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In short, ogs is bad for anything but correspondence.
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Apr 14, 2014 00:52
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| # ? May 12, 2024 17:51 |
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Well I ended up playing a handicap game with a 13k goon, I lost badly but Xombar reviewed the game afterwards so it was an edifying experience in the end.
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Apr 14, 2014 00:55
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Zekky posted:Well I ended up playing a handicap game with a 13k goon, I lost badly but Xombar reviewed the game afterwards so it was an edifying experience in the end. I'm a true 30k. I'm Pander on OGS.
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Apr 14, 2014 01:03
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How long do beginners, and others, usually spend on turns? Are we talking minutes or seconds here.
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Apr 14, 2014 14:02
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It really depends entirely on how much time you have on the clock. Again with literally everything in Go it's not something you consciously think about, you just get a feel for how long you've got with each move having played on those time settings hundreds of times. When you're happy with your move, you play. Generally this means seconds for a joseki sequence maybe 30 seconds to a minute on 30 mins with byo-yomi. Unless it's blitz, in which case you're never happy with your move because oh god no time why did i agree to this
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Apr 14, 2014 14:22
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goodness posted:How long do beginners, and others, usually spend on turns? Are we talking minutes or seconds here. Im a beginner and my moves usually spend way too much of my time (I think 30 seconds to 2 minutes) until I finally have byo-yomi start yelling at me. Im trying to get better at moving faster but go is hard. oiseaux morts 1994 posted:Unless it's blitz, in which case you're never happy with your move because oh god no time why did i agree to this My only blitz game was an accident and I didnt really know what was going on and oh my god my time 
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Apr 14, 2014 14:42
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Actual time spent varies widely, so a better question is how much time one would spend ideally. Beginners tend to spend too much time agonizing in spots where they simply have no clue, while stronger amateurs often play too quickly when they could in fact find a better move if they took their time. Also, the stronger you get, the greater the deviations in your move time. Many moves are automatic/unavoidable, while in other spots you may have half a dozen or more viable options to choose between. I would recommend that beginners take no more than 10 seconds for a move, and maybe 5 seconds on average. Those numbers - especially the maximum time - will go up exponentially as you get stronger. For instance, an amateur dan like me can sometimes productively spend 10 minutes on a single move in a live or correspondence game. More, even, if it's a correspondence game where you're permitting the use of an analysis tool/external resources/etc. I say 10 minutes for a live game because I think that's about the limit of my ability to hold everything in my head... I think if I tried to think longer than that about a move, I would end up going back to reanalyze moves I'd already considered because I could no longer remember what conclusion I'd reached.
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Apr 14, 2014 19:55
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I'm yet to meet anyone who plays slower than me - I'm always on increment on move 75-100 and I play 25 minute KGS games. Seems to work out fine, unless a big fight breaks out in the endgame or something. 10 seconds per move seems insane to me, I really can't read anything with any confidence in that time, so I'll just be autopiloting pretty much and that's baaad because my autopilot goes for extremely submissive/passive or greedy moves which will just lose me the game.
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Apr 14, 2014 21:17
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Hey, who in here is Peaboo? You're a very weird man.
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Apr 15, 2014 00:15
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Svartvit posted:Hey, who in here is Peaboo? You're a very weird man. His name is P2 and he's like the angry old man of ITGO. 
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Apr 15, 2014 00:21
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If you're a beginner just play as fast as you can until you absolutely can't stand that your stones are getting eaten all the time. That's the time to ask for a review.
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Apr 15, 2014 02:18
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IMlemon posted:I'm yet to meet anyone who plays slower than me - I'm always on increment on move 75-100 and I play 25 minute KGS games. Seems to work out fine, unless a big fight breaks out in the endgame or something. 10 seconds per move seems insane to me, I really can't read anything with any confidence in that time, so I'll just be autopiloting pretty much and that's baaad because my autopilot goes for extremely submissive/passive or greedy moves which will just lose me the game. It's good to play a mixture of fast and slow games for this reason. Reading is important, but so is instinct.
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Apr 15, 2014 14:32
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I just played a game where I felt like I was doing well, but I didn't end up with much territory at the edges. I think I focused too much on blocking instead of aggressively placing stones. It seemed like I should have been able to achieve more with the position I had around move 75. Would anyone be willing to review the game? It was played on KGS but I'm not sure how to link to it.
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Apr 15, 2014 15:15
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Uncle Jam posted:If you're a beginner just play as fast as you can until you absolutely can't stand that your stones are getting eaten all the time. That's the time to ask for a review. It's so hard for me to play that style. Stupid being a perfectionist 
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Apr 15, 2014 15:17
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Zekky posted:I just played a game where I felt like I was doing well, but I didn't end up with much territory at the edges. I think I focused too much on blocking instead of aggressively placing stones. It seemed like I should have been able to achieve more with the position I had around move 75. Would anyone be willing to review the game? It was played on KGS but I'm not sure how to link to it. Download the game from KGS, upload the SGF to here: http://eidogo.com/
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Apr 15, 2014 15:19
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sensual donkey punching posted:Download the game from KGS, upload the SGF to here: http://eidogo.com/ Thanks, uploaded here http://eidogo.com/#2uq4HriqI.
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Apr 15, 2014 15:28
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Zekky posted:Thanks, uploaded here http://eidogo.com/#2uq4HriqI. http://eidogo.com/#25A0LcK1r
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Apr 15, 2014 16:02
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How do you properly respond to an invasion? I keep losing to them even if it's behind a well developed wall, for example white placing around G7 in the image below (assuming the edges of the board are where the image cuts off): It seems like with all the black pieces around you should be able to stop white from achieving much inside your territory.
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Apr 17, 2014 00:50
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Zekky posted:How do you properly respond to an invasion? I keep losing to them even if it's behind a well developed wall, for example white placing around G7 in the image below (assuming the edges of the board are where the image cuts off): That particular territory seems kinda large, like the whole goddamn board...not sure how to respond to that.
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Apr 17, 2014 00:58
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Yeah, Pander's right. You're showing the wrong part of the board. Generally speaking, yes, G7 is too close to the Black wall to be a good move, but the outside of that wall is not typically going to be Black territory, but part of a Black moyo. I guess your problem is that you're playing for a moyo game but don't understand the difference between a moyo and territory. Without additional information about the whole-board position, I can't recommend any specific move, but generally speaking what you want to do in these positions is play on the opposite side of your opponent's stones and push him into your wall. If he's really being unreasonable you can kill him like that, but usually killing is not the plan, but rather forcing him to live small and without much profit, while you solidify territory elsewhere with your attacking stones. xopods fucked around with this message at 01:26 on Apr 17, 2014 |
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Apr 17, 2014 01:23
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Are we missing the part where he says "Assuming the edges of the board are where the picture cuts off"?
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Apr 17, 2014 01:32
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Kheldragar posted:Are we missing the part where he says "Assuming the edges of the board are where the picture cuts off"? That'd kinda make sense. If that's the case, then you pretty much couldn't kill G7 before it could form at least two eyes, it's too far to the black strength.
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Apr 17, 2014 02:11
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Apr 17, 2014 02:24
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I'm 30k but I'm like 99% sure there's no guaranteed way to kill white there since your influence is just too far away to kill. Limit, yes, but kill no.
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Apr 17, 2014 02:33
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Zekky posted:How do you properly respond to an invasion? I keep losing to them even if it's behind a well developed wall, for example white placing around G7 in the image below (assuming the edges of the board are where the image cuts off): If what we're talking about is a 9x9 board then, in my opinion, you should be able to kill all invasions. I think the main way to kill such invasions is to constrict space (and reduce it to a dead shape) or undercut it (and remove the base altogether), depending on the invasion point. Let us consider your example you could try to undercut it with j7, or you could restrict its space with j6 and f8. Nevertheless these ways of dealing with an invasion only work if you have enough strength to deal with the continuations, like in your problem. Otherwise you can only limit the invasion. The other way to improve your responses to these invasions is to practice your reading and doing life and death, that way when trying to kill you're less likely to make mistakes. shin42k fucked around with this message at 02:42 on Apr 17, 2014 |
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Apr 17, 2014 02:39
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I don't think white has much of a chance of living. G7 is no good since black plays j7 and white will never get a second eye. Playing at the 3-3 doesn't work either, since B can play at G8 and J6 and again, no second eye. Black's strength here allows him to make huge dives like this and be perfectly fine.
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Apr 17, 2014 03:12
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Finally managed to win a ranked game. Feels good 
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Apr 17, 2014 22:15
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Under 15 posted:I don't think white has much of a chance of living. G7 is no good since black plays j7 and white will never get a second eye. Playing at the 3-3 doesn't work either, since B can play at G8 and J6 and again, no second eye. Black's strength here allows him to make huge dives like this and be perfectly fine.
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Apr 17, 2014 22:55
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Xom posted:What do you think of probing with J5 first? I don't see white living after J5 given the correct followup from black. To be honest most moves from black should prevent white from living as long as black doesn't make any reading mistakes.
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Apr 17, 2014 23:14
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shin42k posted:I don't see white living after J5 given the correct followup from black. To be honest most moves from black should prevent white from living as long as black doesn't make any reading mistakes. Yeah, seems like almost anything would work. Black can pull a lot of fast ones because of how strong he is.
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Apr 17, 2014 23:32
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Xom posted:What do you think of probing with J5 first? Still not going to work if this is a 9x9 game. White had to make his move before the borders were this firmed up.
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Apr 17, 2014 23:45
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Question about counting (The original board IS edited because it is plainly obvious that taking the ko is bigger. Refer to this diagram): Black has a choice between A and B at this point. What do I do to tell which is the larger move? Well, I can try miai counting but I have no clue how to do that. So here's my attempt at doing so, and maybe Xopods can tell me how to do it correctly and give me examples  How many points does white gain if he gets A? Okay, so he gains two captures and one point of territory for a total of two moves. That gives him 1.5 points.  Okay, so let's say black takes the ko. White t1/t2 are ko threat/followup. Black captures one stone, takes away a capture from white, gains a point at m6, and causes three points of territory to be removed from white in three moves, so it has a value of 2. (Not counting the ko loss he has to weigh in)  Am I doing this right? I'm trying to verify if my count of who lost/gained how much score is accurate. AdorableStar fucked around with this message at 06:38 on Apr 20, 2014 |
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Apr 20, 2014 06:33
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Is their a recommended Go Board and Pieces set to order?
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Apr 20, 2014 08:15
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goodness posted:Is their a recommended Go Board and Pieces set to order? The only thing I can reccomend is buy a traditional, light board not a dark rosewood or mahogany, because the stones are hard to see. Also although a folding board looks enticing if its poorly made its not fun to play on. If you need portability still buy a trad board but get a good carry case for it. I guess with stones, its personal preference but just make sure they're full sized and the board is full sized because playing on mini gobans is a pain in the rear end. Plastic stones also suck cause they are light and wobbly, if you can get more traditional heavy stones it will feel much better. I guess in summary, just get the cheapest traditional setup you can. GoGameGuru or Yellow Mountain Imports are the best vendors for the west, and GGG will be happy to give you advice on what to buy if you email them, younggil is really friendly and an expert.
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Apr 20, 2014 11:34
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I found a pretty great video where Elwyn Berlekamp talks about go. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=puK3qYiMKpQ Has a nice segment on the history of go, and why go is awesome. A basic explanation of the rules. And a long segment on endgame and counting. E: he also talks quite a bit about rule systems in the Q&A portion: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_Qya14k8IfA VictualSquid fucked around with this message at 16:32 on Apr 20, 2014 |
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Apr 20, 2014 16:04
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Kheldragar posted:maybe Xopods can tell me how to do it correctly and give me examples I'm afraid not. I never really understood the difference between miai and deiri counting. I do the same as everyone else and just play whatever looks biggest to me.
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Apr 20, 2014 17:46
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xopods posted:I'm afraid not. I never really understood the difference between miai and deiri counting. I do the same as everyone else and just play whatever looks biggest to me. Well, it looks like I should read some endgame books then. Seriously, to me (at least), the Endgame feels like a completely differet game. It feels like Fuseki, the middle game, and the endgame are all three distinct games all crammed into what we call Go.
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Apr 20, 2014 19:36
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oiseaux morts 1994 posted:The only thing I can reccomend is buy a traditional, light board not a dark rosewood or mahogany, because the stones are hard to see. Also although a folding board looks enticing if its poorly made its not fun to play on. If you need portability still buy a trad board but get a good carry case for it. I guess with stones, its personal preference but just make sure they're full sized and the board is full sized because playing on mini gobans is a pain in the rear end. Plastic stones also suck cause they are light and wobbly, if you can get more traditional heavy stones it will feel much better. I guess in summary, just get the cheapest traditional setup you can. GoGameGuru or Yellow Mountain Imports are the best vendors for the west, and GGG will be happy to give you advice on what to buy if you email them, younggil is really friendly and an expert. http://shop.gogameguru.com/economy-go-game-set/ This one looks pretty good. Wood board, which has a 19x19 and a 9x9, and glass stones. Not a bad price either. The next step up is 100$ more, which I don't think is worth it now. http://shop.gogameguru.com/standard-go-game-set/
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Apr 20, 2014 23:50
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Kheldragar posted:Well, it looks like I should read some endgame books then. Seriously, to me (at least), the Endgame feels like a completely differet game. It feels like Fuseki, the middle game, and the endgame are all three distinct games all crammed into what we call Go. Yeah, but maybe you should get good at the one that matters before you worry too much about the finer points of the other two.
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Apr 21, 2014 01:53
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For what its worth, I like Ing Go stones more than glass, and I have glass stones. I dunno if places still sell those though.
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Apr 21, 2014 03:18
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