|
Onmi posted:I'm not kidding that I could go on forever about this poo poo. I'm not entirely clear on what the outcome of his lawsuit has been. On one hand, I think he's said Archie can use his characters provided they state once and for all that his "Mobius: 25 Years Later" story is the official, canonical ending of the Sonic comic universe. At the same time, I've heard that there's some provision in the decision which means he can't actually publish any of his "Original Character Do Not Steal Chronicles" stuff unless there's some sort of action (I'm not sure what this entails) on Archie's end. Ian Flynn posts in BSS from time to time, but I doubt he really wants to say anything about it. Anyway, one thing you alluded to but didn't really mention is that as much as Penders clamours about the originality of his creations, most of the stuff he did when he worked on Sonic was pretty derivative. You had stuff like the forewords to Knuckles comics rewording the "fear itself" section of Roosevelt's inaugural speech and Martin Niemöller's "First they came..." piece and attributing them to cartoon echidnas, the fact that most of his designs (for characters' clothing, spaceships and so on) were copied from Star Wars or Star Trek, and even the story which featured the debut of his number one OC (Lara-Su, the proposed main character of the series he wants to use his echidna characters for) was basically "Days of Future Past", Knuckles-style.
|
#
?
Feb 18, 2014 20:27
|
|
|
|
| # ? May 24, 2024 17:09 |
|
|
Onmi posted:Destiny. That was amazing. You know, ever since you first mentioned him, Pender's name was sounding really familiar, but I couldn't remember why. Then I remembered. Penders killed off Princess Sally in a storyline, and once-famous internet personality David "Daveykins" Gonterman utterly flipped his poo poo and actually wrote a whole revenge comic. Then Sally came back (because, you know, comic book) and David honestly thought he "won". It's wingnuts all the way down. 
|
|
#
?
Feb 18, 2014 20:34
|
|
|
Metal Loaf posted:
I wouldn't ask him even if I could honestly, the most obvious reason being I doubt he even knows, the legal stuff is way above his department. The second is that I've had a chance to speak with him in the past, and he's just a nice guy who I would rather shoot the breeze with about stuff unrelated to the lawsuit than bring it up. And yes, Penders is a crazy person who honestly the only reason he didn't lose horribly is because Archie didn't want to go to a Jury Trial, thus they settled. Their reason being Sega was already pissed off and they could potentially lose the license. Because no way in existence could this case get put in front of a Jury Trial that would rule in his favor. Evil Mastermind posted:That was amazing. Oh yes, The comic basically bred an entire cult of crazies and the drama that went on behind the scenes at Archie (which was a horribly structured company at the time) Is way more interesting than anything in the books themselves. I mentioned before that Penders was a writer on the comic for 12 years, but not the main one all the time, for a decent chunk the lead writer on the Sonic side was Karl Bollers. Let me sum up the difference between Karl and Penders thusly. Karl was overly verbose, and in general his stories just seemed to take forever to get going, in time he improved, but by then Penders was regaining top writing position. Penders was... exactly what was detailed in my big post, an egomaniacal talentless hack, and basically introduced loads and loads of characters that other people made better before the Penderpocalypse. One of the funniest stories I have from that era was the name of Knuckles little brother. Penders being the utterly boring person that he was, wanted to call him "Mace" like a weapon, because... yeah. Bollers, who both hated Penders (feeling was utterly mutual) and possessing a sense of humor said "Kneecaps the Echidna" because that poo poo's just funny. So Penders made sure to introduce Mace about an issue or two before Bollers could introduce Kneecaps, solidifying his canon name as Mace. So Bollers struck back by explaining in "Return to Angel Island" that his name was "Kneecapeon Mace" or Kneecaps for short. And again, the editor at this time, Justin Gabrie was a complete incompetent who couldn't do the one job an editor has... editing! resolving the differences between the different writers for a cohesive narrative! They just constantly sniped at one another. Onmi fucked around with this message at 20:48 on Feb 18, 2014 |
|
#
?
Feb 18, 2014 20:36
|
|
|
Re: Your last point Onmi, settling is not quite the dumb idea you make it out to be. Any lawyer worth his salt will tell you that once a matter goes in front of a jury, anything can happen. You can have the most guilty looking people in the world get aquittal because one or two people on the jury are convinced "all cops are corrupt and will lie about everything" and that everyone goes along with it. It's not likely, but the sheer unpredictability of a trial means that if you take an out and not have the thing proceed to trial you consider it. And just imagine how bad it would get if this thing did go to trial and some mad jury decided that Penders really did own everything? Anyway back on topic, I think it's hilarious how bored/annoyed looking Knuckles is in that last page where Tails is merging with all the versions of himself from the Multiverse. Like he's just phoning in the dialogue, collecting his paycheque and immediately leaving the comic to go home.
|
|
#
?
Feb 18, 2014 21:03
|
|
|
The Question IRL posted:Anyway back on topic, I think it's hilarious how bored/annoyed looking Knuckles is in that last page where Tails is merging with all the versions of himself from the Multiverse. Like he's just phoning in the dialogue, collecting his paycheque and immediately leaving the comic to go home.
|
|
#
?
Feb 18, 2014 21:08
|
|
|
The Question IRL posted:Re: Your last point Onmi, settling is not quite the dumb idea you make it out to be. Any lawyer worth his salt will tell you that once a matter goes in front of a jury, anything can happen. You can have the most guilty looking people in the world get aquittal because one or two people on the jury are convinced "all cops are corrupt and will lie about everything" and that everyone goes along with it. It's not likely, but the sheer unpredictability of a trial means that if you take an out and not have the thing proceed to trial you consider it. That's Rasta Knuckles, Athair.  If you're having troubles discerning the various Knuckles copies, I have this helpful guide  Also I wasn't implying that Settling was a bad choice, just that I couldn't fathom a jury trial buying what he was selling in the face of the evidence. The only reason that sham of a case lasted as long as it did was because Archie was hilariously mismanaged for a good portion of those 12 years and the original contracts went up in a fire, they thought photocopies would be sufficient. Of course all Penders had to say was "Nope didn't sign it" and there you go. Actually settling helps in that it doesn't create a legal precedent, so in the future when Penders tries to sue Sega and EA again, there wont be any precedent set in the Archie case to back him up. Had he won the case with an actual decision it could have been bad for them
|
|
#
?
Feb 18, 2014 21:10
|
|
|
Onmi posted:That's Rasta Knuckles, Athair. The only thing missing is a little "pop!" sound effect.
|
|
#
?
Feb 18, 2014 21:20
|
|
|
Onmi posted:That's Rasta Knuckles, Athair. Tails: After all this time, can't even you tell me?! 8-Bit Rasta Dog Head: I have to go now, my home planet needs me! (Kevin Prenders lifts animation cell upwards.) And I'd agree with you on the other point. As bad as him winning sounds like, it setting a precedent would arguably be even worse.
|
|
#
?
Feb 18, 2014 22:34
|
|
|
Onmi posted:First, the smite. Whoa, a breakup with a long-time girlfriend? Or maybe she's dead? Either way, no chance of happiness with a significant other? Sounds like somebody's trying to get a job at DC! 
TwoPair fucked around with this message at 00:46 on Feb 19, 2014 |
|
#
?
Feb 18, 2014 23:49
|
|
|
Forgot to mention, I had no idea that cover made such a big impression on Sega (I didn't realise Sega particularly cared about that sort of thing, seeing as they thought Sonic Heroes and Sonic 2006 were good ideas) until Onmi mentioned it in his post.
|
|
#
?
Feb 18, 2014 23:57
|
|
|
TwoPair posted:Whoa, a breakup with a long-time girlfriend? Or maybe she's dead? Either way, no chance of happiness with a significant other? Sounds like somebody's trying to get a job at DC! ...Joe Quesada? 
|
|
#
?
Feb 19, 2014 00:50
|
|
|
Metal Loaf posted:Forgot to mention, I had no idea that cover made such a big impression on Sega (I didn't realise Sega particularly cared about that sort of thing, seeing as they thought Sonic Heroes and Sonic 2006 were good ideas) until Onmi mentioned it in his post. well for the longest time they didn't because they thought the brand was untouchable. 2006, in may ways, was not exactly a time when sonic was strong as a brand. So if you're taking steps internally already to "Improve the quality" which I know is hilarious because they were working on 06 at the time, but if you are you're going to want everything carrying the brand to look good. To put into perspective how anal they became about Sonics image from this point on, it was mandated that Sonic may not cry, ever, he may not be in a relationship, ever. There's a bunch of others, but those are the two that stick out as things that had either been directly related to Sega putting their foot down, or had plagued the comic for years. For the record Sega's reasoning for not wanting Sonic to be in a relationship wasn't that they felt it "Aged" him or something stupid like that. Rather the character represents freedom, always characterized as "The Wind" so it wouldn't fit for him. It's actually really funny, because Archie basically has to do the comic now, send it to Sega and then they pretty much have free reign telling them what to do. In Penders day he could do whatever he wanted and nobody at Sega cared because money was flowing. I liken it to a parent coming home to find the house trashed from the wild parties the kids threw, poo poo smeared on the walls and all that. And deciding that they will no longer be going out, becuse the child can not be trusted anymore. Even after the child has been kicked out and a new person has come to live at the house, they still have that really vivid image of the house utterly destroyed. By the way, Penders was not actually fired from the book, he was demoted to back ups and "art" which is in quotation marks because I would not call what Penders does art. But Penders didn't like that, so he had a plan. He said "I'm leaving" and Archie would realize how important he was and make him the main writer again. Instead he got told to not let the door hit him on the way out. If you can take one good thing from all the things surrounding Ken, it's that he's so utterly blacklisted himself that no one in the industry would work with him. Not that he's not insane and thinks everyone is clamoring for more Lara-Su. He also thinks that, despite his trying to sue Sega, that Sega would love to take the license from Archie and give it to him. And he said that if it happened, he would throw out, everything he hadn't worked on and just picked up where he left off.
|
|
#
?
Feb 19, 2014 04:18
|
|
|
That's the equivalent of Todd McFarlane wanting Spider-Man for Image Comics and being convinced Disney would think that wise. I mean, I don't know how Archie structures contracts with their writers, but isn't it the same as the Big 2, where ultimately the characters belong to the company? I suppose that's what the lawsuit was about, I'm just wondering how he could get away with it this far.
|
|
#
?
Feb 19, 2014 05:50
|
|
|
Probably Magic posted:That's the equivalent of Todd McFarlane wanting Spider-Man for Image Comics and being convinced Disney would think that wise. I mean, I don't know how Archie structures contracts with their writers, but isn't it the same as the Big 2, where ultimately the characters belong to the company? I suppose that's what the lawsuit was about, I'm just wondering how he could get away with it this far. Because Archie was poorly structured so even though he had signed a contract that basically is the standard "Everything created here is owned by sega" etc. etc. But there was a fire and the original was lost, they had a photocopy but that's not considered evidence in court, since it could have been faked. And Ken just claimed "Nope, I never signed a contract, they just paid me to write stories but I was never signed to a contract" So he lucked out, especially because Sega didn't want to get involved and Archie didn't want to make them mad because they had threatened to pull the license. I believe the court transcripts have been released but I can only find this one on Bleeding Cool, and you can see just how awkward it is for Archie because they can't really justify going to court OR settling without Sega, and Sega does not want to be involved http://www.bleedingcool.com/2013/05/09/archie-desperate-to-settle-but-cant-without-sega-the-latest-in-the-ken-penders-sonic-comics-case/
|
|
#
?
Feb 19, 2014 06:44
|
|
|
Was there a point where Sonic turned from a kid's comic into furry fodder, or did it just slowly morph over time?
|
|
#
?
Feb 19, 2014 09:28
|
|
|
The secret to Sonic is that at no point was it good and always was an attempt to be "edgy" or "cool" with kids and as such attracted a terrible audience.
|
|
#
?
Feb 19, 2014 09:30
|
|
|
Say Nothing posted:Was there a point where Sonic turned from a kid's comic into furry fodder, or did it just slowly morph over time? Yes there is. And there's a point where it turned back too.
|
|
#
?
Feb 19, 2014 11:32
|
|
|
Thanks for the effort Omni. That certainly is a trainwreck. You didn't even mention Penders' creative naming of Lara-Su's mother - Mari-Su.Probably Magic posted:That's the equivalent of Todd McFarlane wanting Spider-Man for Image Comics 
|
|
#
?
Feb 19, 2014 13:04
|
|
|
Or is it Sputnik posted:Thanks for the effort Omni. That certainly is a trainwreck. You didn't even mention Penders' creative naming of Lara-Su's mother - Mari-Su. That would be because that isn't Lara-Su's mother, that's Julie-Su's mother. and Julie-Su is Lara-Su's mother. Oh man speaking of that pissed me right the gently caress off, along side "Everyone is literally knuckles/sonic etc. except with hair." "The dreadlocks on the Echdina's are head tentacles and some people have robot hair" and the Cabal of Secret Grandpas. Every loving female echidna, without loving fail, was Name-Two Lettters Lien-Da, Julie-Su, Lara-Su, Mari-Su, Mari-An Who by the way marries Rob O' The Hedge because as we've established despite all his cries of Sega infringing on his copywrite while he is totally innocent, he loved making "Sonic but X" in this case Robin Hood. And so on and loving forth! And the men don't have a similar naming pattern! It's Knuckles or Locke or Remmington etc. etc. It's a little thing, but the thing is there's so many little things. Oh yeah that also reminds me, Penders wanted to establish a "Canon" name for Sonic, because Sonic couldn't just be his name Olgilvie Maurice Hedgehog his last name is in fact, Hedgehog still. Son of Bernadette and Jules.  Yes, his mother was literally just him, but purple, and with a tuft of blond hair. Because their quills aren't their hair or anything.  Manga designs seemed to think so, but hey styling those quills as hair would be difficult, best assume that Sonic and Knuckles are bald I guess.
|
|
#
?
Feb 19, 2014 13:32
|
|
|
Reading the Spidey thread reminded me of a lovely lovely Daredevil run, Bob Gale's run. It was a 6 issue legal "thriller" between Bendis's frogman story and Bendis's classic run. It was just a lovely lovely story that made no real sense, and ended in the most shocking may - Peter dressed up as Daredevil. It was complete poo poo and the worst run of Daredevil volume 2. Rereading Kevin Smith's run I have seen that it is trash too, but it is nothing compared to this poo poo storyline. At least Smith's run had an event that much better writere were able to build off of. This run is so bad that it has never been reprinted or mentioned again.
|
|
#
?
Feb 19, 2014 14:19
|
|
|
Man, Sonic comics were messed up... All I really remember is reading a few that were in a hospital toy room, but those would probably be UK ones. I remember Super Sonic was evil though. That said, I kinda want to read whatever book that example 'good page' came from, with Amy Rose and what I can only assume is Sun Wukong fighting stuff.
|
|
#
?
Feb 19, 2014 14:52
|
|
|
Elfface posted:Man, Sonic comics were messed up... That was during the Iron Dominion Storyline, Monkey Khan, who yes is just Sun Wukong with a new coat of paint which I was fine with because Wukong is awesome. And the guy that Amy smacks around (because she's awesome once 160 hits) is the Ox Demon King, Some people don't like the story I personally do because it gave us a lot of good stuff.     Steven Butler still can't do a good Sonic though, it's very noticable that he;s trying to stretch the proportions to a body size the bodies weren't meant to go. But, since this is the bad runs thread, I will again bring up something bad. Many. Hands. Many Hands was a pseudonum for whoever did the art for this issue. Whoever this is would never reveal it.   Someone drew an entire issue like that, then Gabrie, the editor, looked at that said "Yup, that's fine" and it was promptly shipped! if you were ever curious as to how poorly run Archie was at the time, that should be proof enough. I honeslty still can't decide whether Penders Photoshop backgrounds and bad art are worse than Many Hands. And yes the comics you were reading were the UK ones, which are actually fairly good, Mark Millar worked on them too. Also Sonic is just a massive insecure prick to everyone and it's hilarious. Also it could just be beautifully drawn at times to. I recommend giving it a check again. I think it's held up.
|
|
#
?
Feb 19, 2014 16:03
|
|
|
Sonic the Comic (the British comic) was my all-time favourite comic when I was growing up and I still have a lot of affection for it. It did indeed have a consistently very good art team (Richard Elson, Nigel Dobbyn, Roberto Corona and so on) and the main stories were really good once Nigel Kitching arrived.
|
|
#
?
Feb 19, 2014 16:13
|
|
|
I enjoyed Sonic the Comic as a kid until it literally stopped printing new stories. It coasted for about a year entirely on reprinting stuff from the beginning of its life, and when people started complaining on the letters page, they took away the letters page and it never returned. I was far too young to understand why any of this would be happening. I was so confused  The last "new" story, predictably, was a cliffhanger.
|
|
#
?
Feb 19, 2014 16:45
|
|
|
I didn't notice it so much because I started reading maybe a couple of months before they started reprinting older stuff, but by the time the comic ended they'd caught up with the back-up strips I read when they were new. The last story was an extremely loose adaptation of Sonic Adventure. It rushes the ending worse than a Grant Morrison story but it was probably the best they could have managed under the circumstances. 
|
|
#
?
Feb 19, 2014 17:04
|
|
|
Many Hands/Manny Hands/Diverse Hands isn't just an Archie pseudonym. When a Marvel book ran late, they would just grab whoever was availible and put them on finishing the book. I don't think the people involved didn't want to be associated with the work as much as crediting five different inkers is rather messy. I don't remember the exact issue number, but there was an issue of X-Men while Cyclops and Phoenix were living in Alaska that had a different artist for almost every new page. The cover boasted "The most artists in one comic book ever!". Times change, I suppose. If you're interested, you can find Señor Manos Marvel rap sheet Here and here, as well an article about the mysterious penciller/inker/letterer/colorist here. Or is it Sputnik fucked around with this message at 17:18 on Feb 19, 2014 |
|
#
?
Feb 19, 2014 17:04
|
|
|
Or is it Sputnik posted:I don't remember the exact issue number, but there was an issue of X-Men while Cyclops and Phoenix were living in Alaska that had a different artist for almost every new page. The cover boasted "The most artists in one comic book ever!". Times change, I suppose.  I need more JHW3 X-action in my life. (this issue was his only X-work outside of two issues of X-Man and a Wolvie annual) redbackground fucked around with this message at 17:23 on Feb 19, 2014 |
|
#
?
Feb 19, 2014 17:14
|
|
|
And at some point apparently Jean was replaced with a Real Doll.
|
|
#
?
Feb 19, 2014 17:15
|
|
|
redbackground posted:Only because I literally just read through that one, it was during the Kelly/Seagle era, and it was Scott and Jean on an airplane dealing with a hairy situation. What a lineup for that issue though--John Cassaday, Terry Dodson, Tommy Lee Edwards, Cully Hamner, Cary Nord, & JH Williams III. Yeah, it switches to a new artist like every other spread.
|
|
#
?
Feb 19, 2014 17:19
|
|
|
Or is it Sputnik posted:Thanks! Am I misremembering, or were they actually on their way to Alaska for some R&R?
|
|
#
?
Feb 19, 2014 17:20
|
|
|
With the new RoboCop movie, I figure I should talk about the comic Terminator/RoboCop: Kill Human by Rob Williams and PJ Holden. There have been a lot of RoboCop comics from all sorts of publishers. Marvel did a 23-issue series that was really fun. Frank Miller's RoboCop vs. Terminator is the one comic that challenges Dark Knight Returns as my favorite Miller work. Then there's the RoboCop series based on Miller's original ideas for RoboCop 2, which was dull as hell. But nothing compares to the terribleness of Kill Human. It reads like Williams had an outline filled with 3-4 halfway all right ideas and never came up with anything past that. It starts in the future where there's only one human left. She stumbles upon a Skynet museum and accidentally wakes up RoboCop. He protects her from the T-800s, but has no idea what the hell's happened. As he connects into a computer with his spike, Skynet forces him to shoot the last human in the head against his will. RoboCop is horrified and pissed off, also mad that according to Skynet, there are now zero humans in the world when he's standing right there. He downloads information on how this came to be, downloads the directions on how to travel through time and does so. Skynet allows this because he's a robot and is therefore on their side. RoboCop then goes back to the time of Terminator 2, tells the Connors, "Come with me if you'd like to live. You have ten seconds to comply," and he tries to prevent the horrible future. That right there is a good start. A good, new direction to take the crossover concept. Then everything completely falls apart. It turns out that RoboCop went back further in time. He met up with college graduate Dick Jones and gave him the specs for the ED209, making them allies. That in itself puts the timeline into question because if Jones is that young and the robot apocalypse happens after RoboCop is shut down for good, then how old is John Connor supposed to be when the war is going on? Hell, we already know that he's going to lose the war anyway, so why is he even important? The whole Dick Jones alliance was created so RoboCop had a way of countering the T-1000. It's all for naught, as it escapes containment anyway. Then everyone is put on a series of aircraft carriers to keep them protected and that doesn't work out either. RoboCop's end game is to ultimately allow T-1000 to kill John Connor just so he can wipe him out with Dick Jones' special metal-killing acid. Everyone ends up dying except for maybe Sarah Connor. So there you go. A crossover where the climax is that RoboCop would murder a child for the greater good. And you know what? We don't even know what the greater good is supposed to be here. He tells the Connors earlier that the events of Terminator 2 don't do anything to prevent Skynet's takeover. He never says why, nor does the comic ever let us know. RoboCop's master plan is to do all the poo poo they did in the normal timeline (destroy both Terminators, the mangled up arm and the computer chip), but also create an army of ED209s and get a ton of people killed, including John Connor and Dick Jones. There's no logic whatsoever. Gavok fucked around with this message at 20:50 on Feb 19, 2014 |
|
#
?
Feb 19, 2014 20:47
|
|
|
Onmi posted:Yes there is. And there's a point where it turned back too.
|
|
#
?
Feb 20, 2014 01:04
|
|
Onmi posted:Yes there is. And there's a point where it turned back too. I appreciate the efforts of the newer writers who tried to salvage the Sonic comic and fix what's horrible about it while keeping its continuity, but I'm reminded of a Tolkien story about dwarves trying to reclaim a fortress where the dragon Thorog wiped out many dwarves, and finding it to be too tainted by the evil that had been done there to be salvageable.
|
|
|
#
?
Feb 20, 2014 01:10
|
|
|
Lurdiak posted:I appreciate the efforts of the newer writers who tried to salvage the Sonic comic and fix what's horrible about it while keeping its continuity, but I'm reminded of a Tolkien story about dwarves trying to reclaim a fortress where the dragon Thorog wiped out many dwarves, and finding it to be too tainted by the evil that had been done there to be salvageable. Which is why I am partially thankful that they settled with Penders, as that caused the Penderspocalypse and now it's all done. And while it did suck to lose a few characters, now the cancer has all been cut out with a scalple. Thank god that Megaman crossover happened when it did. For the record, they decided that rather than go back to their already hosed up world with half the characters missing they decided "Screw it!" and used the end of the Megaman Crossover to reboot it. But unlike say a DC reboot they didn't do this because "ooh new sales" but becuase "Literally 70% of the cast just became unavaliable and Knuckles just lost his entire race, lets instead make the world free of all that cancerous bullshit, let the main group retain their memories so they know what happened and we can call back to any stories in the future, and forge on.  Amy remains awesome unlike how she was in the games, and the best character is Big.  Because Big has no fucks to give about all your bullshit, he's just chill so long as his frogs fine. The comic is about to do an Unleashed arc as fallout from the reality essentially being rewritten and then hosed up by Eggman while Sonic was trying to fix it, and after that Lost Worlds will probably happen since it hasn't happened in-canon yes. Colours has however... Say Nothing posted:I'm guessing Penders was to blame. Indeed, Mike Gallagher was perfectly content to write his funny book with his cartoon hedgehog and the SatAM characters fighting a fat man and his ineffectual horde of badniks in what, as I described, was essentially a bunch of kids fighting the extremely crusty neighbour who seemed to war with them. Then Penders introduced stuff like "The Great War" and "Overlanders" who would be the humans of the setting, born from mutation when aliens Gene Bombed earth, and Station Square was under a mountain because he had established that the furry tribes had chased all the overlanders off planet, and the Echidnas were a super advanced society with a cloaked city watched over by a Cabal of Secret Grandpas with their Cyborg tech loving faction splits and the eeeeeevil Dingo's and on it went. And of course the 666 descendent of Robotnik, Droid. And he would spend issues at a time, going on and on about the past, and it wasn't a good past. It just served to make the comic retardedly dark, it served to make Sonic feel like an outsider in his own setting, because again Penders had never played Sonic, he had never watched his kids play Sonic, yet was so arrogant about Sonic that he had declared (in the comic) that Archie Sonic was "Sonic Prime, the Sonic from which all other Sonics came from" Including the games. I still like his defense of basically what he did, that being that "Sonic never had a backstory or interesting characters, so I had to do something to have interesting stories." Okay think on that, throw it around https://sites.google.com/site/sthcharasbyauthor/list-of-ken-penders-characters That is a list of all the characters Penders ever created. You can go look through the other writers and with the exception of Ian Flynn (who's characters mostly existed to flesh out the setting, like with Eggmans underlings or the entire Dragon Kingdom stuff) no one ever created as much useless loving characters as Ken Penders. And then okay fine, in 1994 it was Sonic, Tails, Knuckles, Amy, Eggman with Nack, the Chaotix, Bean and Bark and assorted game characters I'm forgetting, along side the SatAM characters. So we have... okay Bollers once did his "What I planned to do after Sonic returned a year later after saving the world and being thought dead" and he tiered them pretty well in terms of importance Primary Characters are Sonic, Knuckles, Tails, Amy. 1st Tier is the Chaotix and Sally there's a single Penders character here with Julie-Su, Knuckles Beau who never had anything interesting done with her, ever. 2nd Tier was Bunnie, Antoine, Mina Mongoose; who was a Bollers character and if you've ever watched Macross/Robotech? She was Minmei, like literally. Her boyfriend Ash was Kaifun. If you've never seen Macross go do it. Anyway Nicole, Rouge, Shadow and then like the parents and Fiona Fox, who was a Gallagher character as a robot and then Penders made a flesh and blood Fiona. 3rd Tier was Rotor, Monkey Khan, Big the Cat, the side characters for the side characters or the heroes who showed up every once in a while for an arc and then pissed off to the wild blue yonder. Simple tier system, main game characters first, secondary game characters and SatAM characters divided between 1,2 and 3. THIS WAS NOT SO UNDER PENDERS. Under Penders the most important characters, the ones driving the plot and all of that were always his own creations. They were first with Knuckles and sort of Tails whenever DESTINY was being built towards. Sonic was literally just there because he was licensed to be there. So reading the comics wasn't reading the adventures of Sonic the Hedgehog, it was the adventures of these random OCs guest starring Sonic.
|
|
#
?
Feb 20, 2014 02:50
|
|
|
Just want to say I am really loving all this Penders stuff. I remember reading (and to my adult self's shame) enjoying the Sonic stuff in the 90s. I loved the whole 'A Moment of Archie Sonic' tumblr that sadly seems to have died. If there's any good blogs or other sources of this stuff, I'd love to see'em. It's like the perfect storm of entertaining awful: an insane hack with a massive ego, and a clusterfuck of written work to go with it. Kind of like Sonichu, where both the 'art' and the 'artist' are equally fascinating from a trainwreck perspective. What I don't get is how the gently caress did Penders manage to get such control?
|
|
#
?
Feb 20, 2014 04:18
|
|
|
RoboChrist 9000 posted:Just want to say I am really loving all this Penders stuff. I remember reading (and to my adult self's shame) enjoying the Sonic stuff in the 90s. I loved the whole 'A Moment of Archie Sonic' tumblr that sadly seems to have died. /v/ is currently Marathoning the entire comic from start to finish, Before they had just done the later issues and Ian and Dubs dropped in to comment on it. They also dropped in to comment on the /co/ Marathon which lead to this lovely Off-Panel as a shoutout  So you can read it there if you can stomach /v/ being /v/. As far as a compilation of all the loving insanity of Penders? Not really. How did he gain so much control? Well look at how many characters he created. Think of it like this, at this time Archie was a horribly run company, they had absolutely no structure, I've been over how Justin Gabrie was the most horrible editor and couldn't do the bare basics of his job. He was in control because he was the writer, Sega didn't care because they were getting money, Archie didn't care because they were poorly run, Gabrie didn't care because he was a pillock, so who the gently caress was going to stop him? The only person at the time who did not deal with his poo poo was Bollers, everyone else tolerated him but Bollers and Penders just loving HATED one another, especially since Bollers was the head writer for a while, while Penders was the back up writer. And they would constantly gently caress with each other to the point where nothing made sense. One would close a story arc and the other would act like it had never happened. What happened in the end was that Penders and Bollers were arguing I think on a forum? and Penders called him Benny Lee. Benny Lee was a Pseudonym he used on the comic when writing stories some times which was really funny because the opinions he gave as Benny Lee essentially talked about wanting to use more of the games stuff. Penders also outed Gabrie, who wasn't doing his loving job, as Romy Chacon so he was just a massive dick and pissed off everyone.
|
|
#
?
Feb 20, 2014 04:56
|
|
|
Onmi posted:Sega didn't care because they were getting money Really you could have shortened the post to this and described the entire Sonic franchise across all media since the Genesis. The one thing I don't get, thinking about all this stuff with Sonic comics, is why there were never any Nintendo comics. The Sonic comics were born out of that early 90s hype of "get this poo poo all over as much media as possible!" and you'd figure Nintendo would've done that too with Mario. Or if not Mario, I mean, they've only got a dozen other franchises that'd be good for comics but the only thing I can think of right off hand are the batshit insane Game Boy comics that Gavok wrote about at 4thletter. I guess Sega really does do what Nintendon't. Basically what I'm saying here is Nintendo, please license the rights for a Metroid comic to like... any publisher and I will buy all of the issues please and thank you. TwoPair fucked around with this message at 05:24 on Feb 20, 2014 |
|
#
?
Feb 20, 2014 05:22
|
|
|
TwoPair posted:Really you could have shortened the post to this and described the entire Sonic franchise across all media since the Genesis. There were some Nintendo comics in the early 90's. I think they were published by Valiant, and there was at least a Mario comic and Captain N comic (based on the TV shows at the time).
|
|
#
?
Feb 20, 2014 05:32
|
|
|
TwoPair posted:Really you could have shortened the post to this and described the entire Sonic franchise across all media since the Genesis. Tracey Yardley who does the art on the Sonic Comic did sketches for a Mario, Kirby and Metroid comic for Nintendo, they didn't want it. So don't think Archie didn't think of it themselves. EDIT: Here we go    http://www.comicartfans.com/galleryroom.asp?gsub=134338 Source there Onmi fucked around with this message at 05:48 on Feb 20, 2014 |
|
#
?
Feb 20, 2014 05:35
|
|
|
|
| # ? May 24, 2024 17:09 |
|
|
Valiant did comics for Mario, Zelda, Captain N and Game Boy. The Mario and Zelda ones were based on the cartoon versions. The Game Boy one was based on smoking a lot of crack. They also did at least one big one-shot that featured stories for Punch Out and the like. Meanwhile, Nintendo Power had their own comics for Mario, Zelda, Metroid, Star Fox and then some random one-shots like Blast Corps. Some of them were released in trade.
|
|
#
?
Feb 20, 2014 05:36
|
|