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Yeah pretty much. A majority of people who have or are going to bother playing NWN2 know the controversy over the ending. Saying it in a way that jokingly invokes the ending to a lot of bad DND games is probably the least offensive way to put it. You're not spoiling major character development (like there is any in NWN2 ha ha jokes) or how it happens or what causes it. If you were to spoil how it ties into Mask of the Betrayer that would be a different story.
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May 13, 2014 23:27
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gatz posted:A spoiler revealing the end of the game is tame to you? What would be an extreme spoiler, then? Probably the identity of Rosebud. It's his sled.
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May 13, 2014 23:29
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Rocks fall, everyone dies, is about the same level of spoiler as someone whose read the game of thrones series telling people who haven't read the books but watch the show not to get attached to pretty much any major character. Also anyone who hasn't played nwn2 OC yet thinks its some kind of joke anyways as opposed to the literal ending
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May 14, 2014 05:44
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WanderingMinstrel I posted:Rocks fall, everyone dies, is about the same level of spoiler as someone whose read the game of thrones series telling people who haven't read the books but watch the show not to get attached to pretty much any major character. As someone who has never played any of those games, I can confirm that I have no idea what any of this means and why it is considered a spoiler.
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May 14, 2014 06:32
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gatz posted:A spoiler revealing the end of the game is tame to you? What would be an extreme spoiler, then?
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May 14, 2014 10:02
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JT Jag posted:A spoiler revealing a major plot point to the expansion, which is much better. Especially anything regarding the evil ending- which is glorious and entirely worth reading through both LPs to get to.
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May 14, 2014 15:50
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Sorry for any inadvertent spoiling/derailing. I've edited the post. And yeah, those LT. Danger LPs are pretty amazing. I wish he'd do another one.
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May 14, 2014 18:02
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JT Jag posted:A spoiler revealing a major plot point to the expansion, which is much better. I actually played all the way through the original NWN2 and got burned out on the "much better" expansion. The game just falls entirely to pieces the higher level you get.
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May 14, 2014 19:34
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Gort posted:I actually played all the way through the original NWN2 and got burned out on the "much better" expansion. The game just falls entirely to pieces the higher level you get. This describes most high level rpg play unless it was actually designed with high level play in mind. D&D starts to fall apart around level 8 and gets worse from there. A fifth generation vampire would be boring to play because you could murder everything, etc.
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May 14, 2014 22:46
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Pvt.Scott posted:This describes most high level rpg play unless it was actually designed with high level play in mind. D&D starts to fall apart around level 8 and gets worse from there. A fifth generation vampire would be boring to play because you could murder everything, etc. Ir'a particularly bad if you play as any type of spellcaster in NWN2. You're spellbook will be holding 60+ spells already at the beginning of MOTB, and it gets worse from there.
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May 14, 2014 23:26
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 We have Isaac's tape. Now all that's left is to bring it back to him.  He doesn't think much of us.  I didn't doubt you'd find this... and I apologize if I was overly imperious before - a reflex action - I get a lot of young blood in here forgetting their place. I'll assist you as reasonably as I can with your task, but first... The camera zooms into the TV screen, and the tape begins... Watch Tape: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UhMgiSR5PdQ  The tape fades in and shows a girl sprinting away from three monsters...  She runs towards the door...  ...and to the right...   ...she closes the door, thinking she's safe...  ...yet she's only secured her death, trapping herself with two more of these monsters.  The screen fades out...  ...and we're left with this logo, accompanied by a low, buzzing noise, and the sound of someone breathing.  We wait for Isaac to clean up, then he rejoins us.  It just so happens that around the time this snuff film started circulating, the Nosferatu disappeared. I tried to elicit their help in tracking down the source, and for the first time in all these years, I was dismayed by their absence. So you think this tape has something to do with their disappearance? Presumably, Isaac has seen the entire thing before. I'm not sure why we need a full copy, but if Saint Isaac demands it, then we must comply. Where do we find a better copy? Behind the spit-shine gloss of the Hollywood dream factory, there's another city churning out a vile by-product for the furtive consumption of a debauched audience. I have no doubt the film's found its way to another smut peddler. I'd ask around.Now that we've done this service for Isaac, he'll answer some of our questions. Before I start looking, I had a few questions. Tell me about yourself.Here we go. Prepare for an hour of dialogue. In your lifetime, unwittingly or not, you have seen an Isaac Abrams production. As the financier of thirty percent of American Film's top 100 movies, you must have. Being the Baron of Hollywood, I can do any project I want.I suppose so, but being dead, you'd probably have to have a series of go-throughs, psuedonyms, go through a big corporation, etc. Not as spectacular as being alive and in the limelight. Can I be in a movie? Unless you're the most spectacular actor I've never heard of, your look would be a tough sell. But don't take it too hard, once you're dead, there's no such thing as good publicity.The same goes for Isaac, here. Who's your favorite person you've worked with? Stewart, Lean, Hitchcock, Wilder, Holden, Dean, Scorsese, De Niro, and, last but not least Ash, my childe.  I remember some studio suit lost in time telling me the only thing they could use Bogart for was to move furniture.His childe, Ash? Ash? Ash. Where do I begin? Seven years ago, I saw a casting session for what would become Negative Zero. The moment I set eyes on him - the passion of his performance, I knew he had it. I hadn't seen anything like him since Clift or Dean. He had the looks, the charisma, allure... that undefinable quality that makes a film legend. My first movie with him made him a sensation... and it also changed him. How? We can't judge. We did the same thing to save Heather. You made him your childe to save him? I acted on impulse. I had seen so many others die before their time, but with Ash, I had a chance to prevent that fate.  So what happened? It devastated Ash - he still wanted to act, but I denied him his place in the limelight. He had to lie to his friends about his new lifestyle. He had to feed. I gave him a club - a scrap of his former glory. I did everything I could to facilitate the change. Does he hate you? He feels obligated to me. I don't think he hates me... resents me, maybe. I am his sire and he is my childe and there is a responsibility and respect inherent in that bond, even if we are no longer the friends we were.Maybe Ash could give us some insight into how to get what we want from Isaac. Where can I find Ash? The "Asp Hole". Maybe I'll head over there some time. I had some other questions. Anything else I can do in this city? Look at that grin. Yeah, tell me about this Gargoyle. It's taken up residence in my beloved Asian theater. It is closed now, but that's beside the point. I sent some people to evict it, and it sent them back with a few less limbs. I can't have that monster attacking Kindred in my city. I'm interested, but how exactly does one deal with a Gargoyle? It's a walking block of stone with a taste for blood - I'd suggest whatever method doesn't result in you being eviscerated. In truth, I'd rather have it as an ally, but I doubt it's going to be chatty. Here's the key for the theater. I'll leave it up to you.Who do we know that might know about a Gargoyle? In other words, where did we find a book about Gargoyles? Maximilian Strauss. Dealing with this Gargoyle means heading back downtown. I'll see what I can do. I had another question. What can you tell me about the Nosferatu? The Nosferatu? I pity them, but I loathe their presence. I deal with them when it's necessary. I know they're beneath my city somewhere, but only they know where. They respect my streets and I keep my politics out of their sewers, but I don't trust them by any stretch of the word. I'll get back to looking for that tape. Later, Isaac.We have four courses of action right now:
 We're going to look into Ash's situation, first. We don't know where to start looking for the complete tape; dealing with the Gargoyle means going back downtown; dealing with the serial killer involves leaving town. Plus, we might get some information about the tape while we're in the Asp Hole.   This place is just another generic club, but the important thing to note is that there's a vampire hunter staking out near the entrance. What could that be about?  Here we can see Colin Kaepernick blowing off some steam after throwing away the NFC championship.  I'm putting another dot into Charisma, bringing our persuasion score up to 7.  We'll also try to hit on this woman. Who can know themselves even really? Such is the conundrum of life. Oh my gosh, my skank-sense is tingling!No luck. Melissa goes home alone tonight.  There's also this guy standing in the corner. Anyway, we find Ash upstairs.  ...or maybe we don't. You Ash? Present.Right now we're given to option to ask him about the tape, which we'll do. Do you know anything about a snuff film? That's street trash. You want the Sin Bin.There we go. Our next stop in the main quest is the "Sin Bin." Anything else?But still, Ash is acting all moody and poo poo, not being very talkative towards a fellow vampire. Something must be up. Is there something wrong? We've clearly interrupted his thoughts. What he just said makes no sense out of context. The only thing we know for sure is that he might die if he leaves the club. Might as well tease more information out of him. Remember, quitters never win and suicide is always the answer. Mmm, yeah, the biographers would eat it up; the studios would sell more copies of my movies; they'd probably put up a statue of me somewhere.... "Die young, live forever." I'd be one handsome pile of dust. Sounds like you've thought about it. Hunters - in front, back, inside my club. I try to leave, they'll move on me. So, I had to ask myself, if I go out there, am I prepared to die? How many could I take out before the killing stroke, huh? Two? Three?There we go. It's the hunter(s). Somehow they've figured out that he's in here, yet they haven't bothered to walk up the stairs to find him for some reason. I could just walk out there, right now, blaze of glory. The end. And you know what? Knowing that... it doesn't bother me. And I guess the only reason I haven't walked out yet is because I'm trying to figure out why it doesn't bother me.Ash was embraced against his will. As a former actor, having to step out of the limelight probably kills him. We have already learned this from Isaac, and that certainly must be causing him distress. But would it drive him to suicide? Speaking of Isaac... Aren't you worried about what Isaac would think? It would break Isaac's heart. It's good to know some good would come from my death. You don't like Isaac? That story would take too long to tell. Suffice it to say, we haven't seen eye-to-eye on too many things lately, and it's pissed off Isaac to no end. For instance? He kept saying I should keep a low profile. He kept saying I was attracting too much attention to myself. What's wrong with keeping a low profile? Now Ash not keeping a low profile has led to Hunters infiltrating his club. The bouncers are, for some reason, okay with letting katana-wielding, trenchcoat-wearing, vigilantes stay here. Being Kindred is great. Having powers, living forever, sleeping all day. I didn't ask for this. I didn't ask Isaac to save my life. Maybe I wanted to die. I was having fun, dammit! I was alive! Who the hell gave him the right to deny me that?!? I can't act anymore, I can't love anymore; all I can do is... fade into obscurity.  Let's pretend we weren't listening and bring up Isaac again. Why don't you ask Isaac for help out of this? Isaac help me? That's a laugh. He wouldn't be caught within 500 feet of this place, not with hunters around. Just the thought of asking him for help, that smug curl of those poison lips of his... not in this lifetime.It all comes down to us. Maybe I can help you. Did Isaac send you?He told us where you were, but not to help you. Maybe he doesn't even know what's happening. No. What the hell, then, would be your motivation to help me?Can't you see that you've touched Melissa's big old kindred heart? If I can help people, I do. And you need some help. Like the Romero quest, this can either be solved through combat or through conversational methods. The former requires defending Ash against hunters in a sewer. No thanks. The latter has to do with someone we've already seen. You can switch clothes with someone in this club who looks like you. D'you get that idea from a sitcom? Whatever. Look around the club, maybe you'll get lucky. I'll come back when I find somebody.Would a hunter really be fooled by a change of clothes? Perhaps, but only on the condition that Ash switches clothes with a look-a-like. Who do we know that looks like Ash?  This guy. [Seduction] Hey, aren't you Ash?!? Uh... yeah, I'm Ash, I'm just trying to keep a low profile. Fans, you know.The easiest way to get this guy out of his clothes would be to dominate him. We're not allowed to do that. So here we'll rely on seduction. Let's ask him to recite one of Ash's famous lines, and act wooed when he does. He must know the lines, right? Do that line from Negative Zero.... Oh, I love that line. You know which one. Oh, do you? [Nervous, fumbling] Umm.... Every time... y-you come in here... uh, you look... uh wai- wai- wait wait, I got it, you look at that picture on the wall and you say, "I gotta go there sometime". Every time! But you never go. And every time, I gotta hear it.That was terrible. That sounds a lot different than the way you did it in the movie. Okay. But first I need you to do something for me. And what would that be? I need you to exchange clothes with someone. Uh... It would just make me so hot if you were dressed like my brother.  Aww... eww... I'm not that drunk. Yikes!This is going nowhere. [Intimidate] I need your clothes. Give them to me. Whoa, back up! What the hell do you want my clothes for?Nice try. Either you take them off or I will. What am I supposed to wear? You see that guy over there? You get to wear his clothes. The look-a-like does what he's told. Heading back up to the real Ash...  Yeah. Go into the men's bathroom. Change clothes with the guy in there. You better hope they get these hunters from a temp agency, cuz all a pro's gonna do is have a laugh. If it works, I'm out of this city. Here, token of my thanks. It will be well spent.Even though we didn't ask for any money, Ash gives us $250. We also take a humanity hit.  Ash meets his double...  ...and they magically swap clothes. It's just different colors of the same outfit. Who would even be able to tell the difference? But sure enough... Watch: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_75b0Ns4GBs  The hunter walks up to the fake Ash...  ...and plunges a stake into his heart!  He falls dead. Yet Ash didn't turn into a pile of ash. But that's because staking a vampire in the heart only paralyzes them.  The hunter realizes that he's killed a human--presumably because of the noises that Ash #2 must have made as he died--and runs out in a panic. The quest ends there, and Ash is safe. Bonus! Watch the alternate way to end the quest, with combat in a unique section of the sewers: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NFlnfiGQiwg gatz fucked around with this message at 16:27 on May 22, 2014 |
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May 21, 2014 11:19
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gatz posted:
The facial animations in this game are magical. That grin is pretty good, but later in the game, Beckett delivers the smuggest loving grin I've ever seen, and it's absolutely delicious.
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May 21, 2014 11:25
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quote:He falls dead, the hunter leaves, and Ash is safe. And despite the victim failing to burn away when he dies, the hunters remain convinced that they got their vampire?
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May 21, 2014 11:55
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Also the fact that staking a vampire in the heart doesn't kill them anyway. Basically, these are the worst vampire hunters. Or they just go "Huh, guess he was human after all. My bad."
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May 21, 2014 11:59
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PureRok posted:Also the fact that staking a vampire in the heart doesn't kill them anyway. Basically, these are the worst vampire hunters. Or they just go "Huh, guess he was human after all. My bad." I think the idea is "I stake the guy, then head out and get my pals to bring the paralyzed body out and back to our secret hideout", and in that window of opportunity, Ash slipped out of the club.
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May 21, 2014 12:01
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Nice to see that you're still updating this. When I played this part the snuff film and the rest of the quest really got to me, almost thought it was too much. Good stuff.
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May 21, 2014 13:13
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It's weird, when you play it back then, you don't notice how awkward the graphics are. It's only when you see newer stuff that you realize how goofy they can make it look in comparison.
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May 21, 2014 13:19
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I remember the cutscene as the hunter stabbing the human, freaking out and running away since he just murdered someone. But i could be misremembering since it has been a while since i played.
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May 21, 2014 14:24
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UrbicaMortis posted:I remember the cutscene as the hunter stabbing the human, freaking out and running away since he just murdered someone. But i could be misremembering since it has been a while since i played. You're right! https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_75b0Ns4GBs The running away part is just done very poorly.
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May 21, 2014 14:29
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Thanks for continuing this LP. This game is nostalgic for me, brings back memories of the 2000's: things were XTREME, movies like the Underworld series, and FM radio played goth-tinged alt-rock music like A Perfect Circle, Evanescence, and Lacuna Coil.
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May 21, 2014 15:43
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I'm surprised you didn't say a word about how Ash is based on Bruce Campbell, another one of those horror icons Bloodlines loves to reference in Hollywood.
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May 21, 2014 15:51
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PureRok posted:Also the fact that staking a vampire in the heart doesn't kill them anyway. Basically, these are the worst vampire hunters. Or they just go "Huh, guess he was human after all. My bad." He basically goes "oh god, I hosed up and killed a human, we'd better bail guys".
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May 21, 2014 16:28
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Bobbin Threadbare posted:I'm surprised you didn't say a word about how Ash is based on Bruce Campbell, another one of those horror icons Bloodlines loves to reference in Hollywood. Really? I always thought that he was supposed to be River Phoenix.
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May 21, 2014 16:33
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PureRok posted:Also the fact that staking a vampire in the heart doesn't kill them anyway. Basically, these are the worst vampire hunters. Or they just go "Huh, guess he was human after all. My bad." Depends on what kind of hunters they were. If they were Society of Leopold, they'd likely rationalize and pray for forgiveness for their error. If they were Reckoning Hunters, depends on the Creed. Waywards wouldn't care. They're the kind of 'broken' hunter who would burn an apartment building down just to kill the ghoul janitor who lives in the basement.
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May 21, 2014 22:57
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Vicissitude posted:Depends on what kind of hunters they were. If they were Society of Leopold, they'd likely rationalize and pray for forgiveness for their error. If they were Reckoning Hunters, depends on the Creed. Waywards wouldn't care. They're the kind of 'broken' hunter who would burn an apartment building down just to kill the ghoul janitor who lives in the basement. They must be Society of Leopold. They're the only named kind of hunters we run into in the game, and I really doubt they'd wheel out some other kind and not name them at some point. I don't think what kind of hunters we're dealing with is really spoiler-worthy, but what the hell, might as well spoiler it just in case.
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May 21, 2014 23:03
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Vicissitude posted:Depends on what kind of hunters they were. If they were Society of Leopold, they'd likely rationalize and pray for forgiveness for their error. If they were Reckoning Hunters, depends on the Creed. Waywards wouldn't care. They're the kind of 'broken' hunter who would burn an apartment building down just to kill the ghoul janitor who lives in the basement. There were also no firebombs. It wouldn't be a Wayward hit without something burning down. I remember from their splatbook an incident where one guy killed I think a werewolf and then set fire to the church where the funeral was held and picked off whoever tried to flee with a sniper rifle. It also bears mentioning that you have to fight a whole bunch of hunters in the sewer if you try and smuggle Ash out that way.
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May 21, 2014 23:08
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Bobbin Threadbare posted:There were also no firebombs. It wouldn't be a Wayward hit without something burning down. I remember from their splatbook an incident where one guy killed I think a werewolf and then set fire to the church where the funeral was held and picked off whoever tried to flee with a sniper rifle. That splatbook also mentioned Waywards working via poisoning entire buildings, if necessary, so they don't all involve fire. Just mass murder. Then again, even more ignorant Hunters tended to figure out rather quickly that poison doesn't work great on Kindred. Non-wayward Hunters are a possibility, but given the context of game, more mundane folks fit better.
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May 22, 2014 00:10
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Zeroisanumber posted:Really? I always thought that he was supposed to be River Phoenix. Or, you know, James Dean. Besides being named "Ash", I can't see a single connection to Bruce Campbell. He's clearly the live-fast-die-young Hollywood bad boy type.
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May 22, 2014 00:25
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Bobbin Threadbare posted:There were also no firebombs. It wouldn't be a Wayward hit without something burning down. I remember from their splatbook an incident where one guy killed I think a werewolf and then set fire to the church where the funeral was held and picked off whoever tried to flee with a sniper rifle. "a whole bunch" is about 20-30 hostiles". They're a pain in the rear end, if you're not tremere. (also Ash's AI pathfinding occasionally glitches and he's got the survival instincts of a lemming)
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May 22, 2014 00:35
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KaoliniteMilkshake posted:That splatbook also mentioned Waywards working via poisoning entire buildings, if necessary, so they don't all involve fire. Just mass murder. Then again, even more ignorant Hunters tended to figure out rather quickly that poison doesn't work great on Kindred. Non-wayward Hunters are a possibility, but given the context of game, more mundane folks fit better. It doesn't necessarily have to be mass murder, there's just no regard for collateral damage for a Wayward. They all have a derangement, and their "hunter vision" is always on (instead of being activated by spending a point of Conviction, their version of blood points). The constant overwhelming input of the corruption of the world drives them mad, and the only way to fight back is to cut the cancer out. And sometimes, you have to take some healthy tissue along with it.
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May 22, 2014 00:54
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double nine posted:"a whole bunch" is about 20-30 hostiles". They're a pain in the rear end, if you're not tremere. 
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May 22, 2014 02:43
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GrimRevenant posted:They’re hilarious if you’re Gangrel. I think they all went down laughably easily as a firearms malk too. Ash's pathing remained an issue however.
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May 22, 2014 02:45
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GrimRevenant posted:They’re hilarious if you’re Gangrel. Everything in the game is hilarious as a Gangrel! I mean, other than the bug where if you activate Protean 5 and get hit while you're transforming you freeze in place and can't do a drat thing. And Romero's graveyard quest. And a timed survival segment at the end of the game.
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May 22, 2014 03:35
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Vicissitude posted:It doesn't necessarily have to be mass murder, there's just no regard for collateral damage for a Wayward. They all have a derangement, and their "hunter vision" is always on (instead of being activated by spending a point of Conviction, their version of blood points). The constant overwhelming input of the corruption of the world drives them mad, and the only way to fight back is to cut the cancer out. And sometimes, you have to take some healthy tissue along with it. That's a more succinct and accurate way of looking at what caused Waywards, but the effect, as portrayed in the book, was a singleminded drive to end threats with no care for collateral damage, resulting in methods that were massively damaging to anyone in the vicinity of any supernatural threat. I had also thought Hunter was too late in the oWoD dev cycle to make it into Bloodlines, but it turns out Wayward was released in 2002, while Bloodlines came out in 2004. I guess I need to double check my info.
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May 22, 2014 04:26
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How could you not have taken a humanity hit for this? That he'd end up dead isn't just predictable - you were counting on it! Edit: Oh. Well, so much for my reading skills. I still don't appreciate the whole idea - it just seems stupid and cartoonish and, in general, less than this game deserves. David Corbett fucked around with this message at 06:23 on May 22, 2014 |
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May 22, 2014 06:01
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You do, and he mentioned it. It happens when you talk to Ash and tell him the person's waiting to change clothes, not at the end, so you may have missed it.
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May 22, 2014 06:07
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Thank you all for hanging in there for the time that I wasn't updating. I admit that getting this update out took longer than usual, since I haven't written an update in quite some time. Lik eI said before, I plan to get the updates back on the old schedule.Bobbin Threadbare posted:I'm surprised you didn't say a word about how Ash is based on Bruce Campbell, another one of those horror icons Bloodlines loves to reference in Hollywood. This is the first I've heard of that. How'd you find that out?
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May 22, 2014 07:49
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Bobbin Threadbare posted:I'm surprised you didn't say a word about how Ash is based on Bruce Campbell, another one of those horror icons Bloodlines loves to reference in Hollywood. Evil Dead was the the first thing I thought of when the name "Ash" came up. By the way, I'm loving this LP.
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May 22, 2014 08:02
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Automatic Slim posted:Evil Dead was the the first thing I thought of when the name "Ash" came up. I just got done starting a new game and on the tv news report they call him Ash Rivers, which to me says River Phoenix. Not that there's anything wrong with Ashley Williams, mind, but that seems like a bit of a stretch. There's nothing of the Evil Dead character in this Ash other than his first name. For one, the combat option would be way better if Ash had a shotgun and a chainsaw and spit out one-liners.
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May 22, 2014 08:09
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It is "Ash Rivers". The internet cafe had an entry on him:rivers, ash posted:After his breakout performance in the film "Negative Zero", Rivers garnered huge critical and commercial success in three more films before a shocking early retirement. Rivers spends most of his time these days managing his club, the Asp Hole, found right here in the heart of Hollywood.
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May 22, 2014 08:16
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