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Wolfsbane posted:If you want to find out, a lot of the mods of the old wiki hang out on the dom3mods forum. From brief searching, it seems like one of the guys over there has the source for the old wiki and has promised to do something with it, but with no visible results so far. I don't really have that much webcoding skills, but setting up a Wiki is not hard. There are also numerous free wiki sites like Wikidot which is pretty ok to use. It'd just be a case of manually pulling the information from the wiki and putting it up on a new site, it'd just take a bit of time, of that I have plenty right now. Would be a lot easier if one could convince the old wiki owner to give over the database, but if people say he's erratic he might not want to share.
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Apr 30, 2014 00:53
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I think the problem is that nobody wants to upload the unit stats. And unlike the old wiki, you'd have to process the armor and weapon values somehow to approximate the mod inspector. I'm not sure if wiki code can do that. In all honesty, it would be better to focus on nation pages and strategy guides and leave the units & spells to the mood inspector, except where you absolutely need to explain hidden mechanics.
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Apr 30, 2014 01:43
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I'm 90% sure the mod inspector could be made to output to wiki format, if you don't want to just run the wiki off a database core again (which might be the most sensible plan).
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Apr 30, 2014 12:07
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Nicely done TheDemon. Neruz posted:Recruitment affected by scales is a super interesting idea. It's ok if you make a heat equivalent to wolven winter. If not, it's going to gently caress heat dependent nations. It may also snowball a war when the folks you're fighting lock down cap recruitment using temp adjust spells.
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Apr 30, 2014 12:48
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builds character posted:It's ok if you make a heat equivalent to wolven winter.
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Apr 30, 2014 12:56
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e: ^^^ argh!!!builds character posted:Nicely done TheDemon. There is now, Breath of the Desert F3A1 in Alt 4. That said the A1 kinda fucks makes it much harder to cast than wolven winter.
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Apr 30, 2014 12:57
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LordLeckie posted:That said the A1 kinda makes it much harder to cast than wolven winter. After checking: List of national mages that can cast Wolven Winter without a booster: - Loads of them (like every UW nation, plus most nations with any water magic at all have W2+10% or W1+110% for 3 at the very least) List of national mages that can cast BotD without a booster on 100% randoms: - EA Berytos' Brides-in-Waiting with an F random. - MA Marignon's Grand Masters with an A random (remember here that Marignon is heat-neutral) List of national mages who can technically do it: - EA Ermor's Augur Elders provided they get seperate F/A picks on their 110% (the odds are low) - MA TC's Imperial Alchemists, both 110% chances get F (25%+2% chance) - LA Bogarus' Starets on a 10% which is actually a 2.5% - That is all.
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Apr 30, 2014 13:17
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Is there any reason it should be harder to cast? Is it more powerful?
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Apr 30, 2014 13:45
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It really should just be F3. None of the Abysias can cast it and they are the ones who would actually like to do it.
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Apr 30, 2014 13:45
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goatface posted:Is there any reason it should be harder to cast? Is it more powerful? Almost 100% guaranteed its because it has "Breath" in the name so the devs figured that giving it A1 would be thematic.
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Apr 30, 2014 13:53
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LordLeckie posted:Almost 100% guaranteed its because it has "Breath" in the name so the devs figured that giving it A1 would be thematic. also "of the desert" generally means AFD in the game. I'm sure if it were possible it would require all 3 schools to cast 
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Apr 30, 2014 14:03
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goatface posted:Is there any reason it should be harder to cast? Is it more powerful? 3 points towards Heat/Cold, 420 population dies. I'm guessing the new faction we're getting has some kind of recruitable Elemental aspect to it, where if it's cold they'll get icy guys, and if it's hot they'll get firey guys. Guessing they'll have heat/cold affinity 1 and the new tag which makes their troops more climate-resistant, so you can actually play around with this kind of thing. Maybe they'll have commanders which shift temperature in the same way as cold/heat gets spread by the Niefelheim/Abysia? Hypothetically an interesting faction. If they manage to branch the heat/cold thing out more to spells, as they have with Water elementals, but not "regular" ones, that could also be an amazing space-saver, where you could mod spells in that increase heat/cold resistance based on the scales of the province you're in, or perhaps swap the multitude of Lesser X Elemental spells for a generalised Lesser Elemental spell based on scales. Maybe completely change things up and make the various Elemental magic types actually just 'emblematic', so Fire gives access to heavy single-target direct-damage spells, Water is about summoning, Air is about climate control/chaff clearing, and Earth is more about buffing (with changes to the path selection throughout the available rosters). I might be getting ahead of myself.
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Apr 30, 2014 17:15
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jBrereton posted:420 population dies. I petition that BotD be renamed to "Blaze it".
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Apr 30, 2014 18:34
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420 change scales by 3 every day
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Apr 30, 2014 19:28
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Finally got around to completing my unbalance mod. I can't really recommend it for game play, but if you want to play around with a variety of excessive buffs to the various early age nations it might amuse you. The mod file: https://www.dropbox.com/s/2yxpcfgm52208oe/unbalance.dm The spoiler: https://www.dropbox.com/s/uq07ifup40f9q7z/Unbalance%20spoiler.txt I mainly created this as a way to get a feel for modding dominions 4. If you would like to give me feedback and suggestions I'm sure I'd enjoy hearing them and I'm on irc a fair amount of the time.
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Apr 30, 2014 22:23
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30 RP non-cap philosophers 
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Apr 30, 2014 23:52
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Does anyone actually use amulets of the dead to boost reanimation? Or is it not worth the gem cost (3 gems with a hammer)? It looks like a flat +2 bonus to all reanimation, so it's only worth it for reanimating cavalry. A lvl 2 priest can get 3 cavalary instead of 1, or 5 for a lvl 3. edit: While I'm asking newb Death nation questions, do people have a favorite way of suiciding mages to get twiceborns? Or is that just used as a cautionary spell for mages with good random paths TheresNoThyme fucked around with this message at 00:53 on May 1, 2014 |
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May 1, 2014 00:09
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TheresNoThyme posted:edit: While I'm asking newb Death nation questions, do people have a favorite way of suiciding mages to get twiceborns? Or is that just used as a cautionary spell for mages with good random paths Yeah twiceborn isn't terribly efficient gemwise. It's something you can put on a mage to make sure you don't lose him. If you want to convert all of your guys into undead, it's cheaper to use something like life after death and some kind of battlefield wide damage spell. I've only done this once in dom3 because BoT just went up and it was the only way I had to try and keep my mages alive. Foul Vapors will kill basically every non poison resistant mage given enough time. 2 casts of rain of stones or 3ish earthquake casts will kill a decent number of them and convert them into zombies. Head injuries are more common with RoS so you may get some idiots out of it. Soulless have decent amounts of hp so you will most likely not do enough damage with consecutive hits to kill both mage and soulless form.
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May 1, 2014 02:42
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Could someone give me a quick rundown of how morale works in dominions? Do a certain number of units need to fail their morale checks before the squad routs? Could you accomplish this with frighten alone?
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May 1, 2014 10:09
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I'm not sure if it checks individual units or the overall average morale of the squad. Not a huge difference in practice, tho the way frighten, panic, and terror work suggests the former. And yes, those spells both lower morale and force a check, making it possible to rout enemies without dealing any actual damage.
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May 1, 2014 14:39
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Flython posted:Could someone give me a quick rundown of how morale works in dominions? Do a certain number of units need to fail their morale checks before the squad routs? Could you accomplish this with frighten alone? I believe they make a check whenever someone in the squad takes damage or is killed. Morale keeps being lowered the more people that are killed, making it more and more likely that they route the more who dies. But I'm not sure whether or not their overall morale is higher if there are more people in the squad.
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May 1, 2014 15:05
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manual posted:Morale check So having more dudes means more need to die to reduce your survivor bonus.
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May 1, 2014 15:33
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goatface posted:So having more dudes means more need to die to reduce your survivor bonus. Realistically having smaller-midsized squads is much better than having large squads if you're trying to avoid disastrous routes. The reason is that damage is often localized to an area anyway: a small squad that eats a few thunderstrikes will be obliterated anyway, so who cares if the 2 survivors limp away? On the other hand if a bunch of Tstrikes hits your large squad and it routes, you're basically hosed, even if it took a few more hits to send then packing. Generally having more commanders and more small squads with disparate orders is a better move.
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May 1, 2014 19:47
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Also since morale is a squad thing, mixing big stupid coward elephants with slow moving elite infantry will pad their morale. It increases the average squad morale and makes it harder to hurt your survivor bonus. This is the only purpose I have divined for MA Caelum's wingless.
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May 1, 2014 20:55
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Finally got this on Steam, time to lose multiplayer games horribly  This is a verification post too I guess
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May 1, 2014 22:41
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And conveniently a new noobgame is in its signup phase.
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May 2, 2014 02:26
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And a verification post for me as well.
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May 2, 2014 13:17
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Post-mortem thoughts on Saxophone, which Midgard won on turn 68. In theory, I can claim to have won my first MP game without it even being a newbie game. In practice: -Pangaea, Bogarus, Gath, Ulm, and Midgard were definitely newbies -C'Tis and Agartha probably were as well, no idea because Agartha vanished after about turn 5 and C'Tis not that long after, but seriously why would you ever put Sloth 3 on LA Agartha? -Marignon, Abysia, Caelum and Atlantis only had a few games of experienced, and Abysia got rushed and taken out early. -Only Jomon could have been really considered experienced. So yeah, it was pretty much a newbie game anyway. The nation start points made things additionally screwy. Caelum's primary neighbours, C'Tis and Ulm, basically failed to expand at all, while Atlantis and Pangaea both expanded away from me (my borders wound up stopping at their cap circles) and Agartha didn't do anything. Meanwhile everyone in what I thought of as the south (it was a wraparound map) actually expanded normally. The fact that it came down to Midgard and Caelum wasn't really surprising. The map had what seemed to me to be really quite a lot of strong sites. Jomon's initial territory had both a Con site (ended up with Caelum) and an Alt site (ended up with me, not that I had any way to exploit it), Atlantis ended up with a Conj site, and I had a bunch of good indie mage sites - Enchantresses, Ministers of Magic, Adepts of being unspellable and F3. That seems rather more than I'm used to seeing. Was the frequency turned up from default? I can't remember. Absum, playing Caelum, played an excellent game and very probably should have won. In our final battles he was bringing 60-100 mages where I could only deploy 20-30 at best. My position had essentially collapsed to a set of isolated strongpoints by the time the game ended - fortunately, those isolated strongpoints happened to contain 50%+1 of the thrones. Had the victory condition been 66% or something Absum would have won easily. I struggled to have enough money to afford to recruit as many Galdermen as I wanted the entire game; some of that's just Midgard being Midgard, it's a very gold-hungry nation, but I think a lot of it was also my resource mismanagement. Fortunately Absum left a 2-point throne unguarded enough that I could sneak and teleport in just enough force to knock down the fort and storm it before he could react (assisted by having two casters of Crumble to knock 500 points of the fort's defence value - that and a few Wall Shakers or Gate Cleavers will blast through even an LA fort in the first turn.) with enough troops. It was very close - he'd have won two turns after I did, I think. Thoughts on Midgard - I made a bunch of first game mistakes; slightly fewer as I went on. The first one was my pretender design. I still don't know what the hell I was thinking. My plan was to expand with Skinshifters, try to use Vans to raid in the mid-game while putting up Perpetual Storm and thunderstriking everything, and then, well, I didn't expect to survive to the late game and didn't have detailed plans, but "do stuff with blood magic" approximately. Fine. So why the hell did I go with a Dormant Father of Winters, Dom7 A3W4E4? Obviously that's a scales build (Order 3 Sloth 1 Growth 3 Misfortune 1 Magic 1), but what do those paths even do for me? I think I wanted a light bless for the Vans, but that never seemed particularly useful. I think if I did it again I'd maybe go Dormant Monolith, which would allow Dom8 E4S6N4, or Dormant Keeper of the Bridge A5E4N4, which would have made for much less faff about casting Perpetual Storm (in my test game, I got an A4 Galderman quite early, but that was just very lucky since it's a <1% chance). I spent too long recruiting skinshifters, which damaged my mage recruitment later. I need to get over my obsession of trying to have chaff do stuff other than die so mages don't. Skinshifters are great at expanding (with arrow catchers, anyway) and terrible at fighting LA national infantry, all of which have enough armour that they don't do damage fast enough and tend to get chopped or shot to pieces because they're quite squishy. I'm in two minds about Perpetual Storm with Midgard, now I've done it. It makes your battlemagic wonderful, since basically means that you have recruit-anywhere non-StR thunderstrike casters since all Galdermen have A2 -> Summon Storm Power -> Thunderstrike. But 25% of Galdermen have A3 so they can cast Storm anyway, and Perpetual Storm stops you sailing and ruins your income (which you really really need). My secondary motivation for it was to slow Caelum down, but it didn't help there as much as I thought it would, since Storm/Perpetual Storm doesn't cause flying troops to take damage from Earthquake. Grrr. Crumble is awesome. That's not a thought about playing Midgard, really, but the coup de main to seize the last throne wouldn't have been possible without it. I'm surprised the topic hasn't come up more often in the thread before now. Astral Corruption is really kind of annoying even if you are a blood nation.
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May 3, 2014 12:17
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Bit of a rush, I'm looking to get into the multiplayer now as well. Single player was a blast but I'm ready to move on up now. Did have just have an amazing battle breaking into an EA R'lyeh castle to be greeted by well over a thousand polyp spawns at the gates that my giants (slowly) hacked through. Even on turbo the battle took about 5 minutes.
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May 3, 2014 14:44
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Bug Squash posted:Bit of a rush, I'm looking to get into the multiplayer now as well. Single player was a blast but I'm ready to move on up now. Did have just have an amazing battle breaking into an EA R'lyeh castle to be greeted by well over a thousand polyp spawns at the gates that my giants (slowly) hacked through. Even on turbo the battle took about 5 minutes.
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May 3, 2014 14:52
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Ilanin posted:Post-mortem thoughts on Saxophone, which Midgard won on turn 68. Good game everyone. I found the Allfather to be not as much of a liability as people always make him out to be, especially when he's providing sailing and cloud trapeze to a nation who really needs mobility. LA Bogarus is a ton of fun but their magic diversity turned out to be a giant pain to manage thanks to the communion changes for path and fatigue effects. And dear lord all their national summons are a giant trap. Even Zmey are freaking coldblooded. Bogarus is a cold 2 nation. Whyyyyy. Having no sacred mages means Bogarus also isn't as much of a research powerhouse as I expected - you get upkeep-capped extremely quickly and each flavor of mage lends itself to wildly different research paths. Props to Caelum for actually running a corpse construct strat, though its effectiveness was hard to gauge when every fight was against uphill odds anyways. I realized too late that the constructs are MR4 and undead, which opens up some disgusting counters. That said, constructs + Caelum flyer bonuses still made sieging castles literally impossible. Props to neruz for spending like 60 death gems on assassination spells when I attacked him. Props to decrepus for amazing mindhunts Props to kitfoxhh for - YOU SHOULD HAVE TAKEN THAT CASTLE BRO Props to Midgard for winning despite Caelum being hugely ahead on every endgame scoregraph. I like to think my minor offensives had some part in delaying Caelum's progress but I suspect it really came down to who could grab the 2 point thrones. Overall, the game would have been a lot more interesting without the perpetual stallers in the first 20 turns (or even just 1 staller, it's hard to organize a big alliance when two players take a lead so early). I definitely felt like more of a kingmaker than an actual contender by turn 25, and this was despite taking over a (non-stalling) player's capitol by then. Sorry Abysia, I felt kinda lovely 2v1'ing you but if you're gonna take an imprisoned scales build on abysia you should really diplo your neighbors like crazy. Finally, my favorite takeaway from this game, sailing.jpg TheresNoThyme fucked around with this message at 18:40 on May 3, 2014 |
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May 3, 2014 18:28
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Bug Squash posted:Bit of a rush, I'm looking to get into the multiplayer now as well. Single player was a blast but I'm ready to move on up now. Did have just have an amazing battle breaking into an EA R'lyeh castle to be greeted by well over a thousand polyp spawns at the gates that my giants (slowly) hacked through. Even on turbo the battle took about 5 minutes. You're in luck, because there is a noob game open  right now! noobs 'r' us is open to all noobs. Note: I don't have the real port information from Tenjou yet so don't try to upload your pretender yet.
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May 3, 2014 19:46
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Flame112 posted:You're in luck, because there is a noob game open Groovy, I'll look forward to getting instructively mauled by slightly less noobish noobs. My major failing is scripting at the moment, so I'm looking for a nation to practice it with in single player. Any advice on a nation that will seriously demand good scripting?
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May 3, 2014 21:00
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Bug Squash posted:Groovy, I'll look forward to getting instructively mauled by slightly less noobish noobs. You have all manner of troops and mages, but they're all average / low level but very communionable.
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May 3, 2014 21:11
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Adding onto jBreton, MA Tien Chi has rather exceptional troops and perform even better under the wide variety of buffs available. The large diversity of magic also means they benefit greatly from a pretender that can forge boosters. A good nation to learn the ins and outs of what each magic path can do.
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May 4, 2014 00:43
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So, something came up IRL and I'm not going to be able to finish my part in noobdom, I was wondering if anyone wanted to replace in as I'd rather not just go AI. If you would, let me know how to contact you and I'll send you the password and a rundown of the situation. Very sorry to everyone in the game, its been great fun, but life got a little more complicated than expected. (I'm assuming this is allowed, if not I can just go AI i guess) Anyone replacing would be playing Nifel from a pretty strong position.
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May 4, 2014 02:05
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Ilanin posted:Post-mortem thoughts on Saxophone, which Midgard won on turn 68. I finally survived to the end of a game TheresNoThyme posted:Props to kitfoxhh for - YOU SHOULD HAVE TAKEN THAT CASTLE BRO I took a bunch of Caelum's castles then Ilanin turned around and looked at me and promptly obliterated my stacks of dudes with 50+ mages and sacked my capital to the ground in the final turns. Next time I play LA I'll hopefully use blood magic more effectively and summon some stuff worth a poo poo, or at least find a few more air/fire/astral sites so I can spam Astral Corruption and stuff.
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May 4, 2014 04:38
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Kitfox88 posted:I took a bunch of Caelum's castles then Ilanin turned around and looked at me and promptly obliterated my stacks of dudes with 50+ mages and sacked my capital to the ground in the final turns. I was Caelum, Ilanin was Midgard .TheresNoThyme posted:Props to Midgard for winning despite Caelum being hugely ahead on every endgame scoregraph. I like to think my minor offensives had some part in delaying Caelum's progress but I suspect it really came down to who could grab the 2 point thrones. I'm pretty sure your AC cast overwrote the Perpetual storm Midgard had up and because of that he managed to sail an army to the two point throne, which was lightly defended as he did not have any troops anywhere near that border. Apart from that I have a higher opinion of LA Caelum mages now. I managed to find a use for most of them, although I'm not sure if they would still have been effective in smaller numbers. Corpse constructs were pretty useful in the early and mid game but they died a bit too fast to be really useful chaff later on. And of course well played everyone, I had fun .
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May 4, 2014 13:20
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Absum posted:I'm pretty sure your AC cast overwrote the Perpetual storm Midgard had up and because of that he managed to sail an army to the two point throne, which was lightly defended as he did not have any troops anywhere near that border. Well, the infantry arrived by sailing. The Vans and Vanjarls were sitting sneakily next to that throne waiting for me to get the mages and the Crumble casters in place. Mind, the assault probably wouldn't have worked without the sailing force (my attack plan had more mages in before Astral Corruption, OTOH) so it's overall a fair enough statement. Ilanin fucked around with this message at 14:02 on May 4, 2014 |
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May 4, 2014 13:59
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The nationgen mod game Court of Life finally came to a close on turn 80. Have a super long recap. Overall I'd say it was pretty fun and *random* but I think I will gen extra nations for future nationgen games and allow people to mulligan if their nation is really really bad. Ironically, in this game one of the strongest performers was actually one of the mostly bad nations. Ashania, the (early leader on the prov graph below) was mostly composed of hoburgs with sticks and poo poo. Had Incy not up and vanished and his nation AIed he could have very well won the game. It was pretty close right up until towards the end of the game where I started to run away with it because of my research advantage (which I didn't realize I had ) and absolutely insane gem income. I had +30N for a good portion of the game and my nation had built in N4s. As a result, I had uncontested Mother Oak, Gift of Health, and eventually Enchanted Forests.  Victorious randomgod. He started with W9F9E2 and I empowered him to what you see here. Though low S means you must be very careful with magic duel, a W9F9 caster can easily teleport in and annihilate armies with decent research, which he did on a few occasions.    Some graph.   Hatwer's final valiant defense of Shixasa against Nairoobeola. My army on the left is composed of mostly meaty chaff with a line of f9w9 pegasus riders backed by a pile of worms that walk and a wraith lord. On the right, we have Shixasa with a line of longspear wielding shielded abysians, one of the aforementioned abysian scorpion riders and a massive pile of mostly water mages. My general idea is to put up howl, relief and rigor mortis. Then just wait and let the infinite chaff drown him while fatigue and a pile of worms spamming stuff like storm of thorns does it's thing.   It works. The line of W mages kills a bunch of stuff but eventually the waves upon waves of continually spawning chaff overtakes them as they eventually fatigue out. In the end only a single mage survives. My lone dead wizard was the result of magic duel which he had scripted to kill any attempted Statue of War shenanigans.  Map position really helped in this game. I started up by the north edge, and was able to immediately destroy iloveyou's unlucky luck3 nation of Tilpada who was to my left with only a single route of expansion available through me. He had f9 magic power monkey sacreds which were pretty neat but I had f9w9 tiger riders in drain dominion and managed to get first hit in the 2 important battles. With that kind of bless on a unit with 3 attacks, first hit means that whatever you are hitting is probably dead unless it has FR. iloveyou also got absolutely screwed by the RNG in the first year with villains, trolls (which helpfully hit a choke and split his nation in half) and other poo poo. With luck3. Seriously. I had negotiated peace with both Patdonannia and Fumstan for the duration of the war so I was able to fully assimilate Tilpada unhindered. Upon completion of that war, I immediately attacked Fumstan as ENesbit was beginning to grow to an alarming size and was busy stomping Poseaa while Patdonannia was busy fighting the Shixasan menace, which I was ill equipped to fight. After a first rather comical loss involving a line of gelatinous cubes eating a large crossbow/flaming arrows army, I sent in a second group composed of yet more crossbows backed by 25 crystal sorceresses in a thunderstrike communion + relief/howl. This immediately flipped the war back in my favor and I was able to crush Fumstan's army. Around this time I also managed to push into the ocean as no one else had bothered taking it. It would take the bulk of nearly 20 turns to actually absorb Fumstan and its forts though and I would go on to require multiple fort assaults to crack then AI Fumstan and its strong skelespam. Had he not gone AI I suspect I would have been bogged down here for a while longer. Ocean conquest with indies was similarly slow. After that the research advantage started to show itself. I began temple spamming extremely hard and had a monthly worms that walk cast going. Shixasa eventually triumphed over Patdonannia and I opened that war by teleporting my statue onto his siege of Patdonannia's cap (which had a large pile of troops and 35ish frozen heart spamming mages with a bunch of water bottles on them). The statue put down acid storm + living water and simply waited for the spell to slowly melt all of the troops and about half of the mages. Once Shixasa finally killed all of my water elementals (a w9 drops 9 of them with a single cast) and hit the statue, its Ritual of Returning kicked in, sending him safely back to my capitol. In the end basically all of the troops were killed and about 15-20 mages. His job done, Shixasa was delayed for a few turns while I finished temple spamming all of my provs. Once he finally killed Patdonannia, my temple spam began to make itself felt. All of Patdonannia's candles vanished and my dozens of temples began throwing my dominion into this dom void, with worms/wraith lords/vampires following right behind. Shixasa was unable to resist. On the other side of the world, I ended up fighting Poseea, who had been at war with basically all of his neighbors since game start and was struggling to regain a foothold after I had killed Fumstan and stopped his advance. Our first battle was a duel of the thunderstrikes, with him winning via HP route after killing a big pile of xbows. However, this battle also ended up routing a bunch of his mages which split into 3 provs while mine all retreated back to a fort. I regrouped them and immediately counter-attacked while teleporting the murderstatue onto one of his retreat provinces. Scripting was also adjusted so that instead of spamming thunderstrike, each and every communion master would now be dropping Air Elementals. The statue was victorious and the air elementals annihilated Poseea's army, leaving me victorious there. At this point I came into conflict with basically everyone as I was approaching throne victory. Tarmarbad sent up hundreds of not-caelians to kill my temple spam and raid, which they did at first before being caught and slaughtered by anti-raid groups composed of my 5res spider riders for chaff backed by piles of my generic N2 mages scripted to throw down 3 to 6 casts of creeping doom + storm of thorns spam. My crystal sorc army which had lead the way on that side of the map was eventually destroyed trying to take a throne fort from the AI without a retreat prov (something I did because I was also storming a throne fort in Shixasa's lands. Only 1 of the 2 had to win for victory). Nuclearmonkee fucked around with this message at 15:59 on May 4, 2014 |
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May 4, 2014 15:49
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