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People should be introduced to doom user maps with a megawad of randomly chosen 1994 and 1995 maps.
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May 16, 2014 06:52
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| # ? Jun 4, 2024 13:12 |
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People should be introduced to Doom user maps with wow.wad. It's interesting how much different Wolf 3D's flow and feel are from Doom. Doom is more of a shooter, but Wolf 3D is basically a slow-paced exploration game with guns; if you try to speed through the levels on any difficulty above easy mode you'll get slaughtered.
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May 16, 2014 07:09
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It's not really a first-person shooter, but I gotta say, Jazz Jackrabbit 3 looked like it could've been a lot of fun. Cutesy, family-friendly third-person shooter in UnrealEngine 1? Mildly surprised all the publishers they pitched the game to passed that up. Did Jazz Jackrabbit 2 sell poorly or something? Granted, the leaked alpha apparently is pretty janky, but a lot of that could've been tidied up had it, well, been further developed out of said alpha instead of being cancelled outright. SALT CURES HAM posted:Jesus, Episode 1 Floor 10 is huge. Also confusing, but mostly just huge.
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May 16, 2014 07:15
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Shadow Hog posted:Did Jazz Jackrabbit 2 sell poorly or something?
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May 16, 2014 07:34
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So since we were on subject of what to introduce to new players of Doom, what wads/mods would you all really suggest? I never had a computer when these games came out, and even when we got out first bad one, I was mainly playing on consoles. But reading about these games and their mods really makes me want to go back play the old games I never got to experience. I wanted to start with vanilla Doom on the "normal" difficulty, maybe up it a bit if I beat it or I think it's too easy, but...I was wondering if there's some alternate "preferred/definitive" versions of the vanilla Doom 1/2/etc. If it means anything, I used to rent Doom and Duke Nukem for the N64 and play them a fair amount, but I don't think I ever beat them. I'm not new to the games, but I don't believe I'm good by any stretch of the term.
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May 16, 2014 08:13
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Just play Doom. I recommend this sourceport with default settings: http://prboom.sourceforge.net/
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May 16, 2014 08:26
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Play Doom 1 in any source port ever, then play Doom 2 in any source port ever. The two base WAD's are really good, even if I personally think the last half of Doom 2 is a goddamn mess of attempted puzzle maps and awkward mazes.
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May 16, 2014 08:37
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Touchfuzzy posted:So since we were on subject of what to introduce to new players of Doom, what wads/mods would you all really suggest? I'm the same, had Duke and Doom on N64 a long time ago and never beat them and thats pretty much the extent of my Doom experience. I started getting back into Doom a few months ago ago with Doom 2, managed to beat that and right now Im stuck on episode 4 of the original Doom, all on hurt me plenty so far. The original map sets are pretty awesome for the most part (Doom 2 has a few lovely maps) and all the other wads I have tried so far have been insanely difficult even on the default setting. Anyway Id say the default campaigns are still challenging and fun, just use Zandronum or GZdoom for nicer graphics.
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May 16, 2014 08:39
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SALT CURES HAM posted:People should be introduced to Doom user maps with wow.wad. It's certainly no surprise given Castle Wolfenstein was one of the first stealth games. Had Wolfenstein 3D gone as the original designers wanted we would have gotten Thief in 1991 with Nazis.
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May 16, 2014 08:47
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Absolutely play Doom (Doom 1 holds up pretty well except for loving Mt. Erebus, Jesus Christ loving Mt. Erebus), play a bit of Doom 2, and go until you either beat it or hit the city levels. Then load up a couple mods. The Doom the Way iD Did are pretty solid, I believe (I've only played a bit of 1). I recommend The Ultimate Torment and Torture when you feel you've gotten a bit better at it, it's rough but not hideously rough.
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May 16, 2014 08:48
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Thy flesh consumed is so much harder than any other episode from doom 1 or 2. It's kicking my rear end.
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May 16, 2014 08:55
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Brasseye posted:Thy flesh consumed is so much harder than any other episode from doom 1 or 2. It's kicking my rear end. No kidding, I could barely get past the first level and had to give up in the second level due to a lack of ammo. Doom holds up extremely well if you play it in a decent resolution and with the modern control scheme.
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May 16, 2014 09:05
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The first two or so levels of Episode 4 are by far the hardest levels in the game. When you get to E4L4, it becomes a lot easier.
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May 16, 2014 09:25
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Shadow Hog posted:It's not really a first-person shooter, but I gotta say, Jazz Jackrabbit 3 looked like it could've been a lot of fun. Cutesy, family-friendly third-person shooter in UnrealEngine 1? Mildly surprised all the publishers they pitched the game to passed that up. Did Jazz Jackrabbit 2 sell poorly or something? Jazz Jackrabbit 2: The Secret Files (a Europe only expansion) sold so poorly that it was basically responsible for Gathering of Developers' demise. Man I really need to finish that LP project.
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May 16, 2014 09:27
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SALT CURES HAM posted:It's interesting how much different Wolf 3D's flow and feel are from Doom. Doom is more of a shooter, but Wolf 3D is basically a slow-paced exploration game with guns; if you try to speed through the levels on any difficulty above easy mode you'll get slaughtered.  ), then a good chunk of the fun got sucked right out of the game until I eventually conquer this level. Please tell me there aren't any more levels like this...  VVV  Thank you for telling me this now after I spent an unknown amount of time (I'm thinking between 30-60 minutes) on the maze alone... On the Steam version (using ECWolf), nonetheless. At least I didn't get stuck, so that's good I guess.
Obeast fucked around with this message at 09:56 on May 16, 2014 |
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May 16, 2014 09:36
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Obeast posted:I'm playing through Wolf3D for the first time in my entire life (I remember we had a shareware disk of it as a kid, but I don't remember that much about it aside from thinking how cool it was to see everything from the main character's POV), and I totally agree with this. I was expecting it to be a lot like Doom than it actually is, but it's still a pretty decent game for it's age... Until a little bit ago when I got to E2M8 (I'm sure almost everyone who has played Wolf3D knows excatly which level that I'm talking about You can completely skip the giant pushwall maze. There's no reward for doing it, you get trapped if you find the "Call Appogee" sign, and the "Call Apogee" sign isn't in the version of Steam.
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May 16, 2014 09:50
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Has anyone made a Wolfenstein 3D-style advice animal meme thing? I want to see one that has BJ's head and it says "CALL APOGEE/SAY AARDWOLF"
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May 16, 2014 10:13
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Amethyst posted:Just play Doom. http://sourceforge.net/projects/prboom-plus/
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May 16, 2014 10:56
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Hard Doom is a very nice addon modification if you like Survival Co-op on the Zandronum source port. And if you like getting your rear end handed to you. Those quad shotgun zombies, good lord.
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May 16, 2014 11:29
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Touchfuzzy posted:So since we were on subject of what to introduce to new players of Doom, what wads/mods would you all really suggest? After you're done with Ultimate Doom and Doom 2, make sure you play Final Doom. Plutonia is a step up in difficulty but easily my favorite of the official IWADs. You can play Doom 64 on PC via Doom 64EX and a ROM. It's also very good and only recently has been getting the praise it deserves.
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May 16, 2014 11:49
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The best introduction to Doom is D!Zone.
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May 16, 2014 13:45
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I'll vote on Scythe (so much fun! You can stop at the later slaughtermaps if you can't handle it) and Back to Saturn X (probably the best combination of pretty and smooth gameplay).
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May 16, 2014 14:41
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Shadow Hog posted:The secret level? It's large, but it's also very linear; it's not too hard to keep track of, even without a map. Yeah, most of why it's annoying is because I was trying to find all the secrets and some of them are a biiiiitch to find. al-azad posted:It's certainly no surprise given Castle Wolfenstein was one of the first stealth games. Had Wolfenstein 3D gone as the original designers wanted we would have gotten Thief in 1991 with Nazis. I mean, from this perspective it makes sense, it's just interesting because this perception of it as "Doom but more primitive" has kinda taken over even though it's the farthest possible thing from the truth.
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May 16, 2014 15:09
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SALT CURES HAM posted:Yeah, most of why it's annoying is because I was trying to find all the secrets and some of them are a biiiiitch to find. You really shouldn't be trying to find all of the secrets unless you have a guide right next to you. It's way too much of a pain and the rewards aren't really worth it. I've found that, even in Death Incarnate, finding a few easy-to-discover secrets with ammo and healing items in them are all you need to get you through a level with little difficulties.
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May 16, 2014 15:29
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I have a guide next to me and it's still a pain in the rear end.  On a completely unrelated note, I'm surprised nobody seems to have tried to make a new commercial IWAD for the Doom engine, given that it's been open-source for ages, Doom still has a crazy-healthy community, and the indie game zeitgeist seems in favor of it.
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May 16, 2014 15:34
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I'd pay for something like BTSX. The production values are commercial quality as far as I'm concerned. (Not a lot, but put it on Steam for 5$ and I'd bite.)
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May 16, 2014 15:41
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SALT CURES HAM posted:I have a guide next to me and it's still a pain in the rear end. Don't bother getting all of them. Seriously. I've played all of Wolf3D in Death Incarnate and I only bother to get secrets if they're obvious or I have a map and I'm feeling adventurous. It just makes the game worse if you spend half of your time in a map following instructions to find all of the secrets instead of blasting everything you can and getting to the next map.
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May 16, 2014 15:42
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Jordan7hm posted:I'd pay for something like BTSX. The production values are commercial quality as far as I'm concerned. (Not a lot, but put it on Steam for 5$ and I'd bite.) Especially once it's finished! 3 episodes of that size 
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May 16, 2014 15:48
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No Rest For The Living isn't an iwad but they do sell it. I thought it was pretty great.
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May 16, 2014 15:50
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On the subject of short maps, mtrop's Coffee Break is a really good set of 11 short maps.
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May 16, 2014 16:05
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I used to have a lot of fun playing a wad called NeoDoom I think it was called. Has that been updated?
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May 16, 2014 16:48
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After Doom and Doom 2 (or even before them) you really should check out Hexen. Much different visuals and more RPG-like gameplay. There's a lot of hunting around and backtracking but it's pretty fun. Heretic is fun too, but felt more like fantasy Doom than an entirely different game. Strife is worth a shot just to see how far they went with the Doom engine, but I didn't really get into it that much. Final Doom is good, but some of the levels are just punishingly difficult. As far as wads go, anything by Team TNT (Icarus, Daedalus, half of Final Doom) is great. Also Memento Mori and Memento Mori 2 were fantastic megawads. Then check out what some recent caco award winners are for more modern stuff.
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May 16, 2014 17:05
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Someone said it perfectly earlier in this thread- Hexen is like playing through a heavy metal album cover.
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May 16, 2014 17:13
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I can't recommend Hexen in good conscience - the graphics and setting are metal as gently caress, but the cross-map switch puzzles where you sort of have to guess what map you just did a thing to are frustration incarnate.
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May 16, 2014 17:24
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Hexen is dogshit.
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May 16, 2014 17:26
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Yeah just read a hint guide when you get stuck. There are a few really annoying things I always miss.
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May 16, 2014 17:26
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The Kins posted:I can't recommend Hexen in good conscience - the graphics and setting are metal as gently caress, but the cross-map switch puzzles where you sort of have to guess what map you just did a thing to are frustration incarnate. Myself and three goons cooped hexen the other night. It was some of the most fun I've had in a long time playing a classic fps. The hexen coop fix patch helps a lot to add global pickups and such.
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May 16, 2014 17:27
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The Kins posted:I can't recommend Hexen in good conscience - the graphics and setting are metal as gently caress, but the cross-map switch puzzles where you sort of have to guess what map you just did a thing to are frustration incarnate. Heretic rules, Hexen drools.  Fun idea for its time (hub worlds! Revisiting old locations! In a DOOM-clone?!) and some cool RPG elements (Items! Magic!) and playing it multiplayer is really fun because of the classes, but playing it single player is a boring slog. You get a whole what, three, four guns in the whole game? You're running around with only 2 loving weapons for like half of the game. That's stupid. If you mod Hexen to have more guns its a lot more fun. My parents didn't let me play Doom when I was real young so I Played Heretic and Dark Forces instead and I loving loved that poo poo. Some really good level design and cool themes in both compared to usual Doom-clones which don't change much. Zaphod42 fucked around with this message at 17:30 on May 16, 2014 |
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May 16, 2014 17:28
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Hexen can be really really fun but it can also be the most frustrating switchhunt in the world (ESPECIALLY the Castle Grief hub and the Gibbet an all that poo poo, gently caress it). It's also brought down a lot by having only four loving weapons, which is by far the worst part about it.
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May 16, 2014 17:28
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| # ? Jun 4, 2024 13:12 |
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Hexen has a lot of cool stuff in there, but it's a case of good ideas executed badly. Good idea: Multiple classes, each with unique weapon sets. Bad idea: Each class only has four weapons, and they're handed out far too slowly. Good idea: Non-linear action RPG hub-worlds and exploration. Bad idea: Pull a switch in one level and it opens a single door somewhere in any of four other levels. You don't know which, or where. The Serpent: Resurrection total conversion mod is pretty great though. Lots of stuff per class, much bigger and more interesting non-linear world design. Much more focus on the RPG elements, too. My advice, though: Don't do the tedious sidequests in the starting town. Just type 'Give Gold 200' (I think - been a while) in the console, buy some stuff in the stores and leave.
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May 16, 2014 17:31
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