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Ableist Kinkshamer posted:Isn't DotP like, dumbed down though? I haven't played it, but I remember someone (I think Chamale) saying that it wouldn't let you do things like float mana in response to a Sword of Feast and Famine trigger. Of course the program is going to work "better" when it's intentionally dumbed down like that. You also can't sac things at interrupt speed, it is relatively simple compared to the actual game.
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Mar 26, 2014 16:29
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Sleep of Bronze posted:If you click a checkbox, DotP is DotP without the animations. Animations in this case being the whole loading bar to next phase thing it does PRESS A IN THIS TIME IF YOU WANT TO INTERRUPT how about just I hammer spacebar until you take me to my turn I don't have any cards to play and I'm not blocking
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Mar 26, 2014 16:33
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Most of my problems with the modo interface aren't the actual gameplay, but stuff like card collection management, deckbuilding, and tournament statuses.
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Mar 26, 2014 16:35
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I just wish foils didn't look like crap in the new interface and didn't make the old interface run like crap.
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Mar 26, 2014 16:37
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Having "foils" at all in MTGO is hilarious to me.
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Mar 26, 2014 16:46
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DotP foils are so sexy, especially the animated ones like Yosei and It That Betrays. Giltspire Avenger, too. The spell effect FX is pretty  , though.
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Mar 26, 2014 16:48
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Entropic posted:Having "foils" at all in MTGO is hilarious to me.
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Mar 26, 2014 16:51
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First Bass posted:You also can't sac things at interrupt speed, it is relatively simple compared to the actual game. Someone's been playing for a while.
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Mar 26, 2014 17:12
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Korak posted:In a dream world foils on mtgo would be awesome animated gifs of whatever is going on with the card. Hire a bunch of fresh out of college animators and have them start with the latest standard set and work their way into popular used cards in modern/legacy. Yes, this would be cool, akin to the way they animate the cards for their little block preview animations.
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Mar 26, 2014 17:15
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Duels 14 has a handful of cards like that. I know It That Betrays is one. Know there are a few others as well.
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Mar 26, 2014 17:16
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Grave Titan does as well, it's pretty cool. EDIT: Infinity Wars' cards are all animated but the art is merely okay.
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Mar 26, 2014 17:18
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I would be all but certain that some of DotP's game limitations are features and not bugs in WotC's eyes. I think a large part of why it's been so successful is that it streamlines Magic's gameplay. Similarly, I'm pretty sure Hearthstone isn't looking to snag the Modern/Legacy tournament player and I'd wager that it is intentionally simple in order to broaden its appeal.
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Mar 26, 2014 17:45
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It should be mentioned that DotP is developed by Stainless, not WotC.
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Mar 26, 2014 18:51
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Korak posted:In a dream world foils on mtgo would be awesome animated gifs of whatever is going on with the card. Hire a bunch of fresh out of college animators and have them start with the latest standard set and work their way into popular used cards in modern/legacy. Interesting, that sounds exactly like the golden animation on cards in Hearthstone! I'd much rather they focus on keeping Hearthstone stable and roll out new features and card expansions slowly, rather than trying to launch with the complexity level of MTG and having it be completely unapproachable. There was a time when MTG only had 300 or so different cards too, and a good number of those are either unplayable or unplayably broken.
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Mar 26, 2014 18:51
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It just occurred to me that 'Wizards Research and Development' has to be one of the best job descriptions ever.
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Mar 26, 2014 18:57
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BizarroAzrael posted:On a similar point, is Firedrinker Satyr good in a way I don't understand? Because it seems to be a 2/1 for 1 with pretty serious downside and an overcosted firebreathing, and I just can't see how you get value from it, yet it seems to be somewhat sought after, people want to use it. Pretend it doesn't have firebreathing - it becomes Jackal Pup, i.e. one of the best beatdown creatures of all time. It seems worse than soldier of the pantheon but color is a big deal here Now give it firebreathing that hurts you and it only becomes better - you have a mana sink late game when your threat of losing isn't from hitting 0 on your own life total but rather from flooding out. The only thing that's changed is that Firedrinker Satyr has to go up against bigger midrange creatures than the original jackal pup. Imagine if Firedrinker Satyr's ability read as "0: you lose the game". It would still be a pretty good card in the right deck. Zoness fucked around with this message at 19:26 on Mar 26, 2014 |
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Mar 26, 2014 19:23
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Zoness posted:Pretend it doesn't have firebreathing - it becomes Jackal Pup, i.e. one of the best beatdown creatures of all time. The second you posted that "0:you lose the game" ability I had to look up if hive mind would copy activated abilities........sadly, it doesn't. Oh but to further your point, it's a 2/1 for 1 with upside, what isn't to love?
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Mar 26, 2014 19:26
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Zoness posted:Imagine if Firedrinker Satyr's ability read as "0: you lose the game". It would still be a pretty good card in the right deck. Specifically, the one with the red donate and mindslaver. There is a red donate, right? That seems like something red might do every now and again.
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Mar 26, 2014 19:33
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Madmarker posted:The second you posted that "0:you lose the game" ability I had to look up if hive mind would copy activated abilities........sadly, it doesn't. Illusionist's Bracers + Bazaar Trader!
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Mar 26, 2014 19:33
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forbidden lesbian posted:Specifically, the one with the red donate and mindslaver. Bazaar Trader. I could also quantify my statement by saying beatdown deck, but the point as it stands is that R for a 2-power creature that isn't restricted in how it can attack is a pretty drat good card.
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Mar 26, 2014 19:34
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PhyrexianLibrarian posted:Interesting, that sounds exactly like the golden animation on cards in Hearthstone! Blizzard can't figure out how to balance going first vs. going second. I don't have a lot of hope for Hearthstone.
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Mar 26, 2014 19:39
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Brownhat posted:Blizzard can't figure out how to balance going first vs. going second. I don't have a lot of hope for Hearthstone. It's not like going on the draw is significantly good in Magic barring really slow limited formats, playing manaless dredge, or one particular build of Flash-Hulk with Gemstone Mine and Elvish Spirit Guide for the mirror match.
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Mar 26, 2014 19:40
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Zoness posted:It's not like going on the draw is significantly good in Magic barring really slow limited formats, playing manaless dredge, or one particular build of Flash-Hulk with Gemstone Mine and Elvish Spirit Guide for the mirror match. Being on the draw in Hearthstone is a significant advantage. You get +2 cards, one of which is basically a Lotus Petal.
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Mar 26, 2014 19:46
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Brownhat posted:Being on the draw in Hearthstone is a significant advantage. You get +2 cards, one of which is basically a Lotus Petal. Then why do Blizzard's metrics show first player still wins more?
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Mar 26, 2014 19:54
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Because you cant get mana screwed in Hearthstone. Your three 8-drops might sit in your hand for awhile, but you WILL get to play them. No mana variance gives the advantage to the first player.
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Mar 26, 2014 20:05
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Promoted Pawn posted:It should be mentioned that DotP is developed by Stainless, not WotC. i.e. it's developed by an actual professional game development company, not by an underfunded badly managed sub-division of a card game company.
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Mar 26, 2014 20:18
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End of Life Guy posted:Because you cant get mana screwed in Hearthstone. Your three 8-drops might sit in your hand for awhile, but you WILL get to play them. No mana variance gives the advantage to the first player. This might be better suited for the "other CCGs" thread, but Blizzard is making the same trap UDE made. Vs. System was one of the tightest, design-wise, games ever and was designed almost entirely by pro players to reward tight play and deck construction, and minimize variance. The problem was, when you minimize variance of drawing your cards on-curve and eliminate manascrew, the better player always wins, which doesn't really allow the game to grow and include new players, since they literally could not win against better players playing the same decks. This made for a loving awesome game for pros to durdle with between rounds, and loving awful game for casuals and kitchen-table players.
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Mar 26, 2014 20:41
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Hearthstone does have a ton of luck based cards, which helps balance it out. I do think it would be interesting to see if people would want to play second in Magic if you got a free Lotus Petal in addition to an extra card, I think it would make the decision a lot less of a no-brainer.
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Mar 26, 2014 20:56
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Tharizdun posted:Vs. System It was also the only card game with Fantastic Fun, and every deck I play in Magic is me attempting to match the joy of passing around the flamethrower.
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Mar 26, 2014 20:59
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Konstantin posted:Hearthstone does have a ton of luck based cards, which helps balance it out. I do think it would be interesting to see if people would want to play second in Magic if you got a free Lotus Petal in addition to an extra card, I think it would make the decision a lot less of a no-brainer. Why would it be interesting to see random things thrown into a game balanced under a particular ruleset? "Gee I wonder what it would be like if we like let everyone start with three lands in play." It would be dumb as gently caress. Just like your idea.
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Mar 26, 2014 21:00
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Toshimo posted:Why would it be interesting to see random things thrown into a game balanced under a particular ruleset? "Gee I wonder what it would be like if we like let everyone start with three lands in play." It would be dumb as gently caress. Just like your idea. Yikes dude, chill, it's not thaaaaaaat dumb an idea. I mean I wouldn't implement it, but it certainly seems like something fun for the kitchen table crowd to try out.
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Mar 26, 2014 21:06
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Toshimo posted:Why would it be interesting to see random things thrown into a game balanced under a particular ruleset? "Gee I wonder what it would be like if we like let everyone start with three lands in play." It would be dumb as gently caress. Just like your idea. Now let's get back to arguing about the reserve list.
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Mar 26, 2014 21:08
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Zero_Grade posted:I agree, harmless speculation must be stamped out with extreme prejudice. None of that in the Magic the Gathering discussion thread. I mean hell, "What if we tried X" is how we got poo poo like limited, EDH, and a good deal of magic design in general. I mean the whole "free lotus petal" idea seems degenerate in anything but the most casual of magic scenes, but, on the kitchen table it seems neat.
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Mar 26, 2014 21:12
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Tharizdun posted:This might be better suited for the "other CCGs" thread, but Blizzard is making the same trap UDE made. Vs. System was one of the tightest, design-wise, games ever and was designed almost entirely by pro players to reward tight play and deck construction, and minimize variance. The problem was, when you minimize variance of drawing your cards on-curve and eliminate manascrew, the better player always wins, which doesn't really allow the game to grow and include new players, since they literally could not win against better players playing the same decks. I know this is getting into derail territory (maybe we should make a VS System legacy thread  ), but the game still allowed for quite a bit for kitchen table gamers. Sure, my Avengers/Brotherhood reservist deck would never make top 8 at a tournament, but there was plenty of room to Johnny around. Hell, my pet team was League of Assassins forever, but they never really made a big splash on the big scene, but it was fun to throw out non-unique Ra's al Ghuls in a Crisis deck. The problem wasn't the mechanics. It was the inability to smooth out the power levels of some cards (Savage Beatdown, Dr. Light, Press the Attack, and Garth specifically). Edit: Talking about "what about X" reminded me about the DBZ card game and how they took Android 18's scry ability and made it an actual game mechanic for GT because they realized that variation with the game's giant decks were too large a crap shoot. AlternateNu fucked around with this message at 21:20 on Mar 26, 2014 |
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Mar 26, 2014 21:15
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Toshimo posted:Why would it be interesting to see random things thrown into a game balanced under a particular ruleset? "Gee I wonder what it would be like if we like let everyone start with three lands in play." It would be dumb as gently caress. Just like your idea. Jeeez whats wrong with you dude. One of the main reasons magic is fun is its willingness to break its own rules sometimes.
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Mar 26, 2014 21:26
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Mar 26, 2014 21:28
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All I know about VS is that a couple of magic grinders (Adam Prosak, Vidianto Wijaya, Michael Jacob and some others) decided to take a few years off of magic to play VS exactly because of the reasons outlined above. The prize payouts (and odds of winning things) were so much better in VS compared to magic at the time.
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Mar 26, 2014 21:28
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Yeah but I mean, there's speculation and there's suggesting "Let's give one of the players a card that was banned from Standard and Extended at some point". That's the absurdity - Lotus Petal is an extremely strong card in Magic.
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Mar 26, 2014 21:29
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Will Wizards ever implement Rare Redrafting into their digital games, is the big question here.
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Mar 26, 2014 21:30
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Zoness posted:Yeah but I mean, there's speculation and there's suggesting "Let's give one of the players a card that was banned from Standard and Extended at some point". Yes, Lotus Petal is obscenely strong in magic, but what we were taken aback by was the bile Toshimo showed toward Konstantin. It was vindictive, and didn't really provide anything productive, or say "why" it was a bad idea, like power level concerns. I just provided nothing informative, and wasn't even humorously mean. Gyshall posted:Will Wizards ever implement Rare Redrafting into their digital games, is the big question here. This, I would love.
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Mar 26, 2014 21:33
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