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I think I'll be joining the "reinstalling/replaying because of this thread" crew, I was playing Human Revolution but I'll put that on hold for now.
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Feb 10, 2014 19:32
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There aren't exactly cures or vaccines, but there are treatments that after infection, can retard the chances of the virus itself infecting the host, like Post-exposure prophylaxis (It is in no way a HIV morning after pill given the several side effects and how long the procedure is). Not to mention around 2012-2013, a lot of progress has been made in terms of treatments and if anything, there are some very early treatments that could be considered to be HIV vaccines. However it's on very early stages/the treatment has to be constant and expensive, so I wouldn't exactly call it a cure for now. However, there's a silver lining to finding out such beasts: We can heavily reprogram them to attack cancerous cells and in fact be able to use is as a very effective treatment. Given it's a very effective treatment to something that makes part of you revolt, the treatment itself attacks the body in such a way that it can almost kill you. To the point that even GE advertising it has to tell you that even on hopeful vids. Kunster fucked around with this message at 23:49 on Feb 10, 2014 |
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Feb 10, 2014 19:37
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The ATMs in Hell's Kitchen are strange (at least on the first visit). In my recent playthrough, I found two account/PIN combos. One in the 'ton, and one on Smuggler's computer. Strangely enough, both of them are for the ATM in the subway. I tried both on the ATM in the 'Ton, they didn't work. Same for the ones in the bar (although I tried that after emptying them out in the subway). Anyone have any insight on if you can find numbers for the other ATMs?
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Feb 10, 2014 21:02
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AugmentedVision posted:The ATMs in Hell's Kitchen are strange (at least on the first visit). In my recent playthrough, I found two account/PIN combos. One in the 'ton, and one on Smuggler's computer. Strangely enough, both of them are for the ATM in the subway. I tried both on the ATM in the 'Ton, they didn't work. Same for the ones in the bar (although I tried that after emptying them out in the subway). Anyone have any insight on if you can find numbers for the other ATMs? That is strange, because the one I found in the 'Ton is the one I experimented with by using it in the 'Ton ATM (specifically when I said the code got me 100 and then hacking got me 232 vs. hacking first getting me 332). Are you sure you aren't thinking of the one that's in the alley between the 'Ton and the bar?
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Feb 10, 2014 21:17
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Goddamn the world in Deus Ex is a hellhole. Everyone is poor, everyone is sick, there's gunfights with secessionists in the middle of New York and nobody is even surprised.
DatonKallandor fucked around with this message at 21:38 on Feb 10, 2014 |
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Feb 10, 2014 21:34
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Bobbin Threadbare posted:That is strange, because the one I found in the 'Ton is the one I experimented with by using it in the 'Ton ATM (specifically when I said the code got me 100 and then hacking got me 232 vs. hacking first getting me 332). Are you sure you aren't thinking of the one that's in the alley between the 'Ton and the bar? Yep, I just double checked (with a save starting at Battery Park, so Hell's Kitchen was in a "fresh" state), and the info you find behind the plant inside the 'Ton (543654/5544) does NOT work on the 'Ton ATM. Must be a Shifter or a difficulty setting thing -- I'm using Shifter and playing on Realistic.
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Feb 10, 2014 21:39
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I'll confess, I thought "Tenderloin Clinic" was a joke about them mostly dealing with cases of the clap. And I've had the NSF try and kill the hostages before. Must be either because I went in non-lethally, or a Shifter/Biomod thing. Do anti-vaxxers also object to mercury fillings? I know some places have banned them, but mostly on environmental grounds rather than public safety.
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Feb 10, 2014 21:42
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Prenton posted:I'll confess, I thought "Tenderloin Clinic" was a joke about them mostly dealing with cases of the clap. And I've had the NSF try and kill the hostages before. Must be either because I went in non-lethally, or a Shifter/Biomod thing. I've had NSF go for the hostages on a vanilla playthrough. I think they are probably just hostile to both you and the hostages, and will shoot at either you or them depending on a bunch of AI factors. It's definitely possible to fail and have the NSF kill the hostages. The trooper out front gives you poo poo for it if you do. AugmentedVision fucked around with this message at 22:05 on Feb 10, 2014 |
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Feb 10, 2014 21:45
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Anti-vaxxers are sadly misinformed, and their kids are paying the price for it. I can't remember right now, but there are some preventable diseases that haven't been seen in years coming back because of it. Here, have some depressing statistics from the CDC dated the week of Feb 1, 2014. Dreadwroth fucked around with this message at 22:15 on Feb 10, 2014 |
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Feb 10, 2014 22:08
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AugmentedVision posted:I've had NSF go for the hostages on a vanilla playthrough. I think they are probably just hostile to both you and the hostages, and will shoot at either you or them depending on a bunch of AI factors. My guess is that JC holds the priority so long as you make yourself an obvious target, and will only attack the hostages if you try to duck away or use thermoptic camo to turn invisible.
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Feb 10, 2014 22:48
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The name Hippolyta Hall is a reference to a character in the Sandman comics. Anybody know if the other names in the 'Ton register are from something?
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Feb 10, 2014 23:33
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"Gully Foyle is my name And Terra is my nation Deep space is my dwelling place The stars my destination" And Oberst Enzian is from Gravity's Rainbow, by Pynchon. Though a character from The Crying of Lot 49 would be more appropriate for the game. "Mucho" Maas is just there, waiting to be scrawled in a flophouse register. Also, I'm not sure we can say with certainty if Kevorkian still advocates euthanasia to this day, as he is dead himself.
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Feb 10, 2014 23:39
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paragon1 posted:The name Hippolyta Hall is a reference to a character in the Sandman comics. Anybody know if the other names in the 'Ton register are from something? Gabriel Syme is a character from the book "The Man who was Thursday" by G.K. Chesterton, excerpts of which can be found throughout the game
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Feb 10, 2014 23:39
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I'm on the autism spectrum and I have to say that I had a strong personal reaction to the end of the science corner there. gently caress disease, bring on the autism. Being unable to make a phone call without sweating bullets, making strange sounds and gestures that make people wonder, having a hard time coping without a literal purple security blanket in my backpack at all times and having no friends at the age of 27 is nothing compared to smallpox. Vax away! Thankfully the two are unrelated and we have have our cake and eat it too. Yay! (Well, at least the rest of you can, but you know what I mean. Don't invite me over, I will eat too much cake because I have no idea how much cake should I eat to not offend the host. It is not likely to be durian cake anyway, so no big loss for me there.) Also: I read that GKC book. I liked it, at least until the final chapter or two when it went crazy religious. I think it is a good read, although in my opinion it has a very high rate of diminishing returns on every chapter. Read the first three and give it a rest after that, maybe. Since GKC is long dead, you can get the book here: http://www.gutenberg.org/ebooks/1695 If only Gabriel's Shadow was a real book too!
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Feb 10, 2014 23:52
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paragon1 posted:The name Hippolyta Hall is a reference to a character in the Sandman comics. Anybody know if the other names in the 'Ton register are from something? Smila Jasperson is a misspelling of the title character from Miss Smilla's Feeling For Snow.
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Feb 10, 2014 23:54
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What is with the references to John? The pad left by Paul, presumably for us, and also the email Jaime sent to Paul's account, also presumably for us, which is weird, both were addressed to John, not JC.
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Feb 11, 2014 00:01
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counterfeitsaint posted:What is with the references to John? The pad left by Paul, presumably for us, and also the email Jaime sent to Paul's account, also presumably for us, which is weird, both were addressed to John, not JC. Bobbin configured JC's real name to be John Edit: Oh, and the secret to effectively using the pepper spray without intoxicating yourself is to run backwards whilst spraying it. Preferably down a corridor when enemies are off to the side so they spot you, come out to take a look and aim, then get a big fit of the wheezies. ynohtna fucked around with this message at 00:17 on Feb 11, 2014 |
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Feb 11, 2014 00:12
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The Merry Marauder posted:"Gully Foyle is my name Someone call? Anyways, I think the assault rifle got a bit undersold in this episode. Its not great at base, but if you are getting Rifle up to master (for the sniper rifle/assault shotgun), it becomes pretty devastating. Once the accuracy is up there, you get multiple headshots easily, and you can still just pump them full of lead if you miss.
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Feb 11, 2014 00:17
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ynohtna posted:Bobbin configured JC's real name to be John Dude, keep quiet! Think of the children! When the news breaks that one can get high on pepper spray the streets will be full of pepper spray junkies. And some won't stop there. Oh no. Some will reach for harder intoxicants such as bear spray or tear gas! That would be terrible.
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Feb 11, 2014 00:32
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loving  on Science Corner today, Bobbin. I come from a medical household, and my mother was a nurse working at the height of the AIDS epidemic in the 80s. The look of blank, hopeless dread in her eyes when she discusses what it was like, and the look of hope that returns when the topic turns to potential vaccines, told me everything I needed to know about whether or not vaccination was worthwhile. Have you ever seen someone with the measles, or tetanus, or hepatitis, or shingles? Up-close and personal? I have. To call it horrifying would be to understate the matter severely.Anti-vaccination is a crock of poo poo, spread largely by rich, famous morons who have no actual clue what they're talking about. They use fear of autism to justify their irrational fear of injections, and use that to spread misinformation and paranoia either unwittingly or maliciously. These people are directly responsible for spreading disease by promoting unsafe behavior and withholding modern medicine from the underprivileged. There is literally nothing on earth that makes me angrier than people who claim vaccination is a conspiracy.
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Feb 11, 2014 00:34
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If you state that vaccinations and autism prevalence are unrelated (as current research strongly seems to support), why do you still say that relatively few cases of autism are small price to pay for hindering or even halting the spread of infectious diseases? Because that just makes it sound like you actually do believe that there's a connection. That bit is worded very badly, I think.
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Feb 11, 2014 00:42
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Jolan posted:If you state that vaccinations and autism prevalence are unrelated (as current research strongly seems to support), why do you still say that relatively few cases of autism are small price to pay for hindering or even halting the spread of infectious diseases? Because that just makes it sound like you actually do believe that there's a connection. That bit is worded very badly, I think. I think the point he was trying to make was that even if vaccines caused autism the benefits would still outweigh the downside by a mile.
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Feb 11, 2014 00:47
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Jolan posted:If you state that vaccinations and autism prevalence are unrelated (as current research strongly seems to support), why do you still say that relatively few cases of autism are small price to pay for hindering or even halting the spread of infectious diseases? Because that just makes it sound like you actually do believe that there's a connection. That bit is worded very badly, I think. The point is even if the crazy anti-vaccers are right (they aren't), then they are still wrong.
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Feb 11, 2014 01:11
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I've always remembered that "Be Safe: Be Suspicious" propaganda piece. I saw it as exaggerated satire when playing the game in 2000 (particularly when taken along with stuff like that Kvork Inc spam), but then after the September 11th 2001 terrorist attacks everyone freaked the hell out, of course. I don't know what it was like elsewhere, but here in Australia we got the 'terrorist kit' mailed out to every single household, with its "Be alert but not alarmed" tagline. It contained wording that was so eerily similar to that in the "Be Safe" piece, I just... was gobsmacked. It may be worth mentioning for those who don't know, though, that the campaign came from the Howard Government, which was... well, exactly the sort of Government you'd expect something like this from.
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Feb 11, 2014 01:32
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counterfeitsaint posted:The point is even if the crazy anti-vaccers are right (they aren't), then they are still wrong. The current rate of diagnosed autism spectrum cases is 1 in 88. The average smallpox outbreak caused death in 1 in 3 cases, permanent blindness in 1 in 33 survivors, and disfiguring scars in 3 out of 4. Measles carries a death rate of between 3 in 10 to 3 in 1000 depending on how well local hospitals can treat complications like diarrhea and pneumonia. Pregnant women exposed to rubella, particularly in the first trimester, will experience a miscarriage or stillborn baby 1 out of 4 times and in a second 1 of 4 the baby will be born with a vast array of potential birth defects, including (but not limited to) deafness, cataracts, heart disease, growth disorders, and (oddly enough) ASD. I realize wishing autism on someone's son or daughter is a lovely thing to do. I just think wishing smallpox were still around is even shittier.
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Feb 11, 2014 01:42
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I wrote an article for a newspaper here in Canada a few years ago about the flu vaccine and why, exactly, people should get it. I focused a lot on the fact that, in some cases (like my own) there are people who cannot get the vaccine for whatever reason (allergies to eggs being one of the chief ones). I had a hell of a time getting the local head of the vaccination team to talk to me because he thought that I was going to be just another crazy antivaxxer who wanted to write a story about how awful they were. I never had to wrangle a story out of someone that hard, before. And then I came into work the day after publishing and had an email box full of people telling me I was a tool. *sigh*
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Feb 11, 2014 01:45
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In 1997 I remember doing an assignment about AIDS, and being requested from the teacher then to remove traces of the clean needles program and of the practice of condom wearing. Folk can be queasy of preventive measures, no matter how effective and otherwise non-invasive they can be.
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Feb 11, 2014 01:58
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1. This is your brother's sniper rifle. Not as random or as clumsy as an assault rifle; an elegant weapon for a more civilized age. 2. My "favorite" part about the Tuskegee Experiment is the end year. Listen again if you missed it: 1972. Why did it end then? Because someone leaked it to the press and they had to shut it down. If that hadn't happened, when do you think we'd have heard about it? 3. The issue of autism and vaccination is one that's close to my heart, largely because my youngest son (who is sitting next to me watching the Muppets sing as I type this) is severely autistic. At the age of four (well, a week from now), he still can't speak or form a wide variety of mental connections, and I have no idea what the rest of his life is going to look like. He might be relatively okay someday, or he might end up in an assisted living facility once my wife and I are too old or too dead to take care of him anymore. The fact is, when things go wrong, you want an explanation for them, and you want it to be something you can do something about. Either something you can fix, or something you can prevent from happening to other people. The pressure towards this kind of explanation is terrific, and it bears on everyone. Talking about autism is difficult, because it's such a broad category. It's like talking about "leg injuries". Well, okay, is it a bruise or did the drat thing get torn off? Plenty of people have autism and lead perfectly fulfilling lives. Some don't. And the world is not kind to people with any form of mental illness. I got hit pretty hard with this the other day; I was reading the political cartoons thread and saw one about a guy named Kelly Thomas, a mentally ill homeless man who was beaten to death by the police for what amounts to no particular reason. (They walked, by the way.) He called out for his dad during the beating. And the first thing I thought was: depending on how things go in the next several years, that could be my kid, calling out for me. Kelly Thomas wasn't autistic, but it's not like the people beating him to death would notice the difference. I've got absolutely no way of preventing that possible future and no explanation for why things are this way. I don't believe that vaccinations cause autism, but I understand people who do. The human impulse is to ask, "why?" You have a happy, healthy baby and everything seems fine, and a few months later something has gone badly of the rails. You look at that child and think, "Why him? Why does it have to be him?" The best answer science has is "maybe some genetic factors got irritated by something in the environment that we can't determine yet", and as an explanation that's about as useful to the human psyche as a bag of nails in a pillow factory. It's tempting to look elsewhere for answers, and when it comes to babies there aren't a ton of common foreign factors. Vaccinations are a handy target because they're mysterious and feel unnatural and worrying. A co-worker of mine has gone way down this path because of his own autistic son, and it breaks my heart, but I can't be upset with him. Sometimes I wish I were credulous enough to buy it. Nevertheless, despite everything I've just written, what Bobbin says in the video is fundamentally correct, and I agree with it. Even if vaccinations did cause autism, which they don't, a certain percentage of children developing severe autism would be a reasonable price to pay, from the perspective of a whole society. But it's hard to be too angry with the people who feel otherwise.
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Feb 11, 2014 02:10
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Man, I don't get the bum rap that the Assault Rifle gets. With Master level Rifle skill and a few mods it becomes a perfectly accurate silent ray o' death where you just have to point it at something's head and laugh as you bring down judgement upon the heathens. Ammo is plentiful too. Also the alternate ammo is the bomb.
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Feb 11, 2014 02:16
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Homeless Guy posted:Who will help the widow's son? Oh man. Somebody did their homework here. It's phrased differently (as it should be), but is close enough to the real phrasing that it should be instantly recognizable to most members of a certain fraternal organization. That man just asked JC for help, using the Deus Ex version of a code phrase that should only ever be used when the person asking is facing imminent threat of death or bodily harm. If you hear it (and have been told what it means) you know that the requester truly needs help, and what's more, he is your Brother. I had to do a double take when he said it.
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Feb 11, 2014 02:27
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I think DE is the best example (one of very few) of video games as art. It's a sustained and multifaceted artistic statement that could not otherwise be represented as non-interactive media without losing it's core and intent. Deus Ex just wouldn't make any sense as anything other than a video game. It's also kind of a shame that with the advent of achievements, gamer points and all that bullshit, any 'choice' you make in a modern game is essentially just a tactical decision for a gold star. DE managed to perfectly blend actual 'moral' decision making with no measurable gameplay consequences, and choices that resulted in entirely self-contained rewards/punishments that don't rely on any sort of external framework to have value. And, like all art, it has to be understood in the context of the culture and prevailing thinking of the time. There are better 'games' (one could argue that as a pure game, judged on gameplay, it's really pretty poo poo) but I can't think of any other interactive media that approaches DE for sheer brilliance.
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Feb 11, 2014 02:41
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Slavvy posted:I think DE is the best example (one of very few) of video games as art. It's a sustained and multifaceted artistic statement that could not otherwise be represented as non-interactive media without losing it's core and intent. Deus Ex just wouldn't make any sense as anything other than a video game. Well, all I know is that my playthroughs tend to devolve into some kind of surrealist performance art sooner or later.
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Feb 11, 2014 02:48
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RickVoid posted:Oh man. Somebody did their homework here. It's phrased differently (as it should be), but is close enough to the real phrasing that it should be instantly recognizable to most members of a certain fraternal organization. For those who aren't following, the organization is the Freemasons. I think the original phrase is something like "Is there no help for the widow's son?" - This is one of those open secrets that pops up in a lot of unexpected places. I always wondered what was up with that guy; he's in a clinic mostly full of grey death patients desperately asking for help. Almost all of the homeless people in this game have something to say that actually tells you a fact or facts about the Deus Ex world. Even the ones that sound crazy. ESPECIALLY them.
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Feb 11, 2014 02:52
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Thank you for taking a moment to face the scourge of misinformation that surrounds the treatment of communicable disease. I desperately want to believe that it will one day cease, but curing the actual deadly diseases is proving easier than immunizing people from foolish, easily disproved nonsense.
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Feb 11, 2014 03:04
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With the science corner as the 4th and final corner, we've truly reached the deepest of conspiracies: Cubic Creation of 4 corner separate simultaneous 24 hour Days within 1 Earth rotation - transcends and contradicts the 1 Day rotation/1 God Creation of Christianity - and all ONEism / Singularity religions - proving them to constitute Evil on Earth for the parallel Opposites. 
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Feb 11, 2014 03:06
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Gimbal lock posted:With the science corner as the 4th and final corner, we've truly reached the deepest of conspiracies: Cubic Creation of 4 corner separate simultaneous 24 hour Days within 1 Earth rotation - transcends and contradicts the 1 Day rotation/1 God Creation of Christianity - and all ONEism / Singularity religions - proving them to constitute Evil on Earth for the parallel Opposites. I played through the game again because of this thread (I mean who isn't amirite). This time, I kept in mind that much of the game is based on the sentiment of "man what if that conspiracy were really true!?" The game is kinda funny with the whole everything-but-the-kitchen-sink approach. For instance, it's a bit eye-rolling that Area 51 is involved. But this post makes a good point (other than ONEism). I wanna see a game that pushes the idea to the limit and assumes that TimeCube is true and half of the episodes of the X-Files are real. And we're all in the matrix and... Maybe in the end it's like that South Park episode on 9/11 conspiracies: the conspiracy is a conspiracy! The government wants crazies to think they're like super competent and menacing! And not idiots!
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Feb 11, 2014 03:40
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You want the video game equivalent to the cabin in the woods.
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Feb 11, 2014 03:52
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I cannot understand the lengths people will go to in order to justify their paranoia, their ignorance and their hubris. I too grew up in a medical family, my dad was a paramedic at the time, and he explained to me why immunizations worked, and how. I took my needles, and was better for it. Hell, I even once went to a Pox Party for the same reason, and I don't regret the infection for a minute. That people can willfully and knowingly put themselves at risk is fine by me. You're endangering yourself of your own free will, and while I may warn against it, it's your choice in the end. But when you try to do the same to others, even their own children, I draw the line. To abuse the power over others, especially those who are dependent on you to make rational and reasonable choices is something that just causes me to rage. ... On the other hand, there is such a thing as being too clean, too sterile, too safe. I have seen, far too often as I'm in retail, where a parent will suddenly stop and whip out some Chlrohexedine medical swabs and wipe down their kid's hands and face. Because they touched something. These people aren't doing their kids any favors by preventing them from getting dirty and sick in the first place. Gah, this subject just aggravates me so much. So much deliberate and incidental misinformation, so much ignorance, and so few people with the strength of character to admit they are wrong and change their ways.
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Feb 11, 2014 04:00
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It isn't just their own children. Not vaccinating your own kids affects herd immunity so your neighbour's kids can get sick even if they've been vaccinated. Hooray for assholes!
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Feb 11, 2014 04:06
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| # ? Jun 6, 2024 15:24 |
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There's not really much more to be said about the Science Corner that hasn't been said but I'm willing to bet that if Polio, TB, measles and other horrifying and disfiguring diseases made a come back it'd probably be those sample people running around demanding that someone save their babies. I find 19th and 20th century history quite interesting, particularly the ramping up of warfare to an industrial scale; the development of chemical warfare with the increased understanding chemistry, carpet bombing with the take off of the aerospace industry and the development of nuclear science and all the wonders that came screaming out of that Pandora's Box. But there is nothing so insidious or terrifying as germ warfare and what weaponized viruses can do. Anyway, back to lighter topics. I gotta say, I never thought to use the tear gas we've collected - something designed for crowd control so you can diffuse a situation - and use it to incapacitate all the NSF guys so our UNATCO buddies can stand there an machine gun the crowd while everyone is too busy rubbing their eyes or running around choking on gas. I don't think those two troopers near the alley thought about all the possibilities to torture people with non-lethal methods before finally just getting bored and capping them. You also had a lot better luck than I normally have with the hostage situation in the 'Ton, normally the lady around the corner eats a bullet when the terrorist tries to shoot me. I need to start lobbing gas grenades into the hallway to distract everyone long enough to get in there and kill everyone before they start executing people. Psychotic Weasel fucked around with this message at 04:12 on Feb 11, 2014 |
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Feb 11, 2014 04:09
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