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Pyroxene Stigma posted:Liiiike Benghazi? Don't get me wrong, it's loving stupid, but that's how the right is treating this non-issue. They're also treating global warming like it doesn't exist and Obama like he's the MOST ILLEGHAL PRESINENT EVAR. That has exactly zero bearing on what history will say. I mean, take away the current media's bizarre inclination to bestow them with undue relevence and all you have is a small minority of know-nothing clowns.
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Jun 9, 2014 07:50
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(by undue relevence I mean the veracity of their arguments, not their effect on politics)
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Jun 9, 2014 07:53
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Chantilly Say posted:As Nixon passes out of memory, and as we (inevitably) see new Presidential malfeasance, someone else will become the yardstick, and there's a kind of darkly humorous anticipation I feel when I think about someday arguing about whether President so-and-so's scandal is worse than Watergate. Eventually yes, but it'll probably be a while before we have something to top the President resigning in disgrace just before being removed by Congress for blatant political corruption. Does anyone know what was the go-to scandal before Watergate?
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Jun 9, 2014 08:13
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Lord Harbor posted:Eventually yes, but it'll probably be a while before we have something to top the President resigning in disgrace just before being removed by Congress for blatant political corruption. Teapot Dome?
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Jun 9, 2014 08:13
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Grant's entire administration?
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Jun 9, 2014 08:14
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To be fair to Nixon it kinda turned out eventually that Watergate wasn't originally his fault and he only made it into his scandal by trying and failing to dishonestly cover it up? Still historic for the outcome, though.
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Jun 9, 2014 08:27
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I think HST said all there needs to be said about Nixon
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Jun 9, 2014 08:45
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Nixon was such a sad, strange, perverse creature that it would take a real crackerjack scandal to unseat him as Reptile #1. I don't know if our current media-saturated world would allow a comparable freak to rise to the presidency. Twitter alone would have cracked Dick in 30 seconds. A platform where any smarmy prick on the planet can insult the president to his face with less effort than it takes to boil water? His enemies list would run to 500 pages and been composed mostly of entries like @dogfartz.
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Jun 9, 2014 09:48
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Holy poo poo. I was just browsing the internets and I came across this spiel from El Rushbo on Nov. 6, 2008:quote:The Obama recession is in full swing, ladies and gentlemen. Stocks are dying, which is a precursor of things to come. This is an Obama recession. Might turn into a depression. He hasn't done anything yet but his ideas are killing the economy. His ideas are killing Wall Street. They need some certainty, and now everybody in the Drive-By, "We don't know who Obama is." We got a story from Jennifer Loven, the Associated Press today: we don't know who Obama is. All of a sudden now on Charlie Rose, they're starting to talk about his ties to Saul Alinsky. I'm not joking at all. It's all coming up on the program. We've also got a Reuters story, here's the headline: "Will Democrats Tinker With Mutual Funds, 401k Plans?" So now they do the story after the election. And they get it right and they tell you what the Democrats plan to do with your 401(k) is, confirming what I told you, a bunch of people did, prior to the election. http://www.rushlimbaugh.com/daily/2008/11/06/obama_recession_in_full_swing 
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Jun 9, 2014 09:51
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paranoid randroid posted:Nixon was such a sad, strange, perverse creature that it would take a real crackerjack scandal to unseat him as Reptile #1. I don't know if our current media-saturated world would allow a comparable freak to rise to the presidency. Twitter alone would have cracked Dick in 30 seconds. A platform where any smarmy prick on the planet can insult the president to his face with less effort than it takes to boil water? His enemies list would run to 500 pages and been composed mostly of entries like @dogfartz. He was almost magnificent in his sheer malice. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iucE78-C2Po&t=36s
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Jun 9, 2014 09:58
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Nixon's life was written as joint effort by Flannery O'Connor and William Shakespeare, during a very cynical time in the lives of both.
paranoid randroid fucked around with this message at 10:13 on Jun 9, 2014 |
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Jun 9, 2014 10:06
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Hunter S. Thompson posted:If the right people had been in charge of Nixon's funeral, his casket would have been launched into one of those open-sewage canals that empty into the ocean just south of Los Angeles. He was a swine of a man and a jabbering dupe of a president. Nixon was so crooked that he needed servants to help him screw his pants on every morning. Even his funeral was illegal. He was queer in the deepest way. His body should have been burned in a trash bin. That's probably one of the best final insults of all time.
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Jun 9, 2014 10:29
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Chantilly Say posted:As Nixon passes out of memory, and as we (inevitably) see new Presidential malfeasance, someone else will become the yardstick, and there's a kind of darkly humorous anticipation I feel when I think about someday arguing about whether President so-and-so's scandal is worse than Watergate. I don't know about arguing who's scandals are worse than others in this age. But if there is a lowest yard stick, it HAS to be Bush Jr. for many many reasons. What worries me, is that the right wing was so effective in pinning the economic collapse on Obama, even though it happened before he was elected. At the very least, it's what my conservative leaning friends and family believe. Thanks to right wing media most likely. Edit: I just noticed that Mr. Interwebs Limbaugh quote is what I was just talking about... Damonic fucked around with this message at 13:12 on Jun 9, 2014 |
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Jun 9, 2014 13:06
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Damonic posted:I don't know about arguing who's scandals are worse than others in this age. But if there is a lowest yard stick, it HAS to be Bush Jr. for many many reasons. It's what they wanted to believe. The media just gives them the confidence they needed to be able to say it in public and not feel like they are baseless.
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Jun 9, 2014 13:12
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Mr Interweb posted:Holy poo poo. I was just browsing the internets and I came across this spiel from El Rushbo on Nov. 6, 2008: I've said it before, but God I hope that a bunch of conservatives all panic sold out of the market at the bottom of the crash because they were being fed poo poo like this daily. The gains in my 401k would be that much sweeter if they were boosted by the bad financial decisions of millions of people who claim to be pro-business but know less than nothing about it.
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Jun 9, 2014 13:22
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Damonic posted:I don't know about arguing who's scandals are worse than others in this age. But if there is a lowest yard stick, it HAS to be Bush Jr. for many many reasons. The beauty of the stock market is that you can be as selective as you want about its predictive powers. Market goes down before the election? That's not a response to bad economic conditions, that's the captains of industry pulling their money out because they know Obama will ruin the country. Market goes up after the election? That's not an expectation of improved financial outlooks, that's because [noble tea partiers held the line and spared this country the worst of Obama's sinister plots/Obama and the Fed have manipulated the money supply and economic statistics to make things look better than they actually are].
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Jun 9, 2014 13:25
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Mr Interweb posted:Holy poo poo. I was just browsing the internets and I came across this spiel from El Rushbo on Nov. 6, 2008: Of course Rush has credited Obama with the Dow doubling since he took office, hasn't he? Of course he has.
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Jun 9, 2014 13:28
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Zwabu posted:Of course Rush has credited Obama with the Dow doubling since he took office, hasn't he? No see that doesn't count because the Fed's printed lots of money and devalued the currency with rampant inflation. Also it's based partly on BLS and BEA data, which is just going to create government lies to make Obama look good because he is their boss.
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Jun 9, 2014 13:31
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Nah, it's obviously due to Congress and them passing legislation that only really matters. You know, like Obamacare.
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Jun 9, 2014 13:32
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Dr.Zeppelin posted:The beauty of the stock market is that you can be as selective as you want about its predictive powers. Market goes down before the election? That's not a response to bad economic conditions, that's the captains of industry pulling their money out because they know Obama will ruin the country. Market goes up after the election? That's not an expectation of improved financial outlooks, that's because [noble tea partiers held the line and spared this country the worst of Obama's sinister plots/Obama and the Fed have manipulated the money supply and economic statistics to make things look better than they actually are]. The thing of it is, this specific talking point of "markets down because Obama elected" is such a ridiculous and transparently dishonest one that it's much more obvious than even the usual bullshit. Of course there are a million ways to interpret the tea leaves of economic and financial data, whether a President or Congress was responsible, what the movements were in response to etc. But the usual most obvious way that certainly both sides will do is give credit to the man who was President when there was economic expansion and improvement, whether or not they were obviously responsible. To ascribe to an election a day or two of market movement that is in the direction that the market was already tanking for a month or more prior to that election is so absurd it doesn't hold up to the slightest scrutiny. The insidious nature of 24/7 propaganda is such that even people who are otherwise highly intelligent will be led to mouth a ridiculous talking point like this one day and a completely opposite one a week later (sometimes an HOUR later) and not be made to feel ridiculous or ashamed because they are being led around by their ideological nose so much that they can't even see it happening. I work with people whose job requires them to have well above average intelligence and to apply rational principles to what they do, yet because they are right wingers who listen to Rush and Fox all day I remember many of them regurgitating this exact "here's your Obama market" immediately after the election. Those same people pretty much don't talk about the stock market anymore, although most have probably seen massive gains from it during the last several years. The talking points are so weak now that they pretty much boil down to "the numbers aren't real because (citation needed)." Unlike their less educated brothers in right wing arms, they would be embarrassed and ashamed if they had to have all their talking points listed out chronologically in giant Powerpoint screens and presented in front of some formal jury or debate forum. "So let's see, in fall 2008 you said X about Obama and the Dow, in 2012 you said Y, and 2014 you said Z. Seriously? C'mon. C'MON MAN."
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Jun 9, 2014 13:54
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Going back a little to the Bork thing. I wonder how many top-level Republicans would have that level of principles today. I can't imagine any would, it seems to be all Borks or worse. I think Eric Holder would, but of course you can never know unless it happens.
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Jun 9, 2014 15:22
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Since I'm not a hosed up Freeper I'll preface this by saying there's no solid report saying the Vegas shooters were previously on the Bundy Ranch, but there are people on the scene saying so. What I actually wanted to post was Cliven Bundy's wife who was asked about just that, she all but denies they were part of their group but...quote:"I have not seen or heard anything from the militia and others who have came to our ranch that would, in any way, make me think they had an intent to kill or harm anyone." 
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Jun 9, 2014 16:40
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Allegedly this was on the facebook page of one of the shooters: If true, between this and the heroic CCW defender getting killed, I think we can declare irony to be the sixth casualty of this spree.
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Jun 9, 2014 16:57
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New York Daily is basically saying they were tea party nut cases. Which wouldn't surprise me if it's true that they were going on about revolution (http://www.nydailynews.com/news/cri...ticle-1.1822387) "The shooters reportedly covered the officers' bodies with a Gasden flag."
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Jun 9, 2014 17:19
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Dr.Zeppelin posted:Allegedly this was on the facebook page of one of the shooters: The alleged shooters' facebook profiles are still up: https://www.facebook.com/jerad.miller.1 https://www.facebook.com/amanda.woodruff.9 
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Jun 9, 2014 17:26
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JehovahsWetness posted:The alleged shooters' facebook profiles are still up: To be fair, just because he has a Facebook post saying he was at the ranch I wouldn't trust that that was true. EDIT VVVV That's true. Whether they were there or not, It still shows allegiance. RoyKeen fucked around with this message at 17:56 on Jun 9, 2014 |
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Jun 9, 2014 17:40
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The Ape of Naples posted:To be fair, just because he has a Facebook post saying he was at the ranch I wouldn't trust that that was true. Actual presence at the ranch is a bit irrelevant, really. He was clearly supportive of the actions and the people there. That's all that really matters. But being so nearby I don't doubt that he may have actually gone there and (possibly) been kicked out for being too methed out and paranoid for even that crowd.
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Jun 9, 2014 17:54
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Like clockwork... http://www.rightwingwatch.org/content/infowars-thinks-las-vegas-shooting-false-flag-custom-made-demonize-patriot-movement Alex Jones posted:The incident is custom-made to demonize the patriot movement. The Southern Poverty Law Center has consistently attempted to forge a link between white supremacists and members of the patriot and constitutional movements. Jeez how many false flags until we can just get this socialist revolution going already?
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Jun 9, 2014 18:29
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I swear, it's starting to interfere with my day to day life, having to oppress so many white people and set up all these double blind operations.
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Jun 9, 2014 18:33
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ReidRansom posted:Actual presence at the ranch is a bit irrelevant, really. He was clearly supportive of the actions and the people there. That's all that really matters. But being so nearby I don't doubt that he may have actually gone there and (possibly) been kicked out for being too methed out and paranoid for even that crowd. I think it does matter, there's a big difference between actions and words. Someone who is willing to drive out to Bundy Ranch is different from someone bitching about obamas on his facebook.
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Jun 9, 2014 18:46
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TheDeadlyShoe posted:I think it does matter, there's a big difference between actions and words. Someone who is willing to drive out to Bundy Ranch is different from someone bitching about obamas on his facebook. Uh. They killed cops. I'd say that qualifies as action.
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Jun 9, 2014 18:51
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Yeah but real Bundy supporters would only have threatened to shoot federal officers if they proceeded with operations at the ranch, not killed some law enforcement in Vegas.
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Jun 9, 2014 18:53
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Also true Bundy supporters would have used their kids as cover to get those few extra minutes of trigger-pulling time and make the cops look bad, rather than just shooting themselves
VitalSigns fucked around with this message at 18:57 on Jun 9, 2014 |
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Jun 9, 2014 18:55
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Dr.Zeppelin posted:Allegedly this was on the facebook page of one of the shooters: why would you use Dale Gribble as your meme avatar for reasonable correct opinions
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Jun 9, 2014 19:02
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*Geraldo interviewing two Bundy supporters* Geraldo: "Are you concerned about the violent elements in your movement?" Bundino 1: "There are no violent elements in our movement!" Bundino 2: "Socialist obamanoid! The revolution starts here!!" *shoots Geraldo* Geraldo: "AHH MY ORGANS" Bundino 1: "That guy isn't a part of our movement." Bundino 2 (Schrödinger's Bundino): "See you at IHOP later?" Bundino 1: "Sure thing."
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Jun 9, 2014 19:11
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The SPLC has an article on the shooters here. The also posted this picture showing the rise in "patriot" groups during the Clinton, Bush, and Obama eras.
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Jun 9, 2014 19:15
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Intel&Sebastian posted:Jeez how many false flags until we can just get this socialist revolution going already? This tragedy is going to be pretty revealing as we get more info on the shooters because the right is in full on denial mode that they had any influence over these two individuals, despite pretty much every bit of rhetorical flourish you'd see on freep or The Blaze comment sections their posters parrot incessantly being almost inline with the poo poo I've been seeing on the shooter's social media pages and the initial witness reports. So far Limbaugh has wisely been sidestepping this issue and focusing on the Bergdahl release 'scandal', much like he did with the whole Cliven Bundy situation. I'd imagine once the talking points come in he'll just parrot whatever angle Fox News goes with if he bothers to opine at all. Hannity and the rest of the band of idiots' opinions will be interesting to say the least. Time to stock up on liquor and weep for humanity!
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Jun 9, 2014 19:30
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Pretty rich of Alex Jones to call it a false flag when dude was (allegedly) posting on Infowars: Rant about Judges and Cops I'm just going to quote it, because that fat coward will pull it as soon as he knows that it's there: quote:The Police (To Kill Or Not To Kill?)
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Jun 9, 2014 19:38
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Miller is also posts on the Breibart comments section: Comment
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Jun 9, 2014 19:58
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This guy was a tremendous rear end in a top hat murderer but I do think that infowars post points to a lot of the serious issues with the way a single weed charge can straight ruin someone's life. Granted, his life wouldn't be as hosed if he didn't react in such an insane way and fixate on being able to keep his guns, but its bullshit he was ever treated that way for reefer.
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Jun 9, 2014 19:59
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