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ScarletBrother posted:Standard? Enjoy! Most of your cards will be worthless in October! (Play Modern and/or Legacy) While a lot of stores support Modern now, Standard is still by far the most supported and played format. Legacy is still very spotty and is straight up not played in some smaller communities. I agree that now is probably not the best time to be building a deck that relies on a bunch of expensive cards that are rotating in 6 months, but if you're looking to play frequent Magic the eternal formats aren't an option in many communities.
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Mar 18, 2014 01:31
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Entropic posted:Modern and Legacy are "cheaper in the long run".* Just becuase I planned on playing Enchantress doesn't mean the metagame will let me. 
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Mar 18, 2014 01:37
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Does standard mono-black run any card >$5 apart from Thoughtseize and Mutavault? That deck is big pile of RTR block rares that were dollar-bin until it started using them. If you wanna get burned on Standard prices right now, buy your $150 worth of Domri Rades for RG Monsters.
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Mar 18, 2014 01:55
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Entropic posted:Does standard mono-black run any card >$5 apart from Thoughtseize and Mutavault? That deck is big pile of RTR block rares that were dollar-bin until it started using them. I was deeply considering playing RG monsters for a while. And then I remembered it requires a playset of a 30 dollar planeswalker. 
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Mar 18, 2014 02:01
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Entropic posted:Modern and Legacy are "cheaper in the long run".* But I mean the rotation isn't on a static, years old seasonal pattern more predictable than the weather or anything.
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Mar 18, 2014 02:02
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Spiderdrake posted:More like if you plan on never trading before the rotation, trading every card that just dropped in value right after the rotation and can never see yourself successfully speculating on incredibly difficult to predict cards like Geist and Snapcaster. Are you trying to say Legacy is cheap if you play it smart? 'cause rotation doesn't really help you with Underground Seas and Forces of Will.
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Mar 18, 2014 02:06
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TheLawinator posted:My local store has been running a paper pauper league using MTGO rules and it has been pretty beast. I bet playing Temporal Fissure without having to click every single step of the combo is great.
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Mar 18, 2014 02:09
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Entropic posted:Are you trying to say Legacy is cheap if you play it smart? No, but neither of these will ever fall out of flavour in legacy and you'll have a net gain purchasing these at any point in time and selling them at any later point in time before magic crashes hard. Consider it a stock investment.
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Mar 18, 2014 02:11
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morning wood posted:And to support my argument of modern/legacy being stupidly overpriced I've attached a link to the Richmond GP modern decklist. Lowest deck price was $600 with most decks costing several thousand dollars. And 75% of that value is probably land. So do what I'm doing: Set aside $X out of each paycheck solely for Modern or Legacy staples. If you play Commander, start with lands of a color you can use so you don't have a bunch of money in lands sitting around until you get everything. I've been setting aside $200 out of each check to buy duals and stuff. If you can't afford that, set aside $50, or $25, or whatever. Duals in particular are only ever going to go up in value, so it's never a bad purchase. Eventually you'll get the lands, which are a huge part of the cost of most eternal decks.
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Mar 18, 2014 02:13
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rabidsquid posted:I bet playing Temporal Fissure without having to click every single step of the combo is great. That card is banned. Combo decks right now are the infinite ghostly flicker mill thing and midnight guard with presence of grond.
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Mar 18, 2014 02:17
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TheLawinator posted:That card is banned. Combo decks right now are the infinite ghostly flicker mill thing and midnight guard with presence of grond. When did Fissure get banned? I guess I haven't been keeping up on Pauper for awhile. Did anything else get banned with it?
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Mar 18, 2014 02:26
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TheLawinator posted:That card is banned. Combo decks right now are the infinite ghostly flicker mill thing and midnight guard with presence of grond. Yeah "Storm" is dead but decks that use Ravnica karoos, Ghostly Flicker, Snap, Cloud of Faeries, familiars, Mnemonic Wall and Mulldrifter have taken their place. Fissure has just been replaced with Capsize since the previously listed cards generate infinite amounts of mana so you can buyback until their whole board is bounced. Cloud of Faeries was the real problem card and should have been on the chopping block as well. rabidsquid posted:When did Fissure get banned? I guess I haven't been keeping up on Pauper for awhile. Did anything else get banned with it? Cloudpost.
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Mar 18, 2014 02:28
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rabidsquid posted:When did Fissure get banned? I guess I haven't been keeping up on Pauper for awhile. Did anything else get banned with it? Cloudpost. Everything's all better now. Bit much monoblue, but eh.
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Mar 18, 2014 02:28
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I play mono black control in Pauper and it is fun enough. Pauper is an odd format.
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Mar 18, 2014 02:33
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Gyshall posted:I play mono black control in Pauper and it is fun enough. Pauper is an odd format. This is the way to go in paper (if you're not using MTGO rules) where you have access to Hymn to Tourach and Sinkhole. While a $120 playset of Sinkholes certainly goes against the spirit of the format, it is technically legal.
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Mar 18, 2014 02:48
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Abunchofdickwavers posted:Cost of standard vs eternal formats pissing contest Oh goody! This old chestnut!
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Mar 18, 2014 03:19
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Promoted Pawn posted:This is the way to go in paper (if you're not using MTGO rules) where you have access to Hymn to Tourach and Sinkhole. While a $120 playset of Sinkholes certainly goes against the spirit of the format, it is technically legal. Oh god monoblack doesn't need the help. I play Slivers as I'm an honorable samurai.
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Mar 18, 2014 03:21
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$90 boxes? My FLGS charges AUS$170 for booster boxes, and that's for already released ones like Theros. Am I getting boned because I can't order online and don't live in the US, or what? 
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Mar 18, 2014 03:42
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BaronVonVaderham posted:Agreed. It's not "just vapor", there's ample evidence otherwise (besides common sense...you're inhaling something other than "just vapor" and your lungs aren't perfect 100% efficiency filters), and they gently caress up my lungs whenever someone uses them around me. I just complained about it to the store owner, as did some other people, and he was happy to ban them from the shop; he actually uses one himself, so it was really cool of him. I had someone get super mad at me and say I wa sbeing rude because I politely asked him to stop smoking his and then explained that I was just enforcing rules. People are assholes.
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Mar 18, 2014 03:44
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ungulateman posted:$90 boxes? My FLGS charges AUS$170 for booster boxes, and that's for already released ones like Theros. The one near my house is the cheapest in the area (The Deck Box in Asheville, NC), they did $90 if you preordered BotG. Boosters are always a flat $3 there too, and they have two free standard tournaments with store credit payout per weekend, among other events (including FNM). Their singles are also always really close to the tcgplayer averages so I never feel like I'm overpaying. All uncommons are .25c except the real high value ones and commons are free. Compare to the highest-priced but biggest store in the area, which charges .25c for all commons and uses SCG as the flat price guide. Some stores are just better than others, shop around.
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Mar 18, 2014 04:06
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Entropic posted:Are you trying to say Legacy is cheap if you play it smart? No, he's saying that about Standard, in that it's impossible to get really badly price-squeezed unless you stubbornly insist on holding onto your soon-to-be-rotating Standard staples past the point where they become worthless for obvious reasons. If you trade intelligently and are willing to let go of your pet Standard deck in late spring/early summer, Standard isn't really that expensive to play and stay competitive in from season to season. Just manage your card pool intelligently and according to the format's painfully predictable patterns and seasonal swings.
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Mar 18, 2014 04:18
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MiddleEastBeast posted:No, he's saying that about Standard, in that it's impossible to get really badly price-squeezed unless you stubbornly insist on holding onto your soon-to-be-rotating Standard staples past the point where they become worthless for obvious reasons. If you trade intelligently and are willing to let go of your pet Standard deck in late spring/early summer, Standard isn't really that expensive to play and stay competitive in from season to season. Just manage your card pool intelligently and according to the format's painfully predictable patterns and seasonal swings. I used to look at Standard as a waste of money, too, but then realized it's just a matter of reaching a critical trade mass. As long as you have all the necessary dual lands for the season, and enough of the format staple spells, you can keep up with the entire season with no additional injection of money as long as you're willing to trade. Then, just be smart about cashing out before rotation (i.e. trade your about-to-rotate-block cards for things from the non-rotating-block that will likely hold value, or sell them and then use those funds to buy singles after rotation). It only works if you have enough value, though, otherwise you just don't have enough variety to trade with and get stuck with cards no one wants (or inevitably lose a trickle of value if you keep selling and then re-buying rather than trading for equal value). You'd also be stuck without anything to play while you're transitioning between decks. Modern and Legacy, on the other hand, require a ton of up-front investment, but then are far easier to maintain. I'm just trying to get into Legacy, and I'm starting by getting all of the fetchlands I'll need for two different decks, then the dual lands. It seems expensive if you want to change decks frequently, which is why I'm building two that have a lot of overlap in things like lands. If you eventually have all the lands and staples like Force of Will, swapping out the cards unique to each deck is no worse than keeping up with an expensive Standard archetype (but with far less risk since they won't swing in value as much). There's also no tremendous concern that it will tank in value; even a reprint won't be awful, original printings in the old frame will hold most (if not all of) their value. All that said, the best tool you can have is a good source of disposable income, otherwise this game can be really difficult; take it from the guy who got into it while unemployed for over a year and still managed to keep up with two formats. If you're willing to trade hard, you can make any format work for you...it's hard but it can be done.
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Mar 18, 2014 04:31
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MiddleEastBeast posted:No, he's saying that about Standard, in that it's impossible to get really badly price-squeezed unless you stubbornly insist on holding onto your soon-to-be-rotating Standard staples past the point where they become worthless for obvious reasons. If you trade intelligently and are willing to let go of your pet Standard deck in late spring/early summer, Standard isn't really that expensive to play and stay competitive in from season to season. Just manage your card pool intelligently and according to the format's painfully predictable patterns and seasonal swings. I just got tired of doing this whole dance every rotation. I really like being able to play the same decks year after year, so Modern works well for me. I happened to get in on it when the format was new and get a lot of my cards pretty cheap ($15 fetches), so I was really lucky.
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Mar 18, 2014 04:33
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TheLawinator posted:Oh god monoblack doesn't need the help. I play Slivers as I'm an honorable samurai. Do you actually have any success with it? How many colors do you run?
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Mar 18, 2014 04:35
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MiddleEastBeast posted:No, he's saying that about Standard, in that it's impossible to get really badly price-squeezed unless you stubbornly insist on holding onto your soon-to-be-rotating Standard staples past the point where they become worthless for obvious reasons. If you trade intelligently and are willing to let go of your pet Standard deck in late spring/early summer, Standard isn't really that expensive to play and stay competitive in from season to season. Just manage your card pool intelligently and according to the format's painfully predictable patterns and seasonal swings. My time is more valuable to me than what I would get from ~value trading~ each rotation. gently caress that noise.
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Mar 18, 2014 04:53
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Toshimo posted:My time is more valuable to me than what I would get from ~value trading~ each rotation. gently caress that noise. Yeah, my schedule allows me one day a week to go to the LGS. I'll be hosed if I'm going to spend it binder grinding.
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Mar 18, 2014 04:57
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BaronVonVaderham posted:Modern and Legacy, on the other hand, require a ton of up-front investment, but then are far easier to maintain. I'm just trying to get into Legacy, and I'm starting by getting all of the fetchlands I'll need for two different decks, then the dual lands. It seems expensive if you want to change decks frequently, which is why I'm building two that have a lot of overlap in things like lands. If you eventually have all the lands and staples like Force of Will, swapping out the cards unique to each deck is no worse than keeping up with an expensive Standard archetype (but with far less risk since they won't swing in value as much). There's also no tremendous concern that it will tank in value; even a reprint won't be awful, original printings in the old frame will hold most (if not all of) their value. I'm kind of doing something like this, building one deck each for Modern and Legacy and sticking to them. I really like the idea of eternal formats where your cards stay legal except for bans, but I'll admit that there's a pretty high activation energy to get into those formats. This is also why I'm a big fan of EDH, both for its eternal nature and that the singleton rule means that you can build a perfectly viable deck without breaking the bank (but breaking the bank is definitely viable as well, I can attest to that). That's not to diss Standard either, I just don't have enough chances to play the game to warrant getting into a format with higher turnover.
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Mar 18, 2014 05:25
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Yeah, obviously valuing your time more than grinding through value-trades to mitigate your financial loss before every block rotation is a valid counterpoint. I was more just clarifying what Spiderdrake was saying and making the point that if you do really care about not losing tremendous value by playing Standard, it's not impossible and certainly doesn't require a crystal ball or superior trade skill from a financial perspective. The time and effort required obviously doesn't suit everyone's lifestyle by a longshot though and that's perfectly fine.
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Mar 18, 2014 05:27
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For those wondering, I took down that Odyssey draft running a pretty sweet green/blue deck with many phantoms, 2x deep anal, and Brian Kibler's invitational card. I also watched my friend hit a guy running black white with this guy so many times that all 8 of his lands were turned and he became very frustrated.  He let the first hit in because he thought it was a temporary effect (???) for some reason.
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Mar 18, 2014 05:30
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The March Hare posted:For those wondering, I took down that Odyssey draft running a pretty sweet green/blue deck with many phantoms, 2x deep anal, and Brian Kibler's invitational card. Which one was that? I know Shadowmage Infiltrator was Finkel's, but Sylvan Safekeeper was from Olle Rade, at least according to Wikipedia.
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Mar 18, 2014 05:46
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C-Euro posted:Which one was that? I know Shadowmage Infiltrator was Finkel's, but Sylvan Safekeeper was from Olle Rade, at least according to Wikipedia. 
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Mar 18, 2014 05:53
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 Edit: Also, looking back on it now, this card is just crazy loving good in OTJ limited. It's one thing to turn any card you want into a Giant Growth, it's quite another to do it in a block where you want to be discarding things. Promoted Pawn fucked around with this message at 06:01 on Mar 18, 2014 |
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Mar 18, 2014 05:57
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Mar 18, 2014 05:59
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I thought we'd lost our subforum for a minute there! Question: what's the worst rare? Every once in a while I spring for a pack or two from older sets and I end up with just crap, pure crap. 
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Mar 18, 2014 06:38
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Recess Rapist posted:I thought we'd lost our subforum for a minute there! That doesn't seem that bad as far as playable in limited stuff goes.
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Mar 18, 2014 06:43
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Really, that's your example of a crap rare? It was pretty good quality-wise for its day (bear that's also a disenchant on a stick? yes please) though if memory serves it ended up being too slow for its format because you really wanted your artifact removal to cost 1 mana instead of 4. I suppose if your argument is that it should have been uncommon instead, then that has some more legs.
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Mar 18, 2014 06:47
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Recess Rapist posted:I thought we'd lost our subforum for a minute there! Necropotence. I mean, you can't draw cards normally AND you have to pay life to ? Unplayable. Or maybe Steamflogger Boss or Vizzerdrix. Plus all the Laces. Then there's stuff like Leveller and Thought Lash which have some weird corner case uses ( Fling, Summoner's Egg/Donate.) JerryLee posted:I suppose if your argument is that it should have been uncommon instead, then that has some more legs. http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?multiverseid=213772 suicidesteve fucked around with this message at 06:53 on Mar 18, 2014 |
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Mar 18, 2014 06:48
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BaronVonVaderham posted:I used to look at Standard as a waste of money, too, but then realized it's just a matter of reaching a critical trade mass. As long as you have all the necessary dual lands for the season, and enough of the format staple spells, you can keep up with the entire season with no additional injection of money as long as you're willing to trade. Then, just be smart about cashing out before rotation (i.e. trade your about-to-rotate-block cards for things from the non-rotating-block that will likely hold value, or sell them and then use those funds to buy singles after rotation). I recently looked through my standard binder and my assembled decks and put some thought into the following questions: 1) which decks do I want to keep playing for this standard season? 2) what archetypes could I see myself wanting to play between now and rotation? 3). What cards from RTR do I see maintaining value? 4) what cards from Theros block do I want to invest in? With these questions in mind I looked at my collection of standard decks at the time, which were: 1) mono-b 2) mono-u 3) r/g monstrous 4) rakdos humans 5) standard dredge 6) orzhov midrange 7) mono-r devotion 8) Grixis aggro (dimir aggro + madcap skills) And I decided to dismantle all of them and start fresh, and only keep a few things, with a slightly heavier focus on cards in Theros block rather than relying on RTR block. So out of the ashes I made mono black aggro splash red, white weenie splash black (for the girlfriend), and golgari midrange (because green/black is my favourite colour combination) So I took my domri's, my jace's, my blood barons, a couple extra Mutavaults, and a pile of other M14 and RTR block rares, and I turned them into: - Theros block rares that I was interested in (Thoughtseize, etc) - RTR cards that I think will hold value after rotation (abrupt decay, deathrite, and foils of each) - a wasteland - a badlands - a tundra - playsets of all the shocks I did all the trading now so that I won't get caught in the crunch closer to rotation. This is my first time doing it because last rotation I got caught with my pants down with a pile of rares that rapidly deflated in price.
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Mar 18, 2014 06:53
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JerryLee posted:Really, that's your example of a crap rare? It's a crap rare that should have been uncommon. Power creep aside, nobody ever could have been too excited to pull one of those instead of a rare with an interesting ability.
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Mar 18, 2014 06:56
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Mezzanon posted:And I decided to dismantle all of them and start fresh, and only keep a few things, with a slightly heavier focus on cards in Theros block rather than relying on RTR block. So out of the ashes I made mono black aggro splash red, white weenie splash black (for the girlfriend), and golgari midrange (because green/black is my favourite colour combination) Sup Golgari colors are the best colors buddy. I'm just starting to do this. I already unloaded my Jace IVs for Thoughtseizes, been trading my Sphinx's Revs, trying to trade Blood Barons and Domris. I'll probably start unloading my 14 Mutavaults. Somehow my shiny Morningtide 'Vaults never really rose in price, so I'm just going to hope they don't fall in price. Would you mind posting your Golgari list? Mine has been a huge success when I actually get a mix of lands and non-lands. I'm really trying to find a better finisher than Desecration Demon, which has been a huge liability and almost always sucks. I really hope they start printing playable removal in Journey to Nyx or M15 so I can at least keep the shell of this deck. My list is here, I think slightly out of date. http://deckbox.org/sets/602477
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Mar 18, 2014 07:06
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