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Started a simple bacon today following Ruhlman's recipe from Charcuterie. I used a 2 lb piece of pork belly however, and I made the cure salt mix suggested in the book. He says use 1/4 cuo for a piece 3-5 lbs, so i used about 2.5 tablespoons for this 2lb piece of belly. Do you think that will be enough? Im not sure it covered the entire belly because I put it inside a ziploc bag and shook it around a bit. I'm worried about adding more salt because it might make the bacon too salty.
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Jan 21, 2014 17:36
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I've yet to do a full 5lb slab and most of mine have been around the 2-2.5 range before the cure. I've been calculating the amount based off of ratio. With the exception of my first attempt which went a day longer than planned they've all turned out fine. Ruhlman describes using firmness as an indicator as well to test readiness. Or, at the very least you can cut off a small piece and cook it.
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Jan 21, 2014 17:49
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Guy, I think I have a problem. I... I don't think I like cured pork. Don't get me wrong, ham is a delicious thing and I would commit unspeakable sins for a nice piece of cured belly. Still, though, since I've started curing meat it just seems my nice pieces of pork have been being ruined by the addition of nitrites. Pork chops, loins, ribs... it just seems like adding pink salt is a bad thing. They become piquant in a weird way like some bad facsimile of ham. The redness also throws me off. Chicken, beef, lamb, turkey, these things it seems I can cook and they're delicious or cure and have them be delicious in another way. Pork though, if it's not belly or if I don't just go ahead and treat it fully like ham and hang it to dry, just seems like I'm ruining what could be a delicious and juicy piece of meat. I've tried adding less pink salt and I've tried adding an acid to the marinade, but it just seems that if I want to eat it quickly (like after 3-4 days) I'm best simply not adding pink salt. It sucks because I had thought pink salt was a magic bullet for delicious.
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Jan 22, 2014 14:13
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You can just not use pink salt, and it should be okay, especially with whole-muscle salumi. Don't sue me if you die of botulism though. If you read Salumi you'll see that Ruhlman no longer recommends putting pink salt in everything. I still do it because I like the red color and the flavor, and I also don't want to die of botulism poisoning.
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Jan 22, 2014 14:15
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I don't think botulism will be a problem since my issue is only with meats I'm eating more or less fresh. I'll try just a regular salt/sugar cure.
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Jan 22, 2014 14:46
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Tweek posted:Guy, I think I have a problem. I... I don't think I like cured pork. Don't get me wrong, ham is a delicious thing and I would commit unspeakable sins for a nice piece of cured belly. Maybe this will come off waxing a bit philosophical, but the whole point of this thread is to find new and different ways to enjoy food, at its heart. If there are things you prefer fresh, eat them fresh. If you can't bear to not cure things, there's no reason to not enjoy a mixed plate of cured and uncured food to compare, contrast, and compliment.
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Jan 22, 2014 14:54
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Just made my bacon for the next few months, as well as a few belated holiday gifts for some friends. I use Ruhlman as a basic recipe, but usually add some stuff just for fun. Of the 18~lbs that I did, about 50% was regular, 25% was garlic rosemary, and 25% was whiskey molasses. I typically do a 2.5-3hr simple smoke with the heat ramping up as it progresses. Start with just a charcoal or two, build up to ending with a handful in a hot smoker. Turned out as lovely as ever.  This first photo is less than half of my total compliment  
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Jan 25, 2014 11:03
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Is there a good place to order pork belly and duck breast online if I do not have a suitable local butcher? Also, can I do bacon and other things if I do not have a smoker but just a regular oven?
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Jan 25, 2014 11:08
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I can't vouch for online dealers, though I am sure they are out there. But even the most rural of towns has access to bellies. You just may have to do some investigative work and call delis to see where they get their bacon, then call their supplier. Call as many as you can asking where you can get a full belly. Eventually, you will probably just find a distributor/butcher that you can buy from. A full belly is the entire underside of one half of the pig; there are two belly cuts per pig. It should weigh anywhere from 8-12lbs, depending on the size of the pig, fat/lean content, and whether or not the skin is still attached. I prefer the skin still on, as it makes the belly a lot cheaper (since they didn't have to do the work) and the skin can be put to use in various things from chicharones to just simply rendering the fat out of it. However, many places don't sell the bellies as full, and will come in halves. There is the front and the back half of the belly. The front half is much thinner, and much more uniformly rectangular shaped. It is easier to cure evenly, cook/smoke evenly, and slice into friendly little strips, but it is a little less flavorful. In my earlier photo, it was the stuff in the middle of the cutting board. The back half is a big, honkin piece of meat that goes from a thin, neat rectangle to totally oblong shape at the end. It has much more meat, much more fat, more flavor, but is consequently harder to ensure even cure, even cook, and even slices. It is the stuff on the near, right side of my cutting board photo. It also has a tendancy to contract and curl irregularly when cooking/smoking. If you can inspect the belly before purchase, make sure it has a good fat/lean composition; 50:50 is ideal. Don't be fooled into thinking more meat = better value, as too much meat per slice will end up tasting a bit hammy and be a bit on the tough side. And definitely don't get a leaner belly because of low-fat 'health reasons'. You are making bacon, if you want healthy eating tips, eat the full stuff, just eat less of it. Also, for your first time, try and get bellies that are about 1.5 inches thick and avoid the pressure they may try to give you to buy the super primo 3" thick belly. That stuff is for fancy, braising meals, not bacon. It's also gonna cost about 4x more. Bacon making will destroy the texture of any fancy belly and turn it into "Bacon texture" and all that extra money you spent won't be noticeable. Also having a thinner belly to start with means that you will have more control and knowledge about the salt migration into your meat. Recipes rarely say how thick of a cut to use, but assume for bacon 1.5". If you have a thicker piece, you will not only have to cure it longer, but you will then have to back some of the salt out again, or the outer areas of the belly will be far too salty. Think of the salt as heat entering the meat: the heat moves in at a constant rate determined by the temperature outside. The salt moves in at a constant rate determined by the salinity of the solution outside. If you have a thick cut, by the time inside is up to temp/salt content, the outside is toast/pure salt. Fortunately, unlike cooking, you can get the salt back out. Just soak it in water for an hour or so, then let the belly rest in your fridge for a day. That will help the cut come to equilibrium. As for you actual question, you absolutely can oven cook it. Just know that it won't really be bacon; it will be cured pork belly. The smoke flavor is a huge amount of what we perceive to be bacon. But don't despair, as you can just dump in a few sloshes of liquid smoke to your cure. How much or how little is up to you, but for a full belly, I would probably recommend something in the tablespoon range. I have done the liquid smoke method for my second time I ever made bacon (after the first time of just using the oven and being a little disappointed with the oven style) and it turned out pretty darn good. It still won't be idea, but it'll help a bunch.
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Jan 25, 2014 23:57
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holttho posted:I can't vouch for online dealers, though I am sure they are out there. But even the most rural of towns has access to bellies. You just may have to do some investigative work and call delis to see where they get their bacon, then call their supplier. Call as many as you can asking where you can get a full belly. Eventually, you will probably just find a distributor/butcher that you can buy from. Awesome, thank you so much for the help! What is a typical price for a full belly and a half?
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Jan 26, 2014 02:29
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Well, I live in Chicago, so I have a huge range of selection available so your options may and probably will vary. I can go to the boutique butchers and get lovingly hand raised belly for something on the order of $15/lb. I can also go to a distributor style butcher shop and pick up factory raised stuff for as low as $1.79/lb. And that is the stuff I make bacon out of. (as well as pancetta and other heavily cured and smoked belly products) I have used better quality stuff a number of times, and when it all comes down to it, I can't tell the difference flavor/texture-wise. Not only that, but for obvious reasons, it is probably better to test the waters with a cheaper cut and go from there. All in all, I would say expect $20-25 per full belly on the economical side of it, and upwards of $100-150 if your ethics won't let you buy factory hog. Even with the cheapest cut, it will blow your mind how good it is. Virtually all bacon you have ever had is pressure cured and chemically smoked, making what is normally a 7-10 day process into a 7-10 minute process. The difference will astound you.
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Jan 26, 2014 04:23
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While I find it interesting that so many goons make their own sausages and other cured meats at home, I don't think any of them could really beat the taste of Hormel pepperoni. Hormel pepperoni is probably one of the best kinds of cured sausage I have ever eaten in my life, and I challenge any one to actually make something more delicious than it, however it is an empty challenge, because that would be impossible. Its not only delicious on pizza it can be used to spice up just about any dish you may be serving, especially sandwiches, but really anything. Making a roast? Throw some delicious Hormel pepperonis on that bitch, the flavor, just divine. An omelette just isn't a real omelette without the spicy flavor of Hormel pepperoni. It can be used literally anywhere. Food for thought.
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Jan 27, 2014 03:16
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holttho posted:Even with the cheapest cut, it will blow your mind how good it is. Virtually all bacon you have ever had is pressure cured and chemically smoked, making what is normally a 7-10 day process into a 7-10 minute process. The difference will astound you. My brother and family jest whenever I bring up making my own bacon and good food  Hopefully I can show them how amazing the difference is.
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Jan 27, 2014 03:24
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Sid Vicious posted:an empty challenge You're right, but for the wrong reasons. Your vote is just simply cast; deaf ears. Granted, I don't spend too much time here in GWS, as I find it to be a little too harsh and insular of a community, but I do know you are missing the spirit of the forum. It is not about fulfilling the minimum requirements of flavor and ease vs. economy, but rather bettering yourself and the lives around you by the dedication to improving a craft. goodness posted:My brother and family jest whenever I bring up making my own bacon and good food Hopefully they jest in good-heartedness, and have a culinarily open mind. Otherwise, you may be fighting an uphill battle that you can never win.
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Jan 27, 2014 04:23
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holttho posted:You're right, but for the wrong reasons. Your vote is just simply cast; deaf ears. They just laugh that it will taste the same and I am making a big deal out of nothing.
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Jan 27, 2014 04:25
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Sid Vicious posted:loving Hormel anything. Nope, Hormel is poo poo. Absolute poo poo. Sorry you lack taste. Think I'm going to do some sopressata soon.
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Jan 27, 2014 15:07
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I think he's just trolling. Ignore him.
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Jan 27, 2014 16:01
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Sid Vicious posted:While I find it interesting that so many goons make their own sausages and other cured meats at home, I don't think any of them could really beat the taste of Hormel pepperoni. Hormel pepperoni is probably one of the best kinds of cured sausage I have ever eaten in my life, and I challenge any one to actually make something more delicious than it, however it is an empty challenge, because that would be impossible. Its not only delicious on pizza it can be used to spice up just about any dish you may be serving, especially sandwiches, but really anything. Making a roast? Throw some delicious Hormel pepperonis on that bitch, the flavor, just divine. An omelette just isn't a real omelette without the spicy flavor of Hormel pepperoni. It can be used literally anywhere. Food for thought. It was only a matter of time.
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Jan 27, 2014 16:28
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I once made some sausage links made out of ground Hormel peperoni, flavored with the juice squeezed from more Hormel peperoni, and cured with dehydrated, powdered Hormel peperoni. Needed more Hormel, I feel. I don't know how they get that double, baked-in Hormel goodness over there at Hormel.
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Jan 27, 2014 16:32
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Anybody make rillettes? I've been looking at that From Belly to Bacon blog someone linked in this thread, and they have some really awesome rillettes variations. I need to try at least a basic pork belly recipe (gonna use the one in my Pickles, Pigs & Whiskey cookbook) next time I get some bellies from my local butcher.
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Jan 27, 2014 18:56
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Salt and pepper belly, pack in double aluminium foil, bake slowly for...five hours? Tear up, clean jars, fat on top. Can't really go wrong. You can simmer on the stovetop too, but let me assure you few things are as good as slow-roasted pork belly.
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Jan 27, 2014 21:27
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Martello posted:Anybody make rillettes? I've been looking at that From Belly to Bacon blog someone linked in this thread, and they have some really awesome rillettes variations. I need to try at least a basic pork belly recipe (gonna use the one in my Pickles, Pigs & Whiskey cookbook) next time I get some bellies from my local butcher. I've made belly rillettes before, mostly just with trimmings from bellies. I actually prefer duck rillettes, as the meat is just a touch drier, it leads to a more pronounced and pleasing texture. Belly tends to have a slightly greasy/mushy feel rather than unctuous. Although, that may have just been my preparation of them. Though, when I am not feeling up to duck, sometimes I like a slightly more American/goony  preparation of them. Use chicken legs, lightly brined and cooked in a bath of lard (or schmaltz, if you actually can get your hands on any real amount), with about 15-20% of the fat from rendered bacon. Peel and toss in a whole handful of garlic cloves and maybe some herbs and put in a crock pot, put the cover on, but put a toothpick or small piece of aluminum foil under the lid so it doesn't fit snugly. That way the steam can vent. Cook on low for about 6-8 hours, reserve the fat and chicken, toss the other solids, and you will have a perfect confit that you can mash up into rillettes. It has a lovely assertive chickeny-garlicy flavor that goes great with a very bold, equally assertive cheese. A bleu like Roaring Forties comes to mind. Maybe side it with some pickled veggies, some fruit compotes, and a few nuts on top of some seared bread and you've got yourself a pretty world class appetizer.Word to the wise, though: I do not recommend eating the garlics after they have been cooked. They have given their all, use at your own discretion. The cooking fat can be reused a handful of times, though it will get saltier each time you use it. I have also used that recipe with vegetable oil rather than lard. The chicken isn't as good, but you end up with a rockin chicken-garlic liquid oil that you can use for other cooking applications. (pan fry potatoes) If you take nothing else away from this recipe, at least use a crock pot for confit. It is nearly perfect for the job, and you don't have to muck about with trying to keep your oven at 200F for 8 hours.
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Jan 27, 2014 22:02
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Made the bacon in the OP. It came out way too salty (I cured it for 8 days because it wasnt firm at all on the 7th), and for some reason my internal temp wouldn't reach 150. After waiting 3 hours, I eventually pulled it at 142 F and when i cut into it, it was pretty much a ham. I don't think it's my thermometer cause its brand new with 4.5 stars on amazon. Hmm.. Maybe it was because I was only sticking the needle in the meat portions? Not sure.
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Jan 31, 2014 17:00
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It's not all lost. I'm not sure what's up with your temperature readings; nor do I understand "pretty much a ham." Anyway, overly-salty bacon can be rescued. Slice it, then instead of just frying it, add a cup or two of water to your skillet. Bring to a simmer. Add bacon. Simmer for a minute or a minute and a half. Discard water. Fry bacon.
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Jan 31, 2014 17:12
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pr0k posted:It's not all lost. I'm not sure what's up with your temperature readings; nor do I understand "pretty much a ham." Sorry, i meant that it was pretty tough and stringy, seemed overcooked. I think im just gonna use it in some soups.
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Jan 31, 2014 17:17
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Yeah, once it's cooked to that point, that's all you can do. Make some split pea soup, it'll be the best you ever tasted. Or use it to flavor greens. I use most of my scraps for that and pasta with bacon and peas.
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Jan 31, 2014 19:47
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Yea, if it got too salty, it's not wasted. It's never wasted. There is a myriad of uses for too-salty bacon: the aforementioned greens and soups, grind it for burgers and chili, or just slice it thin and use it is lardons for various pieces of meat. Especially used in long, slow cooking processes, it will also act to 'brine' the meat. The temp being finicky is a bit odd, though. How did you cook it? Oven or smoker/grill? How uniform was the meat?
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Jan 31, 2014 22:05
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holttho posted:Yea, if it got too salty, it's not wasted. It's never wasted. There is a myriad of uses for too-salty bacon: the aforementioned greens and soups, grind it for burgers and chili, or just slice it thin and use it is lardons for various pieces of meat. Especially used in long, slow cooking processes, it will also act to 'brine' the meat. Agreed - my first bacon a while back was too salty to eat and was too big to blanche and remove. Solution? It became a seasoning - I put that shot in every soup, stew and pasta I made for a couple weeks. Not in huge quantities but I used it like salt. And holy Christ it did that job well. Edit: awful app enables me to be awful squirrelzipper fucked around with this message at 23:51 on Jan 31, 2014 |
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Jan 31, 2014 23:49
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holttho posted:Yea, if it got too salty, it's not wasted. It's never wasted. There is a myriad of uses for too-salty bacon: the aforementioned greens and soups, grind it for burgers and chili, or just slice it thin and use it is lardons for various pieces of meat. Especially used in long, slow cooking processes, it will also act to 'brine' the meat. I just cooked it in the often at 200F, but I think one of the big reasons was an uneven distribution of fat and meat and a poor pork belly product. I'm gonna try again with fresh belly from the butcher shop instead of the frozen belly from the Chinese grocery store.
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Feb 1, 2014 06:43
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hoshkwon posted:I just cooked it in the often at 200F, but I think one of the big reasons was an uneven distribution of fat and meat and a poor pork belly product. I'm gonna try again with fresh belly from the butcher shop instead of the frozen belly from the Chinese grocery store. True, it may be the meat, but I would hazard a guess at the oven at 200F being the culprit. Even the tippy-top of the line models have a hard time maintaining that low a temperature. In addition, every oven cycles on and off to maintain its temp, and depending on the make, model, and quality, that swing may be as much as 40 degrees in both directions; from as low as 160 then up to 240. The best bakers oven in the world is probably 10 in both directions. Now, when you consider how much little heat is in there as it is, the 'off' cycle can be devastating to maintaining the temp; you're losing like 50% of it. And since air makes a poor conductor (in fact, if air doesn't move, it actually makes a great insulator) it would just take hours upon hours to get the temp you want. What you can try is to use an oven-bag and go for a temp even a modest oven can handle, 250F. However, with the bag, the speed of the cooking will be different, as the increased humidity will put heat to the meat much more efficiently. If you have a probe thermo, you're on the gravy train. If you only have a regular meat thermometer, you may want to check it every 10-15 minutes after the hour. Then finish it for about 10 minutes bagless at 300F just to dry it off on the outside.
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Feb 1, 2014 10:29
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I had some smoked salmon (from the store yeah I know) this weekend and was reminded just how much I loved it. Whats the deal with getting a whole salmon, it may be a little harder than finding a pork belly it seems (in Arkansas). Maybe I am overthinking it and I don't need a whole salmon? I asked about cooking bacon in the oven before, and its good to know I can. But besides buying my own smoker, is there a good DIY smoker that I could construct (for the bacon and salmon)?
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Feb 13, 2014 02:16
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goodness posted:I had some smoked salmon (from the store yeah I know) this weekend and was reminded just how much I loved it. Whats the deal with getting a whole salmon, it may be a little harder than finding a pork belly it seems (in Arkansas). Maybe I am overthinking it and I don't need a whole salmon? For a DIY smoker to make bacon or salmon, look up alton brown's smoker or look up gravity84's post on his terracotta smoker. you can make as much or as little smoked salmon so you can use a whole fillet or just a few chunks. if you're going through the trouble, i would make a lot though.
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Feb 13, 2014 20:22
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There are ways to turn a regular charcoal grill into a smoker too, though I can't personally vouch for how effective they are, I don't see why they wouldn't work.
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Feb 13, 2014 21:02
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I've used my Weber Silver as a smoker before and it works out OK. I make a ring of briquettes around the bottom, two rows on the bottom one on top (so the ring goes a little over half way of the way around the charcoal grate - longer for longer smoking), and then light 6 or 9 briquettes and put them at one end of the ring. I place whatever smoking wood around along the top of this ring, so as the charcoal burns up you've got smoke the whole way around - obviously works better for chips than chunk. This is similar to putting a few lit briquettes on a pile of unlit, but it seems more consistent in temp, but you'll still be loving with the vents until you get a hang of it. Obviously pretty futzy to set up, but I've smoked bacon, ribs, and butt this way before I got a propane smoker for christmas one year.
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Feb 13, 2014 21:45
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Comic posted:There are ways to turn a regular charcoal grill into a smoker too, though I can't personally vouch for how effective they are, I don't see why they wouldn't work. I bought something vaguely similar to this and just stuck in on top of one of my grill burners. I put the items to be smoked over the other two burners which I left off. Gives decent enough results: 
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Feb 13, 2014 23:04
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The Alton Brown smokers are awesome. All of them. You can very easily smoke in a grill, you just have to make it work for you and you will have to put more effort in. When I first started smoking, I just used my cheapo grill and it had amazing results. Will you win BBQ awards? Probably not, but you will be very happy. The trick is to just keep the heat very low: use minimal charcoal and set the coals off to one side and your meat away on the other. Using bricks in the grill is also very effective if you turn them into a heat wall; they will block the radiative cooking (at least for a few hours...). Using bricks in the grill is a good skill to learn in general. It's how you make tightly controlled zones in a small charcoal grill. A word of warning with briquettes though: if you are using cheap ones, know they have quite a lot of "glue" and filler in them used to hold them together. This glue can and does include a plethora of things you may or may not want on your food. The filler can and does include anything they may have swept up from the shop floor. They can do this because the idea is that for regular grilling you fully ignite the briquettes and burn off the outer layers before you put the food on. That's why it says right on the bag, 'fully ignite before food application.' More expensive brands only use things like cornstarch to glue them together. Do NOT use brands that include some sort of ignition aid as that is pretty much just the briquettes are soaked in lighter fluid before bagged. Will this stuff kill you? No. Will it give you cancer? What doesn't these days. Will it contribute off-flavors to your product? Most likely. Ultimately, minion method should really only be used with lump/chunk charcoal/wood. If you are using briquettes, just light them outside the grill and let them burn for just a tiny bit to get rid of the bad stuff. Then toss them in.
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Feb 14, 2014 08:05
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holttho posted:The Alton Brown smokers are awesome. All of them. I will definitely have to look into doing it on a grill. We have one outside the apartment, but I have actually never used a charcoal grill before. Only ever cooked on gas or electric.
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Feb 14, 2014 08:12
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goodness posted:I will definitely have to look into doing it on a grill. We have one outside the apartment, but I have actually never used a charcoal grill before. Only ever cooked on gas or electric. Give yourself 1 try to gently caress it up then you'll probably get it right everytime after. It's not hard to work with. 
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Feb 14, 2014 17:06
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I recently acquired a food dehydrator. Are there any fun/creative things you guys would recommend using it for?
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Feb 14, 2014 17:36
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lifts cats over head posted:I recently acquired a food dehydrator. Are there any fun/creative things you guys would recommend using it for? Make bacon. Remove skin and dehydrate. Get craklin'.
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Feb 14, 2014 17:44
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