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J.theYellow posted:And the dumbest addition to the updated design of Starcraft signature characters: Infested Kerrigan's evolved chitinous high heels. 
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May 11, 2014 06:04
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Zanziabar posted:Awesome, that's greatly appreciated. I was hesitant to ask given that the whole process of doing an LP is arduous and time - consuming. The latest video sans commentary is up and in the OP. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rPGY51b6hYQ I'll back fill in the rest when I have time. Really, the only time consuming part of adding the source videos is the upload.
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May 11, 2014 06:30
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J.theYellow posted:And the dumbest addition to the updated design of Starcraft signature characters: Infested Kerrigan's evolved chitinous high heels.
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May 11, 2014 06:33
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At least that's a costume item and not actually part of her body. What exactly would be the evolutionary point of hiking her butt up?
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May 11, 2014 06:45
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J.theYellow posted:At least that's a costume item and not actually part of her body. What exactly would be the evolutionary point of hiking her butt up? Also, at least those are rocket boots. Now Raiden, there was a character who could pull off high heels.
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May 11, 2014 07:00
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J.theYellow posted:At least that's a costume item and not actually part of her body. What exactly would be the evolutionary point of hiking her butt up? Well what's the point of having a body like her that's built out of sex appeal...
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May 11, 2014 07:08
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J.theYellow posted:At least that's a costume item and not actually part of her body. What exactly would be the evolutionary point of hiking her butt up? Jimmy can't kill her if she looks hot. It's the best evolutionary point in existence.
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May 11, 2014 09:37
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chiasaur11 posted:Also, at least those are rocket boots. Raidens high heels were a second pair of hands to do his famous sword grab with while break dancing, if I had to make an excuse for Kerrigan I'd say: So she can stab people with her feet, even though her weird bony wings have more range. She also doesn't walk most of the time but instead gently floats over the ground. Bioshock 1 and 2 had female splicers with malformed/cancerous heels that stuck out as biological high heels as well, which looked akin to footbinding. For those of you not in the know, is all kinds of messed up. Videogames 
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May 11, 2014 10:23
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J.theYellow posted:And the dumbest addition to the updated design of Starcraft signature characters: Infested Kerrigan's evolved chitinous high heels. As far as I'm aware, they were always there. I think an even worse decision was to loving keep them when there was an excellent opportunity to provide an improved design during Heart of the Swarm.
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May 11, 2014 12:29
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Kithrixx posted:As far as I'm aware, they were always there. I think an even worse decision was to loving keep them when there was an excellent opportunity to provide an improved design during Heart of the Swarm. Yeah, that's much worse, especially considering it happened after they'd received feedback from outside whatever misogynistic circlejerk was happening inside Blizzard. I also have a minor dispute with the dialogue in that cutscene, since I think it would've been more suiting to have Kerrigan be sort of reluctant about the oncoming doom (unless they were going to make her properly fatalistic and depressed, which they didn't). "We must embrace it" rather than "I shall", that sort of thing. Considering how much time and money they spent on the cutscenes, you'd think they would spend the time and money on enough writing sitdowns and revisions to come up with something that fits in more smoothly.
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May 11, 2014 14:16
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No, they spent all of that time and money on making sure you can see Kerrigan's Zerg pantyline.
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May 11, 2014 16:59
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Green Intern posted:No, they spent all of that time and money on making sure you can see Kerrigan's Zerg pantyline. Infested booty is the priority for both Blizzard and Jim Raynor.
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May 12, 2014 02:22
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Kithrixx posted:Infested booty is the priority for both Blizzard and Jim Raynor. Blizzard's priority was in designing Kerrigan as a transportation system for Dat rear end.
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May 12, 2014 02:49
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How can people talk about WC3 and blink and not mention the Beastmaster's level 3 bears. For shame. 
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May 12, 2014 03:22
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The heels could have been Kerrigan's own choice. Maybe she just wants to look fancy.
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May 12, 2014 04:40
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SirSamVimes posted:The heels could have been Kerrigan's own choice. Maybe she just wants to look fancy. Yeah, I mean clearly those bone wings aren't doing poo poo but she keeps growing them for whatever reason.
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May 12, 2014 06:02
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SirSamVimes posted:The heels could have been Kerrigan's own choice. Maybe she just wants to look fancy.
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May 12, 2014 06:37
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SirSamVimes posted:The heels could have been Kerrigan's own choice. Maybe she just wants to look fancy. This would work if only Kerrigan were a real person with her own agency, instead of a fictional character created by employees of Blizzard. Unfortunately for you and this post, she's not.
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May 12, 2014 06:57
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Psion posted:This would work if only Kerrigan were a real person with her own agency, instead of a fictional character created by employees of Blizzard. I think that was sarcasm.
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May 12, 2014 07:16
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It is a little known fact that all Zerg just want to look pretty and since Kerrigan is their queen, she can be the *~*prettiest princess*~* of them all.
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May 12, 2014 07:22
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She is the Queen Bitch of the Universe, I think they're meant to be bitch heels. I still think it's dumb as hell and I don't know where I heard the term 'bitch heels' from. 
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May 12, 2014 07:24
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Disco Infiva posted:It is a little known fact that all Zerg just want to look pretty and since Kerrigan is their queen, she can be the *~*prettiest princess*~* of them all. Why else would they come in so many decorative colours? TwoPair posted:Yeah, I mean clearly those bone wings aren't doing poo poo but she keeps growing them for whatever reason. Well, that's how she attacked people in the first, better Starcraft. Spudd posted:She is the Queen Bitch of the Universe, I think they're meant to be bitch heels. You made it up you freak.
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May 12, 2014 07:41
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Anatharon posted:You made it up you freak. Nah it's something I heard or read during high school, granted that was almost a decade ago at this point.
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May 12, 2014 07:44
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Are they anything like gently caress Me Shoes?
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May 12, 2014 08:14
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Kaboom Dragoon posted:Are they anything like gently caress Me Shoes? Looks like it and I am just an idiot who thought a thing club people said was real. Never mind me! I don't go out often. 
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May 12, 2014 08:26
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Psion posted:This would work if only Kerrigan were a real person with her own agency, instead of a fictional character created by employees of Blizzard. Your upset is showing, isn't the point of character writing to simulate the idea of people with their own agency moving within a story and setting? And why can't various (joke) explanations be given for things that are, but not for those who are made up? Kaboom Dragoon posted:Are they anything like gently caress Me Shoes? What are gently caress me shoes? And how would one identify them?
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May 12, 2014 08:51
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Samuel posted:Your upset is showing, isn't the point of character writing to simulate the idea of people with their own agency moving within a story and setting? Agreed, that is the point of character writing. However, for one it reeks of male gaze, there is very little of Kerrigan's design that isn't designed with heterosexual male brains in mind first and foremost; For two, Kerrigan's backstory involves this design being thrust upon her by a pseudo-male, authoritarian captor while she's imprisoned after having been abandoned to a horrible death by another authoritarian male character; For three, Kerrigan is the only important female character in Starcraft (the three minor ones being Selendis, who is indeed alright so far but has never had the 'oh man it's a human woman' aspect, Kate Lockwell, who is pretty great, and Nova, who has very similar troubles to Kerrigan in terms of background and butt display - one of the only pieces of art released for Starcraft: Ghost before it was cancelled was a rear-3/4 picture of Nova with second-skin suit buttcheeks). So yes, it's very possible to have female characters that make sense with a similar sort of design, but it's almost always done poorly. One of the only ones I know about in popular culture is the X-Men's Emma Frost, who you may notice originates in a universe with a good ratio of women:men and a good variety of personalities, body types and backgrounds for them. StarCraft is not that, regrettably. Maybe they can turn it around later, but I'm not holding my breath for Kerrigan.
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May 12, 2014 17:55
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I will say in Heroes of the Storm Kerrigan is back to attacking with the big scary claw wing things. I will say she also just in general has a better design there, she's still got the weird feet and all but she's just in general got a lot more bulk to her. Her alternate skin also proves she would have always worked better with hooves. Feinne fucked around with this message at 18:02 on May 12, 2014 |
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May 12, 2014 17:57
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WFGuy posted:StarCraft is not that, regrettably. Maybe they can turn it around later, but I'm not holding my breath for Kerrigan. This is a problem with Blizzard in general. Their level of writing when it comes to female characters is somewhere between "They have COOTIES!" and "They have BOOBS!"
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May 12, 2014 18:30
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WFGuy posted:Agreed, that is the point of character writing. However, for one it reeks of male gaze, there is very little of Kerrigan's design that isn't designed with heterosexual male brains in mind first and I don't see why a woman can't be sexy or cannot be allowed to be a victim in any way shape or form, for her to be a "good" female character. I'll agree that Kerrigan isn't exactly a shining example of deep heart wrenching intrigue, but the circumstances you illustrate cut off a lion's share of characters ever created for the sake of "someone might feel lustful", and then proceed to highlight X-men for a broad range of characters which is a bootylicious series to say the least and conforms highly to the categories you mentioned. I should also highlight Kerrigan started out as anything but the epitome of dead sexay. (depending on who you ask I reckon)   (And also manage to forget the best lady in SC2!~)(personal preference) Cythereal posted:This is a problem with Blizzard in general. Their level of writing when it comes to female characters is somewhere between "They have COOTIES!" and "They have BOOBS!" And general writing is difficult, and people fail to appreciate a good editor to read over your stuff and have a good discussion with to improve it, I think the gaming industry could benefit from editors. I'll also add that any female character ever written will suffer the criticism of woman everywhere for not being "X Y Z enough" or for not being written by a (prominent) female person. Which in todays world is taken to such extremes that nothing can be written at all without opening the bloodgates. This reminds me of the Last of us LP where people burst from the woodwork because Ellie wasn't enough of a killing machine ubermensch, and was actually exposed to danger to her person which she could not instantly overcome.  Truly heinous writing is everywhere to the right spectator. Again I won't argue Kerrigan's design is wierd and her story forced, but you see where I'm taking this I hope.
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May 12, 2014 20:39
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Samuel posted:Again I won't argue Kerrigan's design is wierd and her story forced, but you see where I'm taking this I hope. I do, and I maintain that Blizzard consistently has major issues when it comes to their writing and portrayal of female characters. It's probably at its worst in the Warcraft franchise, but more prominent in Starcraft due to Metzen's insistence that the heart of the Starcraft story is the love story between Raynor and Kerrigan.
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May 12, 2014 20:51
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I always thought that the story "of love" in SC1 was more intense because it showed the loss Raynor endured and how he was forced to hunt his former love. WHOOPS SPOILER Sorry about that. I guess what I wanted to see was that she consumed enough people and ancient zerg and regained her personality, then just retreated to the depth of space in shame to mentally process the genocides she committed while haunted by the memories of ghost people biomass that entered the swarm. HOTS would be about the Terrans being beset by UEF or the whatever ancients, and would murder with a vengeance to try and right some wrongs, preventing more lives from being lost and coming to terms with the fact that the swarm and by extension her, exists as a force of destruction. I guess there could be some philosophy in there where she creates a new cerebrate and raises it as a kid, in the hope to someday emulate some form of society in the recesses of space. Development of society which isn't structured like our own is prime writing material. Samuel fucked around with this message at 21:26 on May 12, 2014 |
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May 12, 2014 21:14
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Yikes that post contains some rather brutal spoilers...
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May 12, 2014 21:20
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Samuel posted:I don't see why a woman can't be sexy or cannot be allowed to be a victim in any way shape or form, for her to be a "good" female character. I'll agree that Kerrigan isn't exactly a shining example of deep heart wrenching intrigue, but the circumstances you illustrate cut off a lion's share of characters ever created for the sake of "someone might feel lustful", and then proceed to highlight X-men for a broad range of characters which is a bootylicious series to say the least and conforms highly to the categories you mentioned. I agree that I forgot to/didn't mention either the scientist in the refugee storyline or the character we haven't met yet, and that I wouldn't exactly hold up Marvel Comics as the epitome of female representation (although they're getting better and are far better than DC), I just gave an example off the top of my head of a powerful woman in fiction that is justifiably exhibitionist. However, when a writing team steered by men writes about one important woman (if added up, we have maybe seven or eight total other women in Starcraft? Two Protoss, one and a half Zerg, and about four humans? Plus a couple of unit types, of course), and gives her a story dominated by men, in which she has little agency, culminating in the aforementioned imprisonment-transformation to a subservient existence and an appearance with more sex appeal than anything else. It's the direction of choice that causes a lot of the problems - horrible things happen to Kerrigan, whereas the male characters do horrible things themselves. The heels are actually fine whenever she floats around, practically speaking, but if you were to say they had that idea and then implemented heels, rather than working backwards from heels to justification, it would be a more significant claim with less evidence than the reverse. Even then, there's no problem with liking something problematic, as long as you recognise the inherent problems. We can enjoy the Lord of the Rings movies even though they're super whitewashed, for instance. Here, it's men sitting around a table and dictating the horrible life experiences of Sarah Kerrigan and November Terra, which makes me a little uncomfortable.
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May 12, 2014 22:32
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Raldan posted:You promised us a picture of Dr. Hanson. You better deliver...  You can see this poster in the cantina on the wall next to Tosh.
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May 12, 2014 22:52
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Oh speaking of Nova, I'm actually earnestly surprised that her Ghost suit actually has proper footwear. Like don't get me wrong it's still essentially a catsuit but it doesn't have completely insane and impractical high heels so there's that. Feinne fucked around with this message at 22:59 on May 12, 2014 |
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May 12, 2014 22:55
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WFGuy posted:Problem content You keep using the word problematic like like people aren't allowed to write what they want. The only reason woman are any sort of powerful in DC or Marvel is because of a plot device which completely contradicts your statements that point others towards "problem content" while Kerrigan actually has the benefit of being a trained space Commando (deserved power through practice) albeit psychic (plot device power). I also don't see how adding more woman into a story about the Corprulu sector makes them or it any more meaningful, because you'd just add token females for the sake of appeasing your wierd double standards. I can't imagine why it's important that Kerrigan has any say in anything till she escapes the grasp of the Overmind or Mengsk for that matter. She's not a contender for imperial office, no she's a tool for the ghost program,(one of many) a means to an end and if we swapped her with Tosh we wouldn't be having this conversation because it would be happening to a dude. And apparently in story criticism dudes can be placed in any role and nobody bats an eyelash, and woman have to conform to strong independent ubermensche roles to appease "someone" for "some" world view they have and woe those we deviate from that for creating problem content and making people uncomfortable. You're literally constraining the part woman play in any fiction, for not conforming to your liking and that's all sorts of problem content to me. Trying to find or actually looking hard enough that you place your constraining tropes into stories where they may not even be relevant or present is an awful practice. Mengsk is an awful dictator he uses whoever he likes to achieve his goals like Darth Vader, or Claire Underwood. Not because he's written to oppress female agents of the ghost program, that's not his purpose, his purpose is to be hated by both us the viewer and Jim for using and expending him to make him Ruler of the space rednecks. While Jimmy needs to terrible things to undo his mistakes like Emperor Mengsk, and not being able to save his beloved who went on a genocide spree. While Sarah needs to do terrible things to survive and protect her new family The Swarm, and most of all bring Mengsk to justice(death) for causing all this. Mengsk blames everybody for being lesser, Jimmy blames himself for letting it happen, Sarah blames Mengsk for being irredeemably self serving. That you manage to spin this into something to unleash your moral codes on astounds me, I wish it came down to well it's lame and it surprised nobody. But apparently it manages to be problem content against woman, while I'm sure only people who'd actively look for it would find it, actually I'm sure any spindoctor will manage to trash any piece of fiction using a coarse enough filter. Feinne posted:Oh speaking of Nova, I'm actually earnestly surprised that her Ghost suit actually has proper footwear.
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May 12, 2014 23:57
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Technically ghosts have those sam fisher face thingies...
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May 13, 2014 00:32
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Samuel posted:You keep using the word problematic like like people aren't allowed to write what they want. I'm gonna duck out of the conversation after this but I just wanna point out the fact that you missed where he said WFGuy posted:Even then, there's no problem with liking something problematic, as long as you recognise the inherent problems. We can enjoy the Lord of the Rings movies even though they're super whitewashed, for instance. although Samuel posted:I'm always bothered by the lack of helmets, which is supposed to make them the faceless avenger. That makes me think. People only wear helmets in video games when they're not important. Everybody also keeps helicopter doors wide open as well but that's another dumb thing entirely. But what if they started doing the Octo-camo thing from MGS4 with helmets? If you wanted to talk with someone you can set it to literally show your face conversing with people but without the disbelief breaking problem of "WHY AREN'T YOU WEARING A HELMET, YOU'RE NOT BULLETPROOF, WHAT THE HELL?!" rearing its ugly head.
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May 13, 2014 00:32
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Calax posted:Technically ghosts have those sam fisher face thingies... We actually even get to see one in such in one of the cutscenes in Wings.
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May 13, 2014 00:38
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