|
[Falling chat] We've been practicing clinching a lot recently at our gym. Now, my style is Muay Thai, so I haven't had experience in being thrown since it's a stand up art. But from my experiences with big dudes tossing me to the mat, I've found that going limp and allowing my backside to take the fall has minimized the damage I take from the throw. Another way I've been recovering is that if I have enough time to really determine how I'm getting thrown and which direction I'm getting thrown in, I try to fall in a way that I hit with my upper back / shoulder area. It causes me to start rolling sideways. So I just let the roll happen, roll away from the opponent, then spring up once I've come to a stop. Hard to explain, but I'd maybe describe it as a kind of a bastardized Parkour roll. Granted, we're going kind of light since it's practice and we're not trying to injure each other, but doing that seems to not only allow a quick recovery from the throw. This also seems to put me far enough away from my opponent that he's too far to attack me after I get back up. It also gives me time to shake it off and return to my fight stance and re-engage. Not sure how practical this is in the ring competing against an opponent that is actively trying to take my head off. But, it seems to work for now. Speaking of clinching, gently caress wrestlers! I struggle the most against wrestlers. I can never get them off balance, throwing them is impossible. At best, I can hold a wrestler off and stop most of their throws. One of my friends/training partners at the gym wrestled in high school and college. He's just learning clinching, but is already a hell of a match for me. Often times, we nullify each other. But he tends to land more throws. His balance is insane, too! Trying to clinch up and whip him around to get him off balance (and land knees) rarely works. At least I tend to land more knees in the clinch than him. That is, when I'm not looking up at the ceiling. We both just started to really hunker down and practice clinching. So when my friend is owning me, I just try to remind myself that I'm clinching with a guy whose whole sport was the art of flinging people to the ground and keeping them there. It does make me laugh a bit when the trainers tell him that a throw he did is illegal under Thai rules. My friend is not a jerk, he's actually pretty cool. But he's clearly reverting back to his years of wrestling muscle memory sometimes when throwing, since some of the Muay Thai throws are similar to wrestling, except they must be executed with the foot or thigh. So no hip tosses, etc.
|
#
?
May 20, 2014 20:54
|
|
|
|
| # ? May 31, 2024 23:07 |
|
|
I asked about doing judo or some martial art aaages ago but I recently checked out this place http://www.crawleyjudo.co.uk/home/ and the website makes it look legit, and not a Rex Kwon Do type place. I did my first judo practice and now I ache like hell, any advice for goony guys who now ache all over?
|
|
#
?
May 20, 2014 23:46
|
|
|
Crankit posted:I did my first judo practice and now I ache like hell, any advice for goony guys who now ache all over? Try to keep moving around as much as you can. If you sit around all day you'll stiffen up even more. Eat some bananas and lots of water.
|
|
#
?
May 20, 2014 23:51
|
|
|
Take an advil (or other NSAID) before you go to bed the day you train. Like anything working out, it gets better the more your body gets used to it. Bananas help because they have a lot of potassium, which is good for muscles and can help deal with muscle cramps. Keep moving and stretch when you have time.
|
|
#
?
May 21, 2014 00:16
|
|
|
So I just got my rear end kicked at Fonsesca's BJJ class, and I have to say it's interesting. I made cardinal mistakes: I ate <3 hours before I went in, which resulted in an unhappy stomach right at the end of the practice, and I played soccer this morning. Meanwhile, the guy asked how I heard about it and I mentioned "someone on the something awful forums in the martial arts thread" had suggested it, but I didn't know if you wanted me to say your non-forum name or forum name or anything, eggplant. ( dont' even know your off-forum name if you want me to mention it). I like the wrasslin aspects of it, but I didn't realize that there could potentially be quite a bit of striking as well. Also, my old wrestling instincts kicked in just ever so slightly so it was overall enjoyable. However, what the gently caress? BJJ groundwork tears the poo poo out of the tops of the knuckles on my toes and my kneecaps as well. Do I need kneepads and/or socks to counter that? I like it though, but I don't think I know enough about BJJ to really understand the significance of some of the moves practiced tonight.
|
|
#
?
May 21, 2014 03:01
|
|
|
notwithoutmyanus posted:So I just got my rear end kicked at Fonsesca's BJJ class, and I have to say it's interesting. Were you talking to Cliff? I barely know him but he taught some of my first classes with Team Redzovic in the city when I first started a couple years back. I think he's still affiliated with them so if you join, you can train at the city schools too. I bounce between all three, but mostly am at the downtown one. Evanston is pretty out of the way for me. If you just do BJJ, there is no striking or sparring with striking, but the intro curriculum the Redzovics (and I assume Cliff) uses is designed to have a self defense element, so none of it relies on the gi and they cover basic protection from strikes. A lot of BJJers also do Muay Thai or MMA classes for striking. I discovered I'm even worse at that than BJJ, and I neither like punching people in the face or being punched in the face, so i don't. I don't have issues with my knees/toes. Folks with bad knees usually wear knee pads and a few people wear wrestling shoes and/or wrestling headgear but I haven't tried 'em. I've never seen socks.
|
|
#
?
May 21, 2014 04:01
|
|
|
Dolemite posted:We've been practicing clinching a lot recently at our gym. Now, my style is Muay Thai, so I haven't had experience in being thrown since it's a stand up art. But from my experiences with big dudes tossing me to the mat, I've found that going limp and allowing my backside to take the fall has minimized the damage I take from the throw. quote:[quote since some of the Muay Thai throws are similar to wrestling, except they must be executed with the foot or thigh. So no hip tosses, etc. Any sweep with the front of the leg while holding (usually their leg) is ok. Any slam with just the arms is ok.
|
|
#
?
May 21, 2014 04:56
|
|
|
Since self-defense and/or da street comes up here once in a while, check out this guy stand his ground against a baseball bat assisted mad charge and finish the play with style and only minor harm done. I'd hazard a guess this person has been in a "real fight" before. I wonder what'd he'd come up with against a knife? That said, the guy who is choked stays out for a pretty long time, don't you guys think? Most chokes I've seen have the dude wake up in 5-15 seconds. Or does anyone have other experiences? In fact, if you hold a choke longer than at a bjj class or in a ring when someone passes out (i.e. situations where you release immediately when someone goes limp) do they stay down 1) longer and 2) at that point, isn't there a chance of causing brain injury? edit: and another fighr where an overwhelmed person stops the assault (at least momentarily) with a very unconventional... "trick". Ligur fucked around with this message at 12:32 on May 21, 2014 |
|
#
?
May 21, 2014 12:15
|
|
|
That dude really wanted to finish that phone call
|
|
#
?
May 21, 2014 13:00
|
|
|
I'd asked previously about finding an MMA gym and the closest one to me was 45 minutes away. Recently, a new BJJ gym opened up near me. Is this a legit school? I know who Saulo is and it's linked to the Gracies, but don't know enough to say if the instructors are a good choice. http://www.ribeirojiujitsugr.com/instructors.html http://www.ribeirojiujitsugr.com/history.html Thanks.
|
|
#
?
May 21, 2014 13:32
|
|
|
Looks like a solid school, worth a visit. Just make sure they are very clear about pricing and what they charge for etc.
|
|
#
?
May 21, 2014 13:43
|
|
|
I will try to go tonight to see what their classes are like. What should I be looking for in terms of teaching, and what is a good price for adult classes?
|
|
#
?
May 21, 2014 13:51
|
|
|
Bigass Moth posted:I will try to go tonight to see what their classes are like. What should I be looking for in terms of teaching, and what is a good price for adult classes? The way the "standard" 90 minute BJJ class goes is there's a 5-15 minute warmup that consists of basic calisthenic stuff like jogging, jumping jacks and basic jiu-jitsu movements like shrimping, bridging and reaching, sit outs, and other stuff. Then the instructor will call one of the senior students to the center of the mat to demonstrate whatever technique they're showing that day then everyone will pair off to drill that technique for 3 minutes per person. Typically there will be 3 or 4 related techniques that will be shown that everyone drills. After that is open mat where everyone pairs off and spars, usually for 6 minute rounds. That's the usual BJJ class, the biggest difference I've seen between schools is really the warmup, some schools I've been at have done some crazy P90X type poo poo for 30 minutes before and after class and some schools say "gently caress it, work out on your own time" and do literally no warmup it's just technique drilling and rolling e: as far as price goes, I don't know anything about the cost of living in Grand Rapids but the highest I've heard of is in the $200/month neighborhood for schools in NYC with some of the best BJJ people in the world. I pay $80/month in the Phoenix burbs to train at a school run by a blackbelt with very similar credentials to the school you're looking at Dave Grool fucked around with this message at 14:31 on May 21, 2014 |
|
#
?
May 21, 2014 14:16
|
|
|
Anyone know anything about Phillip Nearing Wing Chun? The name "Wing Chun" is kind of an automatic red flag to me, but my BJJ instructor is co-teaching a self-defense seminar with him so maybe he's one of the 1-in-1000 Kung Fu instructors teaching practical stuff.
|
|
#
?
May 21, 2014 16:21
|
|
|
I flipped a toe nail today, I cut a little away from the part of the nail that was sticking out and put two bandages on it. Should I do something else? Disinfectant or something? For such a small thing it hurts like poo poo.
|
|
#
?
May 21, 2014 19:18
|
|
|
ManOfTheYear posted:I flipped a toe nail today, I cut a little away from the part of the nail that was sticking out and put two bandages on it. Should I do something else? Disinfectant or something? For such a small thing it hurts like poo poo. Cut your nails next time. it happens to everyone all the time. I now carry a nail cutter thing in my bag and I check my nails before every single class. As long as there is no sharp bits that could cut people you're fine.
|
|
#
?
May 21, 2014 20:10
|
|
|
For those of you who do strength and conditioning work, I'm re-writing the program I've been using for the last 6 months or so to account for having a little more free time. Basically I have another fight in September, and I've been thinking about setting up a 3 a day system for training where I alternate between heavy, moderate, and light sessions depending on some arbitrary point scale. Like, heavy is anything involving weights or sprinting. Moderate is anything involving long periods of cardio, sparring, or general training. Light is anything like foam rolling, stretching, recovery cardio, or bitching about how sore I am. The idea is that I want to be able to do something in the morning, something midday for around 2 hours, and then whatever my coach has us doing from like 6pm to 8 or 9pm. I've already cut weight training down to 3x a week. Basically, if I'm going forward with a 3-a-day workout plan while I train for my fight, and I don't want to end up an overtrained mess, how should I structure my days? I would prefer to do heavy work in the morning, so I separate training and lifting by as much time as I can, and moderate work in the evening, which leaves midday for long bouts of cardio, foam rolling, recovery work, etc. What do you all think?
|
|
#
?
May 21, 2014 20:57
|
|
|
Eat Bum Zen posted:Basically I have another fight in September, and I've been thinking about setting up a 3 a day system for training where I alternate between heavy, moderate, and light sessions depending on some arbitrary point scale. My question is how do you have time for a 3 a day system? Do you train for a living? Classes 4 nights a week pushes my schedule to the limits but I'm a lazy slacker.
|
|
#
?
May 21, 2014 21:56
|
|
|
n3rdal3rt posted:My question is how do you have time for a 3 a day system? Do you train for a living? I start work around 8am, have a 2hr lunchbreak, and end around 6pm to start training. It's basically just a very convenient working situation. I'm usually up by 5:30, in bed somewhere between 9 and 11.
|
|
#
?
May 21, 2014 22:06
|
|
|
Eat Bum Zen posted:I start work around 8am, have a 2hr lunchbreak, and end around 6pm to start training. It's basically just a very convenient working situation. I'm usually up by 5:30, in bed somewhere between 9 and 11. That makes sense. I don't really have the opportunity or option to do anything on my lunch and since I live in the middle BFE drive times kill my training times. Also I'm lazy. I admire and envy those of you that have the fortitude and opportunity to training that much.
|
|
#
?
May 22, 2014 03:50
|
|
|
Ligur posted:Since self-defense and/or da street comes up here once in a while, check out this guy stand his ground against a baseball bat assisted mad charge and finish the play with style and only minor harm done. I'd hazard a guess this person has been in a "real fight" before. I think the only time you're likely to cause brain injury is if the brain is deprived of oxygen for a few minutes, not a few seconds. IIRC the only reason choke holds were outlawed for law enforcement is because they kept choking people out and then dropping them on the pavement. Not the actual cut off of blood supply. I've only ever seen people out for a few moments because most of the time people lift their feet and give them a chest rub, I've never seen a choke held on to for a while after someone goes limp.
|
|
#
?
May 22, 2014 07:22
|
|
|
I known there's that study on clothing color wrt match performance. That dealt with bright colors and maybe psychological effects. I'm thinking about visual effects here -- if I had black gloves and a black rashguard on, would it be harder to pick up on the starts of my punches? On rare occasion when someone spars in a dark rashguard, I think I have more trouble telling their range, since there's way fewer texture cues.
|
|
#
?
May 22, 2014 07:30
|
|
|
Ligur posted:Since self-defense and/or da street comes up here once in a while, check out this guy stand his ground against a baseball bat assisted mad charge and finish the play with style and only minor harm done. I'd hazard a guess this person has been in a "real fight" before. That was out of a textbook, wow. I'd probably just freeze, judo or no. ManOfTheYear fucked around with this message at 13:05 on May 22, 2014 |
|
#
?
May 22, 2014 13:03
|
|
|
I'm always surprised how inconsistent sparring can be. For weeks you can get a whole bunch of good throws and submissions in, even with the really good opponents, if they are being sloppy for a second or a bit tired at the given day. Then on other days you can't do anything, you don't feel tired and you can focus, but everybody in the world is dominating you and no matter how hard you try, you can't do anything about it. Combat sports are outlandisly technical, being a bit slow or careless really can ruin everything.
|
|
#
?
May 22, 2014 16:21
|
|
|
Got to do some Wing Chun this week before CSW, and holy crap trapping exercises are fun once you get in the zone and go from very slow fumbling to super fast. I'll be the world slap box champion in no time.
|
|
#
?
May 22, 2014 19:11
|
|
|
Crankit posted:I asked about doing judo or some martial art aaages ago but I recently checked out this place http://www.crawleyjudo.co.uk/home/ and the website makes it look legit, and not a Rex Kwon Do type place. Keep moving, take motrin, get as much sleep as you can, eat a ton of vegetables, and wait.
|
|
#
?
May 22, 2014 21:31
|
|
|
Finally decided it was time to get back to martial arts. I've decided on a mixed martial arts place, though I'll mainly be focusing on jujitsu. There is a dedicated jujitsu school in town that is maybe a little better, but I'd like to be able to throw in a little kickboxing here or there, which they don't do. I'm also digging the conditioning classes the MMA place does, since my (current) main goal is just to drop fat and get back some general athleticism. I'm having a hard as hell time balancing it with my lifting, though. In the past, I've found that high frequency, low intensity routines a la Pavel's 5x5x5 or Dan John's 40 day program go great with other athletics, but I'm just dying this week. I'm barely able to make sets of squats that should be basically automatic. I'm hoping it'll just take a couple weeks to get used to, but I may have to re-evaluate or cut down on frequency for a while. Things is, strength training is at least as important to me as martial arts, and I'd like to be able to compete in some local powerlifting stuff for fun at some point and not embarrass myself lol. Do any of you guys train for both sports?
|
|
#
?
May 22, 2014 22:08
|
|
|
Dairy Power posted:I'm having a hard as hell time balancing it with my lifting, though. In the past, I've found that high frequency, low intensity routines a la Pavel's 5x5x5 or Dan John's 40 day program go great with other athletics, but I'm just dying this week. I'm barely able to make sets of squats that should be basically automatic. I'm hoping it'll just take a couple weeks to get used to, but I may have to re-evaluate or cut down on frequency for a while. Things is, strength training is at least as important to me as martial arts, and I'd like to be able to compete in some local powerlifting stuff for fun at some point and not embarrass myself lol. Do any of you guys train for both sports? I used to do Stripped 5x5 at lunch and train MMA/BJJ at night but partly for logistical reasons and partly because I was starting to feel too gassed for nighttime classes I ended up giving up the lifting. The strength training was definitely my second priority though, I could've easily dropped a night or two of training and been fine but I didn't want to do that. (I'm also old as gently caress so assuming you're not I'd guess you'd be even more capable of maintaining training in both areas)
|
|
#
?
May 23, 2014 00:08
|
|
|
tl;dr What do you guys do about gun stance and why? Many martial artists practice gun disarms at least a little. Also I'm asking about the martial arts aspect of gun use so I'm putting this here instead of a gun thread. After I do whatever disarm we're practicing I tend to back away, keep the gun near my right hip and pointed at the target and keep my left arm up in a guard. That seems to be fairly standard. BUT At range I also stay in a forward stance with my body turned slightly. That means my left arm is forward so the only comfortable thing to do with it is place it under the grip of the pistol. That causes all the gun nuts to go apeshit about how I'm using a "teacup grip", how I should be in a proper 3 point stance and use a combat grip (ie left hand wrapped around the grip, overlapping my right hand, with my thumbs crossed and pointed at the target) What I haven't heard is a good explanation on why this is a good idea. The closest I've heard are: 1) That position of the left hand helps reduce recoil. This seems like BS. If you really wanted to reduce recoil you'd put your stronger fingers (middle and ring) over the end of the grip. And when I've tried all of these grips it doesn't seem to change the recoil either way. 2) People have done well with it in target competitions. That's great but I'm training for a fight not target shooting (not that I have any reasonable expectation of ever being in a gunfight it's just fun to train for one). 3) A former military, current state trooper buddy of mine says that he keeps his body square to the attacker because that puts more of his vest in the way. He reasons that there are big holes in the side of his vest and he'd rather not show them to an attacker. Again that's great but I never wear a vest. I don't even own one. So I'd rather give the attacker a narrower target and have more of my left arm between his potential bullet and my chest. So do you guys have any thoughts/experience on the matter?
|
|
#
?
May 23, 2014 12:57
|
|
|
Whenever I have to disarm someone here on the mean streets of central Stockholm I grab the gun by the barrel and hammer the assailant over the head with the butt of the gun.
|
|
#
?
May 23, 2014 13:06
|
|
|
SeventhUncle posted:tl;dr My thoughts are that unless you're a police officer, you are never going to be in a situation where this matters in the slightest.
|
|
#
?
May 23, 2014 13:51
|
|
|
I do a lot of cartwheels and wallsprings, taking most of my shots from an inverted position. I usually am dual wielding, so I can't use the left hand for support.
|
|
#
?
May 23, 2014 14:01
|
|
|
Mechafunkzilla posted:My thoughts are that unless you're a police officer, you are never going to be in a situation where this matters in the slightest. I recently completed a Police personal safety trainer's course, it's mainly directed at a custody environment but we did discuss firearms, the instructor told us about an officer he had known who had practiced his disarming techniques so many time's with a partner including passing the gun back to his partner to continue the drill that when he came to do it in the field his muscle memory took over he executed the disarm perfectly...........then handed the gun back the the criminal.....
|
|
#
?
May 23, 2014 14:21
|
|
|
SeventhUncle posted:tl;dr Since we're even discussing this the reasonable expectation stuff kind of goes out the window, but here we go. Don't know if it really reduces the impact of recoil, but if people do well with it in target shooting that's a reason to take it seriously. Yes, you're looking at a fight situation, not just a target. I think the same relationship exists between fighting a person and hitting a heavy bag or something like that. Shooting::Target practice, Boxing::Bag work. Target practice and bag work both work particular skill sets that you might need in a real situation. Disregarding techniques and practices that people use at the targeting range is just like disregarding techniques and practices that people use when the working the heavy bag. Gaz2k21 posted:I recently completed a Police personal safety trainer's course, it's mainly directed at a custody environment but we did discuss firearms, the instructor told us about an officer he had known who had practiced his disarming techniques so many time's with a partner including passing the gun back to his partner to continue the drill that when he came to do it in the field his muscle memory took over he executed the disarm perfectly...........then handed the gun back the the criminal..... Stuff like that is why I've heard it's a good idea to end the disarm technique with you pointing, but not firing, the gun at your opponent. Buried alive fucked around with this message at 17:33 on May 23, 2014 |
|
#
?
May 23, 2014 17:31
|
|
|
SeventhUncle posted:tl;dr Weaver vs Isosceles Note that this guy is using an non-teacup grip in both stances. There's plenty of debate if you just google Weaver vs Isosceles. There's plenty of information about grips out there as well. Most of it comes down to gun control, recoil management, target transistion, etc. Todd Jarret on grip. As far as "I'm not target shooting..." it comes down to this for me: In a fight, wouldn't being fast and accurate be better? At the top level of pistol shooting (USPSA, IPSC) those guys are all shooting isosceles and using a grip similar to what Jarret is showing.
|
|
#
?
May 23, 2014 19:24
|
|
|
MalleusDei posted:Weaver vs Isosceles Interesting. I hadn't heard the argument about ease of motion to the non-dominant side before. Your and Buried Alive's points about targets shooting are well taken too. I'm not discounting target shooting but there are differences and just because something works at a range doesn't mean it would work in a fight. I did have on instructor who advocated practicing shooting while cowering behind and obstacle and just reaching the gun around it. His reasoning was that that's what cops and criminals alike do in most of the gun fights he's seen so you may as well practice what you'd probably end up doing.
|
|
#
?
May 23, 2014 23:08
|
|
|
Kekekela posted:I do a lot of cartwheels and wallsprings, taking most of my shots from an inverted position. I usually am dual wielding, so I can't use the left hand for support. If I could find a way to safely practice that with live ammo I would love to. It sounds like it would be fun as hell. Now that you mention it I may get some airsoft guns and give it a try.
|
|
#
?
May 23, 2014 23:11
|
|
|
Mechafunkzilla posted:My thoughts are that unless you're a police officer, you are never going to be in a situation where this matters in the slightest. True, but I live in a safe part of town and work at a desk job in an other safe part of town. I don't hang out in strip club parking lots at 2 in the morning either so really, none of my martial arts training will ever matter in the slightest. That's not why I'm doing any of it though. I do it because it's fun and, for me, part of the fun is practicing things that would actually work. SeventhUncle fucked around with this message at 23:24 on May 23, 2014 |
|
#
?
May 23, 2014 23:17
|
|
|
BlindSite posted:I think the only time you're likely to cause brain injury is if the brain is deprived of oxygen for a few minutes, not a few seconds. IIRC the only reason choke holds were outlawed for law enforcement is because they kept choking people out and then dropping them on the pavement. Not the actual cut off of blood supply. I've only ever seen people out for a few moments because most of the time people lift their feet and give them a chest rub, I've never seen a choke held on to for a while after someone goes limp. The artery constriction will raise blood pressure and with the vagus nerve nearby it might gently caress around with it badly enough to stop the heart, particularly when the person being choked out might not be super fit and healthy and could be hosed up on drugs that affect blood pressure by themselves. In fact, I think there was a case a couple of years ago when a bouncer choked someone out and their heart stopped. Also, with a less healthy person's arteries partially blocked due to cholesterol and poo poo, the rapid fluctuation of blood pressure might knock some of that block loose, leading to it getting lodged somewhere else and causing an infarction. There are also concerns about poorly trained people in stress situations making dumb mistakes like loving up the blood choke and constricting the airway instead, which might crush the larynx and lead to suffocation. Gaz2k21 posted:I recently completed a Police personal safety trainer's course, it's mainly directed at a custody environment but we did discuss firearms, the instructor told us about an officer he had known who had practiced his disarming techniques so many time's with a partner including passing the gun back to his partner to continue the drill that when he came to do it in the field his muscle memory took over he executed the disarm perfectly...........then handed the gun back the the criminal.....
|
|
#
?
May 24, 2014 11:05
|
|
|
|
| # ? May 31, 2024 23:07 |
|
|
Does anybody have a source for that "handing the gun back" story? I've heard it a lot of times, and I believe it's real, but I've never read anything about it, it's always been second hand.
|
|
#
?
May 24, 2014 12:48
|
|
