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Chairman Capone posted:Is the second book generally considered better than the first? I've heard a lot of people say that the character roster is pretty dull, but maybe I'm confusing it with the third book. The second book has the most interesting characters. Unfortunately it still contains the dull-as-dirt main cast.
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May 6, 2014 21:00
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Vaz posted:Holden is dullest character and grandma is most interesting. Holden is main character in whole series, Grandma so far is only in second book. She's tangentially in the third too, iirc. It's just that it's mostly the Rocinante crew, Reverend Anna, the power-armor marine lady, and the super crazy assassin girl. Honestly I didn't think it was a particularly awesome entry in the series, but it wasn't like orders of magnitude worse than the prior two to me. The "slow zone" sure lived up to its name though...
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May 7, 2014 00:34
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My favorite scene in the book was when they were in the slow zone when suddenly [spoiler]the max speed changes and slams everyone into various bulkheads[/spoilers]. Scifi as gently caress.
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May 7, 2014 00:46
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The problem with the third book, aside from the lovely new characters (dull-as-ditchwater lesbian priest and Asian-girl-Gollum), was that they pushed all the cool mysterious build-up about aliens and other worlds to the back burner, and the entire second half of the book was tedious poo poo about a mutiny. The sudden slow-down was a cool set-piece though.
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May 7, 2014 00:55
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ThaGhettoJew posted:She's tangentially in the third too, iirc. It's just that it's mostly the Rocinante crew, Reverend Anna, the power-armor marine lady, and the super crazy assassin girl. Honestly I didn't think it was a particularly awesome entry in the series, but it wasn't like orders of magnitude worse than the prior two to me. The "slow zone" sure lived up to its name though... I found the parts with Anna and especially the Assassin were simply boring and dragged out endlessly. They tried so hard to make us care for the Assassin, which fell completely flat for me. Basically the whole third part after Holden returns from the station was stretched too long and too thin. I like Holden, including his mind-bogglingly stupid stubborness, so I don't have a problem with his parts and I like New Miller, even if Old Miller was of course far better, since he was actually a character. I liked the security chief (even if he was pretty bad at his job...), but yeah, next book better have Bobby and Grandma back.
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May 7, 2014 05:57
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I didn't mind the nutty assassin's descent into quasi-sanity, and the wholesome happy religious mommy stuff was trite but alright; my biggest complaint is that the putative big villain captain and the empty-suit political priest were just awful. Incompetent, sociopathic, and yet slavishly followed by enough moral-free peons to form a nigh-unstoppable counter-coup? Yeah, not the strongest written antagonists. I wanted more weird science, but I guess since there're going to be more books we've got all that interstellar transit hub stuff to look forward to. Holden's got to have his brains and DNA pretty much near melted by now with all the rads and proto-crap he's taken on though. I don't see how they're going to be able to keep him as anything like an action lead for three more full books.
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May 7, 2014 07:30
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Honestly the series is leagues ahead of every other new Spacer Opera title being published. What it lacks in excitability it makes up for in not being bat poo poo crazy libertarian crap.
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May 7, 2014 08:05
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They actually released a new novella a week ago; "The Churn". I liked it, and it has the first chapter of Cibola Burn in the back.Hedrigall posted:The problem with the third book […] was that they pushed all the cool mysterious build-up about aliens and other worlds to the back burner Well that's what the entire second book did. I didn't like Caliban's War much at all (although of course I agree with everyone in that it has the best character in the series). The plot just feels like a sidestory to the overarching plot. Venus is left almost completely alone except for, like, the first and last page in the book. I thought the stuff inside Ring Station in Abaddon's Gate was nice. btw I made an Expanse wiki 
Spug fucked around with this message at 09:40 on May 7, 2014 |
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May 7, 2014 09:35
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I have to say that the ending of second book the last few lines where Miller reappears was spine chilling and that unfortunately set my expectations too high for third book.... I liked the overall concept of space opera restricted to Solar System and bam to universe spanning space opera which which might be a let down or not,
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May 7, 2014 17:51
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Yeah, well, I like "space operas" confined to the solar system, and I also like huge, epic, galaxy-spanning space operas. So in this series, I get both!! I'm happy. By the way, if you like sci-fi restricted to the solar system you should check out the Edge of Infinity anthology. There's an Expanse short story in it too.
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May 7, 2014 19:12
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After chilling in weird fiction for a bit, I got back into space opera with House of Suns and Blindsight (not sure if that's space opera) and I realize I really, really love space opera. Anything new out lately I should check out?
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May 8, 2014 05:49
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fookolt posted:After chilling in weird fiction for a bit, I got back into space opera with House of Suns and Blindsight (not sure if that's space opera) and I realize I really, really love space opera. Anything new out lately I should check out? Ancillary Justice is all the rage. The Expanse books starting with Leviathan Wakes are very popular too.
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May 8, 2014 06:10
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General Battuta posted:Ancillary Justice is all the rage. The Expanse books starting with Leviathan Wakes are very popular too. I've read them both already  What else should I look for in terms of the major series in the space opera genre? There's a lot of recommendations here and I honestly have no idea what to go into next. I've already read The Culture, Hyperion, The Foundation, and Revelation Space and I really enjoyed all of them. I'd love to avoid rape/sexism poo poo or right wing war fetishism (so I guess the Gap Cycle is out). My Tom Clancy days ended way back in middle school.
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May 8, 2014 07:36
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The Vorkosigan Saga
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May 8, 2014 07:38
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I started reading Neal Asher' Polity books last week and they've been good so far.
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May 8, 2014 12:19
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pseudorandom name posted:The Vorkosigan Saga Any ideas the next book is coming out or not?
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May 8, 2014 17:05
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Vaz posted:Any ideas the next book is coming out or not? It may be a while. From an interview on the Captain Vorpatril's Alliance tour: quote:I’m kind of between projects, or I’ve got things that are not going well enough to make any promises. I’m working on a novella, which I was actually reading from on the book tour, so I guess now I have to finish the darn thing because I’ve given so many people the beginning of it. I have to think of a middle and an end for this. And I have some other things I was working on this spring that died. I’m not sure whether it needs a different approach or what. ...and I haven't seen that novella anywhere that I remember, so she doesn't seem to be in a hurry.
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May 8, 2014 18:03
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Seems to be in GRRM mode... Are there something else similar to Vorkosagin Saga?
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May 8, 2014 18:49
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pseudorandom name posted:The Vorkosigan Saga That's...a lot of books. I guess I'll start with Shards of Honor :o
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May 8, 2014 18:55
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Vaz posted:Seems to be in GRRM mode... Are there something else similar to Vorkosagin Saga? Not really a good analogy at all.
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May 8, 2014 19:05
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rafikki posted:I started reading Neal Asher' Polity books last week and they've been good so far. They are great. A grittier, more fast-paced and more brutal version of Banks Culture series with probably the best alien eco-systems in the genre. I like him better than Banks.
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May 8, 2014 21:02
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fookolt posted:What else should I look for in terms of the major series in the space opera genre? There's a lot of recommendations here and I honestly have no idea what to go into next. I've already read The Culture, Hyperion, The Foundation, and Revelation Space and I really enjoyed all of them. I enjoyed Allen Steele's Coyote saga. Five novels in the main series and three set in the same universe.
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May 8, 2014 22:25
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Cardiac posted:They are great. A grittier, more fast-paced and more brutal version of Banks Culture series with probably the best alien eco-systems in the genre. I read them in published order and probably the Spatterjay books are the strongest, tightest novels(and weirdest ecology!)
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May 8, 2014 22:52
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EdBlackadder posted:I read them in published order and probably the Spatterjay books are the strongest, tightest novels(and weirdest ecology!) I agree with you 500%. Spatterjay, starting with The Skinner, is the best of The Polity.
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May 8, 2014 23:50
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There was some talk about Stephen Baxter a few pages ago...A relative gave me his Doctor Who book for Christmas ("The Wheel of Ice") and I just got around to reading it. The reason I bring it up here is that it's not only a Doctor Who book but directly builds off his Manifold Trilogy, also. If you liked those books, it might be worth checking out (though it's definitely a different tone, having to be more Who-ish and all).
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May 9, 2014 00:10
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I like Baxter's short stories, but I find his novels impenetrable. I inevitably give up after maybe 20% of the book because I find it a chore to read. The ideas are drip fed over such a long time and the characters are pretty bland. The prose is also just kind of crap. His short stories compress a lot of ideas and events into a low number of pages and are quite pleasing.
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May 9, 2014 08:08
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Cardiac posted:They are great. A grittier, more fast-paced and more brutal version of Banks Culture series with probably the best alien eco-systems in the genre. This sounds awesome. Where should I start?
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May 9, 2014 08:46
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Start with The Skinner to get a taste for what Asher's works evolve into. His earliest books aren't like that (they're not bad, either), but it's representative of his later work, doesn't require a great deal of background knowledge, and is just awesome.
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May 9, 2014 09:22
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Neurosis posted:Start with The Skinner to get a taste for what Asher's works evolve into. His earliest books aren't like that (they're not bad, either), but it's representative of his later work, doesn't require a great deal of background knowledge, and is just awesome. Thanks. I'm a third of a way through Shards of Honor right now and is it supposed to be this...cheesy? quote:Vorkosigan grinned like a boy over his shoulder at her, and jogged after his prize. "Oh," she murmured, stunned herself by the effect of the grin. It had lit his face like the sun for that brief instant. Oh, do that again, she thought; then shook off the thought. Duty. Stick to duty.
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May 10, 2014 01:49
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fookolt posted:I'm a third of a way through Shards of Honor right now and is it supposed to be this...cheesy? The Vorkosigan books published before 1990 or so run from tolerable to adequate, it wasn't until Barrayar or Mirror Dance that they got good.
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May 10, 2014 01:57
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pseudorandom name posted:The Vorkosigan books published before 1990 or so run from tolerable to adequate, it wasn't until Barrayar or Mirror Dance that they got good. Oh okay. drat, I wish I knew that going in. It reads like broadcast TV at times.
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May 10, 2014 02:03
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Neurosis posted:Start with The Skinner to get a taste for what Asher's works evolve into. His earliest books aren't like that (they're not bad, either), but it's representative of his later work, doesn't require a great deal of background knowledge, and is just awesome. Prador Moon The Shadow of the Scorpion 2310 AD Gridlinked - 2434 AD The Line of Polity Brass Man Polity Agent Line War The Technician The Skinner - 3056 AD - Spatterjay sub-series The Voyage of the Sable Keech - Spatterjay sub-series Orbus - Spatterjay sub-series Hilldiggers - 3230 AD The Skinner is my favorite of all.
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May 10, 2014 04:08
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fookolt posted:I'm a third of a way through Shards of Honor right now and is it supposed to be this...cheesy? Almost all of Bujold's writing has at least a few romance novel type motifs, some far more than others. The two novellas in Cordelia's Honor (Shards/Barrayar) are sort of a prelude to the Miles books which are the vast majority of the series. If the space adventure with flirting stuff hurts you, you might want to back out before you get to Komarr and especially A Civil Campaign. Also, get used to protagonists with big moment-of-(emotional)-awesomeness lines and their accompanying awkward set ups. That said I still love her stuff, no matter how earnest or over-the-top it gets.
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May 10, 2014 06:14
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ThaGhettoJew posted:Almost all of Bujold's writing has at least a few romance novel type motifs, some far more than others. The two novellas in Cordelia's Honor (Shards/Barrayar) are sort of a prelude to the Miles books which are the vast majority of the series. If the space adventure with flirting stuff hurts you, you might want to back out before you get to Komarr and especially A Civil Campaign. Also, get used to protagonists with big moment-of-(emotional)-awesomeness lines and their accompanying awkward set ups. That said I still love her stuff, no matter how earnest or over-the-top it gets. Yeah, I'm not saying it's bad or something; it's just not my style. specklebang posted:Prador Moon That's the order you recommend?
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May 10, 2014 06:58
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Little reminder here that Shards of Honor was initially repurposed Star Trek fanfiction. No prizes for guessing the original identities of Beta Colony and Barrayar.
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May 10, 2014 09:13
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fookolt posted:That's the order you recommend? That's the internal chronological order of the series. It's one order and probably not a bad one. Honestly I read them in published order and I liked that (though I'm a bit obsessed with that since being a kid with all the Narnia weirdness). Basically, there are two subseries that should be read in order. There's the Agent Cormac series Gridlinked Line of Polity Brass Man Polity Agent Line War And there's Spatterjay The Skinner Voyage of the Sable Keetch Orbus The rest are fairly standalone but do reference the other books, for example the protagonist of Hilldiggers is sorry of from Spatterjay and there are some minor spoilers as a result. I'd recommend picking either of those series first then filling in the blanks with the rest. For new content, having taken a break for non-fiction I just blasted through Asher's short story collection The Engineer Reconditioned and I have to say it's not brilliant. The stories are almost all from early in good career and it shows. The proto-Polity universe stuff is kind of interesting and the Spatterjay one is not a bad prequel but I'm glad I only paid a couple of quid for it. The Owner sorry stories must've been an idea he loved because he basically wrote the same I've three times. And you really just skip the text between the stories.
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May 10, 2014 09:52
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fookolt posted:Oh okay. drat, I wish I knew that going in. It reads like broadcast TV at times. What you'r reading right now started as Star Trek fanfic. If it's too egregious for you then skip ahead to the Miles stuff.
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May 10, 2014 11:11
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fookolt posted:I've read them both already  ) however I thought it was pretty hilarious.
coyo7e fucked around with this message at 17:32 on May 10, 2014 |
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May 10, 2014 17:29
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coyo7e posted:Allen Steele's Coyote series is pretty good, and tracks Earth and a colonized planet as they first send out a colony ship, explore and learn to survive, and then get uppity about paying tariffs back to the Earth they haven't ever actually seen in their lifespans. There's definitely some Right Wing War stuff going on (neocons took over the country! They named all their ships and kids after Conservative/Confederate paragons! This is what's stopped me from getting into the Coyote series despite the raves it gets...just how deeply conservative/libertarian is it? Or is it a spoof of conservative viewpoints? I know in later books the planet gets colonized by a second wave of South American socialists and that just made me really nervous since it seems like it could veer into the "immigrant race war against American Values!" Fox News echo chamber.
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May 10, 2014 17:36
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The Lone Badger posted:What you'r reading right now started as Star Trek fanfic. If it's too egregious for you then skip ahead to the Miles stuff. Mind you, the second half (Barrayar) was written a few years later and the author's increased skills really show.
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May 10, 2014 19:44
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