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Everything is viable in Deus Ex, skills and augs are completely optional and only serve to make the game easier. You can finish the game without skills, augs or items. Running through the game using a combat build is actually pretty easy compared to the vanilla 'stealthy hacker/sniper' build most people go for. Blasting everyone in the face is a legitimate tactic.
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Jan 15, 2014 21:45
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Especially if you dump all your mods into the combat shotgun or assault rifle. Perfect-accuracy buckshot and armor-piercing slug rounds fired as fast as you can blink with a clip so deep you only need to reload once in a MISSION? Yes please  That said, much though I love it, Deus Ex has some of the dorkiest-looking guns in existence. The assault rifle in particular is a spectacularly ugly-looking weapon.
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Jan 15, 2014 21:52
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Incidentally Bobbin, what style will you be playing given there's so much potential variation. I was always cyber-Garrett myself  , but a blunt force approach does sound fun.Dammit, I'm going to install it, aren't I?
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Jan 15, 2014 22:12
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Agent Interrobang posted:Especially if you dump all your mods into the combat shotgun or assault rifle. Perfect-accuracy buckshot and armor-piercing slug rounds fired as fast as you can blink with a clip so deep you only need to reload once in a MISSION? Yes please Yeah, the assault rifle always puts me in mind of a child's toy that'd shoot bubbles when you pulled the trigger.
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Jan 15, 2014 22:13
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Agent Interrobang posted:That said, much though I love it, Deus Ex has some of the dorkiest-looking guns in existence. The assault rifle in particular is a spectacularly ugly-looking weapon. I can't wait till we get the dragon's tooth. It is the silliest god-drat thing and yet it manages to be one of the best weapons in the game.
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Jan 15, 2014 22:22
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I just installed Biomod and maxed out the athletics skill and put a point in computers. I'll see you slow, non ledge vaulting chumps at the finish line. 
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Jan 15, 2014 22:25
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Diogenes Bub posted:Incidentally Bobbin, what style will you be playing given there's so much potential variation. I was always cyber-Garrett myself Much like in Alpha Protocol, even though overt force was always an option it always felt somehow wrong to me. It's just so much more rewarding to sneak your way through and pull off sneaky spy stuff, saving the heavy combat for when you either decided the guys you were up against needed to die or you messed up and had to shoot your way out.
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Jan 15, 2014 22:33
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Night10194 posted:Much like in Alpha Protocol, even though overt force was always an option it always felt somehow wrong to me. It's just so much more rewarding to sneak your way through and pull off sneaky spy stuff, saving the heavy combat for when you either decided the guys you were up against needed to die or you messed up and had to shoot your way out. A shotgun/smg run of Alpha Protocol is really cathartic if done after a ghost run. Feels good, man.
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Jan 15, 2014 23:06
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Pvt.Scott posted:A shotgun/smg run of Alpha Protocol is really cathartic if done after a ghost run. Feels good, man. Murderous Mike is the only way to Alpha Protocol. 
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Jan 16, 2014 00:04
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Soricidus posted:Okay, that's me out. Is there anyone left in the thread who hasn't learned something new yet? I'm in. the laser-beam-blocking thing is kinda spotty though, since just like the gas grenades the clouds of gas slowly move away. And yes, Shotgun rear end in a top hat Mike Thorton is awesome.
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Jan 16, 2014 00:26
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You actually can overhear a phone conversation between Simons and Page the second time you go to NY, when it's under martial law. It's tough to do though. You have to injure the journalist at the free clinic, then hope he follows the path he's programmed with that leads you to the payphone with the secret conversation.
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Jan 16, 2014 00:27
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I never got around to quite fully beating Dues Ex. My first memories of the game are playing the Demo, Tutorial with my brother watching, and getting my legs blown off because I tried to use an explosive barrel as cover  If he's technically invincible during the training like Bobbin says, perhaps it was either different in the Demo, or that's why I survived eating an exploding barrel face first even if I was crawling along after.I keep tending to be as obsessively sneaky as ninja as possible (with a trail of as many looted baton or ninja execution takedowns as possible)... Aside from my obsessive LAM hoarding to deal with doors I'm too lazy to crack more subtly, and robots I can't conveniently hack or sneak past. Good lord I wish the cool looking mini-crossbow wasn't garbage for the kinder, gentler takedown intentions Paul gave it to you for. "Sweet, I shot them in the skull with a knockout dart... Oh, he's going to scream, sprint to the alarm, and shoot at me alerting everyone in the map before falling unconscious thirty seconds later" 
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Jan 16, 2014 00:35
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Section Z posted:I never got around to quite fully beating Dues Ex. My first memories of the game are playing the Demo, Tutorial with my brother watching, and getting my legs blown off because I tried to use an explosive barrel as cover SuperNano THC only works so fast.  E: I find it silly that a super powered neo-man can render dozens of men harmlessly unconscious with blunt force trauma. Less lethal does not mean non-lethal. Hell, the tranqs probably kill half the guys die to improper dosage and complications. Pvt.Scott fucked around with this message at 01:03 on Jan 16, 2014 |
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Jan 16, 2014 01:00
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I remember when they released the multiplayer patch for DX. Even on 56k it was tons of fun! If I remember correctly my friends and I were all pretty hooked on Unreal Tournament at the time and only got a few good days of DXMP. I've enjoyed all of your other LPs Bobbin and this one has been no exception. Literary Corner was pretty cool. Keep up the good work! FactsAreUseless posted:You actually can overhear a phone conversation between Simons and Page the second time you go to NY, when it's under martial law. It's tough to do though. You have to injure the journalist at the free clinic, then hope he follows the path he's programmed with that leads you to the payphone with the secret conversation. Is he telling Simons how to resurrect Aerith
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Jan 16, 2014 01:54
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You know, I completely missed the parenthesis, as I am a huge moron.
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Jan 16, 2014 01:54
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Wait, so I'm not the only one here who actually played the Multiplayer? Awesome, yet hilarious.
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Jan 16, 2014 02:04
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Benny D posted:Is he telling Simons how to resurrect Aerith Edit: Vandenberg?
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Jan 16, 2014 02:07
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FactsAreUseless posted:No, they're discussing Vandenburg. No, Savage. 
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Jan 16, 2014 02:31
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You can't even use the PS20 to open things. It just tends to blow your legs off/set you on fire instead. Also, vanilla DX doesn't let you carry more than one. It also doesn't let you carry more than one LAW. Shifter/Biomod relaxes this, which makes for a fun bit much later on in the game where it gives you easy access to about five of them and a handy rooftop to go hog wild from and rain fiery death on things below. FactsAreUseless posted:Edit: Vandenberg? No. Savage. [ED] DAMMIT
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Jan 16, 2014 02:31
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No one can ever escape this. No matter how hard they try. And Lord knows I have tried.
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Jan 16, 2014 02:34
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I liked the no-stacking on the PS20 and the LAW. It encouraged you to use them, because it was impossible to stockpile. Got a LAW? Found another one? Go find a bot or camera or something. BOOM! Okay, now grab the new one you found. The LAW wasn't the strongest your rockets could get, I don't think- at mastered Heavy your regular GEP rockets did more- but they had an insane blast radius, I remember. It's very hard to not get damaged by the drat things unless you were very, very far away.
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Jan 16, 2014 03:00
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I've watched this so many times that it was actually weird to see the original opening in the LP.
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Jan 16, 2014 04:35
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I'm starting a "what have we learned" post. How would you guys want it sorted? By person? By discovery? By map? By thread page?
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Jan 16, 2014 06:01
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No Gravitas posted:I'm starting a "what have we learned" post. I think by map would work well. Easiest to keep in line with the LP, too.
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Jan 16, 2014 06:29
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Map, yeah. It was fun counting the "This loving game..." utterances in the Alpha Protocol thread for a while, heh. This should be a fun learning experience, especially in places like Hell's Kitchen and La Guardia.
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Jan 16, 2014 06:57
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Man, I love this game. I must have played through it a dozen plus times and there's still a poo poo ton of stuff I'd totally missed. Depth like that really is the sign of a well designed game. I really like the lecture type deals, lots of stuff I didn't know. I'll defiantly be watching this. On Liberty Island I always lured the baddies into the friendly mechs. Watching them get gunned down really appealed to me on a base level. 
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Jan 16, 2014 06:57
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bman in 2288 posted:Wait, so I'm not the only one here who actually played the Multiplayer? Awesome, yet hilarious. ...maybe you're both my RL friends 
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Jan 16, 2014 07:22
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Ok, if you want to become a crazed bionic murder-fiend, perform the following steps. 1. Install Biomod, then create a new JC Denton. Max out athletics and put the rest of your points in simple weapons. 2. Get the GEP. Grab a crowbar. With max athletics, you run fast enough to get into melee range of the NSF and mercs before they can turn around and bring weapons to bear. 3. Sprint around clubbing people in the head for mondo damage. If the first hit doesn't do it, hit them again! Don't worry, as long as you keep hitting them, they'll never get to fire at you. 4. Blow up the robot with the GEP. 5. For groups of enemies near one another, strike hard and fast. If needed, use enemies as cover while maneuvering to strike. 6. GOTO 1 That has to be my fastest clear time of Liberty Island. It was 5-10 minutes of "...some guy in a coat?" followed by the satisfying clank of iron on bone.
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Jan 16, 2014 08:03
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The 'get out of here Denton' remains awesome.
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Jan 16, 2014 10:00
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KillHour posted:I'm probably one of the biggest DX nerds on the planet (I actually played DX multiplayer - on 56k). So did I! Some servers had some really fun mods running.
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Jan 16, 2014 10:15
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VodeAndreas posted:So did I! Some servers had some really fun mods running. Too bad some of those mods were like 10 goddamn megabytes.
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Jan 16, 2014 17:58
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Apropos of nothing I'd like to submit my defenses of both Environmental Training and Swimming. Swimming is useful to have at least one rank in, because it's dirt cheap for starters. Seriously, some objectives give you enough SP in one go to knock out the 675 required to take swimming to Trained, and there are several passages in the game designed nearly explicitly to kill or heavily damage untrained swimmers. The swim speed isn't that great, but the reduction in O2 is significant enough to make lots of things easier and less nail-biting. And really, if you're being thorough, you'll get tons of SP anyways, dropping 675 in swimming is hardly breaking the bank, especially if you're doing the pistol cheat to begin with. Environmental Training is even easier, I think, despite the increased cost, for two simple words: Thermoptic Camo. Long, LONG before it's feasible to have both Cloak and Radar Transparency at once, a little bit of Enviro training and a little bit of hoarding can give you an instant "Ger out of jail free" card. Untrained, thermoptic camo barely lasts into two digits' worth of seconds. Just bumping it to Trained gives you enough time to get to or from wherever you need to be, and advancing past that basically turns you into Major Kusanagi from Ghost in the Shell. Add to that, the simple fact that having your one use items work longer (rebreather, cloak) and absorb more damage (Hazmat Suit, Bulletproof Vest) it's a pretty easy justification skillpoint-wise.
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Jan 16, 2014 18:49
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Any damage you take from one of the extraordinarily rare long swimming sections can be healed up with points put in something more useful, like medicine. Or just finding a handy medbot. As an example, even on Liberty Island a couple of the underwater bits can go long with untrained swimming skills. You're about 90 seconds walk from a medbot. Who cares. Basically anytime you think about putting points in swimming you can put points in another skill which will effectively make swimming irrelevant and help you out for the other 99.98% of the game you aren't poking around in a sunken freighter.
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Jan 16, 2014 19:28
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GetWellGamers posted:Environmental Training is even easier, I think, despite the increased cost, for two simple words: Thermoptic Camo. Long, LONG before it's feasible to have both Cloak and Radar Transparency at once, a little bit of Enviro training and a little bit of hoarding can give you an instant "Ger out of jail free" card. Untrained, thermoptic camo barely lasts into two digits' worth of seconds. Just bumping it to Trained gives you enough time to get to or from wherever you need to be, and advancing past that basically turns you into Major Kusanagi from Ghost in the Shell. Add to that, the simple fact that having your one use items work longer (rebreather, cloak) and absorb more damage (Hazmat Suit, Bulletproof Vest) it's a pretty easy justification skillpoint-wise. I'm not sure which if any mod does this, but if the ET items could simply stack into piles rather than taking up one square each and/or if they could be deactivated when you no longer wish to use them, I could justify getting the skill that makes them better. As it is, inventory space is always at a premium and I've already said I'm too stuck in my ways to get a gameplay mod now, so no ET it is.
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Jan 16, 2014 20:05
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There's enough swimming in the game that I've found it worthwhile to put a point into Trained. Sure you can get around it, but the same goes for all your skills. It's worth getting pretty much all of the utility skills up to Trained, but the returns start to taper off pretty quickly. Going from 10% lockpicking to 25% is huge, going from 25 to 40 not so much. Environmental is unique in that it has increasing returns, so you're going to want to go to Advanced or Master if you like consumables or just leave it at Untrained if you don't. Computers don't matter after Trained; it's more a question of convenience since you're going to be doing a LOT of hacking.
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Jan 16, 2014 20:24
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Bobbin Threadbare posted:I'm not sure which if any mod does this, but if the ET items could simply stack into piles rather than taking up one square each and/or if they could be deactivated when you no longer wish to use them, I could justify getting the skill that makes them better. As it is, inventory space is always at a premium and I've already said I'm too stuck in my ways to get a gameplay mod now, so no ET it is. Psion posted:As an example, even on Liberty Island a couple of the underwater bits can go long with untrained swimming skills. You're about 90 seconds walk from a medbot. Who cares.
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Jan 16, 2014 20:32
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Yeah I usually like one point in swimming, just to make places like the canals more pleasant. It's a significant difference for a few points that probably won't make or break buying any really expensive upgrades. I tend to just ignore health and environment skills though and use the implants for healing when necessary. (and usually I don't even use things like hazmat suits or cloaks) Lockpicking and multitool skills are good to put a couple levels into each - though if you know where stuff is you'll be overflowing with those by endgame if you do this. The only things really worthwhile going full master on are weapon skills in my opinion. If I remember correctly there are enough points that you can max out two of them while still putting a lot into other things, but I like to go Advanced on pistols early game, then Master rifles later. That's part of the reason I think the silenced pistol is trash - if you slap a scope on a normal pistol and go Trained or Advanced immediately you can sit far enough away from enemies that your gunshots won't even alert anyone else unless they see the guy die. (and if they do they probably won't even find you anyway)
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Jan 16, 2014 20:40
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Hermetian posted:Computers don't matter after Trained; it's more a question of convenience since you're going to be doing a LOT of hacking. I like to take computers to advanced mostly because I like reading the fluff and Trained doesn't give me enough time to read carefully. I won't deny it's a non-optimal use of skill points as far as beating the game goes, but I've played this thing enough that being able to win isn't an issue anymore.
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Jan 16, 2014 20:42
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Xander77 posted:Being able to turn usable items on and off as needed is one of the best Biomod changes. By the time medkits stop being given out like candy, bio-electric cells are, and for all practical purposes those are medkits too at that stage of the game unless you are deliberately picking the worst augs ever. It's not a huge deal.
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Jan 16, 2014 20:44
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Mzbundifund posted:I like to take computers to advanced mostly because I like reading the fluff and Trained doesn't give me enough time to read carefully. I won't deny it's a non-optimal use of skill points as far as beating the game goes, but I've played this thing enough that being able to win isn't an issue anymore. Don't you need advanced to control turrets? It might not be the most optimal use of xp, but come on, nothing spices up a hacker run as much as watching mooks get slaughtered through the camera view.
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Jan 16, 2014 23:55
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