|
an skeleton posted:Oh yeah and another thing, its funny that this episode gets so many "The good guys never win, I'm done watching this "Hubris never wins" Honestly, almost every significant character death, save for maybe Remly and Ned can be traced to some form or extension of hubris.
|
#
?
Jun 3, 2014 01:35
|
|
" whenever Joffrey, arguably the most villainous character and inarguably the biggest prick, just died a couple of episodes ago.
|
|
| # ? May 28, 2024 21:18 |
|
|
precision posted:I think at some point Theon is going to just snap and murder everyone around him, regardless of who they are. In fact I was expecting that to happen when he started twitching inside Moat Whogivesafuckistan. I'm really hoping for this because I want to see the actor just let loose and play a broken berserk killing everybody.
|
|
#
?
Jun 3, 2014 01:36
|
|
|
Jerusalem posted:Walder offers to marry Ramsay to one of his daughters, kills him and stitches Reek's head to his neck. I think Roose knows better than attending another Frey wedding.
|
|
#
?
Jun 3, 2014 01:36
|
|
|
an skeleton posted:Oh yeah and another thing, its funny that this episode gets so many "The good guys never win, I'm done watching this Bad guy dies: Meh. About time it happened. Good guy dies: FUCCK GRRM! I'M NEVER WATCHING AGAIN!
|
|
#
?
Jun 3, 2014 01:36
|
|
|
Lumberjack Bonanza posted:I think Roose knows better than attending another Frey wedding. Nah he'll be lulled into a false sense of security because he can't see that treacherous bastard Roose Bolton around anywhere.
|
|
#
?
Jun 3, 2014 01:39
|
|
|
Jerusalem posted:Nah he'll be lulled into a false sense of security because he can't see that treacherous bastard Roose Bolton around anywhere. At the last moment he looks in a mirror and panics, just as the gates slam shut.
|
|
#
?
Jun 3, 2014 01:40
|
|
|
I'm thinking Reek/Theon will be a redemption character. He's been kicked so low, his death seems like a relief, even to himself. To just kill him off now in the state he's in would make an anti-climatic end to his journey. I think he's going to make a come back in some fashion. It probably won't be as glorious as he imagined his capture of Winterfell would be, but it would be enough for him to forgive himself.... It's a nice thought, anyway.
|
|
#
?
Jun 3, 2014 01:40
|
|
|
WeLandedOnTheMoon! posted:"Hubris never wins" Not at all...Oberyn maybe, but even there it wasn't arrogance that actually got him killed. People die when their emotions get the better of them, but it's usually not pride.
|
|
#
?
Jun 3, 2014 01:43
|
|
|
BubbleGoose posted:Imagine Theon, legitimate from birth, getting that acceptance from his father. That's an interesting parallel that I missed. There are just so many thematic connections in this show.
|
|
#
?
Jun 3, 2014 01:43
|
|
|
an skeleton posted:The problem with "good characters" winning is that usually means less conflict which is less interesting. Also, a major theme of the show (in my opinion) is that being ruthless is often necessary to achieve things. Having honor (or in Oberyn's case, vengefulness) and giving bad people chances to hurt/kill you will often result in you being hurt or killed or what-have-you. There isn't a dichotomy of having good characters win or having plot, though. The problem is that nearly everyone is lovely; it's actually really interesting when multiple sides do have characters worth rooting for, and those sides are poised against each other. Earlier seasons had that. This one... As people have said, it feels pretty much like a wave of poo poo washing over everyone who wasn't involved in creating said wave of poo poo. Personally, I'm going to keep watching, but I can see people's frustration. A lot of the nuance is gone, and, since as people have said this is the middle of a series so the good guys can't really triumph, it's basically a death march from here on out. You just have to hope that the ones you really like aren't the ones who drop dead before we get there.
|
|
#
?
Jun 3, 2014 01:48
|
|
|
BubbleGoose posted:I'm thinking Reek/Theon will be a redemption character. He's been kicked so low, his death seems like a relief, even to himself. To just kill him off now in the state he's in would make an anti-climatic end to his journey. I think he's going to make a come back in some fashion. It probably won't be as glorious as he imagined his capture of Winterfell would be, but it would be enough for him to forgive himself.... He certainly will. He's Reek, now, but what's dead (Theon) may never die.
|
|
#
?
Jun 3, 2014 01:48
|
|
|
wyoak posted:Not at all...Oberyn maybe, but even there it wasn't arrogance that actually got him killed. People die when their emotions get the better of them, but it's usually not pride. Oberyn's ultimate goal was vengeance. He could have finished the Mountain off, but instead he continued to harp on some showmanship bullshit of wringing a confession out of a person who can hardly string a sentence together. I'd call that arrogant. If you want to say that his ultimate goal was the confession then I would disagree, but still, arrogance definitely got him killed. Notice how the Mountain gave no fucks and tried to cut him in half while he dicked around for the crowd. That's why he won.
|
|
#
?
Jun 3, 2014 01:49
|
|
|
WeLandedOnTheMoon! posted:Oberyn's ultimate goal was vengeance. He could have finished the Mountain off, but instead he continued to harp on some showmanship bullshit of wringing a confession out of a person who can hardly string a sentence together. I'd call that arrogant. If you want to say that his ultimate goal was the confession then I would disagree, but still, arrogance definitely got him killed. He wanted the confession to point to Tywin so he could proceed to dismantle them. Killing the proximate perpetrator is easy and not his ultimate goal. Mountain lost the fight then pulled a "Scream" resurrection for troll value
|
|
#
?
Jun 3, 2014 01:52
|
|
|
I'm actually going to call BS on the 'there are no characters left to root for' notion. We've got: Tyrion, who is Tyrion. Jaime, who weird sorta-rape-I-think? scene aside, seems to be undergoing a sort of redemptive arc after his hand got chopped off. Brienne and Pod, who are obviously good people trying to rescue Stark children. Arya, who so far hasn't killed someone who didn't deserve it. Jon and Sam, who are the closest things the show has to stereotypical good guy fantasy protagonists. Dany, who while is obviously very flawed at this point in time is literally trying to free slaves and keep them free. And then you get into characters who are kinda lovely people but you can still easily root for at times, like The Hound and Theon. Seriously, where do people get that idea just because one charismatic guy who was there for 7 episodes dies?
|
|
#
?
Jun 3, 2014 01:53
|
|
|
WeLandedOnTheMoon! posted:Oberyn's ultimate goal was vengeance. He could have finished the Mountain off, but instead he continued to harp on some showmanship bullshit of wringing a confession out of a person who can hardly string a sentence together. I'd call that arrogant. If you want to say that his ultimate goal was the confession then I would disagree, but still, arrogance definitely got him killed. Oberyn had bigger fish to fry he was trying to get the Mountain to implicate Tywin in the murders, a dead mountain with no confession while would have been some justice....not the total justice the Oberyn craves.
|
|
#
?
Jun 3, 2014 01:55
|
|
|
WeLandedOnTheMoon! posted:Oberyn's ultimate goal was vengeance. He could have finished the Mountain off, but instead he continued to harp on some showmanship bullshit of wringing a confession out of a person who can hardly string a sentence together. I'd call that arrogant. If you want to say that his ultimate goal was the confession then I would disagree, but still, arrogance definitely got him killed. That's more anger than pride, on the seven deadly sins scale.
|
|
#
?
Jun 3, 2014 01:55
|
|
|
Roose is great because he's smart and ruthless like Tywin but he has people skills and doesn't constantly poo poo on everyone around him. This show is pretty much full of people seeking approval and getting rejected (especially between sons and fathers) so giving Ramsay his name should earn Roose a Father of the Year award.
|
|
#
?
Jun 3, 2014 01:56
|
|
|
At the very least Alfie Allen needs some serious recognition for how much he's killing it.
|
|
#
?
Jun 3, 2014 01:56
|
|
|
Looking forward to finding out Doran is actually Oberyn's twin and we get Pedro back after all.
|
|
#
?
Jun 3, 2014 02:00
|
|
|
Speleothing posted:At the very least Alfie Allen needs some serious recognition for how much he's killing it. Yeah seriously, he's amazing. He better at least be nominated for some award or something because he's doing an incredible job as Theon.
|
|
#
?
Jun 3, 2014 02:00
|
|
|
KamikazePotato posted:I'm actually going to call BS on the 'there are no characters left to root for' notion. We've got:
|
|
#
?
Jun 3, 2014 02:03
|
|
|
Roland Jones posted:There isn't a dichotomy of having good characters win or having plot, though. The problem is that nearly everyone is lovely; This isn't the problem. This is the reason that the show is so successful.
|
|
#
?
Jun 3, 2014 02:03
|
|
|
Theon is the guy Reek was pretending to be in order to get the Ironborn to surrender, right?
|
|
#
?
Jun 3, 2014 02:03
|
|
|
Speleothing posted:Theon is the guy Reek was pretending to be in order to get the Ironborn to surrender, right?
|
|
#
?
Jun 3, 2014 02:05
|
|
|
an skeleton posted:This isn't the problem. This is the reason that the show is so successful. Yep. Pretty much this. Also, Pedro Pascal is awesome https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Hpewbz7GwCU
|
|
#
?
Jun 3, 2014 02:07
|
|
|
theDOWmustflow posted:Be honest, how many of you guys caught yourselves being moved by the father-son exchange between Ramsay and Roose. I felt like I betrayed the Starks for that brief moment I forgot to blindly hate the Boltons. Compare these scenes, shot composition and score especially: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0Pl8IgTJVj4 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=diZPm20DdLM Can't find a clip at the moment, but there were a few more season 1 Winterfell shots that are very close.
|
|
#
?
Jun 3, 2014 02:07
|
|
|
I'm just saying, if this "drowned god" doesn't literally rise up out of the sea and wreck some poo poo in the last season, it will be the biggest wasted opportunity ever.
|
|
#
?
Jun 3, 2014 02:07
|
|
|
BubbleGoose posted:I'm thinking Reek/Theon will be a redemption character. He's been kicked so low, his death seems like a relief, even to himself. To just kill him off now in the state he's in would make an anti-climatic end to his journey. I think he's going to make a come back in some fashion. It probably won't be as glorious as he imagined his capture of Winterfell would be, but it would be enough for him to forgive himself.... I will have to say that it's kind of funny how the whole Yara plotline panned out. Like, people make fun of how Gendry disappeared, but it would make perfect sense if he really never showed up again. He was a supporting character for Arya's story, and then in the Davos-Stannis story he served as a conflict and forced Davos to make a choice, and that closed off relatively smoothly. But with Yara they built up the whole rescue operation at the end of last season like it was going to be a big thing, but then it ended up just coming randomly in the middle of the season in a rather anticlimactic way, and then she just gives up and goes home? And there's no real reason to come back to her, unless there's some repercussions for Moat Cailin... but the show already has 9 other plotlines to deal with.
|
|
#
?
Jun 3, 2014 02:12
|
|
|
KamikazePotato posted:I'm actually going to call BS on the 'there are no characters left to root for' notion. We've got: Way to forget Bran, Jojen, Meera, and Hodor. More importantly, you forgot the MANNIS.
|
|
#
?
Jun 3, 2014 02:12
|
|
|
Wow, that episode ended pretty jacked up. After watching that play out, I couldn't help thinking about Adm. Marcus from the second Star Trek. Reaction shots were nearly identical.
|
|
#
?
Jun 3, 2014 02:14
|
|
|
I hope there's one of those YOU HAVE TO REMEMBER WHO YOU ARE, THEON scenes, i like those
|
|
#
?
Jun 3, 2014 02:19
|
|
|
precision posted:I'm just saying, if this "drowned god" doesn't literally rise up out of the sea and wreck some poo poo in the last season, it will be the biggest wasted opportunity ever. Okay, so it's my totally unsupported pet theory that the reason the White Walkers can't just freeze the bay and walk around the wall is because salt water is the realm of the Drowned God, ergo their magic has no power over it.
|
|
#
?
Jun 3, 2014 02:20
|
|
|
Fight Club Sandwich posted:I hope there's one of those YOU HAVE TO REMEMBER WHO YOU ARE, THEON scenes, i like those Robb shows up in the sky and sounds like James Earl Jones for some reason
|
|
#
?
Jun 3, 2014 02:22
|
|
|
precision posted:I'm just saying, if this "drowned god" doesn't literally rise up out of the sea and wreck some poo poo in the last season, it will be the biggest wasted opportunity ever. I'm secretly hoping the 'drowned god' is actually a dragon that adapted to water thousands of years ago and has evolved into a long twisty leviathan. A dragon/leviathan battle between air and sea would make my heart stop.
|
|
#
?
Jun 3, 2014 02:26
|
|
|
I'd prefer a kraken.
|
|
#
?
Jun 3, 2014 02:29
|
|
|
CharlieFoxtrot posted:But with Yara they built up the whole rescue operation at the end of last season like it was going to be a big thing, but then it ended up just coming randomly in the middle of the season in a rather anticlimactic way, and then she just gives up and goes home? You could easily take that scene and after the smash cut start dubbing in Monty Python "Run away! Run away!" audio and it'd fit perfectly. Fight Club Sandwich posted:I hope there's one of those YOU HAVE TO REMEMBER WHO YOU ARE, THEON scenes, i like those In other shows this would result in Theon getting triumphant revenge. Here he'd probably poo poo himself and cry for help.
|
|
#
?
Jun 3, 2014 02:30
|
|
|
I haven't read the last 15 pages so apologies if it's been brought up, but are there any Red Wedding style reaction vids out there for Viper/Mountain fight? I would love to see the emotional rollercoaster.
|
|
#
?
Jun 3, 2014 02:34
|
|
|
I wouldn't mind some kind of like "I'm not Theon. I'm not Reek. I'm loving NOBODY. And you... ... ...just got killed by NOBODY." 
|
|
#
?
Jun 3, 2014 02:36
|
|
|
xcore posted:I haven't read the last 15 pages so apologies if it's been brought up, but are there any Red Wedding style reaction vids out there for Viper/Mountain fight? I would love to see the emotional rollercoaster. http://m.youtube.com/watch?v=VmetFPHF_yE Some are fake and unfunny. Others are only kinda lol.
|
|
#
?
Jun 3, 2014 02:37
|
|
|
|
| # ? May 28, 2024 21:18 |
|
|
I wouldn't mind if Hodor killed the Mountain. That would be enough.
|
|
#
?
Jun 3, 2014 02:38
|
|
