has the show been so far? If it's good I wouldn't mind picking up another series to follow. Just to chip in, I think Build Fighters is the best Gundam product produced since the move to digital animation that started with seed (So basically post Turn A). Its very different from a traditional Gundam show, but I honestly can't say that is a bad thing. Sunrise has had a huge problem that they really, really want to remake the same thing over and over. SEED, 00 season 2 (even season 1 has similarities to wing), lovely, lovely age. These shows are constantly trying to be 'Gundam', to touch on some of the same plot points act in a certain way and so forth. Build Fighters... isn't. The closest thing it is imitating would be G Gundam, but even that isn't really a good comparison. It has its own plot, its own characters and most importantly its own themes. In Build Fighters war isn't hell, there aren't female characters introduced solely to die tragic deaths or humanize the pilots. Its light hearted Shonen fun about believing in your dreams, working to achieve them and trusting in the strength of yourself and your friends. And the part that really does it, at least for me is that it still calls back to older Gundam shows, but it does so in intelligent ways. The diologue references concepts from previous Gundam shows, such as the Flanegan institute, but doesn't beat you over the head with them. I really could go on, but basically, if you like Gundam you will probably like Build Fighters. Well written, well directed, animated and everything else.
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Nov 11, 2013 07:49
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Stalin-Chan posted:Are those two even newtypes?? No. Would that make it better?
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Nov 11, 2013 08:00
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Kanos posted:Glemy catapults into a command chair because he's a spoiled little rich kid with connections that matter. Glemy is a romantic rookie one episode and a schemer with his own ship and a vat of clones the next. You can not seriously say that is in any way a smooth character progression. quote:It's still a little rocky but it's not THAT bad. I personally think it is (Sorrowful Cecilia is a massive drama bomb that immediately follows Judau's first trip to Axis, where among other silly things, there is a wacky chase scene), but this is subjective so no point arguing it. quote:Also Mashmyre's death is totally in character for his Haman-sama banzai attitude. I'm not talking about how he died, I'm talking about how his character was handled. He starts the show as the main reoccurring villain, vanishes for like 35 episodes, then reappears and is immediately killed. It's incredibly shoddy and reeks of "okay the tone of the show shifted, now what do we do with this guy?"
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Nov 11, 2013 10:05
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All you need to know about Gundam Build Fighters is that kids are being exposed to, in chronological order of kit release: Wing, Double X, Victory, F91 and V2. Sure, all of us here know these suits but these kids just getting into Gundam are getting the full old Gundam and Ramba Ral experience.
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Nov 11, 2013 10:42
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BlitzBlast posted:Glemy is a romantic rookie one episode and a schemer with his own ship and a vat of clones the next. You can not seriously say that is in any way a smooth character progression. You're largely right. I tend to forgive a lot of ZZ's sins because ultimately I like the show despite its problems and am too used to people bashing on it like it's the UC Gundam AGE or something instead of actually providing reasoned criticism like you are.  Glemy and Mashmyre's transformations are two of the worst handled aspects of the show. Both of them can easily be explained away and/or inferred in ways that make perfect sense and are totally internally consistent(Glemy is promoted through nepotism, Mashmyre vanishes for a while because he's being made into a cyber newtype with Chara), but the show does a really goddamned terrible job of actually showing what happened. This leads to awkwardness like Mashmyre being a bumbling comic relief idiot, disappearing, and returning as a serious threat and Glemy appearing as a bright-eyed rookie and then reappearing as a scheming political operator. Both characters would have worked out a lot better if their first appearance roles were filled by different characters entirely.
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Nov 11, 2013 16:42
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